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HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 11:57 AM Apr 2016

Zika Virus Prompts "Homeopaths Without Borders" To Potentiate Ineptitude

Last edited Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:31 PM - Edit history (1)

http://edzardernst.com/2016/04/zika-virus-prompts-homeopath-to-potentiate-ineptitude/

"‘Homeopaths without Borders’ have been the subject of this blog before. I repeat what David Shaw, senior research fellow, Institute for Biomedical Ethics, University of Basel, Switzerland, wrote about this organisation in a BMJ-article: Despite Homeopaths Without Borders’ claims to the contrary, “homeopathic humanitarian help” is a contradiction in terms. Although providing food, water, and solace to people in areas affected by wars and natural disasters certainly constitutes valuable humanitarian work, any homeopathic treatment deceives patients into thinking they are receiving real treatment when they are not. Furthermore, training local people as homeopaths in affected areas amounts to exploiting vulnerable people to increase the reach of homeopathy. Much as an opportunistic infection can take hold when a person’s immune system is weakened, so Homeopaths Without Borders strikes when a country is weakened by a disaster. However, infections are expunged once the immune system recovers but Homeopaths Without Borders’ methods ensure that homeopathy persists in these countries long after the initial catastrophe has passed. Homeopathy is neither helpful nor humanitarian, and to claim otherwise to the victims of disasters amounts to exploitation of those in need of genuine aid.

Now ‘Homeopathy without Borders’ seem to promote the idea – or should I say madness? – that homeopathy offers a cure for the Zika virus infection. Given their track record this was to be expected. Whenever the world is facing a serious medical problem, homeopaths are at the ready to help. Only that they don’t really help; they make false promises and distract from the task of solving the problem. Need I to remind you of the disaster they almost caused when they set out to treat Ebola?

Tragically, ‘Homeopaths without Borders’ are not alone. Other homeopaths seem to agree with them and promote the madness of a homeopathic cure fro Zika. For instance, Dr Vikas Sharma, a homeopath from India, informs us that “Homeopathic medicines Eupatorium Perfoliatum, Belladonna, Rhus Tox can be safely used in Zika virus infection treatment. These medicines come the closest in treating the symptoms of Zika virus infection. In an epidemics when a huge number of person are attacked by acute and similar sufferings from similar cause, Homeopathy can be of great prophylactic help. Homeopathy has been highly successful in treating epidemic diseases. Among them are cholera, dengue fever, yellow fever typhus, and conjunctivitis. “

Confronted with stupidity on such a scale, I am lost for words. Luckily, David Shaw already said it all: Homeopathy is neither helpful nor humanitarian, and to claim otherwise to the victims of disasters amounts to exploitation of those in need of genuine aid."


