General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsScientists who found gluten sensitivity evidence have now shown it doesn't exist
In one of the best examples of science working, a researcher who provided key evidence of (non-celiac disease) gluten sensitivity recently published follow-up papers that show the opposite.
The paper came out last year in the journal Gastroenterology. Heres the backstory that makes us cheer: The study was a follow up on a 2011 experiment in the lab of Peter Gibson at Monash University in Australia. The scientifically sound - but small - study found that gluten-containing diets can cause gastrointestinal distress in people without celiac disease, a well-known autoimmune disorder triggered by gluten. They called this non-celiac gluten sensitivity.
Gluten is a protein composite found in wheat, barley, and other grains. It gives bread its chewiness and is often used as a meat substitute: If youve ever had 'wheat meat', seitan, or mock duck at a Thai restaurant, thats gluten.
Gluten is a big industry: 30 percent of people want to eat less gluten. Sales of gluten-free products are estimated to hit $US15 billion by 2016.
Snip
http://www.sciencealert.com/scientists-who-found-evidence-for-gluten-sensitivity-have-now-shown-it-doesn-t-exist
Recursion
(56,582 posts)"Is your cream cheese gluten free?"
"Yeah..."
"No, I'm serious. Are you certain it's gluten free?"
"Ma'am, I don't think any cream cheese has gluten..."
"Do you know what gluten does to people?! I need you to check right now!"
(a minute later)
"Yes, ma'am, the supplier confirms it is gluten free"
"OK, I'll take a bagel with cream cheese."
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,910 posts)Electric Monk
(13,869 posts)The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,910 posts)I've run into a few people IRL that weren't too far from that.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)and how gluten intolerant you are".
Egnever
(21,506 posts)Thanks for that.
3catwoman3
(24,076 posts)...hilarious.
MineralMan
(146,338 posts)Personally, I only drink gluten-free water.
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)Taking advantage of consumers that don't know where gluten comes from and how it is made.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)hobbit709
(41,694 posts)Then she started claiming she had full blown celiac because her CHIROPRACTOR told her so.
Of course her quack tells her all sorts of things. Like the box with the digital readout strapped to her arm that diagnosed what "toxins" she needed to remove from her system.
I know of at least 3 occasions where she unknowingly ate something with gluten in it and had no reaction whatsoever. I also know of occasions where she thought she had eaten gluten and had gastric problems immediately.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)My reaction to gluten -- intestinal bleeding -- takes place days after I consume it. And for many gluten sensitive people, it is the accumulation of exposures over a long period of time that causes the person's reaction.
There is a now a standard blood test that can diagnose celiac to a high degree of specificity, and it is quite possible that her chiropractor ordered it. Unfortunately, when people with celiac are repeatedly exposed to gluten, it can cause long term damage to the intestines and even raise the risk of lymphoma -- without producing symptoms that the celiac person is aware of.
So I hope you support your neighbor rather than denigrate her efforts to be healthy.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)After living here for 25 years, I've seen her jump on every "Disease Of The Month" fad there is.
And I pointed out her CHIROPRACTOR told her so, not an actual MD. Her quack has convinced her she doesn't need to see a real doctor for anything. She had a bladder infection once that she kept going back to him for "adjustments" until the pain finally got intense enough for her to seek real medical help. A weeks work of antibiotics worked wonders.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)Anyone who has received a Doctor of Chiropractic (DC) degree has undergone training in the use of clinical laboratory tests, such as comprehensive blood panels and urinalysis.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)Like I pointed out about the box strapped to her arm thingie.
If you want to believe in quackery that's fine but don't try to pass it off as serious medical science just like you do with vaccinations.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)Celiac disease is real and so is non-celiac gluten sensitivity.
The study cited in the OP, involving 37 self-reported gluten-sensitive people (not doctor diagnosed) does nothing to disprove that.
http://www.clevelandclinicmeded.com/medicalpubs/diseasemanagement/gastroenterology/celiac-disease-malabsorptive-disorders/
It has been known for a long time. It is now being abused in the name of profit.
luvspeas
(1,883 posts)Wheat is one of the few things I don't test positive for on an allergy skin test. If I eat almonds, strawberries, rice, and a bunch of other mundane items I will get rosacea and patches of exema. Again, test by a dermatologist. But it takes weeks for symtoms to manefest so it was quite a struggle to understnd what was going on.
