Obama's Big Lie about "renegotiating NAFTA" comes back to gut-punch laid-off Kraft/Heinz workers

[brentspeak]

One of the most ferociously cynical lies ever told by a modern-day campaigning politician, Obama's lie about renegotiating NAFTA has to be bitter fruit for 2,600 Kraft/Heinz workers whose jobs will be relocated down to Mexico, (Kraft/Heinz calls obliquely refers to the Mexican plants' locations as "North America".)

And don't think that it's just 2,600 jobs that will disappear (though some of those jobs were located in Canada) -- also disappearing will be untold small businesses which serviced those soon-to-be-closed Kraft factories, as well as the dollars in local economies which were produced by those 2,600 incomes. Some kid's college education fund? Gone, in a puff of smoke.

It's going to get worse: TPP is just around the corner.

This equation should be set in stone:

Corporate New Democrats + corporate GOP = death of the American lower and middle classes.

[Tommy2Tone]

1. Yea all Obama's fault

No Rec here.

[lumberjack_jeff]

20. The lie was. n/t

[Tommy2Tone]

74. Curious the point?

Going after a Democratic president on a Democratic site?

[lumberjack_jeff]

75. Yes, I guess I am. I dislike being lied to - particularly by people I trusted. n/t

[fredamae]

78. Simply self-identifying as a Democrat

Does not mean they believe in and are willing to uphold the Dem Platform. Based on what has unfolded with TPP etc,I find it a stretch to consider these corporatist "dems" as actual Democrats.
imo, as always and of course.

[rhett o rick]

81. I am a Democrat and I believe true Democrats hold their representatives accountable.

It's the New-Democrats that seem to bow down to authority and never question their leaders.

[arcane1]

39. Said nobody n/t

[WinkyDink]

2. One of the closed plants is in my neck of the woods. Crap.

[Hoyt]

3. Your link doesn't say anything about jobs going to Mexico. Like Krugman said,

people blame NAFTA for things caused by other factors.

[JanMichael]

6. if only ghosts did that. i would pay them. nt.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

10. .

[hifiguy]

19. +1.

I'd pay to see it.

[merrily]

66. LOL!

[davekriss]

14. That's not accurate

He stated that there were other things, too, contributing to the vaporization of jobs, e.g. automation of many previously labor intensive jobs.

[hifiguy]

5. I knew that "promise" was a lie

the moment it came out of his mouth.

[Drahthaardogs]

8. His comfortable walking shoes never made an appearance

Either. He has not been strong on labour.

[hifiguy]

11. The best you can say about Obama and labor

is that he took longer to throw them under the train than Bubba did. But then Bubba did it so fast that you had to run slo-mo to see it happen.

[Arugula Latte]

34. And people wonder why so many of us aren't enthused for another Clinton presidency.

Ugh.

[hifiguy]

36. Eeyup.

[840high]

55. ....x10+

[whathehell]

83. He has NOT been strong on labor, and that, plus his TPP push

are the two things I do NOT like about him, and yes, I DID vote for him five times -- 2 primaries, 2 generals and one US Senate race.

Thanks, Barack.

[Phlem]

15. yep.

There was a great discussion that I wish I bookmarked about how there was massive offshoring, especially tech, at the same time NAFTA was happening. So it all wasn't about Mexico.

I like that we're getting into specifics here since I could give a rat's * what the specifics are cause I havn't had a steady job since NAFTA.

And now we're going to have to swallow the TPP pill?

[hifiguy]

18. Well, it will be rammed down our throats

with the assistance of his new Repig friends, you can count on that. It's his "legacy" after all.

And I am sure he will be rewarded by its beneficiariesin his post-presidentlal years on a scale that will make what they did for the Clintons look like a thousand-dollar shopping spree at Wal-Mart.

[Phlem]

26. I agree with you totally.

And understand there is no surrender, but I'm a man of logic and hearing the stuff from some people on this board just blows me away. Just a freaking Tsunami of cluelessness and I all I can do is just watch.

I'll be better tomorrow.

[yourout]

31. It's not being rammed down our throats....this baby is a suppository.

[hifiguy]

33. And it's big enough for a bull elephant.

I stand corrected. You are very right.

[nationalize the fed]

7. k/r

In case anyone forgot

Two Huge Democratic Achievements-

NAFTA and soon TPP

Because if the Republicans did it there would have been a revolt

[hifiguy]

12. Well that was a

wasn't it?

