Mother Jones: "Liberals Should Knock Off the Mockery Over Calls to Limit Syrian Refugees" (UPDATE)

[ericson00]

Last edited Wed Nov 18, 2015, 10:32 PM - Edit history (1)

http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2015/11/liberals-should-knock-mockery-over-calls-limit-syrian-refugees

Mocking Republicans over this—as liberals spent much of yesterday doing on my Twitter stream—seems absurdly out of touch to a lot of people. Not just wingnut tea partiers, either, but plenty of ordinary centrists too. It makes them wonder if Democrats seriously see no problem here. Do they care at all about national security? Are they really that detached from reality?

The liberal response to this should be far more measured. We should support tight screening. Never mind that screening is already pretty tight. We should highlight the fact that we're accepting a pretty modest number of refugees. In general, we should act like this is a legitimate thing to be concerned about and then work from there.

Mocking it is the worst thing we could do. It validates all the worst stereotypes about liberals that we put political correctness ahead of national security

Update: here's a list of more Dems who are calling for a potential pause in admitting refugees (yes I know its newsmax but still worth looking at)

[FLPanhandle]

1. I've been saying that from the beginning.

Instead of addressing the valid concerns most Americans have, liberals just mock them.

Not an intelligent approach.

Why not address the concerns?

[ericson00]

4. the politics of contrarianism

if GOP says A, liberals say B. If Democrats say C, conservatives say D. Rinse, repeat.

Sometimes, our safety, be it economically, or physically, is too damn important!

[Hortensis]

21. That and just plain silliness. Like the "What could terrorist do to us

we don't do to ourselves?" thread before some with at least one foot on the ground weighed in.

[LonePirate]

78. Valid concerns?

The concerns are valid in the sense that people have them. The concerns are not valid in the sense of legitimacy, American ideals or history.

Nobody likes being talked down to; but some of us have reached a point where we are fed up with the idiocy and hatred that are pervasive in this country, especially from the reactionary right. Opinions and behaviors like those have long worn out their welcome. Why should intelligent, level-headed Americans coddle such nonsense?

[edhopper]

2. I don't think the liberal response

from people like Sanders, Warren and Obama has been mocking at all.

Mockery on twitter, on the other hand, is it's bread and butter.

Drum shouldn't mix the two up.

[Waiting For Everyman]

6. Obama did it too.

For example:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027357502

So no, it's not just twitter and social media. The total disregard came from the top.

[edhopper]

10. Those are some

great lines.

[G_j]

60. disregard for what?

the grandstanding of a bunch of cowards?

[Blue_Tires]

84. +1...

[KamaAina]

70. That particular concern was pretty ridiculous

in light of the fact that not a single toddler has been fingered in the paris attacks.

[razorman]

58. I think the mockery has been coming from other (past & present) politicians and some media.

The current candidates, for the most part (on both sides), seem to have enough sense to hold back on this for the moment. Everything is in flux, and can change at any moment. Rash statements can quickly come back and bite. Look at the reaction to President Obama's statement about ISIS being "contained", the day before the Paris attacks. Unlucky timing.

[NaturalHigh]

3. Agreed, but common sense is in short supply on both sides.

[KG]

5. I lulz'd

[earthside]

7. Liberals, Democrats, Pres. Obama should knock off this whole issue.

Having a political cat fight over Syrian refugees is a loser. Period.

129 people killed in Paris; an airline blown-up in Egypt; 43 killed in ISIS attack in Beirut ... and in the U.S. response is name calling over Syrian refugees?

I'm blaming Pres. Obama for a lot of this -- what is the Commander-in-Chief proposing or doing about this terrorism and violence?

Is his response to these terror attacks that the U.S. will let a few refugees into the country?

This is starting to really look bad for Obama and the Democrats.

[trumad]

9. So---keep our mouths shut and let the bigots say what they want---FUCK that stupid shit.

[FLPanhandle]

16. No is saying keep quiet

But acknowledging the public's concern and going into details of how the refugees will be vetted, why they are low risk, how they will be monitored, etc. would be far more effective and winning than mocking the public.

