GOP Candidate Chris Collins: 'People Now Don't Die From Prostate Cancer, Breast Cancer'

[LynneSin]

Chris Collins: 'People Now Don't Die From Prostate Cancer, Breast Cancer'

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/03/chris-collins-cancer_n_1647196.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

GOP congressional candidate Chris Collins knows health care is expensive these days, but he argues it's for good reason: People are no longer dying from deadly forms of cancer.

"People now don't die from prostate cancer, breast cancer and some of the other things," he told The Batavian in an interview that was flagged Tuesday by City & State NY. Collins was discussing his desire to repeal Obamacare.

"The fact of the matter is, our healthcare today is so much better, we're living so much longer, because of innovations in drug development, surgical procedures, stents, implantable cardiac defibrillators, neural stimulators -- they didn't exist 10 years ago," he continued. "The increase in cost is not because doctors are making a lot more money. It's what you can get for healthcare, extending your life and curing diseases."

In fact, a lot of people do die from breast cancer and prostate cancer, despite advances in treatment. An estimated 577,190 people in the United States will die from cancer this year, including about 39,920 deaths from breast cancer and 28,170 from prostate cancer, according to the American Cancer Society.

What an asshole

They still do die of cancer ESPECIALLY when a person can't afford to get routine checkups for things like Mammograms or Prostate Exams.

[Control-Z]

1. Elizabeth Edwards??

And with the best care money could buy. I suppose he's never heard of her. Fucking idiot.

[Ilsa]

2. I hope he's flooded with wake-up calls

from family members of deceased cancer victims.

And what about other illnesses like MS, Parkinsons Disease, Alzheimer's? They aren't cured yet either. And the end of life care is very expensive.

[ElizabethB]

3. Check your facts...No more routine checkups anyway!

Were you all aware that Obama's "Preventive Services Task Force" has held that (1) routine checks for prostate cancer (the PSA test) were unnecessary for men under 70 AND (2) mammograms are unnecessary for women under 50? That decision *sorta* rubs me the wrong way because my father has matastic prostate cancer. YAY Obamacare!

[Iggo]

4. Yeah, damn that Obama!

[OKNancy]

5. It's not Obama's "Preventive Services Task Force"

This task force is an independent agency... It's been around since the mid-1980's

Your post shows either a lack of knowledge, or a deliberate attempt to smear Obama.

[ElizabethB]

13. You are wrong again

See my link above. The Preventive Services Task Force is connected to the US Department of Health. If I am "smearing" anyone its a so called "expert panel" on which there was not ONE specialist dealing in breast cancer or prostate cancer.

[mopinko]

6. preventative medicine is not FFRREEEE under obamacare.

your facts need a little checking. mammograms, prostate checks, annual physicals, vaccinations, all require to be fully covered by all insurance policies.

http://www.barackobama.com/truth-team/

welcome to du.

[ElizabethB]

14. That's awesome

Could you provide me a link stating that PSA tests and mammograms are going to be covered in routine checks??? That's really strange that the government would contradict itself like that but I'm anxious to see this new update!

[mopinko]

16. can you provide me with a link stating that they aren't?

[ElizabethB]

17. Yes, but have you heard of Google? It's really helpful :)

Here's the government website: (see prostate cancer and breast cancer holdings)

http://www.ahrq.gov/clinic/uspstf.htm

[mopinko]

18. it doesn't say anything about insurance coverage.

and it has no weight. it is just a recommendation, and doctors and patients are in no way bound by it.
you are absolutely wrong, sorry.

[ElizabethB]

19. Once again...please try google

No, I'm not wrong. The decisions of the US Preventative Services Task Force can and have been used by insurers to refuse coverage for treatment. Why do you think there was such an uproar from women over their breast cancer holding??? Why did the USPSTF website have to shut down after their ruling on prostate cancer. The government can't very well prosecute a private insurance company that refuses to cover an item that the government itself says is "unecessary" now can they??? And the new public/government healthcare plan isn't going to provide routine checks for something that the government has ruled is "unnecessary". Use your common sense!

Sincerely, there are numerous articles on this topic--from all political persuasions.

[mopinko]

49. this is how it works on du- you make a statement

you have to prove it. don't turn around and tell people to google. answer the question. you google it if that is what it takes to answer the question.

