After Paris attacks, watch out for massive Muslim hate everywhere.

[randys1]

I am seeing it here on DU, already.

I am seeing it on other boards, where people find me insane to NOT believe Muslims are the problem, etc.

Watch out for this.

[tishaLA]

1. in France, this is going to empower that horrible wretch Marine LePen

and that will be bad for everyone--here and there.

[drray23]

178. indeed.

The "front national" has about 25 % of the electorate already. They used to be a fringe group.

The upcoming local french elections next month will probably result in more gains from that hateful RW party.
I am really distraught over this state of affair.
I was born in France, I am a US citizen too and over the years I have seen old friends and even family members slowly shift towards espousing the views of this party. It all together easy for people to blame a scapegoat when they are handed one.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

2. Muslims in general are absolutely not the problem

Radicalized Muslims absolutely are the problem.

[hifiguy]

4. +1

And how do you tell which are which? There is the real question.

[smirkymonkey]

5. Yes, this is a problem.

The greater muslim community needs to speak out against this or it will look like they are complicit.

[hifiguy]

10. They won't,

any more than the reasonably sane xtian denominations speak out against the fundy freaks. Ultimately they all have skin in the same game, as utterly imaginary as that game is.

Religion kills.

[smirkymonkey]

33. What do you you think? I don't know what to think about this.

I want to be open minded, yet I am so angry about this. I feel so much hate. I am not proud about that, but it is honestly how I feel. I am mostly angry at the fact that these things make us hate even more. I don't like this. Not at all.

[hifiguy]

43. For the brainwashed/"faithful" nothing causes everyone under whatever tent

to band together and possibly even forget their differences for a while, than criticism, howevermuch justified, from "outsiders." It's human nature at its bloodiest and most primitive. And its most predictable.

"Someday we'll live on Venus, men will walk on Mars
But we will still be monkeys down deep inside"

- David Byrne, "The Facts of Life"

[DemocratSinceBirth]

95. I am mad at the people who did it, period.

EOM

[0rganism]

122. you've just been terrorized

your anger and hate are the desired responses of survivors, witnesses, and any around the world who see the reports.

the people who organized these attacks want you to hate. they want Europeans and Americans to become angrier and uglier, and elect right wing extremists who do stupid shit abroad and trash our countries' economies in the process.

the direct damage from their attacks is only the start - the larger share of damage continues in the aftermath. there will be so much death as a result of this, and it will only make the jihadists stronger.

i myself get mad in waves -- every so often i want to see every member of ISIS and Al Qaeda killed, painfully, and their bodies rolled in pig shit.
but what are the odds of that happening? in the end, it's all just pointless unfocused anger that makes it harder for me to go about my day in a calm, peaceful, rational way.
meanwhile, lots of innocents will be paying the price for the jihadists' activities.

[smirkymonkey]

184. I know. It's unfortunate. But I would be dishonest if I said that every time I saw someone

in a burka or similar islamic garb didn't frighten me. It does frighten me. I can't help it. I can't help but think they are all out to get us. I understand that is an ignorant way to think, yet I think that way. They scare me. I don't trust them.

[0rganism]

189. understood, just try to remember and take the long view

right now is probably not the time to try to deal with those feelings. rationality is in the back seat across the board at the moment, and we're headed into some very dark times.

[delete_bush]

138. +++. Exactly.

Except one of them is exponentially worse than the rest.

[hifiguy]

139. Agreed.

[LiberalElite]

150. I have to wonder if they do try to speak out

but it isn't covered by the complicit corporate MSM.

[shireen]

154. correct, they do speak out but

we don't hear about it.

ISIS and Al Qaeda do not practice Islam. They're a cruel demented cult.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

156. Innocent muslims are just that, innocent muslims. They should be left alone, in peace, regardless of anything they have to say.

[drray23]

181. are you serious?

Are you echoing FOX news? Muslims always reject this kind of senseless violence which has nothing to do with their religion. Of course, the media conveniently ignore this because its more sensational to show the other side instead and depict every muslim as an extremist.

When Scott Roader killed Dr Tiller did we demand that Christians denounce it ? I dont think so.

I did not have to look far on the BBC website or lefigaro or such to find articles about muslim community leaders finding this act of terrorism repulsive and rejecting it. So, just stop with the nonsense about the muslims not condemning terrorism.

[MsJaneFuzzyWuzzy]

148. how do you tell which are which?

Why, do they all look alike to you?

[hifiguy]

149. Not a question of "looks"

but what is in their heads. No one can tell whether any one individual is an honest, hard working immigrant or a fanatical lunatic. And the latter will deny that they are.

Which sums up the problem, now, doesn't it?

[MsJaneFuzzyWuzzy]

152. "honest, hard working immigrant"

You may be aware that most Muslims in the world - the enormous, overwhelming, vast majority of Muslims in the world - are not immigrants at all.