Also, laugh f you want but they put gluten containing additives as thickeners, meat enhancement, spices and cosmetics. That's just a small example. Yes, cream cheese can contain gluten as a thickener, you hamburger can contain gluten, and your mascara.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)and it's all compounded by the delay that can occur between exposure and symptoms.
At first they thought I just had a severe lactose intolerance, but that led to more testing that revealed the gliadin antibodies and the gluten sensitivity. I have to stay away from both if I don't want to have the bleeding.
Sen. Walter Sobchak
(8,692 posts)I would have guessed you were my neighbor.
We have one just like her. Except she nearly killed herself with untreated sepsis and put permanent scars on her arms and legs with some sort of ointment intended to leech toxins out of her skin.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,910 posts)While people with celiac disease really do have to avoid gluten, most people don't. But now all kinds of foods are labeled as gluten-free - including stuff that never had gluten in the first place - so people will think these items are somehow more healthful, because who knows, they might have non-celiac gluten sensitivity. Which, at least according to this study, might not exist at all.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)for persons that do have Celiac disease and that is a good thing.
stevil
(1,537 posts)And there is increased awareness in the Foodservice industry as well. Guests at my restaurant sometimes exaggerate severeness of a Gluten allergy but it is always taken seriously and there are special menus for Gluten sensitive guests. It always feels good to let reassure parents of kids with deadly allergies that we are aware and prepared. The fad may or may not continue but I'm sure its saved some lives.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)with her and trying to find anyone that even knew if their dishes had gluten in them.
bananas
(27,509 posts)<snip>
Instead, as RCS reported last week, FODMAPS are a far more likely cause of the gastrointestinal problems attributed to gluten intolerance. Jessica Biesiekierski, a gastroenterologist formerly at Monash University and now based out of the Translational Research Center for Gastrointestinal Disorders at the University of Leuven in Belgium,* and lead author of the study alongside Gibson, noted that when participants consumed the baseline low-FODMAP diet, almost all reported that their symptoms improved!
"Reduction of FODMAPs in their diets uniformly reduced gastrointestinal symptoms and fatigue in the run-in period, after which they were minimally symptomatic."
Coincidentally, some of the largest dietary sources of FODMAPs -- specifically bread products -- are removed when adopting a gluten-free diet, which could explain why the millions of people worldwide who swear by gluten-free diets feel better after going gluten-free.
<snip>
stevil
(1,537 posts)Only that some guests will fib and tell restaurants that eating gluten products will cause them severe illness and or/death just to accommodate their "diet".
cannabis_flower
(3,768 posts)I have a friend with celiac disease and he couldn't even eat tuna (and many other things) most of the time because it had texturized vegetable protein or modified vegetable starch and didn't specifically say whether that was corn, potato, rice or soy which would be ok and not the dreaded wheat which would make him sick.
Oneironaut
(5,535 posts)They usually are loaded with sugar and other bad things to make them taste better. I'm not sure where the "Gluten-free is healthier!" idea came from.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,910 posts)or some other diagnosed condition involving the inability to digest gluten. Otherwise it's just another fad diet with no benefit.
bananas
(27,509 posts)<snip>
Instead, as RCS reported last week, FODMAPS are a far more likely cause of the gastrointestinal problems attributed to gluten intolerance. Jessica Biesiekierski, a gastroenterologist formerly at Monash University and now based out of the Translational Research Center for Gastrointestinal Disorders at the University of Leuven in Belgium,* and lead author of the study alongside Gibson, noted that when participants consumed the baseline low-FODMAP diet, almost all reported that their symptoms improved!
"Reduction of FODMAPs in their diets uniformly reduced gastrointestinal symptoms and fatigue in the run-in period, after which they were minimally symptomatic."
Coincidentally, some of the largest dietary sources of FODMAPs -- specifically bread products -- are removed when adopting a gluten-free diet, which could explain why the millions of people worldwide who swear by gluten-free diets feel better after going gluten-free.
<snip>
Mosby
(16,388 posts)Clearly many people are consuming too many calories, cutting down on the calories probably make one feel better.
leftyladyfrommo
(18,874 posts)Is the cause for everything and she has books to back that up.
Lyric
(12,675 posts)They are very weary of hypochondriacs and attention-seekers with fake "gluten sensitivities" making their lives harder. They suffer because they get lumped in with all the fakers and head-cases, and viewed with suspicion at best when making special requests at restaurants, etc.