[uppityperson]

33. Here you go, this shows they will be covered in routine checkups.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002902822#post25

[cyberswede]

34. They will be covered.

See below:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=907548

[BumRushDaShow]

8. Yay for more Faux Snooze misinformation!!

[ElizabethB]

20. I'm not quoting Fox

And sadly, I'm not just arguing politics here (unlike you). If one of your relatives is diagnosed with metastic prostate cancer or breast cancer, I imagine you'll actually learn a thing or two as well.

[trumad]

9. Link?

[Arkana]

11. Tell us more about the death panels that don't really exist!

[ElizabethB]

21. Okay, but this isn't just "politics" for me

Insurers can now use the US Preventive Services Task Force ruling as a reason to stop covering mammograms and prostate cancer testing for women under 50 and men under 70. The government can't very well prosecute a private insurer that chooses not to cover tests that the US government itself has ruled as "unnecessary" now can they? And, the government healthcare program isn't going to cover something it has deemed as unnecessary. Use your common sense! Why do you think the mammogram holding resulted in such public outrage by women? And why did the USPSTF website have shut down after their decision on PSA testing?

The PSA test is just a simple blood test. It's also the ONLY test available at present!! If prostate cancer is caught within the prostate there is almost a 100% survival rate...if it's not (as was the case with my Dad), it's a death sentence. Testing is expensive, and I can't help but think that the USPTSF decision was just a risk/loss analysis. If men aren't screened they will only find out if they have prostate cancer once they are exhibiting actual symptoms and it has metastasized.

My Dad, two uncles, and one cousin were all diagnosed with prostate cancer in the past five years. These men are not all related to each other either (different sides of the family). My Dad is the only one that didn't catch it and after watching him go through chemo, radiation, and hormone therapy for three years...my heart is absolutely broken. Now he takes the PSA test weekly to monitor how his chemo is working. He starts second line therapy next week (stage IV). I'm damn grateful that my other relatives and my Dad at least had a chance to fight it. It kills me that we are going to see a return to pre-PSA statistics.

Can you explain how this decision won't result in a certain number of "expendable lives"? How is this not healthcare rationing?

[Ruby the Liberal]

22. That is not in the ACA.

Those 'recommendations' were made to a committee and were not published in the final ACA bill. Even Fox news denounced them as being ridiculous.

Please either provide a link to an official source showing where these age minimums are included in the ACA or stop the rumor mongering and fear mongering.

[ElizabethB]

23. It's not fear mongering...it's reality.

Ruby,

Again, I'm not just arguing politics here (unlike you). It's something I'm passionate about and have researched because my Dad is dying from matastic prostate cancer.

Here's the government website: (see prostate cancer and breast cancer holdings)

http://www.ahrq.gov/clinic/uspstf.htm

The US Preventive Services Task Force that issued the decision on prostate cancer is part of the US Health Department....the same department that oversees the ACA! How could an insurer be prosecuted by the government for not covering something that the government itself calls "unnecessary". Have you honestly been following the news? There are multiple articles from multiple political persuasions on this topic. Take your pick! Why did the AMA and the ACS flip out over the recommendation on breast cancer? Why did the USPSTF have to shut down their website after the recent recommendation on prostate cancer?

I'd LOVE to see your sources. I find it hard to believe the government would contradict itself and not even bother to correct its own website.

[cyberswede]

25. How's this?

http://www.okstate.edu/osu_per/docfiles/preventive_care.pdf (emphasis mine)

The Affordable Care Act:
Summary of Preventive Care Coverage at 100%

The Affordable Care Act requires non-grandfathered plans to provide coverage for “preventive care.” This coverage must be provided without cost sharing (e.g., coinsurance, deductible or copayment). Interim final regulations that were issued on July 14, 2010, further define certain categories of items/services that must be covered as preventive care.

/snip/

Detailed List of Covered Preventive Care Items/Services

Adults
General health screenings
• Blood pressure screening
• Cholesterol screening
• Type 2 diabetes screening
• HIV and sexually transmitted infections (STIs) screenings

Cancer screenings
• Breast cancer mammography
• Breast cancer chemoprevention counseling
• Cervical cancer pap test for women
• Colorectal cancer screenings including fecal occult blood
testing, sigmoidoscopy or colonoscopy
• Prostate cancer (PSA) screening for men

You should probably stop posting misinformation all over DU. Several people have pointed out the inaccuracy of your argument; you should listen and learn something.

