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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsArticle: I was fired from my internship for writing a proposal for a more flexible dress code
At least the special snowflakes learned something about life in the real world from their brief time at this company...
I spoke with my manager about being allowed some leeway under the dress code and was told this was not possible, despite the other person being allowed to do it. I soon found out that many of the other interns felt the same way, and the ones who asked their managers about it were told the same thing as me. We decided to write a proposal stating why we should be allowed someone leeway under the dress code. We accompanied the proposal with a petition, signed by all of the interns (except for one who declined to sign it) and gave it to our managers to consider. Our proposal requested that we also be allowed to wear running shoes and non leather flats, as well as sandals (not flip-flops though) and other non-dress shoes that would fit under a more business casual dress code. It was mostly about the footwear, but we also incorporated a request that we not have to wear suits and/or blazers in favor of a more casual, but still professional dress code.
The next day, all of us who signed the petition were called into a meeting where we thought our proposal would be discussed. Instead, we were informed that due to our unprofessional behavior, we were being let go from our internships. We were told to hand in our ID badges and to gather our things and leave the property ASAP.
More @ http://www.askamanager.org/2016/06/i-was-fired-from-my-internship-for-writing-a-proposal-for-a-more-flexible-dress-code.html
metroins
(2,550 posts)For the people in "the real world"
Hopefully these interns learned it's better to create a company and your own rules, rather than be limited by "the real world".
snooper2
(30,151 posts)it's not a fucking democracy LOL
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)This needs to stop. We are doing a huge disservice to the youth when we treat them as special snowflakes. Colleges doing major damage in that regard.
Albertoo
(2,016 posts)tonyt53
(5,737 posts)That petition did you in. I am in agreement with the company.
WillowTree
(5,325 posts)Response to Heeeeers Johnny (Original post)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)the one employee had an exemption.
No, they shouldn't have been told. It's none of their business. Entitlement is right.
Also interesting: "I've never had a job before. I always concentrated on my studies." This kid is graduating from college next year and has never had a job before.
Response to Squinch (Reply #17)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)Response to Squinch (Reply #23)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)As such, the reason is private and confidential.
I fully support the company in their actions.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)I assume the employer got permission from the employee to reveal it.
In general, if you serine or two people doing something no one else is allowed to - there's a reason and it's none of your business. Heck, where I work there's a business professional dress code. I can get away with wearing jeans on a Wednesday, if I'm not in a meeting with the customer, because I'm really good at what I do. I built the respect, so I can flout some of the "rules" now.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)Which makes the intern's behavior all the crazier.
Warpy
(111,261 posts)You know, that part, the one so many companies have that specify closed toe shoes with two inch heels for women.
Those damned things should be banned from workplaces since they contribute so heavily to disability and even injury on the job.
phylny
(8,380 posts)Too old, too fat.
I wear closed-heeled clogs in the winter, other closed-heeled and toed shoes or sneakers in the summer (goes fine with scrubs, and is allowed).
I'd love to wear open-toed shoes but it's against our dress code.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)Warpy
(111,261 posts)Working women know exactly what that means.
I've had to get notes from doctors so I could wear dress flats.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)On pumps and they're more comfortable than flats.
There are so many flat shows that imitate children's styles or look like slippers and that is why the code says no flats. The low blocky heel is very stylish now and comfy.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)seems pretty clearly to mean that leather flats were already allowed.
Initech
(100,076 posts)Like what was the industry? What was the dress code? What was the dress code being proposed? Where is this company located? Why would having this new dress code be a good thing / bad thing? So many details left off.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Interns don't have a say in policy ... well, at least in the real world. And, if you pause to think about it, there is a very good reason for that. In a word, the short version of the reason is "EXPERIENCE."
EllieBC
(3,014 posts)Eom
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)It's called shut up, do your job, and keep your nose clean. When you have earned the right to be heard, then you may speak. No one owes an intern an explanation on company policy. They are not there to question. Little self indulgent shits is what they are
FixTheProblem
(22 posts)So how much blood and sweat, how much stress, how much literal physical pain, much less mental pain, does one need to sacrifice to their boss, who can never do wrong, before he or she has "earned the right to be heard?"
Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)before you try to re-write company policy. I also think you should shut your trap until you have proven to be competent. The fact that these little twits could not take "no" for an answer and actually made a petition shows that they are still not competent.
WillowTree
(5,325 posts)These kids were there for a short period of time to learn something about the business.......or maybe just to learn about working in the real world. They weren't there to criticize or try to change company policy. This is the type of nonsense that colleges are teaching these delicate flowers when they submit to all the "safe space" insanity that's going around. (And so it doesn't o out of context, I'm not talking about actual safety issues. I'm referring to brats who feel they need to be "protected" from seeing the word TRUMP written in chalk on the sidewalk.)
Initech
(100,076 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)...but instead, I decided to talk about shoes.
B2G
(9,766 posts)LisaM
(27,811 posts)Thanks.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Letters to Penthouse, and gun humper self-defense stories are a similar form of creative writing.
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)how terribly unfairly they were treated for, simply, exercising their right to be heard.
Words of advice I received early in my career, that has served me so well, I feel compelled to pass on to every newbie to the work world ... that will listen ...
Your job is to do what your boss tells you to do (unless it is illegal, immoral, or unethical), the way she/he tells you to do it, and within the timeframe they give you. Until you demonstrate that you have the capacity to do so; no one cares to hear about your "better way".
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)But I am having trouble believing this all really happened. There's too many red flags in it for me to swallow it.
Young people nowdays need to hear this. First prove yourself, then discuss your great ideas.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)And, then ... once told "No", accept the "No" as a "No" and move on, or move on.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)Do you believe the story?
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Frankly, I believe it was more than just a proposal and a petition ... it was more likely, a proposal, a petition, a demand and a bunch of pouting.
hunter
(38,312 posts)This nation will die with a pathetic whimper, folding quickly to whatever fascism takes root here first.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)how is this cautionary tale a foreshadowing of fascist dystopia?
hunter
(38,312 posts)Seriously. How could this not be laughed about like other intern nonsense?
Hah, hah, my interns wanted to talk about shoes...
