Restaurant manager responds to jerk church who left fake tip

[n2doc]

On Wednesday, we brought you the story of a restaurant employee in Charlotte, North Carolina who got cruelly stiffed by a religious pamphlet disguised as a twenty dollar tip.


The employee’s manager, the perfectly named Penny Craver, issued a righteous response to the proselytizing jerks who left her server the fake tip. After looking up the Harbor Baptist Church, which had printed its name on the pamphlet, Craver fired back with a letter to the church’s pastor Kenneth Simmons. Craver’s response highlighted the exact problems with the fake tips –they’re not money and they’re incredibly pretentious – and put it all in biblical terms that these sanctimonious church trolls can understand.

Pastor Simmons:

I am the general manager of Dish (restaurant) in Plaza Midwood. Imagine one of my server’s surprise when she received a small pamphlet (Every one of us will face eternity one day) instead of a tip when she served what I assume was one of your congregation. H er particular religious beliefs are not discussed at work; however, I do know that this pamphlet can not pay her mortgage or her electric bill. It concerns me that someone would consider a pamphlet fair monetary exchange. Suppose your congregation felt it was sufficient to tithe their personal writings instead of 10% of their income. Your church wouldn’t be paying their bills for very long. I think it would be great if you used this in a sermon. Pride, one of the 7 Deadly Sins, is considered, on almost every list, the original and most serious of the seven deadly sins: the source of the others. It is identified as believing that one is essentially better than others, failing to acknowledge the accomplishments of others, and excessive admiration of the personal self (especially holding self out of proper position toward God). I think it could be educational for at least one member of your congregation. Thank you very much for your time.

Boom.

Craver says this was the third or fourth time that particular employee had received one of the trollish fake tips and she felt she had to stand up for her.

more
http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/277909/penny-craver-slams-fake-tip-harbor-baptist-church/

[lpbk2713]

1. Isn't it unlawful to reproduce US currency?

And the church identified themselves.

[jeff47]

2. It's legal as long as it's different enough from a real bill.

For example, significantly larger or smaller than a real bill.

[lpbk2713]

6. OK, thanks.

That looks smaller. And of course the paper is different.

[jmowreader]

20. And it's only printed on one side.

[Tab]

40. To clarify, you mean physically larger or smaller

Not monetarily.

Actually most copiers nowadays won't reproduce bills at regular size. You have to go back into the early 90's, I think, to find a Canon copier that will (most copiers had Canon engines).

Not to mention it was black and white, and incomplete, but it was a dick move on the part of the parishioner, methinks.

[DetlefK]

5. I think it's legal if it's not a full bill.

[phantom power]

3. "Suppose your congregation felt it was sufficient to tithe their personal writings"

I like question.

[gollygee]

4. WWJD? Would Jesus stiff the waitstaff? N/t

[Fairgo]

10. The last supper was a dine and dash

That's why it was the last.

[randys1]

51. LOL

You absolutely win the internets today

[TexasProgresive]

18. Maybe Judas would

He carried the money.

[oberliner]

21. The waitress was not stiffed

She received a small (8 percent) tip along with the pamphlet.

[Gormy Cuss]

116. If she provided adequate service then yes she was.

Slang usage of 'stiff' as a verb doesn't require an absolute lack of tip.

https://www.wordnik.com/words/stiff

citing American Heritage dictionary:

transitive v. Slang To tip (someone) inadequately or not at all, as for a service rendered: paid the dinner check but stiffed the waiter.
transitive v. To cheat (someone) of something owed: My roommate stiffed me out of last month's rent.
transitive v. To fail to give or supply (something expected or promised).

[oberliner]

121. Good point

I looked it up as well and was surprised to find that the definition wasn't what I thought it was!

[linuxman]

12. Because it isn't enough for you to think these people are cheap?

You seem to need to make them racist as well. I'm not really sure why.

The sort of people who cheap out and stiff waitstaff don't need race to motivate them. They are terrible as is. Why not be mad over that?

[linuxman]

14. Furthermore...

https://m.

I'll just leave this here...

[Takket]

8. This shit from a tax exempt entity. The audacity!

[Blus4u]

105. Too many pastors preach politics from the pulpit.

Tax exemptions for churches should end.