I feel even sorrier for the kids of those lunatics who self- or internet-diagnose a hundred "allergies" and then cut their kids off from most normal food and start a self-righteous "allergy Mom" blog. And all the while, Moms of kids with REAL food allergies don't have time to waste on a blotchy blog every day, because they have to monitor everything their child eats, drinks, or touches. Real allergy Moms aren't demanding attention whores. They would much rather have a healthy child and get NO attention. They don't demand that people stop giving out peanut butter cups to trick-or-treaters in their neighborhood--they quietly buy their child an alternative and let the other kids enjoy their candy.
I tend to view the loud, pushy "allergy" parents with suspicion. But I have nothing but sympathy for the parents who quietly do their jobs and monitor their own kids while leaving other peoples' kids alone. I understand not wanting peanut butter brought to school, because (1) your kid is legally forced to be there, and (2) it's sticky and hard to wash off, unlike most other allergens. But when you start demanding no eggs, milk, or wheat for the other kids at school just because your kid can't have it? Yeah, I start wondering if you are one of the head cases.
Subjecting children to extensive food exclusions without any medical or religious documentation proving that it's necessary, or at least typical for your religion, ought to be considered grounds for a child neglect investigation--to check nutrition levels, at the very least.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)I'm glad for them, because their numbers are encouraging food processors to label their products.
FWIW, at all the restaurants I've worked at we treat all allergies seriously but just like your cousins we get pissed off when people SCREAM for gluten free products (even telling us gluten ingestion could be fatal) and then go ahead order stuff off the regular menu (rather than the gluten free one) and tell us a little gluten is OK! I've always gotten the impression that those folk are told by their Dr. to cut down on carbs to help them lose a little weight and that they figure asking for gluten free means the same thing.
Almost all of the parents of kids with celiac disease (and diagnosed adults as well) are communicative and also appreciative of us for making an effort to keep their kids from getting sick. Sometimes they can be a little aggressive but they might have already seen a hospital visit when they aren't taken seriously.
laundry_queen
(8,646 posts)I've run into those types of parents, as a parent of 4 myself. It's clear which ones are the ones who actually have kids with allergies and which are just doing it for attention or to feel special or something. "Johnny was hyper and cranky all day after eating strawberries so we've had to eliminate those from our diet." versus "Lisa's face swelled up and she broke out in hives and started vomiting after eating a banana" are 2 very different realities. The parents who tell me the former are immediately suspect.
It does make it harder for those who have ACTUAL allergies or celiac disease. My brother is allergic to fish - he has had anaphylactic reactions in the past, with trips to the ER, epinephrine and everything. He has noticed at restaurants they often don't take him seriously. If it's not peanuts people don't take it seriously because so many people have decided they cannot eat this or that and restaurant staff are often overwhelmed with it. And sometimes staff doesn't even know what constitutes the allergen. Once my brother asked if a dish had fish in it and was told it didn't. It clearly did because he broke out in hives after having one bite, and instantly felt his throat closing - he had to go to the ER. Turns out there were anchovies in the dressing, but the servers didn't know anchovies were fish.
I agree with you regarding food exclusions - unfortunately sometimes parents themselves have eating disorders and pass that on to their kids. I used to know someone online through a parenting website who was a raw vegan. She fed her kids the same way. I remember she once complained that her 5 year old son was still hungry after having *2 WHOLE BANANAS* and that there must be something wrong with him because SHE Was full after 2 bananas! Yes she got piled on after that. Kids have different nutritional needs than adults and require a lot more fat and protein. I once knew someone whose SIL was known to severely control what her 4 teen boys ate. We were at a company function and this woman yelled at her 14 year old son when he was whimpering that he was hungry, "What do you mean you are hungry! You ate half a bagel 4 hours ago!" Parents like that should probably be investigated.
Anyhow, I agree with you.
lame54
(35,331 posts)That your cousins have so many new products to choose from
Lyric
(12,675 posts)No. Lots are stuffed full of refined sugars and fat, but advertised as gluten-free, so hypochondriacs and restricted-eating-fetishists (a.k.a., morons) think that it's healthy. When the gluten-free food fad has worn itself out, celiac patients will be right back to where they were before--clean eating with alternative grains.