They are simply living their ordinary lives with their ordinary families, in the places where they were born, with no need for anyone to either patronize and condescend to them with their "honest, hard working immgrant" stereotype or suggest that they are in some way indistinguishable from a tiny, tiny, tiny handful of men who did something atrocious thousands of miles from where they are living their ordinary lives.

I will bet that most Muslims in the world have no difficulty distinguishing themselves from those men. And I doubt that they see much need to help you with your difficulty by organizing their lives around it.

[hifiguy]

162. Of course the vast majority are just that.

Just like the Latinos, Southeast Asians and the Germans, Swedes, Poles, Jews, Italians and Irish before them. But there are also fanatical religious lunatics among them who are willing to commit mass murder as an article of their own crazy "faith." Which was NOT the case with those other groups.

How do you suggest distinguishing between them? Let the plague rats in with the normal people looking for a new start and a better life? Nope.

[MsJaneFuzzyWuzzy]

173. I suggest you abandon your ethnocentric attitude

Just like the Latinos, Southeast Asians and the Germans, Swedes, Poles, Jews, Italians and Irish before them.

"Before them"? In what chronology? In the book of the USA, again. A book that is not of the least consequence to the vast majority of people, including Muslims, in the world. As I was attempting to point out. None of these people are "immigrants" except from your extremely self-centric viewpoint.

How do you suggest distinguishing between them?

I suggest you start by abandoning the notion that thee, thyself and thou are the center of the universe.

Every time I see this sort of thing I am put in mind of the reactions of some people - whether it would include you I do not know - to the idea that "all men are potential rapists".

Yes, you can't tell which Muslim in a million might want to behead you. You also can't tell which gun owner in a million might go postal, or which driver in a million might drive into your parade, or which hamburger in a million might have e. coli. Just as a woman can't tell which man in a million might sexually assault her.

So as an individual, you feel free to avoid any person or situation you like. As a society or state, you do your best to vet people in certain situations: licenses for car and gun owners, inspections for meat. And certainly, screening and oversight of immigrants. Not, usually, banning cars or guns or beef, or imposing curfews on men.

When situations arise in which there are other considerations - like humanitarian crises of gigantic proportions - you decide what risks to yourself are acceptable in order to reduce the risks to the many people whose lives are threatened directly, not just hypothetically.

If you decide "none", well, that's up to you. Not everyone will agree.

[hifiguy]

186. So any country should just let anyone and everyone in.

OK.

That's gonna work out just great.

My plague analogy still stands. There is no way to differentiate "normal" people from homicidal maniacs, and the one thing they share is religion, not race. Most Muslims are not homicidal international terrorists but virtually all homicidal international terrorists are Muslims. And that is ultimately the crux of the issue.

[MsJaneFuzzyWuzzy]

190. Yes! You got it! You are a genius!

That is exactly what I was trying to say and it just was not coming out right! Just let anyone and everyone in! Don't vet anyone - how stupid of me to have suggested that!

There is no way to differentiate "normal" people from homicidal maniacs, and the one thing they share is religion, not race.

The one thing they share, with me, at least, is that they are members of humanity.

I can think of many things I do share with you. We both speak English, for a start. I would hope that no one would exclude me from something on that basis because of your rather off-putting philosophy.

You do realize that your words are the very essence of bigotry, right?

Most Muslims are not homicidal international terrorists but virtually all homicidal international terrorists are Muslims.

Indeed!

As I am sure you are aware and would agree: most men are not rapists, but virtually all rapists are men.

Given this blatantly obvious fact, what action do you recommend?

Surely there is some way to cure the infection of rapists among us ...

[stranger81]

153. Radicalized Muslims are part of the problem.

The relentless Western interventionism, regime change, and bombings and drone attacks that create radicalized Muslims are another part of the problem.

We attack them. They attack us. We attack them. They attack us. And so on, and so on, ad infinitum.

[Blue_In_AK]

3. I totally agree,

and my heart goes out to the hundreds of thousands of Syrian refugees who will now be demonized.

[PatrickforO]

6. Trying to incite the hundreds of thousands of Syrian refugees

to violence across Europe was probably the plan. Because Europeans are going to oppress and do violence against them as a result of these attacks. I'm sure this is the intent of whatever organization is behind the attacks.

[randys1]

11. Look at this thread, my god. It has started already

[PatrickforO]

18. I'm not trying to demonize the Syrians. What I am saying, is that predictably,

European xenophobes will oppress and do violence against Muslims across Europe as a result of this act.

Then, think this through with me by putting yourself in the Muslims' shoes, they will be indignant because they were not responsible for this and will rightly resent Europeans who do violence to them.