Peace

[TeamPooka]

9. I'd like the person who left that for the waitress to get one instead of his/her paycheck sometime.

[linuxman]

11. Pretty low.

I'm a believer myself, but if I saw someone try to get away with stiffing waiter or waitress with this scam, I'd come unglued on them.


Thankfully, I don't know anyone who would actually have the gall to try this stunt.

[Lizzie Poppet]

15. I like to think about the NEXT time one of those idiots ate there...

...and all of the bodily fluids and various other excreta that ended up in their meal. Restaurant employees have long memories about bullshit like that.

[jmowreader]

25. They probably wouldn't do that, because that's illegal...

...but I can well imagine Jesus causing the server's hand to form the word "liver" on the order form as each person made his or her selection.

[Iggo]

33. Yep.

I've worked in several food service jobs, from fast food to delis to regular restaurants, and let me assure you, people never fuck with an asshole's food, because that's illegal.

[Iggo]

102. You're absolutely right, and that's why you can rest assured that it never ever happens.

'Cause that would be wrong.

[maveric]

16. Thats Fucked Up!

Just sayin.

[spanone]

17. screw you in the name of God....

perhaps there's a special chair in hell for them

[LanternWaste]

19. Another in a long line of excuses to deny tipping.

Another in a long line of excuses to deny tipping to the service industry. The most creative ones show up from our own DUers approximately twice a year.

[oberliner]

22. Please note that the person did leave a real tip along with the pamphlet

It just was a very small amount: 8 percent of the check.

[Human101948]

27. But you know that they were secretly laughing at the thought of the waitress

discovering that the twenty was a stupid ass tract.

[oberliner]

28. I think two different stories are being conflated here

In this case, the pamphlet that was left was not a fake twenty dollar bill, just a regular pamphlet. I posted the photo down thread.

[cwydro]

31. Exactly. nt

[greyl]

44. The server served more than 1 person at that table.

The manager's letter mentions "at least one person" in your congregation, he's not blaming the whole table of guests.

You are in no position to claim that "the person did leave a real tip".

[oberliner]

45. A tip was left along with the pamphlet

Bad phrasing on my part as it is not known who of the patrons left the tip.

Some people might be under the impression that no tip was left, only a pamphlet. That was what I meant to clarify.

Incidentally, I believe both the server and the manager are females.

[greyl]

46. Wooptie do, and some asshole from that church left that stupid tract.

An 8% tip negates the full picture of mean, ignorant arrogance only so much. Maybe about 8%.

[oberliner]

48. If you are a true believer, then you think you are doing something good

If you honestly believe that you are saving people's souls by spreading the word of the gospel, then you think leaving a pamphlet is a helpful thing to do.

Obviously, one should also leave a larger tip as well.

[greyl]

50. That's just one of the colossal problems with Religious thinking,

and is used to irrationally rationalize bad behavior daily.

The manager did a good thing.

[nadinbrzezinski]

54. I hope the manager exercises the right to refuse service as well.

[haele]

64. The tip was 8 percent. 80 cents per $10 on the bill.

While there was a tip, it is a little solace to the waitress who probably spent a good 15 - 20 minutes on the table. That 8% instead of the normal 15% - 25% tip can add up to a $5 to $10 loss on her income for that hour, depending on how large the bill was.
That's why some restaurants have gone to a set wage/no tip business, too many "dine and dash" or "tip by rounding up the bill to the nearest five dollar increment" types that end up costing the wait staff money due to the way taxes on tipped salaries are figured.

My father in law had a bad habit of doing the "round up" if the service was average when he was buying. At least he would slide the rounding up as the bill went up, but still - he would only round up to the nearest $10 for under $50 (i.e, a $42 bill would be $50 with tip, $46 would be $55), and up to $20 ($71 would be $90, $77 would be $95)for under $100 unless he felt the wait staff was paying "sufficient" (jump when he looks up) attention to him.

Me, I always start at 20% at "average" (get the order correct) service and basic attention, even if they do stand and joke with their co-workers a good amount of the time. If I can't afford it, I set a limit to my purchase.

Ugh, some of the comments were horrible. As if working as wait staff is supposed to be easy money - no harder than serving dinner at home. All you have to do is get hired on to a high-end restaurant with only a few tables, flirt outrageously at the high roller's table and close up an easy 6 hour shift with $200 to $500 in tip money all under the table ...