I'm very sorry about your father; it's rough when loved ones suffer.

[ElizabethB]

35. For crying outloud....Thanks for proving my point!

The USPSTF which provides recommendations to the US department of health which in turn oversees the ACA has advised that screenings for mammograms are unnecessary for women under 50 and routine PSA tests are unecesssary for men under 70.

Screenings for these age groups were given a grade of "D" by the USPSTF.

Did you happen to notice this little disclaimer on that website? :
Categories of Covered
Preventive Services
• Evidence-based items/services rated A or B in the current recommendations of the U.S. Preventive Services
Task Force.



So you respond by sending me a source stating that mammograms and PSA tests are covered for some people???? Have you ever read an insurance policy? I used to work for BCBS Illinois ...so I am familiar with concept.

Thanks for your insincere comment about loved ones. It is painful to watch and you should know that I probably have spent more time researching this issue than you.

[uppityperson]

36. Unnecessary to screen EVERYONE. How does showing covered screenings mean they won't be covered?

Like many other tests, it is not necessary to screen EVERYONE with a test that is not accurate. You say they won't be covered and are shown they will be and now claim that showing they will be covered proves your point that they won't be?

Are you just messing with us?

[ElizabethB]

41. Okay in Baby steps

My whole point is that I think men should be routinely screened for Prostate Cancer. It is 100% treatable if they can catch it within the prostate because most cases are slow moving and they can simply keep monitoring it with the PSA test. Many times men will end up dying of some other cause in these cases. However, if it spreads outside...its a death sentence. My dad didn't catch it...3 of my relatives did. He's the only one that is dying.

It's a simple blood test and it's not risky. If you tested positive you would decided with your doctor as to what treatment to pursue (if any).Sometimes they just do "watchful waiting"...which means they keep giving you the PSA test to see how fast it is growing and where its going. Why wouldn't you want the knowledge?? And yes, sometimes the test gives "false positives" but in that case, they simply recommend you to take another one and they start measuring the changes. Most importantly, its the best and only test of its kind that we have to date. Were you aware that there was not one urologist on that "expert panel" but the majority of urologists disagree with the panels decision? By eliminating the test you are saying...its okay to let some men die because they will only find out once they exhibit physical symptoms (it likely has matastazied). It is cheaper at this point though! (They die quickly).

The USPTF gave routine PSA testing a "grade D" . However once someone is actually diagnosed with prostate cancer or is being treated then they recommend it. If you can't screen for it anymore, presumably you will be diagnosed once you are exhibiting physical symptoms (it has likely metastasized).

The Oklahoma BCBS website that you showed me indicates they (along with the ACA) cover services and items given a grade A or B.

Then they list "prostate screening" as a covered service.

It's an exclusionary provision. They do cover PSA testing for some men (men that already have physical symptoms of prostate cancer or are being treated for it already). It's a risk/loss analysis. They've decided it's okay to let a certain number of men die from it rather than screen people which is expensive. Apparently you are okay with it too?! Hope you are never forced to change your mind on that line of thinking! And hey, the chairman of the USPSTF is a pediatrician and she disagrees with the American Urologist Association and American Cancer Society. I never thought to ask my child's doctor about these issues! Who knew!

[uppityperson]

26. Your link goes to 1995 Guide. Here's current info on PSA tests, etc, from uspstf

http://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/prostatecancerscreening.htm

http://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/prostatecancerscreening/prostatecancerfaq.htm

[ElizabethB]

28. Sorry for the error but it says the same thing anyway!!!

They do not recommend routine psa testing.

[uppityperson]

31. Not for everyone. There are reasons why. Did you read those?

They don't recommend routine psa testing for toddlers either. Why? Because the risks outweigh the good it can do.

[cyberswede]

32. Oh for Pete's sake...

The TASK FORCE guidelines may not recommend the test, but healthcare providers can still order it whenever they see fit.

The Affordable Care Act covers 100% of PSA tests. Please stop implying that the ACA will not cover these tests.

http://www.okstate.edu/osu_per/docfiles/preventive_care.pdf

(see also above: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002902822#post25)

[ElizabethB]

42. Yes and I responded his post as well---that just proves my point

The USPSTF gave routine prostate testing for all men a Grade D. They only recommend PSA testing for men who have already been diagnosed with prostate cancer or those who are being treated for it. Since you can't screen for it....presumably men will be diagnosed once they are exhibiting physical symptoms (and it has likely metastisized).