[kelliekat44]

51. The Republicans do it too. They just don't announce it. nt

[Hoyt]

9. Your link doesn't say anything about Mexico. While layoffs are bad, tough to blame on Obama.

[Thor_MN]

54. That's the part I don't really get.

North America includes both Canada and Mexico, apparently to the surprise of some. While I don't like seeing US jobs go to other countries, there's no inherent deceit if they say jobs are being relocated to other North American plants and those plants are in Mexico or Canada. Hell, Cuba can be considered part of North America.

[shenmue]

13. This is Democratic Underground

Not Republican Underground.

[Phlem]

17. Oh that's right

don't question the people in charge, "how very Democratic".

Are we still convinced everyone is not going to vote for Hillary just for spite? Just so we can install Republicans just for spite?

You have got to get off the fear podium for a while.

There are plenty of adults here that will do the right thing.

And I'm sorry, I will always question authority.

[passiveporcupine]

46. NO, how about question the people in charge.

the people who own Kraft and Heinz. They are the ones who decided to merge, which always ends up with a lot of job losses.

I don't agree with TPP or any of the pending trade bills, but this is as much about the businesses themselves and their lack of character, as it is about the laws of this country or the administration who passes trade bills, that contain some good and some bad.

We have to stop letting big businesses combine into even larger businesses. I favor a law that limits the size of a company to a much smaller size that we have going on today. Smaller ocmpanies are more local community minded. Once they get so big they have a main office that is not even in the state where the business is...forget it. It's too damned big.

[Phlem]

56. Yep. Been there done that. The last straw was working for Mormons.

I've been in early tech, and the mantra was pretty much build a profitable company then sell it. The CEO get's a huge bonus while the owners sit back and collect cash. Meanwhile a bunch of people need to find a new job. Shareholders get their pie unless you still have cash after your lay off.

Well then if you don't have cash after your layoff,..... it's just more for everyone else! yeay!

I'm in total agreement with you. Yet our party is filled to the brim with people that cannot comprehend this. It just feels like a slow mow train wreck and there's nothing one can do about it.

We've been pushed to the right too far. As a party, I'll do my part to bring it back, there's just everyone else.

[passiveporcupine]

60. We have the power of social media now. We never had that before.

We need to use it to start targeting things like this. Our government should be responsible to us, but they aren't because of the money influence in politics, so we need to take action and target these things on social media.

We have the power if we will just use it!

[Phlem]

62. Your solid man. I like you.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/tpp-signed-the-biggest-global-threat-to-the-internet-agreed-as-campaigners-warn-that-secret-pact-a6680321.html

http://www.ibtimes.com/tpp-trade-deal-would-curb-freedom-speech-online-internet-activists-warn-1883780

mostly it's the generalizations in the TPP that can set off a bad pattern.

Ambiguity, gotta love it.

You know, on the positive side, Bernie had nothing to do with this.

[passiveporcupine]

63. Thanks...we all need to keep up the good fight

[Phlem]

64. Exactly.

[840high]

57. So will I.

[Doctor_J]

82. It's tough to tell with all the cheering for union busting, off shoring, healthcare profiteers,

Capital punishment, and war. Back when it started most of us were against those things.

[rhett o rick]

84. So those people posting here that want to alert, lock, hide and ban all that don't agree with their

world view should leave because that is not Democratic behavior. Good Democrats are not terrified to discuss, even argue about issues. The Conservative Wing won't get caught dead discussing issues and rely on silencing those that they don't like.

Like you said this is Democratic Underground and Democrats hold their representatives accountable.

[saturnsring]

16. Heinz as in john kerry's wife Heinz?

[Omaha Steve]

23. Heinz was sold to Buffet's company Berkshire Hathaway & a South American company

It is not her fault. She didn't have a large holding in the company anymore.

At the Berkshire Hathaway stockholders meeting here in Omaha this spring protesters for their private airline and Heinz were at the event about lost jobs etc.

[Omaha Steve]

28. Warren Buffett Quadrupled His Ketchup Investment

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-03-25/warren-buffett-quadrupled-his-ketchup-investment

MAR 30, 2015 8:45 AM EDT
By Matt Levine
Two years ago, Brazilian private equity firm 3G Capital and Warren Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway teamed up to acquire Heinz in a leveraged buyout. Heinz at the time was a $28 billion company, but Berkshire and 3G didn't put up that much money: Each of them contributed $4.25 billion of equity, and Berkshire invested another $8 billion in the preferred stock of new Heinz.

