Might America actually elect another black president in 2020?

[yallerdawg]

(An opinion page from Deep Red Alabama. Almost 3,000 comments at link so far - and growing!)

Source: al.com, by Roy S. Johnson

Of course, you can't even ponder the prospects of Booker, Harris, and Patrick vying for the Democratic nomination without asking the elephant-in-the-room question: Is America ready to elect another black President?

University of Alabama Associate Professor Joseph Smith, Phd, who chairs the Political Science department agrees, with caveats:

"It will be easier to elect the second African-American president compared to the first," he told me. "President Obama's two terms makes having a black president more familiar to Americans.

"Many Democratic voters look back very positively on his time in office. Even Republican voters who opposed Obama see the country made it through his presidency. Those two factors reduce the obstacles to electing a second black president compared to electing the first one."

"A lot of people are convinced Obama destroyed the country, and they're beyond reaching by the Democrats," Smith said. "But others are saying that it's hard to look at President Trump and think: this is the kind of person I want to be president. They can look at Obama and say: yes, this is the kind of person I want to be president. He was not that extreme, actually, not even that liberal on almost anything--though a lot still see just the opposite."

Read it all at: http://www.al.com/opinion/index.ssf/2017/08/might_america_elect_another_bl.html#incart_river_home

[bdtrppr6]

1. that will be the proverbial

"tough row to hoe". I'm all for it, no problem if they have the qualifications, just like any other candidate. But, seriously, good luck with that. I'll be surprised if we get another Dem, TBH. Kamala Harris will have the toughest time, Booker has been wishy washy most of his career- not sure of him, and Patrick I'm completely unaware of. We can hope though, can't we?

[bettyellen]

2. Kamala can do it. I can't see Booker or Patrick being charismatic enough.

Kamala has that ability to be very likable when she's pissed off. That's a tight rope for most candidates and she's a natural. I like that she's a prosecutor who went after banks and drug dealers, and is a fierce advocate for women.

[yallerdawg]

3. I like her, too!

And if she promises to freeze all Trump's assets before even charging him with a crime - my vote is a lock-in!

[elleng]

4. I suspect she can be very likeable under many circumstances, and her experience is super, but

her heritage might become an immovable object, imo.

[bettyellen]

6. Her heritage? I'm not worrying about swaying racist scum. I want liberal voters to come back.

They stayed home because HRC didn't inspire them. Kamala has a star quality, and no baggage at all.

[MoonRiver]

25. What is Kamala's heritage?

I really don't know what you're talking about.

[elleng]

29. Kamala Devi Harris (/ˈkɑːmələ/, KAH-m-luh;[8]) was born on October 20, 1964 in Oakland,

California. She is the daughter of a Tamil Indian mother, Dr. Shyamala Gopalan Harris (1938–2009), a breast cancer researcher who emigrated from Chennai, India, in 1960,[9][10] and an African American father of Jamaican descent, Donald Harris, a Stanford University economics professor.[15] Her name, Kamalā, is feminization of the Sanskrit word Kamal (Lotus Flower / Nelumbo nucifera) that means "She of the Lotus", another name of Laxmi, the Hindu Goddess of prosperity whose seat is a lotus flower. She was extremely close with her maternal grandfather, Rajam Gopalan, an Indian diplomat,[10] and as a child she would frequently visit her family in Besant Nagar.[16] She has one younger sister, Maya, a lawyer and public policy advocate, who married Tony West, a former Associate Attorney General of the United States.[17]

The family moved to Berkeley, California, where both of Kamala's parents attended graduate school.[18] They also introduced their daughter to civil rights protests, which were common during that time in Berkeley.[18] Kamala's parents divorced when she was 7.[18] Shyamala raised her daughters in Berkeley, where the family lived in a predominantly African-American neighborhood and where the girls sang in a Baptist choir,[14] and they were also raised with Hindu beliefs. Her mother eventually moved the family to Montreal, Quebec, Canada, where Shyamala took a position doing research at the Jewish General Hospital and teaching at McGill University.[19][20]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamala_Harris

[MoonRiver]

38. Thanks elleng!

That background is a positive for me!

[elleng]

39. For me too, and many others,

but who knows?

[MoonRiver]

40. Yep, we're in for a wild ride, no doubt.

[mcar]

10. Booker seems charismatic

When I've seen him speak and do interviews.

I'm excited we have such a deep bench!

