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MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 10:41 AM Apr 2017

One of the Most Frightening Things about Trump Is His Ignorance

Most of our Presidents, with a few exceptions, have been avid students of history and the Constitution. They understood the functions of government and the complexity of the job they were undertaking. They also knew that they did not know everything, and so they hired and appointed people who had specialized knowledge in specific areas.

Donald Trump is ignorant of most of what other Presidents had studied and learned about the job they faced. Worse, he is refusing to staff his administration with people who could advise him from a position of extensive knowledge. Most of his White House staff is as ignorant as he is, including his "family" advisers.

In most major departments under the Executive Branch, leadership positions are still vacant, with nobody appointed or nominated to fill those positions. Trump does not care about any of this, and believes, wrongly, that he can direct the country based on his "instincts." This willful ignorance and arrogance is an important factor, I believe, that should disqualify him from the position entirely.

We are being led by an ignorant, incurious and arrogant man, and he is surrounding himself with more like him. The future of our nation is in danger.

118 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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One of the Most Frightening Things about Trump Is His Ignorance (Original Post) MineralMan Apr 2017 OP
Completely agree c-rational Apr 2017 #1
He is a disaster for this country. Demsrule86 Apr 2017 #2
And if not that, the walking back of almost every advance MineralMan Apr 2017 #4
Worse than Reagan and Reagan was pretty fucking dumb. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #59
Reagan at least had some smart people around him. JPPaverage Apr 2017 #62
and Reagan was a patriot...not a smart one, and a patriot that had no problem Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #66
Iran on the other hand exboyfil Apr 2017 #102
Can't source this now... zentrum Apr 2017 #110
yes! IMHO, Reagan stole that election with the hostage dirty trick. He also appointed Scalia. diva77 Apr 2017 #111
forgot to add Reagan's famous quote about the government diva77 Apr 2017 #114
Yeah, surely guilty of that. And even though he did that, and it was treason, he was still Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #113
What makes it worse is that he actually believes he's the smartestperson in a room malaise Apr 2017 #3
His sheer arrogance, which has no factual foundation, MineralMan Apr 2017 #5
Narcissism and a sense of entitlement on steroids malaise Apr 2017 #7
Exactly PatSeg Apr 2017 #9
I think he has probably always believed that he is "superior." MineralMan Apr 2017 #10
Oh yes PatSeg Apr 2017 #13
Well, he keeps trying to convince himself. MineralMan Apr 2017 #14
Yes, it is very frightening PatSeg Apr 2017 #28
Delusional Scarsdale Apr 2017 #54
I figure PatSeg Apr 2017 #77
Yep malaise Apr 2017 #17
Like an animal PatSeg Apr 2017 #33
We can hope malaise Apr 2017 #34
See post #70. I'm afraid that could possibly happen. n/t RKP5637 Apr 2017 #71
Ain't that true about his "sense of entitlement." I thought Republicans... Beartracks Apr 2017 #67
Well PatSeg Apr 2017 #84
Ding ding we have a malaise Apr 2017 #89
He's ate up with it Major Nikon Apr 2017 #15
Indeed malaise Apr 2017 #18
So it appears. MineralMan Apr 2017 #30
Because at this point everybody in the room is telling him just that Jonny Appleseed Apr 2017 #31
Very delicately put, I must say. MineralMan Apr 2017 #53
agreed - W wasn't smart NewJeffCT Apr 2017 #94
And that keeps him from learning anything. TNNurse Apr 2017 #99
The most dangerous type of error exboyfil Apr 2017 #103
While this is true enough . . . MousePlayingDaffodil Apr 2017 #6
I expect our nation's leaders to be better than that, really. MineralMan Apr 2017 #8
Under our constitutional system . . . MousePlayingDaffodil Apr 2017 #90
Well, I don't really rely on books that are thousands of years old, MineralMan Apr 2017 #91
This was posted earlier from Ben Franklin. ananda Apr 2017 #11
Old Ben was a wise fellow. MineralMan Apr 2017 #12
Way too many people are giving this... 3catwoman3 Apr 2017 #56
His appointees are interested in destroying the agencies they lead IronLionZion Apr 2017 #16
You're right. Leadership positions in many agencies and MineralMan Apr 2017 #22
WH Office of Science and Technology had 24 staffers under Obama ... hatrack Apr 2017 #115
What keeps me up at night is this: what will he do when he is confronted with an actual Still In Wisconsin Apr 2017 #19
Since Trump appears to react by instinct, it's very likely that he MineralMan Apr 2017 #23
You worked in the intel business right? Still In Wisconsin Apr 2017 #38
I did, yes. MineralMan Apr 2017 #41
That's comforting to know, actually. Still In Wisconsin Apr 2017 #46
I was far from highly placed, but I did see that in practice. MineralMan Apr 2017 #50
He is very much like Bush, Jr.; the GOP is using the same playbook as before Crash2Parties Apr 2017 #20