BTW, it's not just right wingers that have concern. If you look at the polls, most Americans have concerns. Address those concerns like an adult. Mocking their concerns will not win them over especially with less than a year to go until the election.

[randome]

41. What 'public'? You mean the loud-mouth GOP, right?

[hr][font color="blue"][center]Don't ever underestimate the long-term effects of a good night's sleep.[/center][/font][hr]

[bklyncowgirl]

45. Very good points. Remember the Ebola Scare. Dismissing and mocking fear does not work.

Lack of information and dismissing legitimate fears breeds paranoia.

Explain the vetting process.

Explain the importance of showing that America does not hate Muslims.

Be open to change if circumstances change.

That's what makes sense. Telling people they are idiots and bigots for being scared of Isis does not.

[FLPanhandle]

53. Exactly

Pity so many here can't think and act like adults on this topic.

[magical thyme]

19. No, not keep our mouth shut. Ignore the hype, address the real concerns and talk like

grownups.

Security is absolutely a valid issue.
Integration into US society is absolutely a valid issue.

I live in a small, poor, northern rural state that had Somalian refugees sent to us. We struggle to take care of our own, and then were made to take in a large number of people from a very hot climate who didn't speak the language and know zip about our culture.

It was a very real strain, both socially and financially. A p/t co-worker of mine was a p/t (now f/t) social worker at a government agency. His direct experience:

>The people coming here didn't know how to dress for winter -- walking down snowy sidewalks in freezing, sub-zero weather wearing flip-flops and shorts and ending up sick as a result.
>Newly arrived didn't always know to use bathrooms -- the waiting room where he worked reeked of feces and urine because people would relieve themselves right into the chairs they were sitting in. So there was unexpected, very unpleasant added work and expense cleaning and sanitizing throughout the day.

My personal experience:
>They didn't speak English. The state university had to accomodate them in the program I was studying in, with extra assistance getting through it.
>Many brought malaria with them, so our microbiology clinical training had to add that disease to its focus on locally prevalent diseases.
>They were supported and went to school free. I had to take out massive student loans and work p/t in the same program. We then competed for the same, limited and shrinking, number of jobs. They were preferred candidates, so as many as half of my classmates lost out big time.
>My training in the hemotology dept. where I worked was conducted in part by a Somali employee who didn't speak English. I struggled to understand him. Doctors and nurses struggled to understand him. He was very good at what he did, very nice, and I really admired and respected him. But he couldn't help my training very much at all.

[edhopper]

11. What would you propose

sending in the army?

That worked so well in Iraq.

Or have the 6000 airstrikes by the US so far not been enough for you?

[Darb]

14. Ridiculous comment.

You are bathing in the bullshit of the right wing. Why do you ask what the President is going to do about it just like a loony would. The President has been doing plenty about it for a long time and has said that it would be a long drawn out engagement. He is doing pretty much what I think he should do and what are you doing? Second guessing them. Only the baggers think the president is doing nothing. What do you think?

"That is really starting to look bad for Obama and the Democrats"? Who the fuck are you?

Concern noted.

[earthside]

20. I'm just offering a political opinion.

Trying being a bit objective.

People are being killed by ISIS terrorists around the world and the top issue is not what are we going to do about it vis-a-vis Paris, but about how many Syrians we are going to let into the U.S. next year?

I guess I want a pro-active response to the Paris massacres, the downing of the airliner, and the Beirut bombing from our leaders.

Be dismissive of my concerns if you want, but I am merely saying that this refugee cat fight is going to take a turn that will make the President and Democrats look like they just don't take the ISIS terrorist threat seriously.

[Darb]

33. Here's what will happen, just like the ebola bullshit that was parroted here as well.

A year from now it will be obvious that ISIS will be in rapid decline (they already are losing ground). That the approach of Obama, and our allies, will have pushed them into a corner and it will pretty much be over. Lots and lots of those clowns will be dead and the argument will move to where are we going to put them. Many refugees will want to return, some will want to stay here or wherever.