This indignation will perhaps manifest in marches or isolated incidents of violence that may escalate.

Get it? I wasn't demonizing the Muslims, just the people like these terrorists who do violence and the people that will oppress peaceful Muslims because of this violence.

Get it now?

[randys1]

22. I wasn't talking about you, i was talking with you

[PatrickforO]

26. Oh....sorry.

Well, to paraphrase Tommy Lee Jones in MIB, "I don't have a sense of humor that I'm aware of..."

[randys1]

30. LOL -

[KittyWampus]

8. Well, not all Muslims are the problem. But Muslim extremists and their enablers

are a very large part of the problem.

And I've been predicting this since the beginning of the Syrian exodus.

DU'ers paid little/no attention.

[earthside]

49. Time to get realistic.

Last edited Fri Nov 13, 2015, 09:04 PM - Edit history (1)

Western powers are insane to be letting the Syrian refugees into their countries. (And I think the U.S. needs to extricate itself from the Middle East ... our presence there has been almost totally counterproductive.)

First of all because that takes the pressure off the Syrian, Iraqi, Turkish, Lebanese, Kurdish, Saudi governments to come to a solution.

Second because what is happening in Paris is exactly the results of a migration of Islamic and non-European cultures into Europe (and the U.S.?). This also demonstrates the need for cultural integration of immigrants into the lands into which they have moved.

Just like any religion, extremists become fanatical and right now we are seeing this for a variety of reasons in the Arab-Muslim world.

Of course, 99 percent of Muslims are just trying to live their lives like all the rest of us, but there is simply no denying the fact that Muslim radical fanatics are on a rampage in the Middle East and around the world ... in New York, Washington, Madrid, London, et al.

I am very sorry for this, but to preserve our liberal democracies it may be necessary to stop immigration into European nations and the U.S. from the Middle East; it may be necessary to face square-on the militancy of the radical faction of Islamic extremists.

[get the red out]

109. Thank you'

I agree with everything you stated so well.

[hifiguy]

121. I concur in every detail.

[Lizzie Poppet]

126. Absolutely.

I'd love it if more people here would remember that the people who commit these atrocities (and that portion of their greater culture which actively supports them) are profoundly reactionary, profoundly anti-liberal.

[DashOneBravo]

130. +1

[leftynyc]

135. Brave post

Surprised it wasn't alerted. Agree with every word.

[GoneOffShore]

142. Well said.

[shireen]

155. sad to hear that

There are good people in the Middle East who deserve a chance ....

The purpose of terrorism is to generate widespread fear and paranoia. We should not give in to it.

We may not be able to root out all fanatics, but the vast majority of ME immigrants will have a positive impact on our country. I would hate to see them denied entry because we're worried about a tiny fraction of fanatics.

As an immigrant myself, from a non-ME Muslim country, it hurts to hear comments like these.

[MsJaneFuzzyWuzzy]

182. sad to see no response to your post

I can't apologize for some of the comments here, but I feel ashamed for their authors.

[romanic]

160. +100

The ME needs to come up with a solution and then bring Islam into the modern ages.

[Quantess]

164. Agreed. (no text)

[darkangel218]

167. Hi Quantess! How have you been! I haven't seen you in ages!

[branford]

9. This will have VERY negative repercussions for the debate on the migrant crisis in Europe.

Right-wing groups across Europe will say that Europe cannot risk the influx of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of Muslims and Arabs, as even if only a tiny percentage are infiltrators or ISIS sympathizers, what happened in France could easily happen again anywhere. These ideas were already gaining traction, and tonight's tragic visuals will have a tremendous impact.

Angela Merkel's political fortunes have just taken a very negative turn.

[busterbrown]

14. Concerned that much of dumbed down electorate will

look to Carson, Trump or Rubio.. to lead our Country against the “Muslim World”..

[branford]

21. I don't believe the political impact will be that significant in the USA.

Our electorate is already polarized, and views of Muslims, Arabs, and terrorism in general are already long baked into the numbers.

President Obama has already spoken out strongly, and I imagine that the basic positions of everyone from Bernie to Cruz will not significantly differ. It's even quite possible that the Paris attacks will engender a short moment of strong bipartisan unity. Nevertheless, I do not envy any spokespeople for American Muslim groups over the next few days.

[FLPanhandle]

24. There will be no opening of the borders for refugees now

Nor do I think that is a bad decision anymore.

[clarice]

44. Political impact ?????!!!! Are you %$%$#@ kidding me????? nt

[branford]

55. Huh? I was specifically responding to a comment about the effect of the Paris attacks

on our electorate, and how it might benefit certain Republicans.

Moreover, discussions about political or religious repercussions, as set forth in the OP, certainly do not preclude or override the shock, horror and sadness of tonight's unfolding tragedy.