I think he's much worse than Bush. Still In Wisconsin Apr 2017 #21
He is something like Bush, but his associates are as ignorant MineralMan Apr 2017 #24
I don't think they are so ignorant, but rather that they are exceedingly greedy. Crash2Parties Apr 2017 #85
Bush surrounded himself with knowledgeable people, some of them from his father's administration secondwind Apr 2017 #49
If there is a lesson to be learned from any of this, it is, I think, that mnhtnbb Apr 2017 #25
The founding fathers relied on the other two branches of MineralMan Apr 2017 #27
The Founding Fathers probably never imagined a world full of nuclear weapons. mnhtnbb Apr 2017 #32
That is most certainly true. They could not have imagined MineralMan Apr 2017 #36
I agree. Stand strong. caroldansen Apr 2017 #26
We must all stand strong. If Trump cannot be removed MineralMan Apr 2017 #29
I completely agree and strongly suspect Trump is illiterate as well as lacking in knowledge Vinca Apr 2017 #35
Oh, he is literate, but chooses not to read. MineralMan Apr 2017 #39
There was a video clip a while back that showed Trump in a deposition re one of his lawsuits. Vinca Apr 2017 #44
He may not have had his reading glasses. MineralMan Apr 2017 #47
And yet, Trump is just a mirror reflection of tens of millions of Americans Mr. Ected Apr 2017 #37
Half of the population has an IQ lower than 100. MineralMan Apr 2017 #42
Spot on, Mineral Man. Mr. Ected Apr 2017 #51
Wrong. .The most dangerous thing about Trump is his attitude beachbum bob Apr 2017 #40
He listens only to those who appear to agree with his assessment of himself. MineralMan Apr 2017 #43
Not unusual for some one who thinks they are never wrong beachbum bob Apr 2017 #45
You must be mistaken. He told us himself he's one of the smartest men in the world. nt Honeycombe8 Apr 2017 #48
I heard that. Somehow, I couldn't bring myself to believe it. MineralMan Apr 2017 #52
Much like Reagan and Bush the Lesser. guillaumeb Apr 2017 #55
Brilliant post k & R. I read 45 has never read a bio of a former potus. bronxiteforever Apr 2017 #57
Thanks. MineralMan Apr 2017 #60
Well said! PinkTiger Apr 2017 #109
Damn Skippy! MrScorpio Apr 2017 #93
well... D_Master81 Apr 2017 #58
No doubt you are correct. MineralMan Apr 2017 #61
He didn't frighten Republican party, in fact they support him & continue to cover for russia "thing" Sunlei Apr 2017 #63
You're right. They are using him. Trump is a willing tool, because MineralMan Apr 2017 #68
Unfit. Republicans knew their candiditates life history and used/use it. Sunlei Apr 2017 #80
A tool is only as capable as the hand that controls it. MineralMan Apr 2017 #86
Further, Trump's ignorance makes him vulnerable to deception. MineralMan Apr 2017 #64
Ignorance and arrogance... 3catwoman3 Apr 2017 #65
Yes, it is a dangerous combination. MineralMan Apr 2017 #69
The dope is a dupe... 3catwoman3 Apr 2017 #92
I'm constantly bothered that he has access to the nuclear codes and might start a nuclear RKP5637 Apr 2017 #70
That is a real concern, of course. MineralMan Apr 2017 #73
Agreed PatSeg Apr 2017 #83
His mission is to paralyze for the takeover bucolic_frolic Apr 2017 #72
He would not understand that, so it is not "his" mission. MineralMan Apr 2017 #76
I read too many Robert Ludlum novels bucolic_frolic Apr 2017 #87
don't think its ignorance as much as him being a sociopath and probably a psychopathy. nt elmac Apr 2017 #74
Yes, I suspect you're right. But, I'm not all that certain that Trump MineralMan Apr 2017 #78
In trying to find a silver lining to comfort myself with and I did come up with a couple of world wide wally Apr 2017 #75
I'm completely unable to predict anything at this point. MineralMan Apr 2017 #82
What's even more terrifying? raven mad Apr 2017 #79
Prepare yourself. They're about to be nuked even further. MineralMan Apr 2017 #88
Yeah, our state Repukes just cut another 5 -15%. Ignorance is bliss, right? raven mad Apr 2017 #116
Not surprising at all. MineralMan Apr 2017 #117
MM, a worse giggle (ironic and nasty) - raven mad Apr 2017 #118
Yep loyalsister Apr 2017 #100
To the mix, add the attention span of a gnat dalton99a Apr 2017 #81
Remember the two ragged children murielm99 Apr 2017 #95
Profound malaise Apr 2017 #96
Excellent reference! MineralMan Apr 2017 #104
And he has no interest in educating himself Rhiannon12866 Apr 2017 #97
And previous presidents have reached out to their predecessors Rhiannon12866 Apr 2017 #98
He has no respect for anything. stopbush Apr 2017 #101
add a HUGE dollop of PETTY. pansypoo53219 Apr 2017 #105
He is the monster from of our media. Scruffy1 Apr 2017 #106
He does care about it that's why he's doing it disalitervisum Apr 2017 #107
And he has dementia. L. Coyote Apr 2017 #108
Ignorant and incurious pfitz59 Apr 2017 #112

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
4. And if not that, the walking back of almost every advance
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:01 AM
Apr 2017

we have made in the past 50 years. His anti-science, anti-equality, and anti-justice attitudes will certainly lead to a deterioration of our society - just when we need to continue the progress we have achieved at a high cost over the decades.