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52 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Zika Virus Prompts "Homeopaths Without Borders" To Potentiate Ineptitude (Original Post) HuckleB Apr 2016 OP
I thought this was the Onion... damn yourpaljoey Apr 2016 #1
If only... HuckleB Apr 2016 #2
What a frightening concept. procon Apr 2016 #3
Homeopaths market themselves rather brilliantly, unfortunately. HuckleB Apr 2016 #7
When I saw "Homeopaths Without Borders" I assumed it was a fake news story. Iggo Apr 2016 #4
Indeed. It should be a fake news story. HuckleB Apr 2016 #37
Swiss recognise homeopathy as legitimate medicine AxionExcel Apr 2016 #5
So you're saying the Swiss don't care about the reality that homeopathy is bunk? HuckleB Apr 2016 #6
Must own shares in a well REP Apr 2016 #8
It's so good that someone is willing to regularly & systematically attack holistic health AxionExcel Apr 2016 #13
#1 adverse reaction to homeopathy when used to treat a dangerous disease: death NickB79 Apr 2016 #15
"Holistic Health." HuckleB Apr 2016 #16
Homeopathy isn't 'holistic health'. It's fraud. COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #35
+1 BuddhaGirl Apr 2016 #10
Yeah, selling people worthless crap is so awesome! HuckleB Apr 2016 #18
I don't expect you to understand why people use homeopathy BuddhaGirl Apr 2016 #22
I understand that selling worthless products as health remedies is a scam. HuckleB Apr 2016 #23
YMMV BuddhaGirl Apr 2016 #25
It's been shown to be worthless. It is now nothing but a scam. HuckleB Apr 2016 #26
Again, YMMV BuddhaGirl Apr 2016 #31
Your belief does not make it so. HuckleB Apr 2016 #32
Post removed Post removed Apr 2016 #39
Evidence and efficacy isn't about belief EvolveOrConvolve Apr 2016 #41
Because they are gullible, ignorant or desperate, the fact is those who sell... Humanist_Activist Apr 2016 #36
Are you able to cite peer-reviewed, double-blind, scientific studies that show homeopathy is cleanhippie Apr 2016 #17
Citing a single study or two is really beside the point, however. HuckleB Apr 2016 #19
You need to ask your question of Switzerland AxionExcel Apr 2016 #20
Someone just showed us that he/she isn't reading post responses. HuckleB Apr 2016 #21
Post removed Post removed Apr 2016 #28
And another pointless response, with another logical fallacy attached. HuckleB Apr 2016 #30
"impossible to provide such proof for these disciplines" muriel_volestrangler Apr 2016 #27
If you are using a toaster over to try and measure the distance from the Earth to the Moon... AxionExcel Apr 2016 #33
So you're saying people should accept the effectiveness of homeopathy on faith, then? muriel_volestrangler Apr 2016 #34
How is it that faith healing gets support at DU? HuckleB Apr 2016 #51
Post removed Post removed Apr 2016 #29
IOW, your answer is a firm "no, I cannot do that". cleanhippie Apr 2016 #38
Meanwhile, that poster is promoting this harmful scam in a new OP. HuckleB Apr 2016 #43
You need to ask yourself a question of Science. cleanhippie Apr 2016 #45
It's downright scary. HuckleB Apr 2016 #44
No, it doesn't. HuckleB Apr 2016 #40
And they also didn't recognise women as legitimate voters till the 1970s. It's a nice country LeftishBrit May 2016 #52
If HWB is bringing large quantities of sterilized water ... REP Apr 2016 #9
Something tells me they're not bringing water trucks with them. HuckleB Apr 2016 #24
I think part of this is because some use "homeopathic" "holistic" and "herbal" as interchangeable. RadiationTherapy Apr 2016 #11
And the DU ad? Make Powerful Healing Water. SMH Rex Apr 2016 #12
Taken in large quantities, it can save those dying of thirst REP Apr 2016 #14
Scary. DU gives this OP the same number of likes as a pro-homeopathy OP. HuckleB Apr 2016 #42
funny thing is homeopathy spread as a treatment because vaccines had become popular MisterP Apr 2016 #46
Oh, goodness. You are also promoting homeopathy? HuckleB Apr 2016 #47
And, no, homeopathy is not comparable to vaccines. HuckleB Apr 2016 #48
sucker born every minute.... dembotoz Apr 2016 #49
Every second, it seems. HuckleB Apr 2016 #50

procon

(15,805 posts)
3. What a frightening concept.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 12:23 PM
Apr 2016

Its like a glimpse back in time to medieval sorcery, a peak into the witchdoctor's hut, or listening to the spiel of a snake oil charlatan. Where are the regulations, the laws that protect the public from a dangerous hoax like this?

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
7. Homeopaths market themselves rather brilliantly, unfortunately.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 01:19 PM
Apr 2016

It's the only thing they do well, of course. But they sure do make a lot of money with that marketing.

Iggo

(47,558 posts)
4. When I saw "Homeopaths Without Borders" I assumed it was a fake news story.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 12:36 PM
Apr 2016

It's amazing the amount of bullshit that decently educated modern humans will believe.

AxionExcel

(755 posts)
5. Swiss recognise homeopathy as legitimate medicine
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 12:47 PM
Apr 2016

The people of Switzerland must be "STUPID" as Donald Trump and his Republican bootlickers are so fond of saying. They actually find homeopathy to be valid and worthwhile, even if multinational pharmaceutical corporations (R) and their minions (R) have a systematic campaign in place to try and pin the ad hominem attack label "stupid" on the people of Switzerland and anyone else who has an actual healing experience.

"The interior ministry has announced plans to give five complementary therapies including homeopathy the same status as conventional medicine.

"Homeopathy, holistic medicine, herbal medicine, acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine will acquire the same status as conventional medicine by May 2017 when it comes to health insurance..."

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/complementary-therapies_swiss-to-recognise-homeopathy-as-legitimate-medicine/42053830

This factual news about the informed, free-will decision of the educated and discerning people of Switzerland will - pundits speculate - stimulate the ongoing systemactic, regularly scheduled barrage of Homeopathy Hippie Punching, Inc.