The fact is, for non-celiacs, gluten IS healthy! It's protein. It is clumps of amino acids, just like all other proteins. It's GOOD for you. Buying gluten-free when you don't medically need to is idiotic. All you're really doing is paying for someone to make your food LESS nutritious.
lame54
(35,331 posts)because there are quality products
it may take a little more effort to find them but they do exist where they didn't before
haikugal
(6,476 posts)I have to be gluten and casein free or I will have various reactions, all unpleasant and fairly long lasting. Some happen quickly others hours later.
I don't appreciate being looked at like I'm an attention seeker when I go out.
There are many more choices that taste good now than there were in 2010 and I'm happy about that. Not everything on the shelf is worth my money but there are some which make my life more pleasurable.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)but I do tend to gain weight if I don't watch my carb intake, most especially bread. Each body is different.
madville
(7,412 posts)I have very little gluten in my diet as part of a strategy to maintain weight, not because of any reaction to the gluten itself. I also avoid sugar (except for those naturally occurring in fruits and vegetables) and most dairy products.
I find it easy to eat gluten-free since I don't eat processed foods or at restaurants much (when I do I go to places that have nice salad bars mainly). My diet is lean meats, vegetables, fruits, nuts and legumes.
We have one person at work that talks about specifically avoiding gluten a bunch and not feeding it to their family, they are also anti-vaccine so it comes across as more nutty than for any actual medical reason.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)It was based on cycling 37 self-identified people with gluten sensitivity through rotating diets lasting 3-7 days each.
1) the sample size is tiny
2) the participants weren't diagnosed by doctors with gluten sensitivity
3) gluten reactions often take days to develop. So by the time a gluten sensitive person began to have a reaction, he or she could have been on a different study diet.
LiberalArkie
(15,730 posts)put their own test to a test and found that their original consensus was incorrect. This is the way that science is supposed to work.
bananas
(27,509 posts)something not mentioned in the gimmicky article in the OP:
<snip>
Instead, as RCS reported last week, FODMAPS are a far more likely cause of the gastrointestinal problems attributed to gluten intolerance. Jessica Biesiekierski, a gastroenterologist formerly at Monash University and now based out of the Translational Research Center for Gastrointestinal Disorders at the University of Leuven in Belgium,* and lead author of the study alongside Gibson, noted that when participants consumed the baseline low-FODMAP diet, almost all reported that their symptoms improved!
"Reduction of FODMAPs in their diets uniformly reduced gastrointestinal symptoms and fatigue in the run-in period, after which they were minimally symptomatic."
Coincidentally, some of the largest dietary sources of FODMAPs -- specifically bread products -- are removed when adopting a gluten-free diet, which could explain why the millions of people worldwide who swear by gluten-free diets feel better after going gluten-free.
<snip>
Cal Carpenter
(4,959 posts)If so, is it a symptom-based diagnosis or a lab-testable one?
Just curious, as per your point 2.
Ms. Toad
(34,117 posts)Tests can exclude celiac, but then cannot diagnose gluten sensitivity.
MineralMan
(146,338 posts)contain. Due to that, food faddists have a field day and make money by warning people about foods that will surely make them sick or worse. Most of them, as it happens, have something to sell that either replaces those foods or prevents the harm they'll certainly cause.
I've known a few people who were so fearful of food that they pretty much ate almost nothing. They had one or two foods that they believed wouldn't make them sick so that's all they ate. Period. Those people were among the unhealthiest people I've ever known. They were also very difficult to be around, since they thought constantly about the foods they shouldn't eat.
A couple were actually food spectators. If you were eating something, they'd watch you constantly while you ate. "I don't see how you can eat that poison," they'd say, while the entire time they were practically drooling as they watched. Very annoying, to say the least.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)that that study involving 37 self-diagnosed patients.
http://www.clevelandclinicmeded.com/medicalpubs/diseasemanagement/gastroenterology/celiac-disease-malabsorptive-disorders/
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)pnwmom
(109,015 posts)hobbit709
(41,694 posts)pnwmom
(109,015 posts)about non-celiac sensitivity, specifically related to neurological effects in some people.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3641836/
Celiac Disease (CD) is an immune-mediated disease dependent on gluten (a protein present in wheat, rye or barley) that occurs in about 1% of the population and is generally characterized by gastrointestinal complaints. More recently the understanding and knowledge of gluten sensitivity (GS), has emerged as an illness distinct from celiac disease with an estimated prevalence 6 times that of CD. Gluten sensitive people do not have villous atrophy or antibodies that are present in celiac disease, but rather they can test positive for antibodies to gliadin. Both CD and GS may present with a variety of neurologic and psychiatric co-morbidities, however, extraintestinal symptoms may be the prime presentation in those with GS. However, gluten sensitivity remains undertreated and underrecognized as a contributing factor to psychiatric and neurologic manifestiations. This review focuses on neurologic and psychiatric manifestations implicated with gluten sensitivity, reviews the emergence of gluten sensitivity distinct from celiac disease, and summarizes the potential mechanisms related to this immune reaction.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)how are the big baking companies and the drug companies gonna make any money if you keep putting articles up that say this is a real illness and that it can be treated by simple dietary avoidance?