He is a dangerous leader on many levels, all of which could lead to disaster.

Eliot Rosewater

(31,112 posts)
59. Worse than Reagan and Reagan was pretty fucking dumb.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:33 PM
Apr 2017

I dont see how we survive at all if gorsuch or any other extreme rightwing fascist gets on the court.

JPPaverage

(508 posts)
62. Reagan at least had some smart people around him.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:40 PM
Apr 2017

Smart but nasty. He also had an opposition party to keep him in check, at least a little bit.

Eliot Rosewater

(31,112 posts)
66. and Reagan was a patriot...not a smart one, and a patriot that had no problem
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:43 PM
Apr 2017

working against working people, but he would never put his ambitions over the country by working with russia, never.

exboyfil

(17,863 posts)
102. Iran on the other hand
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 07:28 PM
Apr 2017

Someday I suspect we will see irrefutable proof that Reagan/Bush conspired with Iran to hold onto the hostages until after the election. It seems to be a pattern for Republicans (see Nixon/Kissinger and the Vietnam peace talks).

zentrum

(9,865 posts)
110. Can't source this now...
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 01:47 AM
Apr 2017

…but I think this is already known and established. It's just that the MSM and certainly the Repugs and their base don't care at all about this. He was a Saint, remember.

diva77

(7,643 posts)
111. yes! IMHO, Reagan stole that election with the hostage dirty trick. He also appointed Scalia.
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 03:21 AM
Apr 2017

He also vetoed Fairness Doctrine legislation. Not sounding patriotic to me. He laid the foundation for where we are today.

diva77

(7,643 posts)
114. forgot to add Reagan's famous quote about the government
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 11:16 PM
Apr 2017

"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"
-------------
Again, laying the foundation for where we are today

Eliot Rosewater

(31,112 posts)
113. Yeah, surely guilty of that. And even though he did that, and it was treason, he was still
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 05:27 PM
Apr 2017

more patriotic than any of these thugs.

malaise

(269,053 posts)
3. What makes it worse is that he actually believes he's the smartestperson in a room
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:00 AM
Apr 2017

He's knows nothing about anything.

malaise

(269,053 posts)
7. Narcissism and a sense of entitlement on steroids
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:16 AM
Apr 2017

and heroin combined.

I seriously think that the fact that he hasn't been punished for all his illegal business has made him feel invincible.

ReTHUGs defending his refusal to submit his tax returns or call him out on the lies also enables him.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
9. Exactly
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:22 AM
Apr 2017

Like a spoiled child, he has gotten away with more crap than most people know and he believes he can do anything and never be held accountable. He does think he is "invincible" - rules don't apply to him.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
10. I think he has probably always believed that he is "superior."
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:28 AM
Apr 2017

At the same time, I also believe that he probably knows that he is actually not, and is constantly overcompensating for that. Like many bullies, he may well secretly loath himself, internally, and is masking that with bravado. That would not surprise me at all.

He appears to be on a constant search for ways to prove that he is not a stupid, angry, incapable person.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
13. Oh yes
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:34 AM
Apr 2017

That describes him perfectly. He has all the traits of a very insecure person, one who probably has major "Daddy issues" as well. In his constant over-the-top bragging, I think he is trying to convince himself, as well as other.

As for the "superior" belief, I do recall him talking about superior genes and his German heritage. If he'd been born at a different time, he would have been a very good Nazi.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
14. Well, he keeps trying to convince himself.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:36 AM
Apr 2017

That makes him even more dangerous, in my opinion. He may be prone to doing rash things to boost his belief, just because he can. As President, such rash things could lead to utter destruction.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
28. Yes, it is very frightening
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:59 AM
Apr 2017

Men like that could start a war or drop a bomb just to prove a point. History and present day are full of dictators with the same unstable mentality. He even decorates his home like them.

This is a real test as to whether our democracy can survive.