[clarice]

67. My mistake.....I apologize. nt

[hifiguy]

16. The problem is not unlike that of a virulent and contagious disease

for which there is no test. 5000 people enter a country. 4500 do not have the disease, 500 do. The havoc that can be wrought by the 500 who do is a valid justification for keeping them all out and sending them back where they came from. You cannot tell who is dangerous and who is not.

The humanitarian imperative is not a suicide pact. Nothing is that absolute.

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

183. I agree.

When hundreds of refugees are moved into a small German village, and 80% of them are men, it's a recipe for disaster. The same people who were opening their arms to the refugees are afraid now that they are living with them, because it only takes a handful to wreck havoc on society. And that handful is already causing trouble. And when the Germans take action, they will create more angry refugees.

Wash. rinse. repeat.

What is the solution?

[flamingdem]

102. Angela is toast nt

[branford]

112. Maybe not toast, but the political pressure is certainly growing to be less accommodating

to migrants and refugees.

However, Merkel has already been very slowly shifting in response to German domestic public opinion, with actions including expedited deportations and border closures, although many of the actions have been quietly implemented to avoid accusations of failure or surrender. The Paris attacks may actually provide her political cover to expedite and explain her political backtracking.

[philosslayer]

12. DU is ground zero for it right now.

It's disgusting.

[randys1]

13. it is an education for me, people who I assume are...well, never mind

[Scootaloo]

136. Seriously, you've just now seen it?

[busterbrown]

15. Link Please..

[philosslayer]

20. Here's an example

I postulated (very early) that perhaps this was a false flag operation to stir up hatred against Muslims and immigrants. Again, very early when no one know the scope of this. I was called several names, and my post was banned.

Other that that, I'm not going to do your homework for you.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

27. That's your proof?

That you're still annoyed you got shut down with your bullshit "false flag" nonsense?

Still believe that?

[randys1]

36. posts 2 , 4 , 5 , 10 for starters

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

42. So we are not allowed to talk about who did this?

Without it being hate? Even tagging them as "extremist" not good enough?

[Warren DeMontague]

93. Not unless it's a designated group that is pre-approved to talk shit about.

Bernie Sanders supporters, dudes with purple gingham shirts and fedoras, mac users... knock yourself out.

[hifiguy]

124. Well played, sir.

Well played indeed.

[snagglepuss]

111. Bullsh*t. ISIS has being very successfully stirring up hate towards Muslims and immigrants

on its own. Though Arab countries refusal to accept refuges have thrown fuel of the fire.

[delete_bush]

141. It was very clear, with I'd say

a 98% chance of being correct, that this WAS NOT a "false flag" operation.

[Codeine]

147. Your post was fucking stupid.

Your hide had nothing to do with hatred of Muslims and everything to do with the fact that you posted something utterly and completely idiotic, tasteless, and baseless.

[Nye Bevan]

23. I'm pretty sure that no link will be forthcoming.

I've read most of the Paris threads and only seen condemnation of Islamic extremists, not Muslims in general. And the only hidden post I have seen was one alleging that it was a "false flag" operation.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

28. To some people here, merely being upset at this attack is wrong

We should never get upset at any of these attacks, because, you know, Hedbo had it coming. Mitigating circumstances, etc....

[hifiguy]

187. Amazing, isn't it?

Disgusting, too. The "every viewpoint and belief is equally valid and legitimate" brigade are moral and intellectual bankrupts. Interestingly, they seldom if ever apply that maxim to loony fundy Xtians. They are roundly and rightly condemned. Perhaps it is some sort of self-flagellating form of white/western guilt. If so it is moronic and hypocritical beyond description.

Fundamentalist Muslim lunatics hate everything that is not contained in their 9th century mindset - except modern weapons and explosives - and the hate Western civilization and want to destroy it simply because it exists. It's a form of pure nihilism and a death cult. But it's very impolite to point out the blindingly obvious truth: that it exists and has been brutally operationalized in today's world only within one set of religulous fairytales.

[philosslayer]

29. Another post

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=7340374

Immediately attributing it to Muslims. Before anyone had any details. You don't think this is attributable to hatred of Muslims?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

31. And you dropped the word "extremist"

No shock, your intellectual dishonesty is noted.

[Marr]

127. +1

[SickOfTheOnePct]

32. No

I don't think it's attributable to hatred of Muslims. I think it's attributable to knowing that most suicide bombings in recent years have been completed by radicalized Muslims. It's a percentages thing.

[philosslayer]

34. Oh we go by percentages now.

Gooooood. Wouldn't want to base our comments on facts. That might be hard.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

37. Let's see

When you hear about an attack on abortion clinic, do you assume that it was probably a fundamentalist Christian? I know I do.

That doesn't mean I hate Christians, it means that we base our assumptions on previous experiences.