Instead it's like, "OH NO! The interns are plotting against us! We'd better fire them ALL before this escalates!"
I guess my blasé attitude comes from living in a place where professional people will sometimes have very obvious tattoos, pink hair, and/or piercings in unlikely places. And the guys dressed like Mexican cowboys probably are Mexican cowboys.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)firing them is not a bad idea.
whatthehey
(3,660 posts)I would however consider it a sign of an inability to both follow procedure and take direction. They raised the issue, it was responded to. Just because that response was one they didn't like was no reason to make a public point about a disabled employee and waste time using an inappropriate method to escalate (whoever heard of petitions in a workplace? What's wrong with ask manager, then go to HR on matters of personnel policy if you don't understand, then accept it?) I'm no fan of overly strict dress policies except where necessary to protect the product or eliminate offensiveness. I certainly see no need for blaazers and leather only shoes in 99% of jobs, but if I was offered a job where these were the policies, I'd decide whether I could follow them before taking it not after, and I surely wouldn't leverage a disabled colleague to moan about it when I'd already been told they were not interested in exceptions.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Nothing more, nothing less.
It's sad and pathetic.
whatthehey
(3,660 posts)Having managed more than a few people, organization among them has never caused much fear or indeed any negative emotion for me. But their questioning an answer that not just I but all my peers had consistently given that policy exceptions were not going to happen, their choice to waste time complaining about it yet again, and using a method that is inappropriate for organizational development purposes to boot, would certainly make me question their ability to listen and understand and respond appropriately, which are important skills in any office job.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)They were told no and they should have moved on. Instead they wasted more time of their internship on the stupid shoe issue instead of doing what they were supposed to be doing - learning.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Dredging up new interns and getting them up to speed takes time. Office wars over trivial shit are a waste of time too.
Ha, ha. Did you see the shoes that intern was wearing?
Crisis averted.
rockfordfile
(8,704 posts)obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)And, I am a very lenient, very reasonable, and very friendly boss. I LOVE working with kids this age, I love mentoring them, and helping them achieve their goals.
However...
My interns know my expectations and our policies. They are treated very well and paid decent, but if they pulled this? Gone. I have too many kids who want these jobs and want to actually learn something and be mentored to put up with this time wasting and ridiculous requests.
I would love to wear a t-shirt, running shorts, and flippies to work every day. Guess what? I can't, and knew that when I accepted the job offer.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Frankly I think it's a made-up story, like the guy who gave five bucks to a bum for food and then followed him to a liquor store.
Oh no, he bought a tall Colt 45 and two individual cigarettes! Clearly the bum's a liar and a cheat and a worthless human being.
Interns do silly things, but so what?
Ignore the "petition" or give a little slack when it comes to shoes.
The jobs I really hate, however, are those where you can wear anything you like, a Grateful Dead teeshirt, shorts, and sandals, if you please, but you're on salary and expected to live in your office and carry your pager (now company cell phone) when you go out to the parking lot to smoke a joint.
The forty hour work week was a good thing, and too many jobs are salary or 1099 that shouldn't be.
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)really?
hunter
(38,312 posts)Guess I'm not up to date in that peculiar dialect.
I'm sure they have more derogatory names for homeless people.
Nothing more, nothing less.
It's sad and pathetic.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)The management wasn't clutching its collective pearls in fear of a great proletariat uprising. It got tired of a bunch of entitled brats who couldn't do something as simple as wear leather shoes without constantly disrupting business.
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)The last thing a smoothly running company needs is noisy troublemakers. That probably worked for them in college, but it doesn't fly in the real world.
hunter
(38,312 posts)An office tempest over shoes? Really?
Would you like to tell your boss you got into a fight with the interns about shoes and had to fire them all?
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)Response to hunter (Reply #9)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
hunter
(38,312 posts)I may have some brains, but I thoroughly damaged my body getting paid well for heavy physical labor when I was younger.
The first time I got paid more than $100 in a day I was moving furniture. I've done a lot of warehouse work, loading and unloading trucks and such, but my body simply can't do it full time any more, not even as a volunteer at the food bank.
My car is an $800 piece of shit, and our health insurance is crappy. What we thought was good insurance covered only a fraction of our medical expenses when we got hit with random illnesses that can happen to ANYONE.
No, I do not believe the U.S.A. is exceptional. We do not live in a true first world nation because we're so fucking gullible that people still celebrate Saint Ronald Reagan the meat-puppet, a pathetic little worm who'd say anything for a blow-job.
Response to hunter (Reply #61)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Could be Trump for all I know, but he seems more like a Mussolini waiting for his Hitler.
Response to hunter (Reply #67)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Obama is an extraordinarily competent President, and has the street smarts to dodge the crap the Republicans flung at Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton.
I'll bet he can deal with silly inexperienced interns too, without setting off a tempest in a teacup.
The U.S.A. is not my utopia, but I was born here and I'll stay on until I lose all hope.
So again, what are you talking about?
Right wing talking points won't get you anywhere with me.
Anyone who is not concerned about the state of our nation isn't paying attention.
TRUMP, a fucking reality show television clown, won the GOP primaries. That should scare the hell out of any rational person.
Response to hunter (Reply #80)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
rockfordfile
(8,704 posts)That's not true
"My point is that your defeated, defeatist, angry, resentful attitude is typical of the far left and a big reason the far left candidate I'm sure you suported got trounced in the primary, including losing the working-class vote substantially. "
That sounds like something from the far right.
Response to rockfordfile (Reply #82)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Throd
(7,208 posts)If you're not constantly cynical and depressed then you are unaware of how crummy everything is. Wake up!
Response to Throd (Reply #98)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)and those who at least imagine they're poor are here. DU has a major theme of broad-spectrum populist "where's mine" resentment running in tandem with a left-wing extremism that insists on seeing America, and specifically liberals, as corrupted beyond recovery. It's not that the people you describe aren't here also, but those two groups are a natural pairing of the chronically discontented who both believe any fix requires destruction.
d_r
(6,907 posts)closeupready
(29,503 posts)hunter
(38,312 posts)That's an insane amount of optimism.
Whatever we do at this point, this fossil fueled civilization WILL crash.
We are not the first innovative species on earth to change EVERYTHING, and we won't be the last.