The repube cowards will have moved on to something else to try and scare the voters into voting for them, never mentioning the fact that Obama was right again and won again.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

[earthside]

38. I tend to agree with your analysis.

It being a presidential election cycle and the unpredictability of terrorist acts makes me want Democrats to be more focused and, well, calculating.

I've always had this complaint about Obama: he doesn't crow enough about his accomplishments ... and while usually that works out okay, in this case I think he ought to fully explain to the American people what he has done and what he wants to do. Because if there is a terrorist attack or incident inside the U.S., we need it to be very clear to the American people what the administration has been doing -- we can't take it for granted that they know.

And, frankly, I'd rather see the argument moved away from refugees and on to what the hell the Repuglican Congress has NOT been doing as far as a 'use of force' resolution for Syria/ISIS. It is the Repuglican Congress that has purposefully been irresponsible of their Constitutional duty to debate the use of military force.

[Waiting For Everyman]

15. Completely agree

[Doremus]

27. Want to know who we should emulate?

Hollande: France Will Still Take In 30,000 Refugees In Next 2 Years

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/hollande-france-plans-to-take-in-30000-refugees-over-two-years_564c78bae4b06037734bb934

The French president, and much of the French citizenry, are afraid of no one. They make US hardliners and many Americans, look like sniveling babies.

Let's grow up and grow a set, shall we? It's just this type of hysterics that gave us Iraq and 12 years of nonstop war.

[Jim Beard]

62. Syria is a very, very complex situation.

There is not very many we can back. I like the way the Kurds fight but there are drawbacks to them. All but one other faction the US is backing are not in our best interest. I don't like Assad but Lord Forbid who would take his place.

[KamaAina]

71. Which is the other faction of which you speak?

[trumad]

8. Come on---

When you got dumb asses in Texas saying that Refugees shouldn't be allowed in because it's easy to obtain guns---that deserves full fucking on Mocking.

Concern trolling from Mother Jones. PLEASE!

[ck4829]

42. Yep "How dare you highlight our own hypocrisy and not thinking things through, it's mocking to us!"

It seems as though the discourse is getting so bizarre, when the right uses mocking, they usually embrace it and they themselves say they're NOT being politically correct.

When a liberal does it, it's something to run away from but somehow it's also 'politically correct'.

It sure seems as though a lot of mental gymnastics are being performed here.

[Erose999]

69. +1

[Jesus Malverde]

86. Some would then restrict their gun ownership

And other freedoms more so we have less risk. The privacy of Americans will be up next. We'll need another patriot act, more government spying, etc.

It's a win for some people.

[BootinUp]

12. I think responses should be thoughtful

and forceful. I think Obama, Clinton, some of the Dem Governors (Governor of Ct. for example) took the right tone. The author makes a good point. Mocking alone probably not going to be helpful.

[bigtree]

13. MoJones needs a reality check on the fearmongering about Syrian refugees

...here's one:



and, another:

Peter Bouckaert ‏@bouckap
'Confusing refugees with terrorists is morally unacceptable and, as a matter of strategy, misguided.' @nytimes http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/17/opi

[Kurska]

29. Boston bombers, literally off the top of my head.

"Tamerlan was left in the care of his uncle Ruslan in Kyrgyzstan,[22] and arrived in the U.S. around two years later.[41] In the U.S. the parents received asylum and then filed for their four children, who received "derivative asylum status".[42] They settled on Norfolk Street in Cambridge, Massachusetts. Tamerlan lived in Cambridge on Norfolk Street until his death.[43]"

[magical thyme]

37. yup. They emigrated to the US in 2002.

[Erose999]

72. The Boston bombers were just kids at the time of their asylum. The older one was 16 in 2002 when

they moved to the US. And it was HERE that they were radicalized by hatemongers, including right-wingers like Alex Jones.