Oh, and anyone that started a thread about this being a false-flag operation doesn't get to lecture me or anyone else about basing comments on facts.

[randys1]

38. As long as one tenth of one percent are even thought to be bad, then we have

to distrust them all , it seems

[SickOfTheOnePct]

46. Where has anyone at DU said anything like that?

Link please.

[randys1]

62. 2 4 5 10

[SickOfTheOnePct]

70. No one in any of those posts

said anything like what you and your cohort in feigned outrage are claiming.

Care to try again?

[randys1]

89. Like saying how all Muslims must denounce? yeah, right

Give it up

[SickOfTheOnePct]

96. Give up

showing again and again and again how wrong you are in almost everything you've posted in this thread?

Nah, I don't think so.

[randys1]

101. so these comments werent made here? sure

2

4

5

10


gonna be there till the end of time, i hope

[SickOfTheOnePct]

103. Where is hatred of Muslims displayed in any of those posts?

I'm waiting.

[snooper2]

168. Do you think if we gathered up several thousand dollars to send you to Syria

You could have a couple sit downs and smoke a joint with some ISIS types, explain the World and ask them to stop please?

We could get a really nice hotel! somewhere around the area....maybe?

[randys1]

172. Your posts to me are sickening and you should be banned from this site

[melman]

88. You see what you want to see

as always.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

92. So true

I can't imagine living with the mindset that I'm going to assume the absolute worst motive/attitude in EVERYTHING.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

51. Do you go into threads and warn people not to blame ALL Christians.....

.....when a right-wing religious nut commits a hate crime against a Muslim or a homosexual?

I hope you do. I wouldn't, but then again I have no double standard when it comes to defending religious idiots.

[randys1]

56. Yep, here it comes....predictable

[SickOfTheOnePct]

57. No one on this site is as predictable as you are

New day, new contrived outrage.

[hifiguy]

188. Ain't THAT the truth?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

61. I'll take that as a no

Some forms of broad brushing don't bother you. Got it.

[climber3986]

120. your numbers are wrong

it hovers on average from 10%-30% with a few countries higher or lower

http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/07/01/concerns-about-islamic-extremism-on-the-rise-in-middle-east/pg-2014-07-01-islamic-extremism-10/

[GReedDiamond]

145. Sez the person who called this event a "false flag" attack...

...the mind boggles.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

35. It could have been soccer hooligans

Or maybe fans of this metal band. Sounds like some Aryan rock group.

Or of course, the CIA.

Just trying to help keep some options open.




I pray for the dead and wounded.

[AngryAmish]

113. As a small note, this is not a metal band

Kinda an indie type band. I saw them around 9 years ago, it was the last rock and roll show I will go to. David Bowie to Eagles of Death Metal.

[Nye Bevan]

40. No, because it had many similarities to the Charlie Hebdo attack, and was in the same city,

so this was certainly a reasonable assumption, and which of course proved to be correct. Also note that the post specifically said "Muslim extremists", not just "Muslims".

[FLPanhandle]

58. Hey, that's my post! I see you dropped the word Extremist though.

How do you expect anyone to take you seriously when you are dishonest?

[hollowdweller]

91. Not entirely.

I think it's because the majority of acts of terrorisim in western countries in the last 15 years have been by muslims.

People would just assume it was until it was proven otherwise.

Now in the US we would probably first assume it was some mentally unstable kid with an AR15.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

19. I have seen no Muslim hate here

Do you have a link? Thanks.

[Nye Bevan]

25. There isn't any, which is why no link will be forthcoming (nt)

[clarice]

45. What is disgusting? I hope to God that you mean the loss of life in Paris !!!!! nt

[Sebass1271]

100. And?

So much empathy towards Muslims but not at all towards Christians

Typical DU behavior

[leftynyc]

137. That's a broad brush

Plenty of sanity reigning on this.

[closeupready]

17. Oh yeah. Every time. I just spend less time here.

Let the haters talk to an echo chamber, and stop helping them waste my time.

[clarice]

39. The reilgion of peace. nt

[philosslayer]

50. It is actually

These monsters are 1% of 1%.

But your sarcasm and hatred is noted.

[clarice]

64. My God, where is your commpasion?????? nt

[philosslayer]

72. Where is YOUR compassion...

Towards the billions of Muslims who had absolutely NOTHING to do with this???

[clarice]

77. Right now...my compassion is with the hundreds of people that have ....

just been killed, supposedly in the name of a certain god.

[6chars]

94. Poll: 16% of French citizens support ISIS

(No breakdown by religion given)

http://europe.newsweek.com/16-french-citizens-support-isis-poll-finds-266795

One in six French citizens sympathises with the Islamist militant group ISIS, also known as Islamic State, a poll released this week found.