Exponential growth always ends, often badly for the species experiencing it.
In a hundred thousand years it's all a peculiar layer of trash in the geologic record.
Life is what we choose to make of it now.
I'm practical in my politics, and pretty far out their in my dreams.
As a kid I dreamed I'd be playing with supercomputers.
I didn't imagine I'd be retrieving them from dumpsters.
Eventually we may get some true "first world" social democracy in the U.S.A. too.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)swipe at all American workers because of a story about entitled brats who got taught a valuable lesson about what working for a living is actually like.
Response to leftynyc (Reply #46)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)These were INTERNS - they're there for work experience and learned a valuable lesson that places of employment are not democracies.
Response to leftynyc (Reply #95)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)from especially privileged backgrounds, just not from genuinely impoverished ones. These days typical American suburban kids of parents doing okay are privileged, whether they realize it or not. They typically have undemanding responsibilities around the house and lead very sheltered lives, overloaded with possessions and overprotected and underexposed to the world. The group could also span the entire socioeconomic spectrum. College does that for people.
Response to Hortensis (Reply #154)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)The vast majority is not every one. Also, the majority of your students were undoubtedly working for discretionary spending money, plus perhaps meeting the dreadful hardship of being required to save some money toward some large purchase their parents required them to help kick in for. The majority were not working to help their parents feed the younger children, though if relatively poor they may have had to buy their own nice clothes if they wanted any and help out the family in a crunch.
Our children are raising their kids in solid middle middle class and upper middle class neighborhoods. I recognize the attitudes well enough. The more modest-neighborhood neighbors just got to bail a 16-year-old out of jail who thought the police couldn't treat people "this way" and may have learned the hard way that challenging cops when they ask for your license is a bad idea. May because that seems to be slow in coming. They're both bemused and amused to realize they raised such a dumbass kid who now "understands" why people join terrorist groups, but the kid probably literally never walked farther than the subdivision pool area alone until he was in high school.
In any case, like others I wouldn't be a bit surprised if this group had a leader who instigated a group-think that this was a reasonable and appropriate way for people preparing for mid-level jobs to approach a workplace problem.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)What was the point of that?
Squinch
(50,949 posts)like the existing terms.
Seems like gargantuan entitlement to me.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)when she/he got home, Mom and Dad told him/her how special she/he is and how he/she is going to change the world.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)Mommy probably made him his favorite meal.
EllieBC
(3,014 posts)"What's wrong with you? Who raised you? Now you go out and find whatever job you can. And you shut your mouth, open your ears and eyes, and learn something!".
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)My sibling from another mother ... Frankly, I would have been afraid to tell my parents what happened ... better I just say I quit!
EllieBC
(3,014 posts)For pulling a lot of call ins on the weekend because I wanted to hang out with friends. My father warned me I would get fired. Sure enough, I did. My father asked me how I was going to afford to loiter at the mall with friends now that I didn't have job. That wasn't all he had to say about my poor work ethic but I'm sure you can fill in the rest.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I hated it. The boxes were heavy ... the storeroom was a mess ... and the owner was a first rate ass. So, after my first pay check, I just didn't go back.
My Father noticed me at home, when I was supposed to be at work. I told him what happened and that I had quit. He asked me how I took the owner. I told him, "Nothing ... I just didn't go back."
He put me in the car a drove me to the shop, and put me out, telling me ... "You were 'Man" enough to quit; you have to be 'Man' enough to own it."
That, was a valuable lesson.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)Being "man enough" to own the fact that you abandoned a job ... If that's supposed to equal something like "big girls don't cry", then well, you didn't cry about it, did you, so what was your father's problem? Weird on your father's part, IMHO.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)What was wrong with my father?
closeupready
(29,503 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)as a result, he raised a well adjusted, adult that owns up to/takes responsibility for his decisions.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)that's something that I would not do to my child.
If, on the other hand, my child quit for a stupid reason, or just got lazy, then I would think about doing so.
Perhaps I'm not getting the nuances of how events unfolded; not trying to antagonize you, so peace to you.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I quit for the reasons I stated ... the boxes were heavy and the stockroom was a mess ... and the unspoken reason ... I was 15.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)I said what I needed to say, I didn't intend for you to take my remarks personally, I apologize if it came off that way, ok? Sincerely.
We three may have a difference of opinion (or not). I can live with that, and I'm done with this sub-thread.
Have a great evening.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)to something that could be used as an excuse for just walking out. Somehow I doubt this father thought his son should stay and be genuinely seriously abused. But being able to fit calmly and properly into a hierarchical work environment is absolutely necessary for success for virtually anyone, no matter how privileged the upbringing.
In any case, there are right ways and wrong ways to do anything, and this father insisted leaving the job be done a right way--for his son's sake. We would absolutely have insisted on the same. We were far from perfect, but it's about trying to raise a child to be an honorable, responsible adult who can be proud of himself, as opposed just being around while it happens willy-nilly.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)you have committed to do.
The only person I ever knew that did that had bipolar disorder.
1StrongBlackMan didn't have that excuse. His dad did the right thing.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)pnwmom
(108,978 posts)and give whatever notice you agreed to when you took the job. Clearly this workplace wasn't a dangerous place and 1StrongBlackMan wouldn't have been at risk if he had announced his intention to leave.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)But he said "the boss was an ass".
If you were being abused by a boss, and you walked off the job, you'd go back and explain? I don't think so.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)and that the boss wasn't so abusive he should have walked off the job without notice.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)alphafemale
(18,497 posts)You've avoided that with wave smilies?
closeupready
(29,503 posts)Oky, great, thanks - I'll remember you said that. Cheers.
astral
(2,531 posts)I heard a story myself a new hiree just didn't come back after lunch on their first day of work, never bothered to tell them anything. now that's just weird.
even in an abusive work environment you tell your employer you are quitting. If you feel it's bad enough you don't need to give notice, that's a separate issue and sometimes might be warranted. if you don't need the money and don't want to put them on your resume', or if the abuse was that extreme in your opinion.
hunter
(38,312 posts)So much so that I quit telling them about the hardest knocks I endured.
At one point I was homeless and living in my broken car in a church parking lot.