[magical thyme]

80. not exactly. it's uncertain whether he was radicalized in the US or in Dagestan.

...a YouTube channel in his name linked to Salafist[185] and Islamist[183][187][188] videos. The FBI was informed by the Russian Federal Security Service (FSB) in 2011 that he was a "follower of radical Islam."[187] In response, the FBI interviewed Tamerlan and his family, and searched databases, but did not find any evidence of "terrorism activity, domestic or foreign."[189][190][191][192][193][194]

During the 2012 trip to Dagestan, Tamerlan was reportedly a frequent visitor at a mosque on Kotrova Street in Makhachkala,[195][196][197] believed by the FSB to be linked with radical Islam.[196] Some experts believe "they were motivated by their faith, apparently an anti-American, radical version of Islam" acquired in the U.S.,[198] while others believe the turn to radicalism happened in Dagestan.[199]


Some analysts claim the Tsarnaev brothers' mother, Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, is a radical extremist and supporter of jihad, who influenced her sons' behavior.[209][210][211] This prompted the Russian government to warn the U.S. government about the family's behavior, on two occasions. Both Tamerlan and his mother were placed on a terrorism watch list about 18 months before the bombing took place.[212]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Marathon_bombing#Motives_and_backgrounds

[Bluenorthwest]

43. The folks MoJo is chiding are folks who silently supported a 22 year immigration ban and travel

restrictions on persons with HIV coming to the US. That's a context that needs to be digested as straight folks decide to carry on as if they have always been guardians of the open door, as if their own baseless fears have not motivated the closing of those same doors. Imposed under St Ronnie and enforced under Clinton, it endured until Obama without so much as a concerted peep of protest from the straight or faith communities on behalf of persons with HIV.

So affecting that fear based discriminatory immigration policies are the purview only of Republicans is unsound historically and it is very self serving.

[Johonny]

47. Exactlly, Why would I think Obama wouldn't somehow have a good, ordered, methodical, intelligent

refugee policy and method? Why should I plan to Republican's fears? The whole article is pointless.

[magical thyme]

56. and here are a few who fortunately failed...

There is a fairly long list of failures, but info on whether they were on student or visitor visas, their family's emigrated or whether they were specifically seeking asylum or refugees is not always readily available.

Najibullah Zazi (born August 10, 1985) is an Afghan-American who was arrested in September 2009 as part of the 2009 U.S. Al Qaeda group accused of planning suicide bombings on the New York City Subway system, and who pleaded guilty as have two other defendants

Zazi was born in a village in Paktia Province, Afghanistan.[9] He has two sisters and two brothers.[9] At the age of 7 in 1992, he and his family moved to the city of Peshawar in Pakistan where they settled as Afghan refugees.[10][11]

In 1999, he and the family left Pakistan and immigrated to New York City in the United States.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Najibullah_Zazi


Shahawar Matin Siraj is a Pakistani-American who was convicted in 2006 of plotting to bomb the Herald Square subway station in Manhattan, New York. Siraj was arrested in 2004 and found guilty of terrorism conspiracy in U.S. v. Shahawar Matin Siraj (2006).[1] Siraj worked at an Islamic bookstore in Bay Ridge, Brooklyn. Over a period of several months in 2004 he was recorded by an FBI informer Osama Eldawoody plotting to plant a bomb in the 34th Street – Herald Square station of the New York City Subway.[2] He was sentenced to 30 years in prison in January 2007.[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shahawar_Matin_Siraj
The parents and sister of a man convicted of conspiring to bomb the Herald Square subway station were detained yesterday by federal immigration authorities, who have been seeking to deport them to Pakistan.