Haele

[oberliner]

66. I definitely support the set wage/no tip idea

However, in relation to this story, I would assert that people leave crappy tips all the time and it is not newsworthy. Adding a religious pamphlet to the crappy tip does not make it worse, in my opinion.

Of course, this could all be resolved if we move to a no tip structure.

[Warren DeMontague]

77. The bait and switch is cruel. Combined with a shitty tip- 8% is a shitty tip- its noteworthy.

I leave 20%, as a rule, unless there is something REALLY wrong and objectionable with the service, which almost never happens.

I guess im just not "Christian" enough.

[oberliner]

83. There was no bait and switch

Again, these are two different incidents that are being conflated.

[Warren DeMontague]

85. Putting a phony printed half $20 to lure her into reading about Jesus isn't a bait and switch?

I disagree. It's cruel because they made it seem like they were giving her a good tip, and instead they gave her a bunch of fucking platitudes about Jesus.

[oberliner]

87. That was a different story

In this case, the pamphlet was not disguised as a $20. (The story in the OP is misleading in that regard)

[Warren DeMontague]

126. Gotcha.

Yeah, that wasn't clear from the story.

[rurallib]

104. totally, totally agree - get rid of tips!

but the NRA - National Restaurant Association - spends millions in every state to keep wages way, way, way below poverty in their industry.

[CommonSenseDemocrat]

124. I do 20%, but only because that is American custom

I think there should be a higher base wage and no or less tip.

[Megahurtz]

72. I don't see anywhere

where it says that.

[oberliner]

82. That's why I added the reply

Here are more details:

Pastor Simmons says that he's spoken to the congregant who left the pamphlet at Dish, who stated he left a tip on the credit card receipt.

In response, Pastor Simmons said, "If it turns out we did not pay that tip, we're going to take care of them, because we always leave a 20-percent tip. We'll make sure it gets taken care of."

After hearing from a man claiming to be the congregant who left the pamphlet called to say he left a tip, Dish investigated and told NBC Charlotte that there was a $2 tip left on a bill of $25.96-- a 7.7-percent tip.

http://www.kgw.com/life/restaurant-manager-fed-up-with-religious-pamphlets-as-tips/19953489?c=n&can=n&fb=y

[Orrex]

80. 8% is a funny definition of "a real tip"

[oberliner]

84. We are talking about a difference of $3 here

Presumably, there are good tippers and bad tippers and this is something that wait staff deal with on a regular basis all over America all the time.

[Orrex]

88. It's an asshole move whatever the intent

Some will argue that it's simply meant as a nice way for the customer to share their faith, but that's exactly why it's an asshole move.

If they want to share their faith, then they should have that conversation, or they should leave a bible tract/church invitation/whatever on the table without disguising it as money.

What if I went to their church and planted books that looked like their hymnals but were actually pages and pages of explicitly blasphemous pornography between real-looking hymnal covers? Would that be ok in your view, as long as 8% of the faux books' contents was real hymns?


The restaurant customers are a gross example of religion entitlement, and their enablers & apologists are just as bad.

[oberliner]

89. If they had left a 20 percent tip plus the pamphlet would that also be an "asshole move" ?

What if they had left a "10 Reasons to Vote Democratic" pamphlet along with a small tip?

[Orrex]

92. If they disguised the pamphlet as money, then it's an asshole move

If they'd left their church propaganda openly on the table without disguising it, then I see nothing wrong with it. It will simply be swept into the bus bin with the rest of the garbage.

You're missing the point, perhaps deliberately: if they want to leave their pamphlet, that's fine. But when they disguise it as a big tip (while simultaneously leaving a shitty tip), then it's an asshole move. The deception is what makes it an asshole move.

[oberliner]

93. The pamphlet left behind in this case DID NOT look like money.

And the customer left a small monetary tip with the pamphlet.

http://www.kgw.com/life/restaurant-manager-fed-up-with-religious-pamphlets-as-tips/19953489?c=n&can=n&fb=y

(Note the bolded correction at the top of the article)

[Orrex]

94. Lovely

The small monetary tip is still a cheap-ass move, but at least it's not dishonest.