Scarsdale

(9,426 posts)
54. Delusional
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:29 PM
Apr 2017

and the gop are backing him without flinching. They HAVE to know their jobs are in jeopardy from supporting this clown? The angry people at the town halls let them know what is at stake. Do the gop HONESTLY think their constituents will forget their treachery when they go to vote? The repub. voters have overlooked a LOT for their "representatives" (who only represent themselves and their interests) but this healthcare bill exposed just how self serving the gop really is. I am hoping they all get caught up in this Russia mess. McConnell KNEW about the vote obstruction and did nothing. He knew tRump was going to get into the WH when he refused to hold hearings on the SC nominee from President Obama, insisting "the next president will fill that vacancy"

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
77. I figure
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:56 PM
Apr 2017

that could be the silver lining in this nightmare, many republican voters may wake up and realize how they have been used and deceived for years. The fact that so many representatives in the House and the Senate have gone along with this insanity is very revealing, even the ones who were critical of Trump during the campaign, assuming that Hillary would win.

In the end, all republican politicians care about is "winning". It does not matter how. There never was a conservative agenda or ideology, they will change all of that in a heartbeat if it will help them win. I know there is a handful of exceptions, but these days they are very rare. Most of them are just used car salesmen and grifters.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
33. Like an animal
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:03 PM
Apr 2017

backed into a corner. This is when he could be the most dangerous. If we are lucky, the worse he will do is fire off some nasty tweets.

Beartracks

(12,816 posts)
67. Ain't that true about his "sense of entitlement." I thought Republicans...
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:43 PM
Apr 2017

... HATED people with a sense of entitlement.



========================

 

Jonny Appleseed

(960 posts)
31. Because at this point everybody in the room is telling him just that
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:01 PM
Apr 2017

There are so many tongues competing for spots of Trump's asshole that it looks like 30 red snails crammed into a single (likely bleached) shell.

NewJeffCT

(56,828 posts)
94. agreed - W wasn't smart
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 05:45 PM
Apr 2017

but, at least he knew he wasn't the smartest guy in the room, and would sometimes even joke about it.

I never thought W was stupid - he was just not nearly as smart as I'd want a president to be, and he also suffered by being between two brilliant presidents in Clinton and Obama.

TNNurse

(6,927 posts)
99. And that keeps him from learning anything.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 06:50 PM
Apr 2017

He thinks he knows more than everyone else and is almost the dumbest and most ignorant in the administration. There is a good bit of competition in the category of people who do not know what they are doing. Unfortunately the evil Bannon does know a lot, he is just wrong and EVIL.

exboyfil

(17,863 posts)
103. The most dangerous type of error
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 07:36 PM
Apr 2017

You don't know that you don't know. A Type II error in hypothesis testing.

6. While this is true enough . . .
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:13 AM
Apr 2017

. . . why should we expect Trump to be any less "ignorant," "incurious," or "arrogant" than the people in this country?

It seems to me that, in light of our system of government, Trump is just "chickens coming home to roost."

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
8. I expect our nation's leaders to be better than that, really.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:18 AM
Apr 2017

I wouldn't be competent to be President, and I know it. The 2017 election was a manipulated election. The people voted, in the majority, for Hillary Clinton.

If you're saying that "we got what we deserved," which it seems you are, you are incorrect and obviously so. If you're not concerned about the man sitting in the White House, then you're not really thinking things through, either.

So, no, we shouldn't expect that. We should expect actual leadership, and we're not getting it. We need to find a way to remove Donald Trump from office is what we need to do.

It's no longer "Nice to be here." "I hope you agree."

90. Under our constitutional system . . .
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 01:43 PM
Apr 2017

. . . our so-called "leaders" are also understood to be our "representatives."

I think that, by and large, Trump "represents" what this country is today.

Psalm 146:3 captures the state of my "concern," as you put it.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
91. Well, I don't really rely on books that are thousands of years old,
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 01:47 PM
Apr 2017

and based on the oral traditions of nomads, for my thinking. I've read some of them, but I prefer more recent writings, frankly.

ananda

(28,866 posts)
11. This was posted earlier from Ben Franklin.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:28 AM
Apr 2017

Benjamin Franklin wrote: "We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid."

3catwoman3

(24,006 posts)
56. Way too many people are giving this...
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:30 PM
Apr 2017

...way moe effort thn it deserves, and they are succeeding at an alarming level of efficacy.

IronLionZion

(45,451 posts)
16. His appointees are interested in destroying the agencies they lead
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:42 AM
Apr 2017

and his political operatives are interfering negatively with important military and law enforcement missions and getting push back from the generals. America's enemies can see weakness in our leadership.

It's a very dangerous situation to be in.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
22. You're right. Leadership positions in many agencies and
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:51 AM
Apr 2017

departments are vacant, with no sign of appointments from the White House to come. The State Department is the most glaring example of that, I think. Trump has no concern whatever about international relationships with either our allies or adversaries. His Secretary of State is an abrupt, unfriendly person who has no intention of leading diplomacy efforts.

Not only do our adversaries see the weakness, but our allies are not feeling like they will be supported with Trump at the helm. Domestically, too, the Trump administration is gutting much of those parts of the government that deal with domestic issues. Donald Trump simply does not care about much of anything.