The family, who came to the United States in 1999, had been seeking asylum since 2003, citing religious persecution in their home country.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/10/nyregion/10plot.html?pagewanted=print&_r=0

Yassin M. Aref is a resident of Albany, New York, who was arrested by Federal authorities in August 2004 as part of a counter-terrorism sting operation, convicted in October 2006 of conspiring to aid a terrorist group and provide support for a weapon of mass destruction, as well as money-laundering and supporting a foreign terrorist organization, Jaish-e-Mohammed, and sentenced to 15 years in prison in March 2007.[

When Aref left Iraq as a refugee in 1994, he lived in Syria for 5 years. During that time he was approved by the UN as a refugee to be sent to a third country, which ended up being the US.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yassin_Aref

[Jim Beard]

65. Excellent post

One of the Garland Texas shooters was an American born Muslim who went to school in Pakistan for a while.

[magical thyme]

83. and here are dozens of terrorists let in as refugees, with 2 arrested

http://news.yahoo.com/terrorists-once-used-refugee-program-settle-us-201016834--abc-news-topstories.html;_ylt=A0LEVip63UxWO9wAuFonnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTEycXU4aDk2BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDQjExMTVfMQRzZWMDc2M-


Of the 31 states that have declared their opposition to taking in Syrian refugees, one state, Kentucky, has a specific reason to be wary of the background check process: previously two Iraqi refugees who settled in Bowling Green turned out to be al Qaeda-linked terrorists with the blood of American soldiers on their hands, an ABC News investigation found. Both pleaded guilty to terror-connected charges after trying to acquire heavy weapons while in America’s heartland.

The 2013 ABC News investigation also revealed that several dozen other suspected terrorist bombmakers, including some who were believed to have targeted U.S. troops, may have mistakenly been allowed to move to the U.S. as Iraq and Afghanistan War refugees,

[Rose Siding]

17. I'd argue that hate and cowardice hurts nat'l security worse than bigotry

Explain the thorough vetting process, then grab moral high ground. Hell, even stroke the exceptionalists with our goodness.

[phantom power]

18. Mother Jones is being stupid. Conservatives don't care how seriously we treat them.

Conservatives are the ones detached from reality, and attempting to take them seriously is just repeating the same fucking mistake Dems have been making for 30 years.

[Brainstormy]

23. Bingo!

Yours is the only post worth reading in this thread. Thumbs up!

[G_j]

25. word

[FLPanhandle]

26. Did you read the article?

It's focused not on the hard core Conservatives.

It's about addressing valid concerns of the centrist majority without mocking them and losing them.

[phantom power]

28. Another bogus premise that I reject. There is no "centrist majority."

[Jesus Malverde]

85. The centrist majority are conservative democrats

And socially liberal fiscal conservatives. They are demographics of both parties.

[jeff47]

31. 11% of the electorate are centrists

in that they are willing to vote for candidates of either party.

11% is not a majority.

[bklyncowgirl]

49. Like it or not it's these swing voters who determine national elections.

[jeff47]

50. Nope, they aren't.

That 11% splits roughly in half every election.

40% of the electorate are "marginally attached voters". They will always vote for one party, they just won't always vote. They are the people who determine national elections.

They are not centrists. In fact, the "Democratic" half of those voters are to the left of median Democratic voter. Aiming for "the center" turns them off and they don't vote. That's how we lost 2010 and 2014, and why 2012 was so much closer than 2008 - we aimed for the middle, and many of these voters stayed home.

Lazy media will often lump all of these voters together instead of separating them into "Republican-leaning" and "Democratic-leaning". Which results in an incorrect belief that they are centrists. Just like averaging Republicans and Democrats will give you an incorrect result that everyone is a centrist.

"The big middle" disappeared when the Southern realignment completed.

[Jim Beard]

67. I think its more than 11%

In U.S., New Record 43% Are Political Independents

PRINCETON, N.J. -- An average 43% of Americans identified politically as independents in 2014, establishing a new high in Gallup telephone poll trends back to 1988. In terms of national identification with the two major parties, Democrats continued to hold a modest edge over Republicans, 30% to 26%.

[jeff47]

74. "Political independent" does not mean they will vote for both parties.

