What do we do about Erdogan at this point?

[LettuceSea]

Take him out? Appease him? Something in the middle?

I admit that I hate this guy, or any secular dictator who thinks its ok to treat women like cattle and want to throw gays off of rooftops. He is a threat to the modern way of life and freedom for all. But I do realize the situation is now far more complicated after this weekend.

He's got 8.5 million followers on his verified (WTF Zuckerberg???) Facebook account, and if you look at those comments he's now a hero in the eyes of the Islamic world. We have nukes and other defense weapons in Turkey, they are a NATO country, Russian influence...this is really a shitty situation. How do we resolve it?

[onecaliberal]

1. Don't pretend to really know. Saddam was a bad guy too but he kept the country out of chaos.

I hope we learned something from history in this situation.

[LettuceSea]

5. i'm not sure either

Heart wants us to teach them a lesson and take him out, Head obv says it's waaaaaaay more complicated, and acting on emotion would make it worse....

[NCTraveler]

26. "but he kept the country out of chaos."

That thought is very dependent on the group being looked at. Large parts of Iraq were extremely chaotic for specific groups. It can't be discussed in absolutes as you have done.

[Avalux]

2. Absolutely nothing.

If the people of Turkey allow Erdogan builds a perfect little dictatorship and swing the country way conservative, we can't do anything.

It's up the the citizens to decide what happens next. Just like here...if we don't participate and let the radicals decide we surely will go that way too (it's been happening slowly anyway).

Democracy demands participation. Violence and intercession from foreign countries doesn't create it or restore it, as we should know by now.

[PJMcK]

29. This^^^

[Statistical]

3. Kick Turkey out of NATO and for god sake pull those pointless nukes out of there.

A single Ohio class submarine has more explosive power than all the ordinance ever used in all wars combined ... and we have fourteen of them. We absolutely don't need to be keeping 30 ish aging gravity bombs in a place like Turkey. While we are at it let's end the asinine nuclear weapon lending program completely.

Honestly the internal affairs of Turkey really aren't our business. We can encourage them to avoid going down that road but the people of Turkey seem to overwhelmingly want an islamofascist homophobe ISIS ally as a President. The one thing we can change is our relationship with the country and we should.

[LettuceSea]

6. Your post resonates w/ me

I see we just banned all flights b/t the US and Turkey.

Perhaps we will first take steps to weaken their economy and currency? I'm betting the Lira will take a beating for awhile. Maybe they won't love him so much if their currency and economy falls apart....?

[geek tragedy]

15. Bingo. They want to act like Egypt or Algeria, they get treated like those countries nt

[randome]

4. "We wish him well."

[hr][font color="blue"][center]You have to play the game to find out why you're playing the game. -Existenz[/center][/font][hr]

[mopinko]

7. out him.

when they file for extradition for gulen, release the intel that we no doubt have that no doubt shows he had nothing to do with it.
then let him stay here.

i dont doubt we also have intel showing that the whole thing was a sham. release that, and yeah, kick them out of nato immediately. and close our base there.

[onecaliberal]

8. We have nukes there

[mopinko]

9. yeah, we need to get them out of there.

like, now.

[onecaliberal]

10. Indeed

[JanMichael]

11. Secular? Really? nt

[AntiBank]

12. Erdogan is not secular

[bemildred]

13. Wait.

He is a desperate man.

[geek tragedy]

16. desperate or just unhinged? nt

[bemildred]

17. Erdogan taunts Obama over coup attempt in Turkey

The Turkish President Recep Erdogan’s sensational demand on Saturday to US President Barack Obama to extradite the Islamist preacher Fetullah Gulen living in exile in Pennsylvania does not come as surprise. It had to happen sooner or later.
Erdogan appeal to US for extraditing Gulen

Turkish President Recep Erdogan told his supporters on Saturday that although he had shared with Barack Obama the intelligence on a likely coup attempt by Gulen’s followers, the US President sat on it

But then, Erdogan has chosen to speak publicly on such a highly sensitive issue instead of using the confidential channels of communication.

Any long-time observer of Erdogan and his political personality can make out that he is taunting Obama within the week of the NATO summit in Warsaw. These are excerpts from Erdogan’s public remarks in Istanbul on Saturday:

Please meet our request (on Gulen’s extradition) if we (Turkey and US) are strategic partners. I asked you (Obama) previously either to deport him or surrender him to Turkey. I told you that he is considering the coup d’etat, but you didn’t listen.

http://atimes.com/2016/07/erdogan-taunts-obama-over-turkeys-coup-bid/

Both. He is grabbing at straws. His own people may remove him for his fuckups, or one of his many enemies may do the job for them.

He may cling to power for a while yet, appearances must be preserved, sorry to say.

[geek tragedy]

18. Real issue, imo, is whether Istanbul would secede.

Outside the cities authoritarian Islamism is wildly popular in Turkey--they want a fundyloon strongman in charge.

For all the pretense of being a European country or straddling different civilizations, Turkey the country is really not terribly different from Egypt or Algeria. It appears to be reverting to the mean for middle eastern states--theocratic authoritarianism.

[bemildred]

19. I do expect this will not have the effect of bringing all of Turkey together as one.

One can foresee more trouble, not less, but what sort of trouble, like the coup, depends on the decisions made, and externalities like economic events, and is not predictable out here in TV land.

[geek tragedy]

20. the rural/urban divide isn't exactly unique to Turkey, but it really is front

and center there.

Especially given Istanbul's location.

[bemildred]

21. That divisions will not be healed by any of this is the point I want to make.

Nor does Erdogan seem like the guy to do that, he seems more likely to double down on repression.

[geek tragedy]

22. Turkey may have to be broken up just like Syria.

For once, it's not European colonialists to blame for this mess either.

[bemildred]

30. They already have a civil insurrection going on.

Erdogan is now about to divide the side he is on further by repressing political dissent.

Putin will give him more rope and watch the show.

The only point where I think we have erred with Erdogan was when Bush ignored his objection to our Iraqi invasion, I believe he still harbors resentment against us for that. But otherwise this is his own doing.

[modem77]

14. He is not secular and doesn't recognize "moderate islam"

He is very far right.

[oberliner]

23. Take him out?

What the heck?

[lapislzi]

24. Never start a land war in Asia

I thought this would be obvious by now.

[JCMach1]

25. We don't resolve it, but we have to give real thought to suspending them from NATO...

It's ultimately up to the Turkish people to resolve it.

[malaise]

27. We who?

Who put you in charge of the planet. Fix your own house

[Agnosticsherbet]

28. He is the legally chosen President of a Sovereign nation.

We have no legal rational to do snything. We can not even use the fig leaf of national intrest to do snything.