profits before people!
dragonlady
(3,577 posts)Non-celiac gluten sensitivity is a real thing. A family member was diagnosed with it several years ago. Eliminating all gluten from her diet has cleared up the debilitating symptoms she had been experiencing. She is very strict about avoiding gluten because she knows that if she unknowingly ingests even a tiny amount of gluten she is in for weeks of great discomfort. Her condition is not some kind of food fad, it is a matter of her quality of life.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)I believe one of my grandparents probably had Celiac (the disease wasn't diagnosed back then) and I have a non-Celiac sensitivity (positive gliadin antibodies and intestinal bleeding when I ingest). Another relative had the dermatitis that's associated with gluten.
It isn't a fad -- but I think we've all benefited from the increased attention to it, and better labeling.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)this study was funded by george weston foods, one of the largest producers of baked goods, but i am sure that has nothing to do with it
Weston Foods specializes in producing and delivering a wide variety of baked goods found in grocery stores, convenience stores, supermarket in-store bakeries and food service outlets. Each day Canadian families start their day with the nutrients supplied by Wonder+, Country Harvest, Gadoua and D'Italiano. Our operations include over 40 facilities across North America manufacturing a range of baked goods products.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)LostOne4Ever
(9,290 posts)[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=indigo]That stuff should be banned. It has the highest pH of any acid in the world!!![/font]
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)It's in industrial solvents, lots of cleaners, rat poison, and lots of other nasty stuff. And it's in almost every food!
Also, acids typically have low pH. The fact that the poster was talking about high pH was a hint.
It's water.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)but sometimes people say high ph when they mean high acidity..is one of those contradictory things
oh well, thx for the reply!
GoneOffShore
(17,342 posts)PatSeg
(47,672 posts)I was waiting for something like that. Science and corporate cash, not a good combination.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)this had been a premier gluten researcher. and to do a complete about face would seem to require either overwhelming evidence or some other motivation. I guess we found the other motivation.
Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)It's the other thing.
Except when they found the thing that you want to believe is true. Then they were noble scientists and not the sell-out hacks they have become now. for the impaired.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)its not evidence
PatSeg
(47,672 posts)sort of thing on Monsanto/GMO stories. Obviously they aren't the only corporation buying scientists. Also I've noticed some of the usual suspects showed up here berating people for being "anti science". That is getting so old.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)they control our health to some degree and of course, the remedy
my guess is the "gluten free is nonsense"crowd has never gotten ill after eating a common food item
PatSeg
(47,672 posts)supposedly with our little tin foil hats on, while they ridicule us for questioning what we hear and read. They use mockery to try and shut down any meaningful conversation or debate. That kind of tactic might be acceptable on some right-wing site, but it is hardly appropriate here. Thanks for the sanity!
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)Silent3
(15,394 posts)...study knew right from the start that they needed a follow-up study. They didn't greatly trust their original results because the controls for the first study weren't strict enough.
It's only the popular press and the wannabe diet gurus and the marketing people who treated the first study as if it were earth-shattering news demanding an immediate giant diet fad as a response.
A great deal of the public reaction that "the scientists say this, then the scientists say that!" has nothing to do with the actual science itself, but the wildly careening public overreaction to limited data along the way as the scientific process works through a slower, far less dramatic course.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)but i don't necessarily trust these 37 cases to say anything important either. and the media does tend to sensationalize things.
but for the many people who have celiac and non celiac sensitivity (and yes, i believe it exists), no study will change for them what they already know. i just hope THIS study does not get sensationalized to the point that people who might do better without gluten will just not bother. and although many, esp celebrities, want to jump on the latest "fad," we all have a right to eat and to avoid what works best for us and there are many many people for whom a gf diet is very beneficial, whether or not they have true celiac. marketing people will do what they do and try to convince otherwise, but when you have been attacked by your own body, you tend to get good at ignoring the marketing hype.
and i once had a dr say that symptoms trump blood tests. so if someone believes they have an allergy or sensitivity, best that they respect what their body says.