Bloody hell, I learned a lot about the world, all the good, bad, ugly, and Holy Mother of God there is some ugly shit out there.
I'm sure my own kids, adults now, have stories to tell, their own stories of crash-and-burn, but I pray none as bad as my own, or that they ever had to learn to be invisible as a means of survival.
FixTheProblem
(22 posts)I'll likely die before 40 due to depression that no one cares about. I've had a few jobs, and always worked as hard as I was able, but that's not good enough, it seems. I quit my first job at 17 after my boss called me "poor white trash" and called my mother a whore. I guess, according to the responses here, I should have "accepted responsibility" and "learned something," since I had not "earned the right to speak." Oh yeah, about that boss, he's serving 30 years in prison for rape right now.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)This kid did not think "he/she could dictate terms to the company when he/she didn't like the existing terms."
This kid thought he/she could approach the management with a grievance AND a proposed solution and get a fair hearing without punitive consequences. That doesn't make her/him a "special snowflake." That makes her/him an American. Or does that whole "right to petition grievances" thing in the First Amendment rub you the wrong way, too?
Squinch
(50,949 posts)horrible abuse! Such patriotic Americanism to refuse to accept a dress code they tacitly agreed to when they took the internship! Such bravery in the face of such vile injustice!
And do read up on that right to petition grievances. Because it has nothing to do with this situation.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)Asked management to consider a broad employee request. No sit in, no hunger strike, no hostages. A request. And that a fireable offense? And you're good with that? Because its way too authoritarian for my tastes.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)they have no standing) and for wasting everyone's time.
And the sad and tragic fact is that when you are a summer intern, others do have professional authority over you.
obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)As I said downthread, I would have booted them, too.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)work." I think the reaction of the company was way overblown. And yes, very authoritarian.
obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Squinch
(50,949 posts)made an issue of it and distracted many members of the office into an argument about shoes.
No one who is actually doing a job has any time for that, and if some intern is insisting that we all take the time to do that, that intern would be showing me that they aren't mature enough to be in the workplace.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Restarting with a new batch of interns isn't cheap.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)tammywammy
(26,582 posts)The request was already turned down.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)It's not like they staged a sit-down strike or set the office on fire. They revisited the question, showing that it was nearly all interns who felt that way, not just one malcontent. Hell, if I accepted every answer from every moron manager I've ever worked for, I'd never have gotten as far as I have. Sure, tell them no again, but firing? I can't imagine any actually competent manager or organization responding that way.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)After being told no, the interns continued to press for information they had no right to and waste time on a freaking petition about shoes. And on top of that doesn't even have the audacity to be embarrassed that their whole argument essentially rested on an ADA situation with someone that had lost their freaking leg! They were wasting time that should have been spent learning about the company and industry to bitch about shoes.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Proud Liberal Dem
(24,412 posts)pretty much none. Plus, we may not even be getting the full story either. Who know what was said, how things were spoken, and how they were acting. Could be more there than we are being told.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)to change its policy -- without even first trying to understand why the policy was in place.
Not a good tactic to take. Work places aren't democracies, by the way. Too bad these interns had to learn that the hard way.
Abq_Sarah
(2,883 posts)I can say if I had a group of interns who decided they wanted to float a petition to change company policy, they'd get some real world experience in getting fired.
f the idiot who started the petition had come to me and asked for a revision of the dress code, I would have at least considered it and listened to her. But a petition? Oh hell no.
Squinch
(50,949 posts)was told no and THEN did the petition.
If they worked for me they would be out the door before they knew they had turned around.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)This doesn't rub me the wrong way - I just don't quite believe it.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)per se. But the constitution also enshines our values -- including questioning authority, something I'm always surprised isnt more valued on DU.
Drahthaardogs
(6,843 posts)I fail to see this intern as Patrick Fucking Henry. I see a spoiled little shit who wanted to wear sneakers and organized a "petition" when told no. I would have fired the intern for lack of maturity if nothing else. There are things worth falling on your sword. Keds ain't one of them...
Squinch
(50,949 posts)PJMcK
(22,037 posts)The Constitution does not grant rights to workers in private employ. It grants rights to the people protecting them from the Government. In contrast, private corporations are protected by the Constitution to have their own rules for their company's operations.
The young person in this story clearly didn't understand their position in the company's hierarchy. That's life. Perhaps they will have learned an important lesson about work.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)Right above your comment.
obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)I feel like, so far, I am hearing a bunch of right-wing senior citizens spouting off about how kids these days just don't sit down, shut up and do as their told. No matter how stupid it is.
And for the record, I have been employed in the corporate world for over 30 years, so it's no like I am some non-conformist rabble-rouser.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)I was starting to feel like I had stumbled into the Twighlight Zone. Glad there are at least two of us who get it!
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)Iris
(15,657 posts)X_Digger
(18,585 posts)A private (non-government) employer doesn't have to allow you to proselytize at work, or listen to your political speech.
The right to a free press or the right to the free exercise of religion is the ability to do so without government interference.
It has fuck-all to do with you and your employer. The same applies to the fourth amendment. Your employer doesn't have to get a warrant to search your desk, and they can fire your ass for not letting them search your bag / purse / backpack, if it's company policy.
It's right there in the preamble to the bill of rights.
God, I get tired of this. I swear to god, we need to propose a $50 tax credit for people to take and pass an online 10th grade civics class.
* There are things that an employer must accommodate, but there is specific legislation protecting these circumstances. e.g. union organizing or reasonable accommodation for religious practice. These have nothing to do with the bill of rights.
Iris
(15,657 posts)This is a thread that makes it hard for me to believe this is still DU. I'm not even sure what I'm seeing here - resentment towards college students or complacency with a system that has such little regard for workers'rights that firing someone for speaking up is a fireable offense.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)Further, what they don't seem to have considered is the one with sneakers may have had a medical need.
EDIT - I went to the article and I see, yup, Ms. Sneakers DID have a medical need.
Some interns are interns for a good reason, I guess.
splat
(2,294 posts)Your head is supposed to be into how to improve procedures or save or make money in most businesses.
They made a dress code to create what they think of as a professional atmosphere. If your energy is going to making you comfortable rather than making them more successful, they'll decide you don't fit.
