In Case You Missed It: TOS and not advocating for the Democratic Party

[Purveyor]

From a thread in "Ask The Administrators". http://www.democraticunderground.com/12598967

Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground.

Isnt it a violation right now, today, if anyone says they will not vote for Hillary, if she is the nominee in the GE?

That is as simple as I can put it.

We know it comes in a variety of ways, Bernie or Bust (write in his name) or saying they wont vote or whatever.

Right now, if someone actually SAYS (as opposed to not saying it out loud) they will NOT support whoever the Dem candidate is, shouldnt they be banned now?

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Skinner (60,834 posts)

1. You are correct.

Based on the Terms of Service, we have grounds to ban anyone who states that they do not intend to vote for the Democratic nominee in any general election. There is a popular misconception that the "Vote for Democrats" rule only applies after a nominee has been chosen, but that is not correct. The use of the term "never" is intentional in the section you quoted above.

So the next question, of course, is why so many people have been permitted to claim here on DU that they won't vote for the Democratic nominee, and have not been banned for saying so. The reason is because the admins believe that most people who say this in the context of a contested presidential primary don't actually mean it. Some of them say it because they think threatening to withhold one's vote might be a persuasive argument in favor of their preferred primary candidate. (It isn't.) And in other cases they say it because they really believe it at that moment when they are caught up in the heat of the primary campaign, but once the primary is over they suck it up and do the right thing. We have seen this over and over again on DU after previous contested primary campaigns when the vast, vast majority of people went on to support the nominee.

The DU Terms of Service actually gives a nod to this and contains a clause that a certain amount of ambivalence toward Democrats is understandable:

During the ups-and-downs of politics and policy-making, it is perfectly normal to have mixed feelings about the Democratic officials we worked hard to help elect. When we are not in the heat of election season, members are permitted to post strong criticism or disappointment with our Democratic elected officials, or to express ambivalence about voting for them.

I want to be clear that that the Terms of Service remain unchanged, and members are still permitted to express their ambivalence about voting for the eventual nominee. The DU administrators have been allowing members a significant amount of leeway in our interpretation of that clause, but is a limit to how far we are willing to go.

Unfortunately, there are some people here who who say they won't support the nominee and actually won't. As we explained above, our feeling is that we want to give people the benefit of the doubt. But if you convince us that you actually mean it and you really aren't going to support the nominee, then we're going to treat you like you actually mean it. That person who started the OP telling people to sign the pledge that they won't support the Democratic nominee was very convincing, and is no longer a member of DU.

From the Terms of Service:

Democratic Underground is an online community for politically liberal people who understand the importance of working within the system to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of political office.

That's the bottom line.

[HassleCat]

1. A reasonable policy

DU can't have people who work in favor of the Republican Party, even if they express it in terms of refusing to support a particular Democratic candidate.

[MH1]

2. Thanks for the PSA, always a good reminder. (But since apparently I missed the fun...

... can someone post a link to the "pledge" thread that resulted in the poster being shown the door? Just curious which one it was.)

[Cali_Democrat]

3. Here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/128068973

[MH1]

4. Thanks. Wow, that was an old-timer. Should've known better.

I just don't get why people have to get so far out there in their hatred of a Dem. Sure she's not perfect. Neither is (gasp) Bernie. I lean more to Bernie's positions, but jesus-christ-on-a-trailer-hitch I wouldn't think for one second of helping the republican win. Hillary is nowhere near as nutjob-crazy as any one of the republican clowns, and while I think some progressive reforms would be on hold, maybe even go backwards with her, some things WILL improve and we damned sure wouldn't have the rapid descent into hell that the repukes will bring.

[CBGLuthier]

5. No, not a violation to say they will not vote for her. It IS a violation to say you will vote for

another candidate.

So, if she gets the nomination then I will not vote for president. Period.

Actually that is not true as the thought of a republican presidency disgusts me.


Oh, and so long as we got our wagging fingers out and are shoving them into everyone's face it is a violation of this forum's purpose to make meta posts. Just saying.

[Purveyor]

7. "it is a violation of this forum's purpose to make meta posts" Then alert on the fucking OP then

and get it locked if you so desire.

[pnwmom]

10. I think Skinner knows what a violation is, since it's his policy. n/t

[Lithos]

6. This is old ground...

This has been the policy from the earliest days. We used to consistently ban people who pushed this back when I was a moderator on DU1 and DU2 (2001+).

To be honest, any Democratic candidate of note is aces better than any of the clown car pukes running. Once the primary is over, we'll be down to a Democratic candidate vs whoever tops out from the clown car. Anyone who thinks otherwise is not thinking things thru. Fight hard during the primary for who you support, fight hard in the General for the Democrat as the alternative is many times worse.

Think before you post.

Lithos
- former DU moderator -

[Logical]

8. His board, he can do anything he wants. nt

[Astraea]

9. Take a chill pill

If you can't handle what someone says on a message board, maybe you should go to your corner and play with your jacks and pick up sticks.

[pnwmom]

11. Maybe you should get informed. Skinner, who wrote the response to the question

in the OP, is the owner of this site.

If you want to hang around, pay a little more attention.