Someone please help me with this one.....National Debt...

[clarice]

Had about 20 guests last night for a dinner party... I would describe most of them as middle of the road Dems...and a few
moderates. We were talking about the upcoming election, and many of them were very concerned over our mounting National debt.
I checked Google this morning to find quotes by either Hillary or Bernie concerning this issue. Granted I didn't do an exhaustive search, but I couldn't find anything. Can anyone out there point me to a link where either of them has addressed this issue?

Thanks in advance

[Jackie Wilson Said]

1. They only care about the debt when Democrats are in the WH or in charge of Congress.

[clarice]

3. I'm sorry JW...who are "they"nt

[Matt_in_STL]

2. This page has some info, maybe not worded exactly for what you are looking

http://feelthebern.org/bernie-sanders-on-the-federal-budget-and-national-debt/

[clarice]

4. Thanks Matt.....I read it briefly.....but

I'm not so sure that Bernie's answers, although eloquent, would calm many fears among
those concerned about the debt. Just guessing.

[Matt_in_STL]

5. Most people concerned about the debt won't find anything to assuage their fears.

It really is a hard sell.

[clarice]

6. That is correct....just curious Matt.... what are your views on the issue?nt

[Matt_in_STL]

8. Honestly, I don't really put much thought into the debt as a whole

Until we get our deficit back down, there isn't much to be done there. The Obama administration has us on the right track, deficit-wise but there is much more that could be done to bring it down. We really need to overhaul the defense budget from top to bottom, audit where every dollar is being spent and why it is being spent just as a starter.

[clarice]

9. Agreed 100%... but I don't think that National defense is the ONLY place to look.nt

[Matt_in_STL]

11. Nope, there are always places to find a few bucks

But, it is the best place to start as it is the overwhelming piece of our annual budget and I don't think it is a secret there is a certain level of corruption and incredible inefficiencies.

[clarice]

12. Yup!! Thanks and have a GREAT Memorial weekend.nt

[SickOfTheOnePct]

13. 16% is not "overwhelming" IMO n/t

[Matt_in_STL]

14. I was thinking of the discretionary budget where it is 54%

Also, in the larger budget, SS and Medicare comprise the larger pieces of the pie and I think defense is a better place to start.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

16. I don't disagree that military spending needs to be cut significantly

But using a number that misrepresents the truth by more than tripling the actual percentage of the budget consumed by the military isn't really helpful, again, IMO.

[TreasonousBastard]

7. Go to the source...

https://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/faqs/Markets/Pages/national-debt.aspx

Or, an equally wordy Wiki discussion that's pretty good:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_debt

Essentially, the debt is when the gummint spends more than it takes in. Sometimes, as with War Bonds, it's for a special purpose, but now we seem to be at a point where we just borrow because we can't help spending but refuse to pay more taxes.

FWIW, I think it was Aristotle who said democracies are doomed to fail when the will of the people includes more stuff, but just "free" stuff they will never be taxed for. So this is not a new problem.

[clarice]

10. Thanks for the good info TB..but

I wonder what would happen if I ran my household that way?lol

[dumbcat]

15. Your household is not a sovereign nation

so that is not a good analogy. I suppose if you could print your own currency and it would be accepted worldwide, that would help.

[clarice]

20. granted...but basic rules of economics dictate otherwise. (Please, no Keynesian references)..

That has never worked and never will. IMHO

[whatthehey]

17. Well that's the problem really

Home budgets and national budgets are not, should not and cannot be managed the same way.

States can set monetary and fiscal policy, households cannot. You can neither print money nor demand more income (assuming no sophisticated organized crime ties). Governments have more options.

But one way to think of it is that even with the eyepopping debt, it's still only slightly above annual GDP. In other words it's smaller than a typical homeowner's mortgage relative to income.

Another tidbit is that almost all your guests are likely to answer "China" if asked who holds most of our Federal Gov't debt. The real answer is.... the Federal Government. It is in debt to itself for about 5T, China only about a fifth of that. Another multi-trillion chunk is owed to US citizens who hold bonds and T-bills. Foreign debt is only about 1/6th of the total IIRC. Again this is not how your budget works, but imagine if you had loaned yourself over a quarter of your mortgage. Wouldn't that take a chunk of worry away?

One more comforting thought. One analog that IS true for households and nations is that riskier debt is more expensive. People with 800+ FICO scores, who are careful and judicious with debt, can get low rate or even zero rate loans because creditors are safely confident we'll pay it back. At 450 you are paying ususry rates at buy here pay here joints with thumbbreakers on staff. The US government issues short term debt at 0% and long term (really long term - 30 years) at about 2.65%. That's a sure sign that its debt is seen as safe and responsible globally. See Greece and Argentina for sovereign analogs of poor credit.

Finally, and back to non-analogs to families, debt can be very very good financially. The Feds can borrow money insanely cheaply, and use it to invest in infrastructure, education, etc which drives up wealth therefore taxes therefore government revenue greater than the amount borrowed. THAT'S where you'll see Sanders' and Clinton's political response to the debt issue. Notice I do say can invest though. This is nigh impossible with a regressive RWNJ Congress holding pursestrings, but it is indeed what both Dem candidates suggest.

[clarice]

21. EXCELLENT, rational, well tempered response...just what I was looking for. Thanks WTH. nt

[tonyt53]

18. And with good reason. The debt to GDP is actually quite low and the deficit is falling.

With a continually improving economy, both will improve. With an increase in the minimum wage as well as a reversal in manufacturing jobs trends here in the US, coupled with proper taxation, the improvement can be quite remarkable.

[taught_me_patience]

19. When you include the trust fund debt, the debt to GDP is about 100% -- not low at all

but not concerningly high either. One concern is that another recession could easily increase the debt by another 20-50%, where it becomes high enough that it's impossible to continue fiscal stimulus.