For example, there's lots of people on DU who are not Democrats, yet will never vote for a Republican.

[smirkymonkey]

22. K&R

[Petrushka]

24. To some people, it's the same old "news"---No Room at the Inn . . . for Syrian Christian refugees!

http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/foreign-policy/228670-no-room-in-america-for-christian-refugees

[jeff47]

30. The first step in losing on an issue is to accept your opponent's framing.

Their advice is awful.

And it's exactly what we've done on a wide variety of issues for the last 30 years. Golly, I wonder why we keep losing elections.

[phantom power]

32. +1e6

[The2ndWheel]

48. So that's why debating an issue never changes minds

Nobody on one side accepts the other side as valid, because if they do, they've lost.

[jeff47]

55. :facepalm:

No, the article demands we accept that Syrian refugees are dangerous, and then we talk about what to do.

When we do the first part, the Republicans have won.

If you'd like other examples, "welfare reform" required Democrats to claim welfare queens were a huge problem, and then we could talk about reforming it. In fact, one of our candidates wrote a book that included talking up the "dignity of work".

When we accepted that, the Republicans won.

Spending on social issues? We have to accept that tax cuts always boost the economy, then we can talk about spending. And once again, the Republicans won.

Single payer? We have to accept that single-payer is completely unaffordable (despite it costing less in every other industrialized nation). Then we can talk about healthcare reform. Giving the Republicans yet another win.

Do you need more examples, or are you just going to throw out another strawman?

[The2ndWheel]

66. I'm just saying that's why no debate ever changes minds

I'm sure Republicans say the same thing about Democrats. Same with Israelis and Palestinians. Sunni and Shia. Northern states and southern states. If we accept their framing of the issue, then we can't win. That's the case with everything. Life is subjective. That's why wars have ultimately been the thing in human history that moves the ball down the field one way or the other. Nobody can agree, winner gets to make the rules. Otherwise we seem to end up in stalemates.

[jeff47]

75. So your opinion is government is impossible, and civil war is the only way societies change?

Yeah...history might show a wee bit different of a result.

[The2ndWheel]

82. Certainly at first

Once a civil war is won, it may not take physical war for society to change, depending on who won and which rules they come up with, but in the early stages of a nation, there are a lot of people and groups trying to figure out who gets to make the rules in a given society.

How many countries were founded on enlightened and vigorous debate in the public sphere?

[Kali]

34. oh bullshit

if anything needs mocking it is the chicken shit reaction of these tough-guy dickwads. wwwhhhhaaaaa brown muslims are coming to impose sharia law on us!!!!!11!!

they are clueless, xenophobic, assholes who have no shame, no compassion, no sense. they deserve mocking, ridicule, and shunning. too bad they aren't quite afraid enough to migrate out of the US!

[phantom power]

35. testify

[lame54]

36. Fuck your Mother...

Their heartlessness should be called out

By asking for a no-risk plan before allowing any refugees in they are calling Americans Cowards

[Rex]

39. All these years of endless crimes, one after another by the GOP. The destruction of the economy

and the family...but MJ is worrying about MOCKING SOMEONE!?! After millions dead in Iraq by our war machines...but yeah liberals MOCK someone! Oh dear!

Fucking bullshit unfreakingbelievable.

This kind of bullshit only HURTS the party, it never helps...it is on par with "both side do it" and "both sides are the same" garbage!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

40. Tsk. Tsk. We need to coddle the conservatives and moderates...they're soooo sensitive.

[Johonny]

44. This person's concern is noted. I will now go back to mocking zenophobic bigotry

because it should be mocked.

[TwilightGardener]

46. Agreed. I've been concerned for a while about the prospect of inadequate vetting of refugees.

If a Dem administration deliberately adopts a policy to take in more refugees than can be accurately checked and a terror attack results from that policy, it's going to kill the Dem party's chances for a long, long time.

[madville]

51. If some kind of attack happens between now

And election time and it is tied to recent refugees the Republucans will win pretty big come November. It will be 2002 all over again.