Today Heinz is acquiring Kraft, more or less: Heinz's shareholders, mostly Berkshire and 3G, will end up owning 51 percent of the combined Heinzkraft, while Kraft's existing public shareholders will own the other 49 percent. Kraft is an even bigger company than Heinz -- its equity was worth $36 billion as of yesterday -- so Berkshire and 3G will pay Kraft's shareholders $10 billion in cash to make up the difference. Here is the deal infographic, just in case you find that helpful. (It is a ... I'm going to say mayonnaise jar full of brands? Definitely some brands, in a jar, plus some disclaimers. The disclaimers didn't fit in the jar.)

By my math -- based on Sujeet Indap's math at the Financial Times's Lex Live blog, and on where Kraft's stock was trading earlier today -- the combined company will have an enterprise value of about $111 billion and an equity value of about $83 billion:



FULL story at link.

[Phlem]

35. yeay Warren and BH investors!

Just ruined a few live's, not much, no one will notice.

[Omaha Steve]

37. Many people have that stock in their 401ks, mutual funds, etc

And don't know because they don't read the prospectus (or don't care).

[Phlem]

38. probably more of the latter.

It doesn't exist in our Retirement fund namely because we can't afford it.

But just like Apple Stock, I won't come near it.

There has to be a line one does not cross.

[Omaha Steve]

41. Social Responsible Investing Can Be Profitable Too: 2 Funds to Buy - Mutual Fund Commentary

Even these kind of funds have Apple and it's made in China etc.

http://quotes.freerealtime.com/dl/frt/N?NewsStory=1

Socially Responsible Investment (SRI) funds have been enjoying increasing popularity. Reportedly, officials at the sustainable investment conference late last year said U.S. socially responsible funds held $6.57 trillion at beginning of 2014; significantly up from $3.74 trillion held at the beginning of 2012. Morningstar confirms that there are 412 U.S. socially responsible funds now, compared to 375 in 2009. Also, the funds are said to occupy 18% of all managed assets at the beginning of 2014. This is an increase from 12% in 2012.

Snip: Domini Social Equity Investor (DSEFX) seeks to provide total return over the long term. The fund invests a lion’s share of its assets in securities of mid to large domestic companies. Investments are made after evaluating the social and environmental standards in which the businesses are involved in.

DSEFX currently carries a Zacks Mutual Fund Rank #1 (Strong Buy). The fund has returned 17.1% over the last 1-year period. Its 3 and 5-year annualized returns stand at 15.8% and 15.4%. The fund has an expense ratio of 1.20%, which however is higher than category average of 1.08%.

The fund’s top holdings include Apple Inc (AAPL), Microsoft Corp (MSFT) and Intel Corp (INTC).

[Phlem]

50. Thanks for that Steve.

I'll check it out!

[Omaha Steve]

53. Your welcome

[saturnsring]

77. that's a lot of info thanks os

[karynnj]

59. Teresa Heinz Kerry and her sons was NEVER involved with Heinz Corporation

She did head the family foundation - a philanthropy.

[whereisjustice]

21. Conservative Democrats don't give a fuck if 2 or 3 more million jobs go to India and China and

now Vietnam with TPP. They'll claim that we don't need them anyway and it's your fault for not being a CEO or being born in an Asian hell hole.

A conservative Democrat is every bit as toxic as a Republican except that conservative Democrats are generally in favor of woman's right to chose and perhaps a few other social liberties. Other than that? Good luck finding a difference.

Neither one wants anything to change except more economic motion to the right.

[whathehell]

22. +100. nt

[hifiguy]

27. Damn straight.

They want more and more of that oh-so-sweet corporate MONEY!!!

The people can fend for themselves.

[Phlem]

32. You obviously don't know what's going

It's all about Hillary, the anointed one and.............................................what?

Were we talking about something?

Oh yea, Hillary, Hillary, Hillary. She's my BFF!!!

Squeeee!!!!

[bhikkhu]

40. From the February 2009 debates:

Hillary Clinton: "I have said that I will renegotiate NAFTA, so obviously, you’d have to say to Canada and Mexico that that’s exactly what we’re going to do. . . . Yes, I am serious. . . . I will say we will opt out of NAFTA unless we renegotiate it, and we renegotiate on terms that are favorable to all of America. . . . "

Barack Obama: "I will make sure that we renegotiate, in the same way that Senator Clinton talked about. And I think actually Senator Clinton’s answer on this one is right. I think we should use the hammer of a potential opt-out as leverage to ensure that we actually get labor and environmental standards that are enforced. And that is not what has been happening so far. "

But this was before the economic meltdown, and pragmatists will always adapt to conditions as they present themselves, keeping their core of good intentions. This can lead, fairly enough, to claims that they lied when they have to change their minds. I don't think renegotiating NAFTA was much of an option for Obama as he took office with the US shedding millions of jobs. I don't think it would have been an option for Hillary either.