As time passes, his deficiencies will lead to a loss of control over much of what keeps this country on a more or less even keel in all areas.

hatrack

(59,587 posts)
115. WH Office of Science and Technology had 24 staffers under Obama ...
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 11:23 PM
Apr 2017

Most of them were experts in all kinds of stuff - IT, energy, environment, space, oceans, climate.

There's now one guy, and I believe he has a BS in Political Science. But he's loyal, or served as a campaign manager for President Shitstain, so that's what counts.

 

Still In Wisconsin

(4,450 posts)
19. What keeps me up at night is this: what will he do when he is confronted with an actual
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:48 AM
Apr 2017

international crisis? Say NK launches an ICBM that actually travels around the globe and splashes into the ocean off California, then announces they have three more ready to go, with warheads. Say Iran hits a US plane or ship, by accident or otherwise.

What, then, does Trump do? Does he listen to Mattis, who seems to be, if nothing else, level-headed? Or does he lash out and blow something/someone all to shit?

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
23. Since Trump appears to react by instinct, it's very likely that he
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:53 AM
Apr 2017

will react in a detrimental way to any crisis, assuming he recognizes that a crisis even exists. He will also probably not respond to natural disasters well, and will more or less leave it to the local area to deal with them.

He simply is not a thoughtful or careful leader. He is a bull in the American china shop.

 

Still In Wisconsin

(4,450 posts)
38. You worked in the intel business right?
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:08 PM
Apr 2017

I can only imagine what those folks must be thinking. "If we tell him this, what will he do?"

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
41. I did, yes.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:11 PM
Apr 2017

I'm sure the IC looks at Trump as a clearly dangerous person. All of those agencies, however, understand that a President does not necessarily have to be shown all intelligence information. That's a little secret that few people fully understand.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
50. I was far from highly placed, but I did see that in practice.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:27 PM
Apr 2017

Even Presidents do not see everything there is to see. I watched that happen in reality in 1969. The entire building in which I worked was sanitized to within an inch of its life on the occasion of a Presidential visit. It was a wonder to observe, to be sure. During that visit, I actually met Nixon, despite my low position in that agency. Everyone who would encounter him was thoroughly briefed beforehand.

More than that, I cannot say, though.

Crash2Parties

(6,017 posts)
20. He is very much like Bush, Jr.; the GOP is using the same playbook as before
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:48 AM
Apr 2017

Pretty much knows nothing & cares even less. Bannon is Trump's Rove, Pence is his Cheney.

I just hope we don't have another 9/11.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
24. He is something like Bush, but his associates are as ignorant
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:54 AM
Apr 2017

and willful as he is, which makes his administration much more dangerous.

Crash2Parties

(6,017 posts)
85. I don't think they are so ignorant, but rather that they are exceedingly greedy.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 01:05 PM
Apr 2017

Ignorant implies that if they learned of something they might reconsider their position.

I think Trump's cabinet - most of whom are part & parcel of the 'new' GOP are well aware of other positions but simply don't care b/c they have adequate privilege. They can be solely focused on either their religion, wealth, power or all of the above.

mnhtnbb

(31,392 posts)
25. If there is a lesson to be learned from any of this, it is, I think, that
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:55 AM
Apr 2017

the Founding Fathers were naive when it came to listing qualifications for the job of President. Their assumption
that any natural born (white) male of a certain age was qualified for the job has been shown--with Trump--to be
foolish and incorrect.

Trump came to us because of the racism in this country. Trump succeeded in gaining the job of president because
of the deep seated misogyny in this country and the willingness of many people to vote for the totally unqualified white
male over one of the most qualified persons to ever run for the office who happened to be female.

I agree the future of our nation is in danger. Until we deal with the issues of racism and misogyny in this country, we will
not be out of danger.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
27. The founding fathers relied on the other two branches of
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 11:58 AM
Apr 2017

government to balance and check a President like Trump and for voters to make corrections every two years in their choices for Congress. That may still work, but it may require too much time. There are some real risks in the short term with Trump in the White House. This will be a serious test of our system, I believe.

If we do not rise to the challenge, it may be a test we fail.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
36. That is most certainly true. They could not have imagined
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:06 PM
Apr 2017

such a thing. At the time the Constitution was written, it took weeks to travel from Europe or Asia to North America, and only small numbers of people like soldiers could be transported at one time. Communications were just as slow. Today's world would seem like either a nightmare or a utopia to the Founders. I expect they'd think it a nightmare.

However, the Constitution was written to take change into account, and has the capability of being amended, which has been used a number of times.

It is by the the general nature of the Constitution, and its recognition of human nature, that this nation has survived this long already. Will it be enough to keep us surviving? That, as always, remains to be seen.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
29. We must all stand strong. If Trump cannot be removed
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:00 PM
Apr 2017

from office, then we must retake control of Congress in 2018, which is our first opportunity. We must not fight among ourselves, but work together to accomplish that. We made a grievous error in the 2016 election by not doing so. We must learn from our error.