You can find a looser atmosphere within the industry or bite the bullet and take what you need while looking harmless.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)the money-saving proposal, would likely be unfavorably received, if not filed away, unread ... Why? Because "you're" a summer intern!
This is not to say, the rare case that someone with a month of experience can develop a money-saving plan (that hasn't been tried, evaluated and discarded) can't occur; but, the odds are, vanishingly, short.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)As someone with a daughter who has interned, and someone who has supervised interns, here's my view: business attire either costs a lot or looks shitty . If I'm taking on some college kid or recent grad (who's likely drowning in debt), and that kid is working without a salary, I will think twice about requiring them to acquire more business attire (they generally all have an "interview suit," but wearing the same suit all week every week is impractical, especially in a DC summer). If they're trapped in their cube all day, only interacting with other coworkers, I don't have a problem with business casual.
Also, any business that deals with a non-confrontational employee request by summarily firing the employee is evil. That goes without saying.
Arkansas Granny
(31,516 posts)and was told there was no leeway. The other interns who had asked their managers had been told the same, but they collectively decided to carry it further with a signed proposal.
Sometimes you have to accept the answer even if you don't like it.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)The kid asks the manager, manager says no way, no leeway.
So the kid thinks: well, why not? Maybe if we all band together, showing that there's broad feeling about this among the interns and asking that the dress code have a rational purpose (most don't), maybe we can effect change.
Sure, shoot down the proposal. But fire her/him? Frankly, that's the kind of person I want working for me: somebody who questions institutional behavior, looks for a rational fit between policy and purpose, and acts on their ideas.
Iris
(15,657 posts)We throw the word entrepreneur around until its meaningless and take glee in watching someone get cut down for questioning?
tonyt53
(5,737 posts)They take the position knowing what is expected, including attire. I've been fortunate enough to have had some good ones, as well as the two that I have here now (engineering firm). They do ask questions about why we do some things a certain way, but those questions are relevant to their careers and part of gaining experience, and never about attire. While here, they can wear jeans and tennis shoes. But when they go out to a customer's location, they have to wear business casual attire, including the appropriate shoes. The intern has a choice when taking a position. They know the responsibilities up front.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)That the kid was okay with professional attire requirement because s/he assumed it had a purpose. It sounds like it had no purpose at all (I've seen plenty of positions like that, and worked a few) and the interns wanted managers to rethink their policy. I respect that. You don't have to agree with the intern, but firing seems like thin-skinned overkill designed to teach the lesson, "never question authority." That's not something I'd ever get behind.
hunter
(38,312 posts)Unless it's the sort of internship that provides free room and board the only kids who can afford to be interns have wealthy parents.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)I've supervised plenty of interns who worked a second job in order to get the educational and professional opportunities of an internship (usually while living in group homes with shared bedrooms to save on housing). I agree interns should be paid, but not every intern is the spoiled scion of the 1%.
hunter
(38,312 posts)... half for working, half for formal classroom-style training.
The U.S. system is bullshit.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)AntiBank
(1,339 posts)on the US too (law clerk).
tonyt53
(5,737 posts)The union building trades all have this type of program. The apprentices go to school on their own time usually, but in some places like Chicago and the Plumbers & Pipefitters Local 597, they also get paid to go to school because it is during the day
etherealtruth
(22,165 posts)This is the mid-west not the east or west coast, so one would hardly call this a meager wage.
The only unpaid internship I ever had was at the university I attended.
I work in a "science and engineering" profession ... I have never run into unpaid internships; quite the opposite. These internships usually pay more than other typical "summer jobs" and are coveted.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)Interns paid around $20/hour and this is in the DFW area.
etherealtruth
(22,165 posts)I can't fathom this type of behavior from interns.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)Mechanical, electrical, software, manufacturing, systems engineering, etc. It's a manufacturing facility, so that plus the business stuff - finance, proposals, etc.
etherealtruth
(22,165 posts)Senior Environmental Scientist .... a token "non-engineer"
hack89
(39,171 posts)hunter
(38,312 posts)The only uncomfortable footwear I've ever been required to wear is steel toed boots. They grow on you. Eventually you feel pretty bad-ass wearing them.
Closed toed non-porous shoes with non-skid soles have been another requirement, but some of the stuff we were working with isn't anything you'd ever want on your toes.
hack89
(39,171 posts)Which means leather shoes for men and no sandals for women.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)belcffub
(595 posts)at the end of the summer I asked if I could stay... they said yes... I canceled all my classes drove home packed up and moved 500 miles away... best thing I ever did... went to school at night while working for a big name company the paved my way for other jobs... loved my internship...
belcffub
(595 posts)and I was an intern and it lead to great career...
christx30
(6,241 posts)I've been working where I am for 4 years. Love my job, and the relaxed atmosphere here. Jeans, tshirts, and no open toed shoes is the dress code.
We recently had a merger, and the dress code changed to business casual. I'm in a call center environment with no customer interaction. But rather than complain about it, I went to a second hand store and bought some slacks.
If the aim is to keep your job, sometimes you just do what you are told. Plus, I look GOOD.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)tammywammy
(26,582 posts)I read it daily.
Allison's advice was spot on to them. The intern made a petition and demanded changes - the workplace isn't school. It's not a surprise they were all fired. Hopefully the interns take this as a learning experience, by the way the letter is written it doesn't appear so.
fasttense
(17,301 posts)And Democrats here on DU think it's great they all got fired for daring to question their masters...Er I mean their poorly paying or no paying capatalist empolyers.
These so called employers (cause if you're not paying for your labor you ain't an employer.) cut off these students (interns are suppose to be students learning about the industry) from even asking questions. What kind of educational experience is that?
Or have we gone so far down the rabbit hole the we are allowing employers to use and abuse interns as if they were real full time paid workes? Now that attitude will ensure that unions will disappear from the American economy.
And then Democrats, who were once the party of the working people, get on a Democratic board and cheer on the abuse as if they were guards of some slave labor camp.