AxionExcel

(755 posts)
13. It's so good that someone is willing to regularly & systematically attack holistic health
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 01:45 PM
Apr 2016

That takes a "special" kind of "courage."

I mean, imagine what might happen to the profits of multinational pharmaceutical corporations if homeopathy and other forms of holistic health were to catch on?

There's already a grave threat to profits from increasing public awareness of the putrid toxic side effects of pharmaceutical-chemical remedies. Somebody has to crush holistic health, somebody has call the people of Switzerland out as STUPID for using holistic health and trying to avoid drugs from Prescriptions, Inc.

Multinational Pharmaceutical Drugs, Inc. "side" effects:

NickB79

(19,253 posts)
15. #1 adverse reaction to homeopathy when used to treat a dangerous disease: death
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 02:07 PM
Apr 2016
I mean, imagine what might happen to the profits of multinational pharmaceutical corporations if homeopathy and other forms of holistic health were to catch on?


Stock in casket making would sky-rocket

COLGATE4

(14,732 posts)
35. Homeopathy isn't 'holistic health'. It's fraud.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 05:00 PM
Apr 2016

There is absolutely none - ZERO proof that a) water retains 'memory' of things diluted in it; 2) a cure should replicate the symptoms of the disease it cures and 3) the more dilute the solution the stronger it is (without even considering Avogadro's number, which proves that, after a certain point of dilution the actual 'content' in the water of the 'drug' is zero), all basic tenets of Homeopathy. By trying to make the attack on Homeopathy an 'attack on holistic medicine' is just dishonest - a dishonest as Homeopathy itself.
























0

BuddhaGirl

(3,608 posts)
22. I don't expect you to understand why people use homeopathy
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:22 PM
Apr 2016

And I really don't care what you think about it.

It works for me, and that's fine.

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
23. I understand that selling worthless products as health remedies is a scam.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:24 PM
Apr 2016

And, yes, homeopathy is worthless. It doesn't do anything but empty your wallet, for no good reason.

It's your choice to waste your money on it, but it has no place in actual health care.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/1800-studies-later-scientists-conclude-homeopathy-doesnt-work-180954534/

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2012-09/plausibility-test-homeopathic-medicine

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
26. It's been shown to be worthless. It is now nothing but a scam.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:47 PM
Apr 2016

Your false belief is yours, but I do not have a belief about something that has been shown very clearly. Ignoring such overwhelming evidence in order to continue to promote something that has no value is not helpful to anyone. Ever.

https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/another-review-finds-homeopathy-worthless/

BuddhaGirl

(3,608 posts)
31. Again, YMMV
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:52 PM
Apr 2016

My belief is not false. Homeopathy has been very beneficial to me.

You can post all the links you want expressing your disbelief.

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
32. Your belief does not make it so.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:53 PM
Apr 2016

My posts contain links that show the actual reality that homeopathy is worthless.

https://www.minnpost.com/second-opinion/2014/04/yet-another-meta-analysis-finds-homeopathy-useless

Thanks for the kicks, by the way! I do appreciate that.

(And you don't even seem to realize that saying "YMMV" confesses the reality that it does not work for anything but emptying one's wallet.)

Response to BuddhaGirl (Reply #31)

EvolveOrConvolve

(6,452 posts)
41. Evidence and efficacy isn't about belief
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 08:31 PM
Apr 2016

It's about facts, and the fact is that water doesn't cure the Zika virus.

 

Humanist_Activist

(7,670 posts)
36. Because they are gullible, ignorant or desperate, the fact is those who sell...
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 05:20 PM
Apr 2016

homeopathy are fucking predators who should be jailed for medical fraud.

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
17. Are you able to cite peer-reviewed, double-blind, scientific studies that show homeopathy is
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 03:19 PM
Apr 2016

Effective?

I find it most interesting to see someone promote activities that science has long debunked as no more effective than placebo, and in most cases, harm the individual by not actually doing what it claims it does.

Seriously, when it comes to the science, put up or shut up, as the saying goes.

AxionExcel

(755 posts)
20. You need to ask your question of Switzerland
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 03:46 PM
Apr 2016

If you actually read my post your response might have a degree of coherence. I'm just reporting a fact. Thus it's truly stupid to imply that I am stupid, or that I should shut up. You'll just have to find a way to deal with facts.