Vinca

(50,278 posts)
35. I completely agree and strongly suspect Trump is illiterate as well as lacking in knowledge
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:05 PM
Apr 2017

about history and the Constitution. I'm surprised he hasn't presented one of his white boards upside down.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
39. Oh, he is literate, but chooses not to read.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:09 PM
Apr 2017

His ignorance is by choice. That makes him doubly dangerous and incompetent. He may also suffer from some deterioration of his mental capacity at this time. I can't say definitively that he does, but it is a possibility.

In any case, he is clearly incapable of understanding his limitations and compensating for those by surrounding himself with competent, knowledgeable people.

Vinca

(50,278 posts)
44. There was a video clip a while back that showed Trump in a deposition re one of his lawsuits.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:18 PM
Apr 2017

An attorney handed him the transcribed document that was a statement he had previously given and asked him to read it. Given his reaction, it certainly appeared that he was unable to read it. As for the dementia, I was wondering if his walking out of the signing ceremony without signing the executive orders was a red flag. Mike Pence seems to be playing the part of Nancy Reagan.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
47. He may not have had his reading glasses.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:24 PM
Apr 2017

I know that, at 71 years of age, I cannot read without them. My eyes will simply not focus on a page of text without corrective lenses any longer. Vanity may have prevented him from wearing them.

He appears to be able to read a teleprompter, after all.

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
37. And yet, Trump is just a mirror reflection of tens of millions of Americans
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:07 PM
Apr 2017

Apathetic, lazy and uninformed.

These people wanted a mirror image of themselves in Washington.

They saw Trump as a champion of their values.

The problem is, he isn't and never was the person they think he is.

The Trump electorate has been hoodwinked into protecting the financial interests of the rich as a supposed tenet of democracy. They may be poor, but that doesn't mean that the rich man should be discriminated against. That's not American! The Trump voter fashions himself/herself a patriot for standing up for the big guy, the bully, the guy who actively engages against their best interests.

Trump is perceived to be a businessman extraordinaire in their eyes.

The fact that he is a charlatan, a grifter, a liar and a hyperbolic catastrophe is lost on them. The fact that he is a lousy businessman is also ignored.

Sustained propaganda has devastated our country.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
42. Half of the population has an IQ lower than 100.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:15 PM
Apr 2017

That is a fact. It is a fact that every democratic system of government has to deal with. It is also why our elections are so evenly-divided on a national basis.

We rely on the concept that only more intelligent people get elected to office. That is sometimes true, but not always. Right now, it appears that it is not true, overall. And that's dangerous. It's made worse by the fact that some fairly high percentage of even intelligent people do not possess good will towards others.

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
51. Spot on, Mineral Man.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:28 PM
Apr 2017

And to many Americans, the fact that the Commander in Chief is intellectually challenged is a feature and not a bug.

 

beachbum bob

(10,437 posts)
40. Wrong. .The most dangerous thing about Trump is his attitude
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:11 PM
Apr 2017

That he is never wrong...And he listens to no one

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
43. He listens only to those who appear to agree with his assessment of himself.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:16 PM
Apr 2017

That's not an unusual trait, I'm afraid.

bronxiteforever

(9,287 posts)
57. Brilliant post k & R. I read 45 has never read a bio of a former potus.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:30 PM
Apr 2017

That is a clear indication of what we are dealing with, as you say it, incurious. The amazing fact is that the party that calls itself "conservative",which means the preservation of things, is led by a destroyer of things such as history of the nation, the constitution, the limitation of power,the National and world environment and our foreign policies ( forged over centuries).

So again we await our party to clean up their mess but this mess is going to leave a mark. It's startling how so many Americans were willing to be profligate with the stability of the nation and were so unaware that destruction of the American State will not benefit them but bring horrible loss.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
60. Thanks.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:34 PM
Apr 2017

Trump is not a Republican. He is not a Democrat, either. He is sui generis. He has no loyalty to anyone but himself. It happens that he will be willing to pass whatever nonsense legislation the Republicans in Congress send to his desk. So, for them, he's close enough to suit them very well. But he has no loyalty to the Republican Party. Not one bit.

PinkTiger

(2,590 posts)
109. Well said!
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 12:47 AM
Apr 2017

He is a total narcissist. He would probably sell his own children if the price were high enough.