PatSeg
(47,672 posts)or a news crawl with "scientists say", they generally don't look any further and accept broad generalizations as gospel. Six months later when "scientists say" the opposite, they accept that too. We live in an entertainment, media driven world, where people digest sound bites and short YouTube clips and think they are informed.
Sadly many people were never taught to think, just to listen and react accordingly.
Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)And I GUARANTEE you that they make a bigger profit margin off those than their regular products. If they are equipped and are making those, why not just convince the whole world to give up gluten and then they can make more money.
I mean, if you are going to do tin foil conspiracies, you need to up the ante a bit.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)i would love to see figures on the profit margins
i would bet they still make gobs more off the glutened products
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)by george weston foods, a major baking company...this is the actual paper
it is all the way at the end...of course
https://universecitypod.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/glutenfodmaps.pdf
laundry_queen
(8,646 posts)So a few years ago I thought I would try gluten free.
After a month I felt far worse.
My doctor made me eat gluten rich foods so I could be tested for celiacs. I immediately felt better. And I had the test and I don't have it. So I don't worry about gluten so much any more. I actually have fewer stomach issues when I eat wheat, strangely.
NobodyHere
(2,810 posts)That's good to know.
SickOfTheOnePct
(7,290 posts)But it might fall off.
Beware gluten!
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)Once Wakefield had a bunch of well-meaning but deeply misguided parents of Autistic kids convinced that Autism was a disease with intestinal causes, various diets (gluten and milk protein free, sometimes with additional restrictions) and supplements and medications have come and go as fads to treat the mostly imagined intestinal ailments of those kids. Often their parents start self-diagnosing or getting some quack to diagnose related intestinal maladies (weirdly enough parasites are a big one, as if those were a going concern in the developed world?) for themselves and the neurotypical kids after that, and the next thing you know the whole family is a mess of imagined food sensitivities diagnosed by muscle testing or bogus tests.
I worked at a bakery with a GF line when this fad really got going. We got the strangest and most heartbreaking emails, and the oddest questions about innocuous ingredients. I felt bad for the kids and the parents. The parents really wanted the illusion of control over the situation, and they got it through a kind of eating disorder by proxy.
As a person who had real, serious digestive issues growing up (the kind that needed surgery and medication that wrecked my baby teeth and uncountable visits to real doctors) I can't imagine going through all that for something that wasn't even real. Poor kids.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)with Celiac disease -- after medical science incorrectly taught, for decades, that the disease didn't exist here. It turned out that descendants of Europeans here are just as likely to have Celiac as their relatives in Europe.
And that non-Celiac sensitivity is even more common, and affects many of the relatives of Celiac patients.
From a highly respected group of European researchers, published by the NIH:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3641836/
Celiac Disease (CD) is an immune-mediated disease dependent on gluten (a protein present in wheat, rye or barley) that occurs in about 1% of the population and is generally characterized by gastrointestinal complaints. More recently the understanding and knowledge of gluten sensitivity (GS), has emerged as an illness distinct from celiac disease with an estimated prevalence 6 times that of CD. Gluten sensitive people do not have villous atrophy or antibodies that are present in celiac disease, but rather they can test positive for antibodies to gliadin. Both CD and GS may present with a variety of neurologic and psychiatric co-morbidities, however, extraintestinal symptoms may be the prime presentation in those with GS. However, gluten sensitivity remains undertreated and underrecognized as a contributing factor to psychiatric and neurologic manifestiations. This review focuses on neurologic and psychiatric manifestations implicated with gluten sensitivity, reviews the emergence of gluten sensitivity distinct from celiac disease, and summarizes the potential mechanisms related to this immune reaction.
Monk06
(7,675 posts)pizza and croussant/ The gluten that is causing the trouble is the industrial form of gluten which is made from washing the starch out of flour. That produces an artificial protein additive that is used to boost the nuitritional levels of processed foods that otherwise would have no nutrional value whatsoever.
As we saw with the IAMS pet food scandal, it is a lucrative industry that attracts crooked processors and counterfeit food rackets.
Good quality high gluten hard grain wheat is not a problem. It is in fact a post war miracle that saved millions from starvation
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)and other forms of non-Celiac gluten sensitivity. Celiac used to be called the "wasting disease" because otherwise well-nourished children could waste away from exposure to the gluten in bread and other wheat and barley products.