And others have indeed left the counterfeit $20 in lieu of a tip, so the underlying point remains: disguising church propaganda as currency is an asshole move.

[oberliner]

95. Agreed

I think that fake $20 thing is awful and anyone who leaves that instead of actual money is a creep in my book.

[Orrex]

96. What's the big idea, agreeing with me?

I was trying to have a fight!!!!1!

[oberliner]

110. Fighting is definitely more fun!

I guess my only point in even responding at all was to clarify the fact that two different incidents were being conflated in the OP.

That fake $20 thing was not done by the same person who left the small tip and pamphlet that generated the letter to the pastor.

[Orrex]

112. I definitely conflated them, but only because I mixed them up.

[Gormy Cuss]

117. Here I disagree with. Leaving a religious tract even with a super tip is assholish.

If one is going to proselytize at least have the spine to do it with spoken words.

[ladyVet]

107. If that waitstaff was anything like I was when I waited tables,

he or she depends on tips to help live. Only $3? That's a gallon of milk, a pound of hamburger at Aldi, or a couple of gallons of gas (roughly) to get to work another day or two.

If people want to leave religious materials lying around like trash, why do they have to make it look like money? To get people to look at it when otherwise they'd throw it away. That's deceptive, and I'd bet Jesus wouldn't approve.

But you go on making excuses. God loves you.

[oberliner]

109. He should've left more money

I'm just saying that a restaurant patron leaving a tip of 2 dollars instead of 5 dollars is not generally a newsworthy event.

[Warren Stupidity]

111. Was there something wrong with the service?

Or are you just desperately searching for a deflection?

[rusty fender]

119. Sounds like he/she just wants to defend

religious assholes, but not cheap ones

[silverweb]

23. Time for a change.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]Time for that restaurant to follow the lead of a few others that have now abolished tipping, and are incorporating the proper "tip" into their prices and paying their employees a decent wage.

[Travis_0004]

79. I thought that wasnt going over well, and places were switching back to tips.

[silverweb]

100. Not that I've heard.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]Then again, I haven't been following that outcome particularly closely.

[WillowTree]

24. What would be an even better response.......

.......would be if the restaurant paid their wait staff a living wage so that they didn't have to rely on tips and then raise their prices accordingly. This also applies to massage therapists and hairdressers etc. etc. etc. I personally hate the whole tip system on principle.

[Sherman A1]

29. That was my first thought as well,

It's nice to provide a sanctimonious religious pamphlet as a tip and it's nice to provide an sanctimonious response to that "tip" complain gin that your employee might have trouble paying their electric bill. It would be far nicer to simply pay them a living wage and not have to go through the faux concern of responding to them being slighted when in fact it is the restaurant owner that is doing the real slighting of the employee......

[oberliner]

26. Also the pamphlet was not disguised as a $20 bill

Here's an image of the actual pamphlet.

[cwydro]

30. Don't throw facts around when DU is getting its collective poutrage panties on.

I saw you trying to do that in another thread.

Sheesh, once people have an agenda...forget it.

[oberliner]

32. Some folks seem to prefer quick outrage to careful information collection

Personally, I prefer the latter.

[cwydro]

35. I hear you there.

Same as in the other thread.

People have difficulty thinking things through.

[Facility Inspector]

47. It doesn't change the fact

that the christains in question are fucking assholes.

Talk about agendas!

[greyl]

43. You mind taking a look at the other side then imagining how it looks folded?

[oberliner]

58. The other side of that fake bill is posted above

At no point is any claim made that this particular pamphlet was disguised as money. Just that it was left along with a very small tip.

These are two different incidents (the fake bill and the eternity is waiting pamphlet).

[smirkymonkey]

71. Rude!

[LiberalAndProud]

49. Yes. That makes it all better.

Why, I don't know, but it wasn't a fake $20. It was pretentious and judgmental and not a tip, regardless of form.

If a patron expects service in exchange for a sermon, they should be the one left waiting.

[oberliner]

91. The person left a chintzy tip along with a pamphlet

People leave chintzy tips all the time. I don't think it is made worse by including a pamphlet.