The people of Switzerland, however, have found homeopathy to be effective. They are legitimizing it. Not me. They are the ones you want to be TRUMPing about as "STUPID" in your special opinion, and they are the ones you want "shut up" so they cannot exercise their intelligence or free will.

Please do your homework.

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
21. Someone just showed us that he/she isn't reading post responses.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 03:50 PM
Apr 2016

Not that anyone is going to be surprised.

And it is funny to see yet another classic diversion attempt.

Response to HuckleB (Reply #21)

muriel_volestrangler

(101,321 posts)
27. "impossible to provide such proof for these disciplines"
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:48 PM
Apr 2016

That's right, the Swiss have decided that homeopathy and the other claims can never "prove their “efficacy, cost-effectiveness and suitability”". They've admitted they can't show they're effective, even when given 5 years to show it.

After being rejected in 2005 by the authorities for lack of scientific proof of their efficacy, complementary and alternative medicines made a comeback in 2009 when two-thirds of Swiss backed their inclusion on the constitutional list of paid health services.

As a result of the vote, these treatments are covered by basic compulsory insurance as part of six-year trial period from 2012-2017. However, they were all required to prove their “efficacy, cost-effectiveness and suitability” by 2017.

In a statement released on Tuesday, the interior ministry said it had come to the conclusion that it was “impossible to provide such proof for these disciplines in their entirety”.

So they know they can't show they work, but they want their insurance to cover it anyway.

Yes, the Swiss people are able to be stupid.


AxionExcel

(755 posts)
33. If you are using a toaster over to try and measure the distance from the Earth to the Moon...
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:55 PM
Apr 2016

...you've got the wrong tool for the job. You are never going to come up with a valid answer.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,321 posts)
34. So you're saying people should accept the effectiveness of homeopathy on faith, then?
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 04:57 PM
Apr 2016

Faith healing is bunk.

Response to AxionExcel (Reply #20)

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
38. IOW, your answer is a firm "no, I cannot do that".
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 06:47 PM
Apr 2016

The next question that seems obvious is "why?"

But we both already know the answer to that.

HuckleB

(35,773 posts)
43. Meanwhile, that poster is promoting this harmful scam in a new OP.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 09:35 PM
Apr 2016

Last edited Tue Apr 19, 2016, 01:24 AM - Edit history (1)

And far too many DUers support that OP.

How does one fight climate change denialism, when this kind of crap gets progressive support?

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
45. You need to ask yourself a question of Science.
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 10:23 AM
Apr 2016

Does the science support what I believe to be true? If not, maybe you should change your beliefs to fit reality instead of tyring to convince others that reality fits your beliefs.

LeftishBrit

(41,208 posts)
52. And they also didn't recognise women as legitimate voters till the 1970s. It's a nice country
Thu May 26, 2016, 01:21 PM
May 2016

(been there a few times) but the Swiss are not the Oracle or the Voice from Mount Sinai, any more than any other country.

REP

(21,691 posts)
9. If HWB is bringing large quantities of sterilized water ...
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 01:29 PM
Apr 2016

... maybe it's not all bad ... Keeping hydrated is an important part of recovering from an viral infection.

But if they're just bringing those tiny bottles of purified bullshit, well fuck them.

RadiationTherapy

(5,818 posts)
11. I think part of this is because some use "homeopathic" "holistic" and "herbal" as interchangeable.
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 01:31 PM
Apr 2016

Homeopathy is total bunk.

Holistic approaches to health - by an MD - in terms of assessing one's lifestyle and environment has potential.

Herbal approaches are largely worthless, but some active herbs - like cayenne, thyme, and oregano - do have some potential for helping minor issues such as disinfecting a small injury or relieving a sore throat via gargling.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
12. And the DU ad? Make Powerful Healing Water. SMH
Mon Apr 18, 2016, 01:31 PM
Apr 2016

So what is the survival rate of people that use homeopathic remedies? I wonder.

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
46. funny thing is homeopathy spread as a treatment because vaccines had become popular
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 03:54 PM
Apr 2016

in Brazil they’re semiofficial and used to provide clinic care in areas even NGOs don’t serve (let alone Brazilian doctors) and provide health education

presumably the Brazilian medical system has only one-10,000th of a stick up its ass about homeopathy by comparison to the Fearless Fanboys

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