From The February Atlantic: What ISIS Really Wants

[HuckleB]

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/

"...

Our ignorance of the Islamic State is in some ways understandable: It is a hermit kingdom; few have gone there and returned. Baghdadi has spoken on camera only once. But his address, and the Islamic State’s countless other propaganda videos and encyclicals, are online, and the caliphate’s supporters have toiled mightily to make their project knowable. We can gather that their state rejects peace as a matter of principle; that it hungers for genocide; that its religious views make it constitutionally incapable of certain types of change, even if that change might ensure its survival; and that it considers itself a harbinger of—and headline player in—the imminent end of the world.

The Islamic State, also known as the Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham (ISIS), follows a distinctive variety of Islam whose beliefs about the path to the Day of Judgment matter to its strategy, and can help the West know its enemy and predict its behavior. Its rise to power is less like the triumph of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt (a group whose leaders the Islamic State considers apostates) than like the realization of a dystopian alternate reality in which David Koresh or Jim Jones survived to wield absolute power over not just a few hundred people, but some 8 million.

We have misunderstood the nature of the Islamic State in at least two ways. First, we tend to see jihadism as monolithic, and to apply the logic of al‑Qaeda to an organization that has decisively eclipsed it. The Islamic State supporters I spoke with still refer to Osama bin Laden as “Sheikh Osama,” a title of honor. But jihadism has evolved since al-Qaeda’s heyday, from about 1998 to 2003, and many jihadists disdain the group’s priorities and current leadership.

...

Nor, in the case of the Islamic State, its religious or intellectual appeal. That the Islamic State holds the imminent fulfillment of prophecy as a matter of dogma at least tells us the mettle of our opponent. It is ready to cheer its own near-obliteration, and to remain confident, even when surrounded, that it will receive divine succor if it stays true to the Prophetic model. Ideological tools may convince some potential converts that the group’s message is false, and military tools can limit its horrors. But for an organization as impervious to persuasion as the Islamic State, few measures short of these will matter, and the war may be a long one, even if it doesn’t last until the end of time."


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Many factors are at play, including, and maybe most importantly, the stupidity of attacking Iraq in 2003, but it does appear that this is not going to be an easy road for the world at large.

[tabasco]

1. They are crazed barbarian murderers who will never live in peace and must be eliminated

Ain't religion just peachy?

[CJCRANE]

2. But still, it's weird that its nondemocratic neighbors

think that installing an islamist democracy on Syria is more important than defeating Isis.

Since the collapse of Libya, sectarianism in Iraq and installation of Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, I don't think much of this so-called democracy we're spreading.

[smirkymonkey]

3. They are a sick death cult.

They must be obliterated. And so must all their supporters.

[Hydra]

4. This is a long but interesting read

If it is factual, it cuts through a lot of the propaganda to show what a huge (and long lasting) problem this poses.

[HuckleB]

5. Indeed. The hard part is truly finding what's fully factual about the group.

[hifiguy]

6. A worldview based on 9th century religious idiocy

combined with modern weapons and tactics. No way can that end well.

Maybe Pooty-Poot will lob a few tactical nukes in their direction. He's enough of a hard-ass to do it.

[HuckleB]

13. Indeed. -eom-

[tishaLA]

7. I remember this piece getting criticism when it came out

but I thought it was the smartest, best thing I'd read about ISIL. It's a very important article.

[HuckleB]

9. Indeed. I wish it was very off base, but I don't think it is.

[boston bean]

8. Thanks for linking to the article. Very informative. nt

[Yorktown]

10. "The reality is that the Islamic State is Islamic. Very Islamic."

The Holy books (Quran, Bible) are so loosely written and contain so many exhortations to violence that they can lead to the theologically correct birth of frankensteins like ISIS.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

11. It's difficult to fight people who place no value on this world n/m

[HuckleB]

16. Exactly.

[CJCRANE]

12. I remember how Bin Laden stated that he wanted to bankrupt America

and more recently how ISIS wanted to send a wave of 500,000 refugees into Europe and infiltrate terrorists among them.

It's strange how they foreshadow what they are going to do and how our western leaders somehow go along with their agenda.

[smirkymonkey]

17. Well, things seem to be going according to plan.

We are being played.

[HuckleB]

18. What's interesting, of course, is that ISIS doesn't seem to be dong well with infiltrating refugees.

One has wonder if that was just another attempt to terrorize people. Well, it's working.

[CJCRANE]

19. We might not know for a while. They can be very patient. They seem to wait for special dates

like Halloween and Friday 13th. They chose to wait for those dates for their own reasons.

[HuckleB]

20. They seem to have plenty of people to attack via other modes of entry.

A classic "look over there" routine becomes easier to use the more jingoistic the world gets.

[treestar]

14. if they consider the brotherhood apostates

we are in big trouble.

That was where the idea came from, Muslims insufficiently Islamic were to be treated as infidels.

So Americans consider themselves to be in danger, but they are not nearly in as much danger as Muslims living over there.

[HuckleB]

15. Indeed.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/saudi-arabia-ashraf-fayadh-death-sentence-apostasy_564f5cf9e4b0879a5b0acfc6

[CJCRANE]

21. It's basically the Sunni Inquisition.

It's like the Inquisition and witch-hunters were to Christianity: even if you were a believer they could brand you as a heretic and do what they want.