[Gormy Cuss]

118. A cheap tip with no explanation of why other than a religious tract isn't worse?

What is the server left to think, that the diner thought she lacked faith and was unworthy of an average tip? That the diner gave her a better tip than money because it was an invitation to get right with God?

[oberliner]

123. Well the pamphlet led to the church getting that note

Which in turn has led to an apology and some positive attention. Without the pamphlet, there would have been so coverage of the incident.

[druidity33]

78. How so?

When folded, it looks like a $20. Opened up and turned over, it's got writing on it. Technically it's not a "pamphlet" per se, but close enough so why nitpick? As far as i can tell the image you present here was not placed on the table. The picture from the waitresses original FB post only includes an image of the fake $20. The one at the top of this post, so again, why nitpick?

[oberliner]

90. The OP is conflating two separate incidents

The pamphlet that is described by the person who wrote to the pastor at the church is not the one in the image in the OP disguised as a $20.

[LonePirate]

34. Her restaurant is one which I would like to eat in someday. Bravo to her!

[Arugula Latte]

36. In "Nickeled and Dimed" Barbara Ehrenreich wrote about waiting tables and the "Visible Christians"

The worst, for some reason, are the Visible Christians - like the ten-person table, all jolly and sanctified after Sunday-night service, who run me mercilessly and then leave me $1 on a $92 bill. Or the guy with the crucifixion T-shirt (SOMEONE TO LOOK UP TO) who complains that his baked potato is too hard and his iced tea too icy (I cheerfully fix both) and leaves no tip. As a general rule, people wearing crosses or WWJD? (What Would Jesus Do?) buttons look at us disapprovingly no matter what we do, as if they were confusing waitressing with Mary Magdalene's original profession.

[Odin2005]

57. Every person who has been a waiter I know has said the same thing.

The religious nuts are terrible tippers.

[AwakeAtLast]

67. I watched it happen to a server who was 8 MONTHS PREGNANT!

True colors, very ugly colors.

[yardwork]

98. This was my experience as well, waiting tables in the 70s and early 80s.

The church groups never tipped, and they were the most demanding of all customers.

[ladyVet]

108. I waited table in the mid 790s, before I went off to the USAF.

I hated working Wednesday nights and Sundays. Church people were nasty (I mean, absolutely filthy, both at table and in the restrooms -- you don't want to know how many times I had to go behind them and clean piss and shit off walls, floors, sinks, door handles...), rude, bossy and mean. They never tipped more than fifty cents or a dollar on bills often approaching $100 for large groups, and usually in pennies scattered in the leftovers, dropped into glasses full of cigarette butts or left on the chairs.

We got $1.25 an hour, usually only 18 to 20 hours a week, and after the law changed we had to report tips, a large percentage of which was deducted from our wages for taxes. Most of us got really good at pocketing half our tips and not reporting them, because we needed every penny to pay bills and eat.

Oh, and I got fired because someone told the manager I was going into the service before I could put in a two weeks' notice. I needed to work as long as I could, because sitting around starving for two months isn't pleasant. Let's not talk about the hot pants uniform, which nearly got my ass beat by some woman whose husband couldn't keep his eyes on his own paper.

[yardwork]

114. These and many other reasons are why I tip well!

[Melurkyoulongtime]

103. Ex-Head Waitress here

and it was true when I was waitstaff and I don't doubt it's still true today. I read Ms. Ehrenreich's book back when I was still waiting tables and her assessment was dead on. Oh, and Sunday brunches? The absolute WORST. At LEAST 3 times the effort to serve the church people for a third of the pay in tips as compared to the rest of the week (even working the slowest Tuesday night usually paid better, sheesh). Most of them wore their religion on their sleeves, at least on Sunday, and EXPECTED you to grovel for the measly 1% - 5% they so "generously" left you. And this went on at one of the most popular restaurants at the time in the richest county in the state. ETA: We also got our fair share of those ridiculous pamphlets.

[Liberal_in_LA]

37. Cheap bastards

[oldandhappy]

38. Going to look them up on the internet. Thanks for the post.

Self righteous people. They fail to see how much this is NOT a witness.

[valerief]

39. More bible-thumping sleazeballs. The country's full of them. nt

[oldandhappy]

41. It works.

I looked them up and there is contact info on their website. It went thru. Let them know how well they 'witnessed' to you. Thanks.