With the TPP done (which could be taken as a renegotiation of NAFTA), its beside the point now. Of course, the paths not taken are very easy to argue over...

[Phlem]

49. ...

http://www.thomhartmann.com/bigpicture/third-way-panicking-over-bernie-sanders

http://www.thomhartmann.com/blog/2015/09/worldwide-anti-corporatist-backlash-has-begun
In Britain, the result was Tony Blair’s “New” Labour; in America it was Bill Clinton’s “New” Democrats.

http://www.politico.com/story/2009/03/obama-i-am-a-new-democrat-019862

And your trying to me Hillary is going to be any different? Look at her donors.

http://www.thomhartmann.com/bigpicture/third-way-no-way

[bhikkhu]

73. Not that Hillary is different, rather that circumstances changed

and the practical ways forward were very limited after the economic meltdown whoever was in office. A republican would have likely prolonged the collapse and screwed up the recovery badly.

Given the realities of running for high office here, I'm also less concerned about donors. When massive sums of money are required to run, its no big surprise that someone with a long political career has donors with massive sums of money. I'm voting for Sanders in the primary, but will support whoever wins the democratic primary unreservedly regardless.

[appalachiablue]

69. Amen.

[Recursion]

24. TPP *is* a re-negotiation of NAFTA

He's been re-negotiating NAFTA for his entire time in office.

[jwirr]

42. NAFTA is an agreement between Canada, USA and Mexico.

TPP deals with another agreement with South Pacific countries.

[Recursion]

44. But the US, Mexico, and Canada are in it, so if it passes it replaces NAFTA

It's very literally "a re-negotiation of NAFTA".

(And actually, from what I understand its literal format is as a series of bilateral agreements between each pair of the 12 countries, for a total of 66 actual treaties.)

[Egnever]

65. Shhh

It's a secret. Just look there's an article that says it's a lie.

[pampango]

70. Changing the terms of our trade with Canada and Mexico is, apparently, not "renegotiating" them

in the eyes of many.

[Recursion]

71. Especially amusing is that opposing the TPP means fighting for... NAFTA.

I'm out of step with most of the board on trade; I get that. Still, some of this still kind of strikes me as odd.

[Recursion]

25. And where is there anything about Mexico in that article? (nt)

[jwirr]

43. The article says the jobs are being moved to Mexico.

[Recursion]

45. Uhh... no.

Control F -> Mexico

"Not found"

The word "Mexico" does not appear in the article.

Some factories are closing in the US and Canada, and the production will remain within North America. Which, hey, might include Mexico, but we have no idea. Mexico in particular has become less attractive for manufacturing as automation continues because of its infrastructure problems.

Given the way automation works, there will first and foremost simply be fewer people working for Kraft, period.

[Hoyt]

47. No, the OP's title says that. The article does not.

[passiveporcupine]

48. What?

Production at the seven manufacturing facilities that are closing will shift to other existing factories in North America over the next two years, Kraft Heinz spokesman Michael Mullen said in a statement.

[Recursion]

68. It's not clear *any* factory is taking on more employees

If it's like how most of manufacturing is going, they're finding ways to produce the same amount of stuff with much fewer people.

[Initech]

29. So how much of a raise is Kraft/Heinz CEO going to get out of this?

[Phlem]

30. You already know the answer.

And people here support it.

[kelliekat44]

52. Now this is a big lie. nt

[pnwmom]

58. How could he have gotten a renegotiated treaty through Congress?

How do you know he didn't work with Congressional leaders to see what could be done?

[840high]

61. How do you know he even tried?

[pnwmom]

67. I'm not the one saying he's a liar. I'm the one asking for the evidence. n/t

[Recursion]

72. Well, I mean, by all signs he's about to.

The TPP negotiations, which will replace NAFTA if they are implemented, have been going on throughout his administration, and it's at least plausible that they will be signed and ratified.

[jeff47]

79. He's about to.

The TPP covers Canada and Mexico.

[blm]

76. The cuts are in management from what I've read, not factory workers.

.

[jeff47]

80. They're closing the factory. Where would the workers do their jobs? (nt)