D_Master81

(1,822 posts)
58. well...
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:31 PM
Apr 2017

think about it. he's grown up his entire adult life surrounded by a bunch of ass-kissing yes men. He then as a politician shot right to the top and has a rabid, sycophant followers and took down some of the biggest political names on both sides of the aisle. unfortunately for all of us, he does think he knows it all b/c thats all he's ever heard from people - how great he is.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
61. No doubt you are correct.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:37 PM
Apr 2017

Now he is in a position where he continues to be able to choose those who surround him. That is has been reduced to including his daughter and her husband in his close staff is indicative of how few people he has from whom to choose. Just about everyone is smarter and more knowledgeable than he is, so he can only choose from people who will be his sycophants. That's a bad place to be, really, because some of the people around him truly have evil intent and are only pretending to be his toadies.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
63. He didn't frighten Republican party, in fact they support him & continue to cover for russia "thing"
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:41 PM
Apr 2017

The entire world knows Mr. Trumps weaknesses, the Republican party is responsible for the transition failures. Pence is in charge along with the gaggle of Republican suits following Pence around.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
68. You're right. They are using him. Trump is a willing tool, because
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:43 PM
Apr 2017

he doesn't know that he is being used as a tool. He is truly not capable of the position he is in.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
80. Unfit. Republicans knew their candiditates life history and used/use it.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:59 PM
Apr 2017

President Obama wasn't joking about his 'unfit' statement.

un·fit
/ˌənˈfit/
adjective
adjective: unfit
1. (of a thing) not of the necessary quality or standard to meet a particular purpose.
"the land is unfit for food crops"
synonyms: unqualified, unsuitable, unsuited, inappropriate, unequipped, inadequate, not designed;


MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
86. A tool is only as capable as the hand that controls it.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 01:05 PM
Apr 2017

I worked as an auto mechanic for a few years. Few tools were as useful to me as pneumatic impact socket wrenches. They made some tasks much easier and faster, but were also capable of twisting a fastener off and breaking it. In the hands of a skilled worker, they are a wonderful device. In the hands of an amateur, they can make a disaster of many tasks.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
64. Further, Trump's ignorance makes him vulnerable to deception.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:42 PM
Apr 2017

That means that people who will pretend to serve him might not be his true servants. Take a look at Steve Bannon, for example. Clearly, Bannon is intellectually his superior by several degrees. Steve Bannon, it appears to me, has evil intents, and is playing a game with Donald Trump to accomplish his own goals.

I'm very certain that Bannon's goals are even more detrimental to our nation than Trumps. There are others, too, in his immediate circle, including Pence, who appear, even publicly, to be doing nothing more than tolerating Trump while they scheme behind his back. Trump is too stupid to recognize when he is being duped by people he thinks he can trust. He has no trustworthy close associates, though. They are all using his ignorance to further their own goals.

3catwoman3

(24,006 posts)
65. Ignorance and arrogance...
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:42 PM
Apr 2017

...is a very dangerous combination.

all the more so when it is willful ignorance, like that of Trump and his supporters.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
69. Yes, it is a dangerous combination.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:46 PM
Apr 2017

It is made worse by the fact that the people who are closest to him are only pretending to be on his side. They have their own agendas and are acting on those. Trump is their dupe.

RKP5637

(67,111 posts)
70. I'm constantly bothered that he has access to the nuclear codes and might start a nuclear
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:46 PM
Apr 2017

holocaust to divert attention from himself, his failings and the investigations. He's a highly unstable individual IMO. And those around him aren't wrapped too tightly either IMO. Striking NK, I hate to think of it ...

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
73. That is a real concern, of course.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:52 PM
Apr 2017

I hope we do not find ourselves in a situation where using nuclear weapons is any sort of potential choice. There are two things that might occur in that situation. One would be that Trump would order their use and his orders would be carried out. The other involves someone making the lethal decision that Trump not be allowed to do so. Either situation leads to consequences that would rip the country apart.

I do not actually know which of those two alternatives would occur. I do imagine, however, that discussions about those two alternatives have taken place. I cannot imagine that they have not occurred. Scary stuff, to be sure.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
83. Agreed
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 01:01 PM
Apr 2017

There are numerous scenarios that are terrifying. Nuclear codes aside, he could start World War III with his total disregard for the State Department and diplomacy. The possibilities are endless and Trump is unstable and reckless.

bucolic_frolic

(43,180 posts)
72. His mission is to paralyze for the takeover
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:52 PM
Apr 2017

not to be erudite

Question is, who is taking over? Is it corporate, Russian, or something else?

I'd place my bets on Global Capitalists, the same money-goes-anywhere-for-profit
bunch that was behind 20th century wars. But I could be crazy too.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
76. He would not understand that, so it is not "his" mission.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:54 PM
Apr 2017

If what you suggest is the case, then Trump is only a tool in the tool chest. I hope you are not correct. I do not know, and have no way to know.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
78. Yes, I suspect you're right. But, I'm not all that certain that Trump
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:57 PM
Apr 2017

is actually in charge, in the end. He may be no more than a tool being used. I don't know that for sure, of course, but it would not surprise me in any way. If you have time, please look at that video of him walking out without signing those two executive orders. Don't watch Trump, though. Watch those around him, paying special attention to Pence.