There are so many things wrong about this thread, I pray it's not indicative of what DU has turned into.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)Where I work all interns are paid an hourly wage. They're also not given crap tasks and if they work out well are offered a full time position for when they graduate. Interns comply with the same dress code as everyone else.
fasttense
(17,301 posts)tammywammy
(26,582 posts)They don't do grunt work like make copies or fetch coffee, but they don't have near the responsibility as even an entry level person and no where close to what I do. They're paid around $20/hour which is less than an entry level college hire.
Hekate
(90,686 posts)...about the company and the industry, and if they make a good impression (and if there is an opening) they might be offered a job as a regular hire after college.
Internships are opportunities, not careers. They are below entry level. Way, way below. They are a coveted foot in the door when every available job has hundreds, if not thousands, of applicants.
So you want to show up on time, do what you are told to do as best you can with a smile on your face, and dress the way they tell you to dress because it's their company and their image, not yours.
ProfessorGAC
(65,042 posts). . .to do the same job as a full time, experienced professional?
R.A. Ganoush
(97 posts)Strong enforcement over the past 5 years since the rule clarification has dramatically reduced the number of unpaid internship. They're paid a wage with mandated deductions and are expected to do the work assigned to them.
It isn't a fucking vacation lifeguarding at the town pool.
Do. Your. Job...and keep your mouth shut and you just might learn something, which is why you're there.
fasttense
(17,301 posts)R.A. Ganoush
(97 posts)at no time was that stated. If you inferred that, well I guess that's on you.
The point is there are increasing enforcement mechanisms that have rendered your argument moot over time. Interns serve a valuable purpose to many businesses, large and small; they've received additional protections over time to mitigate abuse, and if they'd like the same working conditions, privileges and benefits as regular employees, they're free to apply or be offered continuing employment at the conclusion of their internship. Until then, their smartest move is to just learn from the opportunity.
That's just the way it is.
fasttense
(17,301 posts)I live in the south and I've seen interns in the fields picking, on the roads digging and in the office filing. The office filer was getting college credit from Walter State and no pay. The field hands were recieving only room and board and were from a college in NC. And the road crew worker said he got minimum wage, even though the others were making $10 an hour. Interns seem to be just a way to beef up your labor for little to no pay.
R.A. Ganoush
(97 posts)It's a federal standard.
hack89
(39,171 posts)we view internships as extended job interviews and are very careful who we pick.
Orrex
(63,212 posts)Last edited Thu Jun 30, 2016, 03:36 PM - Edit history (1)
Why shouldn't interns be held to the same standard as conventional employees? What rules should apply to interns? Can they be expected to perform the work that they agree to perform? Can they hang out on their phones for their entire shift? Can they insult customers and use profanity with no fear of repercussion? Why do you prioritize the interns over their employers?
They're not children running around in a field; they are professionals working in a professional environment, and they should reasonably be expected to conform to the policies of the company for which they're interning. If they don't like the terms of that employment, then they are free to leave. If they violate the terms of that employment, then the employer is under no obligation to retain them.
B2G
(9,766 posts)Everything you just posted explains entirely why these kids feel entitled to live by different rules and get all pouty when they can't.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)And Democrats here on DU think it's great they all got fired for daring to question their masters...Er I mean their poorly paying or no paying capatalist empolyers.
I'm going to be frank. If I were in the boss's position, I would have let them go as well. This has nothing to do with rights of workers vs. employers; this has everything to do with the fact they were being nuisances and wasting everyone's time on a ridiculous non-issue.
And then Democrats, who were once the party of the working people, get on a Democratic board and cheer on the abuse as if they were guards of some slave labor camp.
"Waaahhhhh I can't wear tennis shoes when I feel like it"
IS NOT
"I'm being worked to death, developing cancer, never getting to see my children, not able to put food on the table, and unable to afford to see a doctor."
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)I can't believe all these authoritarian posts.
LarryNM
(493 posts)NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)Growing pains can be, well, painful.
Throd
(7,208 posts)closeupready
(29,503 posts)A lovely, friendly woman. I met her one day during a period when I was collecting unemployment after having been laid off from a job that was just not a good fit for me. Upon learning of my industry, she asked me for a favor (which I could never fulfill, I didn't even want to), but I recall one thing she said, that she believed it was healthy for everyone to get fired from at least one job at some point during their careers.
I didn't really understand her meaning at the time, but in hindsight, I do now, and I would now agree with her.
The lesson I learned was never to work for that jerk again! (wink)
Happy 4th of July.
astral
(2,531 posts)so long ago I forgot it ever happened. I was fired for not WEARING my shoes, my feet sweated a lot and I was walking down the hall in my socks on an errand, something I did all the time but nobody seemed to notice nor was I aware there was anything wrong with it. My boss from a distance saw me and hollered at me to put my shoes on and I thought that was rude ( this was in truth my first 'boss from hell' anyway) so I decided to keep walking and put my shoes on when I come back.
Surprise, surprise, I was fired that day for Insubordination. I was very surprised, and I HAD learned my lesson, not too sad to lose my boss from hell, tho!
I had been on the job almost six months and was told my probationary period was still in effect so I didn't need to be given a warning or a second chance.
People should realize that young people don't know where their boundaries are yet, and they certainly don't learn about them in school, what they do and don't learn in school is another topic of conversation, tho!
My reason for not immediately obeying my boss were twofold, first, I thought she was just being obnoxious and trying to embarrass me, second, I was very offended at being hollered at from far away so everyone could hear it, besides from being totally startled, my reaction was to hold off on reacting, so I kept on walking.
Wait, wha. . . ?
taught_me_patience
(5,477 posts)this was just an excuse.
PJMcK
(22,037 posts)There wasn't any indication in the article that the writer had an acrimonious relationship with her supervisor(s). Further, she wasn't the only intern let go, the whole group who felt entitled to argue a ridiculously unimportant point, i.e., wearing athletic shoes to work, were let go.
Please explain your post.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)say "No." If you think it is important enough for you, Just Do It without drawing a bunch of other people into it. I hope the intern learned something.
alc
(1,151 posts)I'm against most H1B use but this is part of the reason companies go that route. I've worked for 2 companies that pay more for H1Bs than they would for direct hires (the consulting company takes a huge cut so the workers don't get that much).
If you need 100s of IT workers it's a risk having new grads or young junior developers (which you need for cost and worker availability reasons). 5-10 will have this attitude and will often get others to go with them.