[47of74]

42. Kudos for the manager for standing up to these idiots.

[MynameisBlarney]

52. Wow, I used to work at Dish!

Excellent food!

And not surprising a Carolina Bible Thumper would do something like that there.

Plaza Midwood is "Sin City", or at least it used to be when I lived there.

[mhatrw]

53. .

[romanic]

55. Ugh leaving stuff like that alone

would be bad enough if I were a server. -_-

[KentuckyWoman]

56. Why do we accept a system that does not pay restaurant workers properly?

Pay people properly instead of forcing workers to depend on tips. This problem goes away.

[Megahurtz]

74. Because Conservatives.

Stingy is the word that comes to mind.

[SwankyXomb]

86. Thank the NRA

No, not those losers, the other NRA, the National Restaurant Association, and their spokesmouth, Herman Cain.

[yuiyoshida]

59. This story makes me want to

swear in Japanese but I will hold my tongue... this stuff pisses me off.

[Person 2713]

60. Do the servers in Japan work off of tips , or receive an average wage for serving or a hybrid?

Thanks if you know

[yuiyoshida]

61. Well first of all I live in San Francisco

But I am sure they get paid full wages like any other job. Things are done differently there.

[Person 2713]

63. I think most of the US is doing things differently from most other countries by using customer tips

as primary wages. I thought I read once CA does provide min. wage to servers which is better than most states, if true.

[Gormy Cuss]

120. All three West Coast states have done away with the server subminimum.

Yes, prices are a little higher but not as much as the fear mongers claim.
Yes, we have plenty of restaurants.

[Person 2713]

125. Thanks ! Yes fear mongers like how they paint the whole minimum wage issue but hey it benefits

the wealthy so fear on
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carl-gibson/mark-dayton-minnesota-economy_b_6737786.html

[Jesus Malverde]

68. No tips

And they work very long hours, no OT, six days a week.

[Omaha Steve]

62. Thanks for posting

K&R!

OS

[hifiguy]

65. Scumbags.

And major props to the manager for calling these assholes out, big time.

[JesterCS]

69. The whole point of the pamphlets

Is to trick you. Bottom line.

[Sheepshank]

70. I have long ago passed by the doors of religion, but......

.....if their intent was to provide a well received (instead of castigated) message, imagine how a 20% to 25% may have affected this waitresses perception of that church.

Frankly it feels more like the patron, was a fucking asshole cheapskate and simple using his church as an aid to that personality flaw.

[MisterP]

73. jerk-church church jerk jerks church-adjacent like jerks

[Monk06]

75. I had to stop communicating with an old friend from University who started attending a Baptist

church and went hard fundamentalist.

He's 55 years old and has never had a relationship with a woman that lasted longer than three weeks

According to him women must cleave to the man and accept his mastery. Even women in his own congregation have dumped him because he calls them 'biblical illiterates' the first time they have an opinion that differs from his.

I got sick of bible based essays on the Dirty Harry movies forty years after anyone cared about the RW killer cop genre

Same with Batman, I couldn't have a civil conversation about that and I don't even care about Batman movies

Baptists are self centered, cruel, doctrinaire and cult like. They think Jesus Christ is their own special friend and salvation is just one prayer away.

One easy payment and you're saved

Craver will never convince the pastor of Harbor Baptist that he isn't biblically justified in encouraging this impious behavior.

If I was the restaurant owner I would tell him that his parishioners are not welcome in the restaurant

That or take the service charge, tip included approach to billing

[merrily]

76. People like that better hope the Rapture is a myth.

[Orrex]

81. Further proof of the war on Christianity

When the flock's pithy slogans are no longer accepted as legal tender, all is lost.

[yardwork]

97. Good for the manager! Right on target.

[Iggo]

99. Jerk church.

Jerk church.

[Initech]

106. That manager deserves a mic drop.

[Mendocino]

113. If people can afford to eat out

they can afford to tip properly.

[Iggo]

115. It's quite simple.

If you can't afford to tip the waitstaff, you can't afford to eat at a restaurant that has waitstaff.

[CommonSenseDemocrat]

122. Agreed putting "tracs" as fake tips is total bullshit, but why isn't the manager paying her a living

base wage? Maybe he is, but I doubt he is.