I'm beginning to suspect that Trump is little more than a toy soldier being moved about from place to place at this point.

world wide wally

(21,744 posts)
75. In trying to find a silver lining to comfort myself with and I did come up with a couple of
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:54 PM
Apr 2017

Small glimmers of hope.
1) We should be glad he has chosen to weaken himself with destructive incompetents. When we get power back, we will have to rebuild things like the EPA from scratch. At least he hasn't been able to build a bureaucratic nightmare in its stead that we have to tear down as well. Think of a big remodeling job on your house.

2) Most of the BS he has done can be undone through signing ceremonies like when he shows off the pictures he drew in class today.

And 3) He probably won't make it to the 4th of July whether he is impeached or he drops dead (could even be from Russian medicines or dementia or falling out of a White House window.)
This gives us a crippled, unpopular Pence to deal with, but he has axes hanging over his head as well.

2018 will tell the tale.
VOTE!

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
82. I'm completely unable to predict anything at this point.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 01:00 PM
Apr 2017

I'm watching, horrified, as the play continues. For the first time in my 71 years, I feel like just an audience member, watching a drama written by someone I don't know and being played out by actors. Who the director might be is also something I don't know.

Will it end up being a comedy or tragedy? That's still unknown, too.

raven mad

(4,940 posts)
79. What's even more terrifying?
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 12:59 PM
Apr 2017

The folks who voted for him are much more ignorant. Thanks, Repukes, for nuking our educational budgets.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
117. Not surprising at all.
Tue Apr 4, 2017, 09:37 AM
Apr 2017

There are so many bad trends occurring right now. It's hard to keep track of them all, really.

raven mad

(4,940 posts)
118. MM, a worse giggle (ironic and nasty) -
Tue Apr 4, 2017, 09:42 AM
Apr 2017

We just voted to UP the education budget by 58.5 million..............

I'd bet 90% winds up in certain legislator's new cabins by their personal private lakes.

https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/education/2017/04/01/anchorage-voters-to-decide-tuesday-on-a-58-5m-school-bond-after-rejecting-last-years-proposal/

murielm99

(30,745 posts)
95. Remember the two ragged children
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 05:56 PM
Apr 2017

in Dickens' "A Christmas Carol?"

They are hidden in the robe of Christmas Present. The boy is called Ignorance, and the girl is called Want. The ghost tells Scrooge to beware the boy more than the girl.

I first read that story in fifth grade, and I never forgot that.

Rhiannon12866

(205,467 posts)
97. And he has no interest in educating himself
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 06:35 PM
Apr 2017

To him, it's all about the "show..." And this clown follows a constitutional scholar.

Rhiannon12866

(205,467 posts)
98. And previous presidents have reached out to their predecessors
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 06:44 PM
Apr 2017

Whoever they were! President Johnson counted on Eisenhower as one of his advisors. And Jimmy Carter reached out to both living presidents, though he only had Ford and Nixon. Nixon wasn't all that interested, for obvious reasons, but Ford became one of his closest advisors, was very helpful dealing with Congress since he had the experience...

Scruffy1

(3,256 posts)
106. He is the monster from of our media.
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 09:12 PM
Apr 2017

Ignorant, opinionated and full of himself. If nothing else maybe some people will realize being rich doesn't make you smart. most are born rich and have the inside track. Besides I don't think it's normal for people to be that focused on money. I don't remember growing up with anyone who had a burning desire to get rich. Most thought of a career that was useful and provided a decent living. I think the media has glamorized greed to the point it's accepted as normal. Charles Schwab died broke and unhappy with the guilt he had for squeezing his fortune out of workers, Carnegie tried to atone for his greed by giving it all away.
The main ingredient Trump had for getting elected is the complicity of the media. Even "liberal" web sites and newspapers headlined him daily. The only way to counter this is to make bigger news. In marketing, name recognition means a lot and there was little talk of actual policy in the election. Hopefully we get to see some new faces by 2018. It was Obama's 2006 speech that made him known and it takes 2 years to run a campaign, so we need to get our ass in gear and find a great candidate who can bring in the first time voters, and a large swath of average voters. On the good side Trump is killing the Republican brand like it should have been killed by W and they have a fractured party with nobody to replace him. Right now he is virtually powerless and might as well stay at the Gulf course. I expect there serious discussions going on now among the power brokers on a way to replace him. I'm waiting for a "disease" to incapacitate him in order to avoid some real nasty muckraking. That will leave us with a flacid Pence who couldn't mange a lemonade stand.

 

disalitervisum

(470 posts)
107. He does care about it that's why he's doing it
Sun Apr 2, 2017, 09:16 PM
Apr 2017

They want to destroy the career federal workforce, which stands as an informal check on unbridled executive power. This is one of their stated campaign goals. What better way than to just not fill the positions.

pfitz59

(10,381 posts)
112. Ignorant and incurious
Mon Apr 3, 2017, 05:29 AM
Apr 2017

a very bad combination. Easily gulled by whatever sycophant catches his attention du jour....

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