[TwilightGardener]

52. Yup.

[ericson00]

91. I don't even like to think how Bush woulda done had the 2004 election been in '02

it woulda been a 40 state sweep at least, given Kerry's ineptitude.

[Douglas Carpenter]

54. same thing can be said about mocking those who don't want blacks, gays and Jews in their

neighborhood when we should show some empathy for their legitimate concerns. Mocking these opinions has wrecked the Democratic Party and is political looser. Wake up liberals!!

[pampango]

57. Our president and all of our candidates urge tight screening along with compassion for the refugees.

We should support tight screening. Never mind that screening is already pretty tight. We should highlight the fact that we're accepting a pretty modest number of refugees. In general, we should act like this is a legitimate thing to be concerned about and then work from there.

Republicans don't want to admit any Syrian refugees despite tight screening. That deserves to be mocked since it "validates all the worst stereotypes about" conservatives.

Not sure why MoJo thinks Democrats should not mock republicans' hatred and xenophobia when our alternative is a compassionate and responsible policy concerning refugees.

[tblue37]

64. Can we at least mock Chris Christie for insisting he wouldn't consider even a 3-year-old Syrian

refugee orphan suitable for admission to his state?

Chris Christie is winning the a**hole primary with his callous refugee stance: Not even “3 year old orphans” welcome
http://www.salon.com/2015/11/16/chris_christie_is_winning_the_ahole_primary_with_his_callous_refugee_stance_not_even_3_year_old_orphans_welcome/

[HuckleB]

59. Mocking is never helpful. Alas, it seems to be growing with the age of the Internet. -eom-

[AZ Progressive]

61. Liberals shoot themselves on the foot with intellectual snobbery

It only pushes everyone else away from liberals.

[hifiguy]

63. Agreed 100%

So Mother Jones will be headed under the train in 10, 9, 8, 7 . . .

[Erose999]

68. Same writer supported the IWR in 2003. Same cynical neoliberal SHITE we heard back then. "Give the

neocons a pass, people are scared". "9/11 changed everything".

a year later the PATRIOT ACT had passed and the Iraq war clusterfuck that birthed ISIS had began.

I'll keep mocking conservatives, Kevin Drum, and you can fuck off.

[underpants]

73. Sorry, I call bullsh|t on bullsh|t

[gregcrawford]

76. "...we should act like this is a legitimate thing to be concerned about and then work from there."

What a total crock of the proverbial substance, Drum! Even calling their craven political posturings "valid concerns" or "a legitimate thing" affords them a level of credibility they do not deserve. You only make matters worse by cowering in the face of their bullying.

By this absurd reasoning, every political cartoonist in the country that hasn't gone over to the Dark Side should just say sweet, fawning things about pathological liars, or find a new line of work altogether.

Well, that ain't gonna happen. So I'm really sorry, Kevin (Psst! No I'm not!), but I will mock and ridicule these jerk-offs every chance I get because THEY ARE WRONG! And so are you.

[treestar]

77. Since they are based on bigotry, they are mockable eom

[Kelvin Mace]

79. Pants-wetting bigots

now called "centrists".

[Solly Mack]

81. No

[ericson00]

87. more Democrats are turning on this refugee thing: see the update link in OP

I really don't wanna see Trump elected, 12 million hardworking, assimilating undocs who do the jobs Americans won't get kicked out because people wanna act as if Islamism isn't a threat.

[Stinky The Clown]

88. Sage advice. Dems should listen.

No need to change policy because the policy, if not Obama's, would be a-okay to the xenophobes.

Liberals far too often look - as the write suggests - too concerned about political correctness.

[backscatter712]

89. Fuck that shit, I'm going to call cowards cowards.

When you're trying to turn away three-year-olds, like Chris Christie because you're afraid of Daesh, that makes you a fucking coward, and thus worthy of mockery and contempt.

[dembotoz]

90. would rather not repeat the ss st louis

maybe its just me