The poll of European attitudes towards the group, carried out by ICM for Russian news agency Rossiya Segodnya, revealed that 16% of French citizens have a positive opinion of ISIS. This percentage increases among younger respondents, spiking at 27% for those aged 18-24.

A recent Ifop poll placed French president Francois Hollande's approval rating at just 18%.

[hifiguy]

125. That is a deeply disturbing number.

And those people have no business being in France or anywhere else in Europe.

[GliderGuider]

144. These numbers seem to indicate that Hollande is probably facing

a well-entrenched underground resistance-style network of fighters and sheltered routes. At the moment it feels as though somebody out there in asymmetric-warfare land really has their shit together, and Hollande is in big trouble. And that means the big powers are going to line up over it. Sort of a Syria II, but on a lot more aggressive scale.

I don't like the tea leaves - we should all probably hang on pretty tight right about now..

[name not needed]

107. Yeah, a piece here, a piece there...

[randys1]

53. THere it is, amazing and wow

[philosslayer]

73. I'm glad i'm not the only one seeing it

n/t

[randys1]

76. The problem is their fear will drive them to make bad decisions, politically and otherwise

I am hearing now that refugee camp is being set afire.

This tiniest of tiny group of assholes, ISIS and Al Qaeda, can cause lots of harm to millions of wonderfully decent Muslims

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

79. "This tiniest of tiny group of assholes, ISIS and Al Qaeda......"

Sounds like anti- radical Muslim/Islamic hatred right there to me.

You just joined the club.

[randys1]

82. you are grasping...nobody is buying

I called them assholes, nothing religious

Anyone who kills innocents is an asshole, you disagree?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

85. I've been outraged all fucking night

While you're accusing people of being bigots for pointing out what is now obvious. Extremist Islamic radicals carried this out.

The bottom line is Al Q/ISIS says they are an Islamic group, and you're pulling out the defacto "No True Scotsman" defense.

[Live and Learn]

83. Yep. nt

[DesertFlower]

41. it's sad. you can't blame a religion for

the extremists. there are extremists in every religion.

be interesting to see what bill maher has to say tonight.

[clarice]

47. Bill Maher ?????? Are you 5%$%^& kidding me????? nt

[Blue_In_AK]

59. I won't be watching.

You KNOW where he's going to go with this. I think I'll even remove him from my DVR cue for tonight.

[AngryAmish]

117. Daesh is very popular among the Sunni tribes.

[Marr]

134. All religions are not the same.

I think you can argue that the western religions are easier to put in the service of militarism and conquest, compared to other prominent religions.

I also think it should be obvious that Islam is much more radicalized and violent today than any other prominent faith. Yes, there are extremists in every religion, but they have more sway in Islam than they have in today's Christianity or Judaism.

[B Calm]

165. G W Bush claimed he was on a mission for God.

Just sayn'. .

[Marr]

166. My point is not that violent fundamentalists only exist in certain religions.

My point is that they don't all enjoy equal influence and access to power.

GW Bush used every trick he could lay his hands on to get his invasion, yes-- including not-so-subtle appeals to Christian fundamentalists, suggesting his war was a new Crusade. He was also roundly condemned for it throughout the west. That same sentiment is made in reverse every day in mainstream Islam, and it's practically expected.

Whether the Quran and Hadith are easier to 'weaponize' than the Bible is debatable, but the west has gone through a whole series of cultural changes, from the Enlightenment to the Civil Rights Movement, that have done a lot to put religion in it's place, so to speak. The same hasn't happened in the Muslim world.

[pintobean]

48. Some people could find bigotry in a hockey puck

and they live for flinging accusations.

I haven't seen any of it, and no one has provided any examples.

[Warren DeMontague]

65. I find it funny that some people are, like, "we mustnt demonize groups of people"

No doubt they will get back to their regularly scheduled demonization of groups of people shortly.

But i hear you.

Ps, yr. not missing much.

[pintobean]

75. You made me lol

and thanks for clarifying. I took it wrong the first time.

[randys1]

98. I do admit I wont demonize all Muslims by saying garbage like all of them have to

denounce this

The greater muslim community needs to speak out against this or it will look like they are complicit.

And how do you tell which are which? There is the real question.

pe the posts I have been referring to...dont know why I even bother

[Warren DeMontague]

115. I won't demonize all Muslims, either.

But then I don't spend the rest of my time demonizing "brogressives" (your worst enemy!), or evil Bernie Sanders supporters who are racist, misogynist, volvo driving fedora-wearers and who are BERNIE SANDERS'S BIGGEST PROBLEM, either.