They tell me I'm using the wrong programming language; wrong platform; wrong tools; wrong methodology. Or the business is stupid for asking for this requirement or that tool or some data analysis. And we have THE SAME discussion every week. I've had junior developers do things "their way" AFTER we had a discussion of "their way" vs "my way". And use an open source library AFTER legal told us not to. And bypass me and go directly to the business to tell them they wouldn't get what they asked for because it was stupid (the trouble makers don't have a lot of tact). Most are not like this but a small percent cause huge headaches. And potential legal liabilities they don't understand even after being told. A $multi-million fine can happen really quick with cookies, and user-uploaded content, and accessibility for the disabled. And some junior developers don't care no matter how much training legal and senior developers give them.
H1Bs don't have this problem. And when there is a problem the company you hire them from will have them replaced tomorrow. There are many other problems with H1Bs but certain classes of headaches don't happen.
EllieBC
(3,014 posts)We have a large immigrant Filipino and Indian population here in BC. Many industries from IT to transportation to service prefer to hire them because they show up on time and work hard.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)American staff seem to dress not just sloppily but scandalously - and now, from this story, it seems they DEMAND no standards.
Bring back "Dress for Success!"
tblue37
(65,357 posts)the international students have a better work ethic, a more respectful attitude, and a willingness to accept and learn from correction and critiques. Students from some countries can be difficult to deal with, but most of my international students, despite difficulties with English, are more willing to be taught and more aware that they have a responsibility to be in class, do the assignments, and pay attention.
(Again, these observations are general, so of course there are exceptions.)
Hekate
(90,686 posts)....and not have ever held a job where, oddly enough, you have to do what the boss tells you to do unless it is actually illegal.
I wonder how many of those kids learned the many valuable lessons available from this episode.
EllieBC
(3,014 posts)She focused on school so she never held s job before.
Hekate
(90,686 posts)....as a sales clerk all the way through university. The store had a strict dress code, which we were instructed in when we were hired. The pathetically low wage covered food, rent, clothing and not much else (ie, no car, not much entertainment). Fortunately my savings covered tuition and fees, which were orders of magnitude lower back then. While I was under my parents' roof I was required to find summer jobs -- which, aside from everything else was supposed to teach me responsibility in the adult world, things like showing up on time and taking orders from the people who paid you to be there.
I would have loved to have had the opportunity for an internship to learn something in the career world that didn't involve sales clerking, babysitting, or canning pineapples, but kids of my social class didn't even know what internships were, or at least my parents certainly did not. They had no "connections" and they had no means of paying my way if I was living away from home.
I do not begrudge any young person who has it easier, but it flabbergasts me that their parents would fail to let them learn the essential life lessons involved in holding that first crummy job at 16 or 18 years old. Then by the time they get to be an intern in the industry they want to have a career in, they will have some basis on which to judge the incredible privilege that involves.
B2G
(9,766 posts)Dress codes and other corporate policies are specifically detailed for new employees prior to or immediately upon hiring.
They agreed and became disgruntled when they observed an employee wearing casual footwear...due to a lost limb when they were deployed, BTW. So they decided to circulate a petition, most likely on company time, and got slapped down for it. Boo hoo.
Snowflakes indeed.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)equals sick perverted control freaks
closeupready
(29,503 posts)LarryNM
(493 posts)Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)My area cellphone company is being sold to AT&T. Some in this area are being held hostage. Anyway I got a real jackass letter from AT&T telling us what we were to do or we could shove it. IT MAKES ME FEEL SO GOOD TO TELL AT&T TO SHOVE IT. I feel sorry for those in my area who have no choice but to subscribe to AT&T because of reception problems.
In 1996 because of the feud, I had to pay, because of use of AT&T lines, 50cents a minute to talk to my son 60 miles away.
Screw the big boys and their chicken shit rules. I am 69 and have earned the right to be a jackass!
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)I can't believe this crap!
cbdo2007
(9,213 posts)It really does matter...not that they should be overdressing, but they should go out of their way to wear as nice of clothes as they can afford and definitely make a point of not underdressing, even if other people are.
SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)I find that sad
do the clothes make the person - for far too many this is true
Hekate
(90,686 posts)Careful shopping of sales or even thrift stores will allow a person of limited means to accumulate a very good career wardrobe over time.
Or, in this context, another valuable life skill.
PJMcK
(22,037 posts)This is the advice that I got when I began working and I note that closeupready made this point in post #87.
At my first job, the boss/owner always wore impeccable suits and ties. He looked like he was the wealthy success that he was. Although I couldn't afford to shop where he did, he set the tone for the office and as a new hire, it would never have occurred to me to dress down. After all, people respond to one's appearance whether subconsciously or not.
The old adage is still true: you only get one chance to make a first impression.
uppityperson
(115,677 posts)something else. Like just doing your job.
I'm not going to call this person names or insult them. I hope they learned that it is unfortunate but businesses are often not democratic.
AngryOldDem
(14,061 posts)Job Lesson No. 1.
tblue37
(65,357 posts)Their comments are well worth reading.
tammywammy
(26,582 posts)The comments are excellent.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)only a few would say "probably not the best time to stick it to the man."
The intern probably would have been better off trying to form a union, at least you have some protection if you do it right.
obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)And, I am a very lenient, very reasonable, and very friendly boss. I LOVE working with kids this age, I love mentoring them, and helping them achieve their goals.
However...
My interns know my expectations and our policies. They are treated very well and paid decent, but if they pulled this? Gone. I have too many kids who want these jobs and want to actually learn something and be mentored to put up with this time wasting and ridiculous requests.
I would love to wear a t-shirt, running shorts, and flippies to work every day. Guess what? I can't, and knew that when I accepted the job offer.
brooklynite
(94,571 posts)SwankyXomb
(2,030 posts)brooklynite
(94,571 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)...seem to me to be overly punitive. Some people are taking some undue satisfaction from this story, predicated on an unspoken and bunk notion that younger people don't compare favorably to middle aged and older people. That's just not true.
etherealtruth
(22,165 posts).... like everyone else there's good , there's bad and most are in between.