Did you happen to notice this provision on that website (see below):

Categories of Covered Preventive Services
• Evidence-based items/services rated A or B in the current recommendations of the U.S. Preventive Services
Task Force

Again, PSA testing got a grade D for all men except those already diagnosed (exhibiting symptoms or being treated).

It's called an exclusionary provision and it means they cover prostate cancer screenings for men that have already been diagnosed or are being treated. I.e....NO ROUTINE TESTING/SCREENING OF HEALTHY MEN in accordance with the USPSTF.

Your comment about toddlers is offensive considering this disease is treatable if it's caught early and a death sentence if its not. You are basically saying its okay to let those men die that weren't given a chance to catch it early.

[uppityperson]

27. uspstf on breast cancer screenings...

http://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/uspstf/uspsbrca.htm#summary

[ElizabethB]

29. And like I said before

they do not recommend routine testing for women under 40.

[uppityperson]

30. "The decision to start regular, biennial screening mammography before the age of 50 should be an...

"The decision to start regular, biennial screening mammography before the age of 50 years should be an individual one and take patient context into account, including the patient's values regarding specific benefits and harms. "

True. And?

[uppityperson]

37. But ACA will cover them. nt

[SunsetDreams]

40. Perhaps that is because Breast Cancer

is more common in post-menopausal women. Younger women can and do get yearly breast exams by their doctor or whenever they feel a suspected lump on their own. The doctor may then recommend that they have a mammogram if something is suspected. Mammograms are generally recommended at age 40. The ACA now covers that.

[uppityperson]

24. DRE and PCA3 are 2 other tests, PSA is not "the ONLY test".

DRE is digital rectal exam. PCA3 is a fairly new urine test. Yes, digital exam is a test performed on most men to check for enlarged prostate and prostate cancer. Not fun but hey, try getting a pap and pelvic exam.

Yes, PSA does have false negatives and there has been a need to develop a better blood/urine test. PCA3 is the urine test and another more sensitive with less false negatives blood test is also being worked on.

I must admit that when they changed PAP recommendations from annually to every other yr or every few yrs for those NOT in a high risk category, it took me aback. It sounds like this is how you feel about decreasing PSA and mammogram frequency to those NOT in a high risk group.

However, if men get their annual exam, a DRE will be included. If men or women are in high risk groups, they will be able to get tested as needed. Studies have shown that testing everyone (pap, mammo, psa) isn't necessary.

And, again, PSA is NOT "the ONLY test". There are others and more are needed.

[Arkana]

47. You should probably stop drinking the red stuff in your thermometer.

It's not actually fruit punch.

[ElizabethB]

12. Links & Views

I am actually not Republican and not out to "smear" Obama. I don't support his healthcare policy but that doesn't mean I hate him as a human being or that I dislike all of his views. I am well read and you can be too if you just google PSA testing, mammograms, and the PSTF.

More about PSA test ruling....

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/opinion/54284455-82/cancer-prostate-screening-psa.html.csp

Who is the Preventive Services Task Force?....

http://www.ahrq.gov/clinic/uspstfix.htm

[uppityperson]

38. You don't like the fact that Obamacare will continue to cover psa and mammograms? Seriously?

ACA does cover them.

[ElizabethB]

43. you are misinforming people

READ the USPTF decision giving routine PSA testing a grade D (except men already exhibiting physical symptoms).

Then read where the ACA only covers services given grade A or B

This isn't a complicated concept...really.

They won't cover routine screening for men unless they have been diagnosed. If they can't be screened, they must have been diagnosed by physical symptoms.

[hobbit709]

7. And evidently Republicans don't die of acute stupidity.

[Arkana]

10. I'm sure Mr. Collins is drawing on years of medical experience

which qualifies him to make such a claim.

What's that, Lassie? He's talking out of his ass?

[ElizabethB]

15. Knowledge is dangerous and Ignorance is cheap $$$

Insurers can and likely will use the US Preventive Services Task Force ruling as a reason to stop covering mammograms and prostate cancer testing.

The Mammogram ruling resulted in public outrage by women and people were so angry about the PSA holding that the PSTF website had to shut down for a couple days. (This has been in the news for quite awhile--all political affiliations).