[Alittleliberal]

131. +1

[SickOfTheOnePct]

54. No shit

"and they live for flinging accusations. "

[jberryhill]

63. That's what the terrorists intend to provoke - hate

[randys1]

68. Happening already and gonna get way worse. They know that while they are

the tiniest of tiny percentage of the ONE BILLION Muslims, that they can easily frighten people into comments like

"Well all of them better denounce this otherwise they will look guilty"

i read that here, and I cant believe i read it here, but i did

[jberryhill]

78. That's very unfortunate

People need to learn not to play the game the terrorists want.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

80. When you read through the thread

You'll see that there has been zero hatred towards Muslims.

All such claims are figments of a couple of very active imaginations fueled by a drama-llama complex.

[jberryhill]

86. Been reading Twitter

I hope cool heads prevail.

[snooper2]

169. your numbers are off... a bunch...but you can continue to be an apologist for extremists

I guess they need somebody on their side here right

[randys1]

171. Your posts to me are sickening and you should be banned from this site

[snooper2]

174. because I admit there are 10's of thousands of fundie assholes who hate everything "West"

Can't reason with somebody who has been brainwashed for 20 years of their life-

How the alerts working for you?

[randys1]

175. Because you said this

Do you think if we gathered up several thousand dollars to send you to Syria

You could have a couple sit downs and smoke a joint with some ISIS types, explain the World and ask them to stop please?

We could get a really nice hotel! somewhere around the area....maybe?

Show me ANYWHERE I said anything remotely close to anything about implying I was giving the terrorists a break for what they did...

[snooper2]

180. It's implied, you keep saying the tiniest of a tiny amount of Muslims

Maybe I just need to explain your numbers are wrong-

Polls in the UK, in Germany, in France, show that anywhere from 10-25% of the Muslims in those countries approve of ISIS and approve of attacks-

And yes, their religious leaders do need to denounce it. Just like people here wanted Christians to denounce shit like the Charleston church shooting.


What ISIS is doing is WRITTEN in their holy book, they are literally following it. Should I post passages people here usually ignore? Christians for the most part stopped literally following their holy book hundreds of years ago. Now the vast majority just give it lip service.

This is why I ask the religious here, Hey, you going to go out and shoot your neighbor for working on Sunday? Never get a response. Because they don't literally follow it. Because deep down they know it is thousands year old mythology, and most of it is, well- BULLSHIT.

[Live and Learn]

84. And people play right in to their hands. nt

[geek tragedy]

66. maybe they were showing cartoons at the theater nt

[maryellen99]

69. Worried about Obama's safety too

Especially when you have 30-40% of the population who's batshit crazy thinking he's a Muslim in cahoots with ISIS.

[randys1]

71. Now that you mention it, in the past 30 minutes the HATE of Obama

on the one site I am posting on is ramping up

[LittleBlue]

74. People taking literal interpretations of Islam are the problem

The watered down version is fine. The literal versions is responsible for the Paris attack and Syria.

[Warren DeMontague]

81. Nah. Those people aren't your enemy, silly!!!!!

"Brogressives"- now, THOSE are your enemy.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

87. Eagles of Death Metal sounds very violent

Do Brogressives listen to them?

[Warren DeMontague]

90. the real problem here is free speech, no doubt.

I am 98% certain someone will show up in a few days with an authoritative-sounding bullshit and babble wall o' text thesis condescendingly explaining to DU why that is the case.

[LittleBlue]

116. Yeah those damned brogressives strike again

[Warren DeMontague]

119. YOUR WORST ENEMY

killing hundreds of people in paris is bad, sure... but eye rolling at a blogger while wearing a purple gingham shirt is UNACCEPTABLE!

[Sebass1271]

97. In general Muslims are not BUT the

People in the Muslim community in high power DO NOT condemn the terrorist actions - they stay MUTE!!!

So- there IS a problem in that community when they stay SILENT- it shows sign of support to the barbaric acts being committed under the name of religion. Their religion.

Lastly- what I have seen happened all the time with them is they play the race card and the "you are at attavking me" and go on the defense instead of speaking out strongly against what is being done.

This is also a lesson for a lot of DUERS HERE who constantly feel empathy towards Muslims and NO SIGN of same towards CHRISTIANS.

[randys1]

104. Wrong

[Sebass1271]

106. Who are you? And? What makes you

To be right? It's happening and we have seen it happening so..

[hifiguy]

140. Links or it's BS

and not to one or two isolated muslim clergy.

[shireen]

159. yes, they do condemn it

Reactions are coming ...

What Muslims Are Saying About The Paris Attacks
http://muslimmatters.org/2015/11/14/what-muslims-are-saying-about-the-paris-attacks/

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/reaction-world-paris-attacks-35195752
This link has condolences from Iran, Persian Gulf countries,

I'm sure you'll find more statements tomorrow but you'll have to dig deep in Google to find it.

You won't hear about it in the MSM.