Have had an absolutely horrible intern this summer .... due to the particular circumstances surrounding her hire we are looking at her internship as a $6,500 bill for the cost of doing business. her actions sound very similar to the spirit of the interns in the OP
Squinch
(50,949 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)Squinch
(50,949 posts)favorably to older people.
You appear to be projecting on me the fact that you are putting words in the mouths of others.
cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)"I am here to see to it."
Yup.
meaculpa2011
(918 posts)in the past 10 years.
Before she's been through orientation, she already knows everything the company is doing wrong.
Employers love that.
aikoaiko
(34,170 posts)The warning was worded just like that. My interviewer said there are lots of things that need changing, but just don't say anything until the PTB trust you and that will take 2 years. He was right.
obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)They need to trust you, and know you consider yourself a stakeholder in the company, and the critique/suggestions are coming from a thoughtful place.
elleng
(130,908 posts)Company doesn't want to deal with employees who have MINDS.
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)Sounds like a "Men in Black" situation.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I'm gonna take a wild guess that the "industry" in question is on the East Coast, and it involves some shit like moving other peoples' money around in less-than-transparent ways.
On the other side of the country where people actually make and sell innovative products that folks actually use, no one gives a flying half a fuck what people wear to work, as long as they're competent.
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)In the places where actual innovation is taking place, no one gives a fuck about suits and ties. The truly valuable people in Silicon Valley come to work every day in sweats.
"tradition" is shorthand for "we are out of ideas"
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)...And Nolan Bushnell was recalling about how laid-back and easy-going things were at Atari in it's early years before he sold the company. Bushnell was kept on at Atari after he sold the company but was soon sacked because he angrily resisted the big-wigs trying to "tighten up" the behavior of employees. A bunch of angry workers left to form the company Activision and soon after Atari was fucked when the 1983 video game crash happened.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Odin2005
(53,521 posts)Folks on the west coast don't give a shit about dress codes.
Haveadream
(1,630 posts)rather than someone who took it for granted. Employment is competitive and good jobs are at a premium. Getting a foot in the door (no pun intended) in a profession of your choosing is a luxury afforded to few. She threw away that opportunity just to make an irrelevant point. I would fire her not so much for the insubordination but the stupidity, lousy work ethic and lack of ability to learn even the basics of their corporate culture. The only thing I blame the employer for is giving her too much free time to waste on nonsense like this rather than being productive.
No sympathy for this one.
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)Shit, I like it when when I have employees bring these things to my attention. I really hate the way we have made women spend their producing having to hassle with walking on stilts. (High Heels)
Bought two investment properties a couple of months ago and I complimented the lady employee for her choice in flat footwear.
dilby
(2,273 posts)But anyways hopefully these kids will look at other avenues for dealing with corporate America like looking into Unions and how a Union would have addressed this.
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)"special snowflakes"
Iris
(15,657 posts)SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)???
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)Squinch
(50,949 posts)hunter
(38,312 posts)Right wing memes are so damned pathetic. I can't tell if some of the posters in this thread are trolling or serious.
Parody or reality???
I asked above, in a reply to another poster, how would you like to tell YOUR boss you fired all the interns in a dispute over footwear.
In the real world, not bizarro authoritarian wingnut world, firing all the interns would get YOU fired too.
But I don't know, maybe in bizarro authoritarian wingnut world shit like this happens every day.
And maybe all those letters to Penthouse were real too!!!
"I often fantasize about having sex with men in uniform, but I never thought this would happen to me..."
PJMcK
(22,037 posts)Squinch
(50,949 posts)The Second Stone
(2,900 posts)and management wanted to bust them fast.
RandySF
(58,832 posts)romanic
(2,841 posts)That's hilarious. I'm sorry but the interns truly were special snowflakes. They knew the job had a dress code and agreed to it upon being hired. You have no say as to what your employer expects of you. They learned the hard way.
GOLGO 13
(1,681 posts)Not everyone will be treated all the same. Therefore, OBEY & shut your face. No sympathy from me.
Ilsa
(61,695 posts)the parking lot to the office, a distance of over 1/4 mile. The following year, it looked like most women were wearing them to walk into work in NYC. I had ruined at least 2 pairs of shoes trying to be in dress codein the parking lot.
hunter
(38,312 posts)One day I forgot to change my shoes and wore my red Chuck Taylor High Tops into the office.
My boss looked me up and down and I could tell she was trying not to laugh. It took me a second to catch on.
Fortunately I was well regarded in my work, and considered a bit eccentric otherwise. But even then, what's the big deal?
Response to Heeeeers Johnny (Original post)
LanternWaste This message was self-deleted by its author.
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)I'd say a name change is in order for this board. Authoritarian Underground anyone? Since when do we cheer the firing of underlings making proposals to their employers?
Oh and all hail the gig economy!
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)And get off my lawn!
FixTheProblem
(22 posts)I'll vote for Clinton, then I guess I'll go commit suicide, since I can't get a job due to my depression, and all everyone, even liberals, do is laugh at me. There certainly isn't any help out there.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Ripping off the retirement funds of old folks with shady-ass "creative investment vehicles".
Then, when they crash the economy with their fraudulent crap, we the taxpayers bail them out.
"Entitlement", amirite?
But they're wearing brooks brothers suits, so ....they must be legit.
Dress code intern should learn to code, move out west and get a job with a tech company that actually makes shit people buy...
and where no one will even think about giving a fuck what outfit he or she wears to work.
FixTheProblem
(22 posts)Millennials REFUSE to be slaves, and WILL NOT TOLERATE being abused. They DEMAND respect and they will get it or else they'll tell their "job creator" to go pound sand.
Why is it that whenever a young person stands up for his/herself and refuses to be treated like horse shit, then they're "lazy" or "spoiled" or a "special snowflake?" Why is it whenever someone mindlessly submits to whatever abuse their "job creator" wants, then it's called "being an adult" or "having responsibility?"
FUCK that!
Squinch
(50,949 posts)It's just brattiness.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)and you want a decent salary, expect it to be necessary to dress nicely. That's just the way it works.
How damn hard is it to wear a decent pair of shoes? There are plenty of them that are comfortable and tasteful out there. I wear running shoes ... for running.