It's true that modern techniques might have increased the amount of gluten in foods, making it even harder for the gluten-sensitive person, but that doesn't mean that good quality gluten in wheat isn't a problem for a subset of the population.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Gluten forms when gliadin and glutenin are mixed in the presence of water. Kneading dough is how gluten is formed, and worked into a lattice that will later trap CO2 released by yeast.
It's the gliadin and glutenin that are natural. Making gluten requires human intervention, thus it is not naturally-occurring.
u4ic
(17,101 posts)There is still research that is ongoing.
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2015-10/sh-rfn102215.php
Barcelona -- The intriguing story of the recently-discovered protein, zonulin, advances a chapter today as Italian scientists announce the results of their latest research linking zonulin with two common inflammatory bowel conditions. The researchers have discovered that people with non-coeliac gluten sensitivity (NCGS) and irritable bowel syndrome (IBS) have higher than normal blood levels of zonulin, suggesting an important role for the protein in the development of these conditions.
Speaking at the 23rd United European Gastroenterology Week (UEG Week 2015) in Barcelona, Spain, Professor Giovanni Barbara from the University of Bologna said the results may lead to new treatment strategies for these conditions. "We were intrigued to find that blood levels of zonulin were almost as high in patients with NCGS as in those with coeliac disease," he said.
This is especially interesting for me because my gluten sensitivity causes me intestinal bleeding, which isn't classic celiac.
u4ic
(17,101 posts)I have CFS/ME and Fibromyalgia. I have a lot of food sensitivities. I was gluten free long before the recent "fad", when manufactured GF breads were weapons of mass destruction (my, how they've improved!). Through an elimination diet almost 20 yrs ago, I found my eczema ceased and my Fibro pain diminished significantly when I went GF.
I had the blood test and biopsy - not celiac, but my internist recognized what I knew as well - gluten was/is an issue for me. As he was also familiar with my illnesses, and how often food sensitivities come with the territory, his recommendation (which I had already been doing up until the 2 weeks prior to my biopsy, where one gorges on gluten) was to stay off of it. I have.
GF has come a long way since I first started. Definitely more options, but with those come a lot of sugary crap as well. A GF diet isn't automatically healthy, especially if you're filling up on the cookies, pastries, etc.
I'm not the food police. If someone wants to go GF, go for it, I don't care. Yes, for some it's a fad, but for some they genuinely do feel better. Truly, it's their business, not mine.
pnwmom
(109,015 posts)when I went off gluten at my GI doc's direction -- and ended up losing the fibromyalgia, too. Doctors knew so little about that at the time.
I'm glad you're doing better. It's much harder to get diagnosed for those of us with extra-intestinal symptoms.
And I'm with you. It doesn't hurt me if other people go off gluten who don't need to. If anything, it helps, because sheer numbers are causing manufacturers to label things better.
rjsquirrel
(4,762 posts)The gluten hysterics are absurd. All these people suddenly have a syndrome that used to be exceedingly unusual? Yeah right.
Once it was yeast. Then lactose. Americans always find some reason their stomach hurts besides plain overeating. Unless you have diagnosed celiac disease (which is actually very rare) you can tolerate gluten just fine and your ancestors have for millennia. Stop falling for dietary woo.
SalviaBlue
(2,918 posts)Are you actually claiming that lactose is not a problem for some people? Are you actually claiming that people who get stomach aches after consuming lactose just over ate?
You think lactose intolerance is not a thing. Wow.
Gluten intolerance is a thing too. Just because you don't experience it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Intolerance is a thing. You (and many other DUers on this thread) are exhibiting the symptoms.
bananas
(27,509 posts)Orrex
(63,243 posts)1. You probably don't have it
2. You might have something far more serious and not realize it--that's the peril of self-diagnosis.
Funny that big business is evil when Big Pharma practices it, but when the "supplement" and "health food" industries engage in the same tactics, it's a noble enterprise designed to improve the human condition.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)I'd add "get checked for it by an MD," but...
Gloria
(17,663 posts)visiting brother to the pizza place which makes dough the way I used to....flour, water, yeast, salt ONLY...that I got incredibly sick afterwards and also when I ate the leftovers. I had been avoiding wheat due to being on a lower protein diet....enjoyed the pizza, was simply delicious, thin crust, etc.