[AngryAmish]

99. And watch for massive moral posturing on DU.

The fucking line will be long.

[ibegurpard]

105. Pamela Gellar is salivating right now

[PersonNumber503602]

110. The people behind this attack just doomed many refugees who are trying to flee.

[Cali_Democrat]

114. Yup.

[restorefreedom]

118. shep smith reporting arson

at one of the large syrian refugee camps in france...in other words, victims being attacked wtf...

[clarice]

123. I say that we should be wary of all Irishmen, They could be behind all of this. nt

[Joe Turner]

128. How many more times do Western countries have to endure

this kind of terrorism before the realization that Islam is the problem. I want to know. Seems pretty clear to me.

[Kilgore]

129. Shep Smith showing photos of the carnage

Absolutely horrific.

[TeddyR]

132. So I'm not aware of any religion other than Islam

Whose adherents are responsible for terrorist attacks killing thousands over the last decade -- Paris tonight, 9/11, the Madrid train attacks, London underground, Charlie Hebdo, Beslan school attack, Mumbai, USS Cole, Sharm el Sheikh.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

133. K&R

[MellowDem]

143. Islam, like Christianity, is an explicitly...

Bigoted, hateful, misogynistic, homophobic, genocidal religion. It's all laid out quite clearly in the Koran and hadiths.

Islam is a problem. Christianity is too, but Christianity has been utterly neutered by secularism, there are no more "Christian" governments. Not so for Islam, so you combine a religion with the power and institutions of government, and you get very powerful, wealthy extremist groups that can fund terrorism and genocide across the globe.

If this turns out to have been based on some strain of Islamic thought, it is yet another opportunity to criticize those parts of Islam that push hatred and violence, and even the religion as a whole for even allowing such hateful parts to be part of the overall ideology. Just like we would with any other ideology.

Religion is extremely privileged in our society. You can identify with explicitly hateful, bigoted religions in our society and expect others to give you the benefit of the doubt that you choose not to follow those explicitly hateful parts of the texts you claim to follow. That privilege keeps honest criticism of religion from being allowed, criticism any secular ideology with similar tenets would surely face.

[snagglepuss]

146. Very well said especially that religion is so privileged in our society.

No one would endure someone claiming their favorite politician is beyond criticism and that everyone must be respectable of the esteem in which they hold their fav pol. and not say anything that would offend sensitivites.

Really why do people feel religious beliefs have special status?

[hifiguy]

151. Your post is both wise and brave.

Extremely well said and 100% truth.

Even flat out madness is excused in the name of "religious tolerance." Which is itself profoundly bent logic that can turn such "tolerance" into something resembling a suicide pact.

[6000eliot]

157. Not because Christian extremists wouldn't like to return to religious rule.

[MellowDem]

163. They would, and we have plenty...

of examples in the US, which is why we have to be so vigilant.

[brewens]

158. I will actually probably be seeing some scared kids, or not. They may actually be to scared to come

around. I mean some of the nicest, polite, friendly college kids you could ask to meet. And I mean without exception. I work blood drives at a couple major college towns and universities. I can't say I ever remember a kid from that part of the world being the least bit snotty or trying to play being a badass. They are always exceptionally respectful and it's always been that way.

Go back to the late 70's when I went to school with a pretty good bunch of Iranian kids. Now those guys were a different breed. I mean that in a good way though! They were partiers, going nuts on their parents money over here! I loved those guys! Once the accounts got frozen with the Iranian hostage crisis, most of them left. One guy name Javad ( I can't spell his last name) worked on an asphalt crew with me one summer. Another buddy knew the companies bosses kid and got him on. He was the only one I knew that stayed and became a citizen. He's like a big time equipment operator that they send all over the northwest to run the big track hoes on tough jobs. I've sen him in action. That guy can tie his shoes with one of those!

[backscatter712]

161. I don't hate Muslims.

I do fucking hate ISIS. As far as I'm concerned, if ISIS thugs want to act like animals, it's time to start treating them like animals.

Kill them. Kill ISIS. I'm fine with military force against the fuckers. Hunt them down like animals and kill them like animals. They're impossible to reason with.

It's time for more force.

[davidpdx]

170. I think there is going to be backlash, particularly in France

I hope all religious communities stand together against such actions and condemn violence.

[drray23]

176. unfortunately already started

Last night in France, the refugee camp in Calais (near the eurotunnel) was set on fire.

[Stuart G]

177. Hate is contagious..don't ever underestimate it. It isn't new and it's vicious. no text

[randys1]

179. I wonder if prosecuting Bush and Cheney would make a difference in this mess.

[odd_duck]

185. You mean MORE Muslim hate....

[Rex]

191. You mean like this hidden thread?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027344826

I see the usual suspects are denying it ever happened. Boy they sure do work fast.