The PSA test is just a simple blood test. If a man had a positive result they'd discuss options for treatment (or choose "watchful waiting&quot with a doctor. Since when is knowledge dangerous...especially when it comes to cancer?? The PSA test does give false positives, but that's why they often use more than one PSA test. It's also the ONLY test available at present!! If prostate cancer is caught within the prostate there is almost a 100% survival rate...if it's not (as was the case with my Dad), it's a death sentence. Testing is expensive, and I can't help but think that the PTSF decision was just a risk/loss analysis.

My Dad, two uncles, and one cousin were all diagnosed with prostate cancer in the past five years. These men are not all related to each other either (different sides of the family). My Dad is the only one that didn't catch it and after watching him go through chemo, radiation, and hormone therapy for three years...my heart is absolutely broken. Now he takes the PSA test weekly to monitor how his chemo is working. He starts second line therapy next week (stage IV). I'm damn grateful that my other relatives and my Dad at least had a chance to fight it. It kills me that we are going to see a return to pre-PSA statistics.

Can someone explain how this isn't healthcare rationing?

[uppityperson]

39. Since it is in the ACA that ins companies cover them, how is it healthcare rationing?

[ElizabethB]

44. Why are you doing this?

The ACA isn't covering routine screenings for any healthy men. They only cover when you are diagnosed/treated. Why can't you understand?

[SunsetDreams]

45. Oh goodness here:

Preventive Services Covered Under the Affordable Care Act
If you have a new health insurance plan or insurance policy beginning on or after September 23, 2010, the following preventive services must be covered without your having to pay a copayment or co-insurance or meet your deductible. This applies only when these services are delivered by a network provider.

http://www.healthcare.gov/news/factsheets/2010/07/preventive-services-list.html#CoveredPreventiveServicesforAdults

To say that there isn't coverage for any healthy men is not true.

Edit here is more:

For example, depending on your age, you may have access — at no cost — to preventive services such as:

Blood pressure, diabetes, and cholesterol tests
Many cancer screenings, including mammograms and colonoscopies
Counseling on such topics as quitting smoking, losing weight, eating healthfully, treating depression, and reducing alcohol use
Routine vaccinations against diseases such as measles, polio, or meningitis
Flu and pneumonia shots
Counseling, screening, and vaccines to ensure healthy pregnancies
Regular well-baby and well-child visits, from birth to age 21

http://www.healthcare.gov/law/features/rights/preventive-care/index.html

http://www.healthcare.gov/

[ElizabethB]

46. ummm yeah...but the Topic of the thread was the PSA test for Prostate Cancer

Routine PSA screening for health men is not included under the ACA.

[SunsetDreams]

48. Oh I see,

I was just going off of your previous post veering into the topic of Breast Cancer and screening for Women.

But hold on. Suppose your doctor tells you a different story. First he explains that a recent, large-scale US study looked at the effect of annual PSA screening on more than 75,000 men, and found no benefit at all. A separate large study in Europe showed a very small benefit, but only in 2 of the 7 countries participating in the study. Suppose your doctor also explained that if you have a positive PSA test, there’s an 80% chance that it will be false – that you won’t have cancer.

Suppose your doctor also explained that “PSA-based screening leads to a substantial overdiagnosis of prostate tumors” and that treatment usually requires surgery. The effects of treatment are serious: 20-30% of men treated with surgery and radiation suffer from long-term incontinence and erectile dysfunction.

....

Why did the urologists react so strongly? The answer appears to be simple: money. Urologists make a lot of money on prostate cancer treatments. The USPSTF estimated that in the first 20 years of PSA testing, 1 million additional men were treated as a result of screening. And if the surgery is unnecessary, you don’t get a refund.

So who are you going to believe? The Preventive Task Force report presents a thorough review, laying all the details on the table. Their members don’t make a profit from prostate surgeries. Their report simply more credible than the knee-jerk reaction from the urologists’ association. I’ll let the Task Force have the last word:

“The harms of PSA-based screening for prostate cancer include a high rate of false-positive results and accompanying negative psychological effects, high rate of complications associated with diagnostic biopsy, and—most important—a risk for overdiagnosis coupled with overtreatment. Depending on the method used, treatments for prostate cancer carry the risk for death, cardiovascular events, urinary incontinence, erectile dysfunction, and bowel dysfunction. Many of these harms are common and persistent.”

http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevensalzberg/2012/06/24/psa-tests-might-hurt-a-lot-more-than-you-think/