By they time I got home, I had cramps and had chills...
I don't have celiac, but have been doing much better without wheat....and this really intense reaction was just really crazy!
At the reheated leftovers a couple of days later and the same thing happened.
Never again...
SalviaBlue
(2,918 posts)They are so tolerant and I'm sure they know better than you would know about your own health
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)A friend of mine had gastro-intestinal distress for years and years. She thought she was lacto-intolerant, which she probably is to some extent. But when she finally gave up gluten-containing foods entirely she has felt about 95 percent better and doesn't have the episodes of cramping, diarrhea, bloating, etc. (she does not have celiac disease). The results were very stark -- this wasn't some placebo effect.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)Or it could be a different trigger. Self diagnosis is the big problem, really, though.
This is a good piece on the topic.
https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/a-balanced-look-at-gluten-sensitivity/
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)Previously, she'd had all sorts of tests, got a colonoscopy, etc. etc.
I'm talking years and years of problems, and then *poof* -- it's basically gone. That's not placebo, because the previous episodes were very apparent and measurable over the years. So if it wasn't the gluten itself it was something that often accompanies gluten-containing products.
I believe in the scientific method and peer-reviewed research, but I think this requires a lot more study.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)They aren't supported by science over and over again. You might not know a great deal of the real story.
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)Believe me, I heard the details of her digestive symptoms, doctors' visits, etc., for many years. This is someone I know well.
cbdo2007
(9,213 posts)They all tested negative to Celiac but all have major physical issues caused by eating gluten. So I'll respectfully disagree with these scientists.
merrily
(45,251 posts)And celiac disease is very real.
If gluten makes you feel bad, see a doctor.
Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)Prism
(5,815 posts)I eat a lot of protein, so I'll nab a brick of gluten from the local asian grocery and prepare it a bit like tofu just to change the menu up.
Then I bring it to work where half the people are all "socially gluten sensitive" (claims of exhaustion and being shut down and they just can't get anything done once they've been exposed! Tch, they don't even when they are on their diet). Of course, when baked goods are afoot, suddenly it's all "What's gluten?!" but lord almighty am I tired of hearing that word. The Bay Area is full of these nutjobs.
When I bust out the gluten in front of them, it's like I've brought in a live rattlesnake.
meow2u3
(24,774 posts)It burns me up when those fad dieters try to shove their eating habits down everybody else's throats. What's next? Banning and criminalizing the possession of gluten-containing foods? I wouldn't put it past those wussies.
Fortunately, there are very few of those flakes in my part of the country.
Prism
(5,815 posts)It's amazing my eyes haven't detached and rolled into the Bay. The amount of nonsense that flies around here among supposedly educated people. The vaccine stuff is bad enough. But now there's the gluten phase, a massive interest in naturopathy, electromagnetic sensitivities, all organic everything ("Is your toilet paper organic? Mine is! I have an asshole sensitivity!" Yeah, me too.
There's a reason for the term Wacky Californians. I keep saying I'm going to weed my patio, dry it all out, crush it into powder, slap on the label "Super Greens!" and sell it for $50 a bottle. These people? Would buy it.
meow2u3
(24,774 posts)If there are any health wackos in PA, they'll most likely be in the ritzy Philadephia suburbs, especially in what locals call the Main Line, an rich suburb west of Philly, replete with multimillion-dollar mansions.
Their diet is typically high in fruits and veggies and low in red meat and carbs. Some of them carry this healthy lifestyle too far in that they gag at the sight of a good, juicy steak or a succulent roast beef.
People like them must be bored out of their minds, having too much money for their own good. Maybe they ought to do something constructive, such as volunteer their time helping and getting to know real people instead of locking themselves up in their gilded cages, force-feeding themselves foods that don't occur in the real world, etc.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)You are bringing me back to my days in San Francisco.
The food allergies/sensitivities, faddists, etc. were ridiculously out of control. It was so annoying to even go out to dinner because there was ALWAYS at least one or two "special snowflakes" who had to make a big fuss out of what they could and couldn't eat and bore the rest of us to tears.
3catwoman3
(24,076 posts)MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)I never took the time to find out. Gluten free has never been a selling point for me because I'm quite sure that I'm not gluten intolerant, whatever that is.
Electric Monk
(13,869 posts)Matariki
(18,775 posts)people would be demanding "Nutrition Free" choices in restaurants and complaining how bad food with Nutrition makes them feel.