[bettyellen]

12. I like him but I feel like he's always aware he needs to temper his anger before an audience?

Similar to the way people told Hillary to, which is unfair and all that, but I think kind of limiting. Kamala is the rare woman who's actually on fire and lovable when she's pissed off. I don't know where she gets it, but I know it's all too rare.

[TomCADem]

20. Not Really A Worry Relative To Trump...

...Heck, McCain seems like a cool cucumber relative to Trump.

[bettyellen]

23. It's about putting out the best candidate, period. Not about Trump.

[TomCADem]

90. Bernie Is Known to Get PO'd But He'd Still Be A Good Candidate...

...and Booker is even more even tempered. I am not sure we want someone who barely has a pulse to go up against Trump.

[bettyellen]

91. i thought people like Sanders because he's a scold and appeals to the cynical? Maybe that's just my

Friends who like him, hmmm. I'm talking about just the early impressions I think Kamala has incredible energy and tremendous personality. She's got the tough but cool thing. I think people will love her.

[Warren DeMontague]

44. I think Booker comes across as very charismatic.

Someone recently reminded me about his speech at the convention:

But I've also said for a long time I think Harris is going places.

[bettyellen]

46. I think he's a good speaker but maybe too polished? Something less genuine

About him to me- and I know the appearance of being genuine was so highly valued last year. People thought Trump was genuine because he showed us his ass so often, LOL.

[Warren DeMontague]

47. I haven't seen Harris on the stump, but she's certainly smart and takes no shit.

[bettyellen]

48. She can be very cut and dried without seeming cold, somehow...

Last edited Sat Aug 5, 2017, 08:31 PM - Edit history (1)

And very cutting while retaining a sense of humor. I think she has a rare gift. She doesn't ever sound scripted as so many do. And her questioning Sessions and others- she really cuts through their crap so well... I cannot wait to see her debate some GOPers. I think she's going to kill it.

[Lordquinton]

66. Your complaint is that he's too well spoken?

Booker, a black man, is too well spoken?

[bettyellen]

68. No too polished, rehearsed - there is a huge difference, but thanks for the bullshit dog whistle!

I know what that's about. BTW, I like Booker a lot, have always defended him here.

[Lordquinton]

71. I know that dog whistle too

Which is why I was so surprised to see it here.

[bettyellen]

72. interesting how you chose to introduce that dog whistle and pretend I did. So easily it tripped

off your tongue.
Very telling, and completely dishonest when you know I said he seems polished and rehearsed when Specifically discussing his oratory. So yeah- I had context and you were playing an ugly little game. Disgraceful stuff.

Nice try though. LOL I see you, bro!

[Lordquinton]

92. Play it off as you will

I, and others saw it.

You seem rather shaken up that you got called out, seems like a guilty conscience.

[bettyellen]

94. No one agreed with you, and it's creepy as hell to use dog whistles and pretend others did. It's

a sickening little game, designed to shut down positive discussion about certain candidates. That's why you came into this thread, you had nothing positive to offer. Ick.

You unsuccessfully tried to twist my words into different ones and make me look bad. Why? Because I like candidates you don't? It appears so. You sure as hell weren't defending Booker- I doubt you ever would.

You put YOUR words in my mouth to try and shut me up and ain't no one falling for that crap. You were called out.

[pangaia]

78. You brought up a dog whistle, not bettyellen

[bettyellen]

81. When I think about it, I'm sure it was designed to discourage talk about ANY of these candidates via

Intimidation and false accusations. No one could read what I wrote in good faith and make that leap unless they wanted to be disruptive.

I'm so disturbed to see this tactic used here.

[bettyellen]

89. Run out of dog whistles to try and out in others mouths, have you?

Seems like this positive discussion really bothered you.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

60. Kamala. We need to have a woman. It's getting ridiculous. Most men suck as presidents/leaders.

No more macho assholes like Trump and Bush.

[TDale313]

76. I agree.

I've been impressed with what I've seen from her so far.

[smirkymonkey]

77. I agree.

I like Booker too, but as an MA resident, I really don't think Patrick would cut it.

[bettyellen]

80. Why do you think that about Patrick? his name is only vaguely familiar-

Unfortunately Baine capital is more well known. What was he like as gov?

[smirkymonkey]

82. I only moved back to Boston toward the end of his term.

He wasn't bad, but there was kind of a smug, arrogant side to him that a lot of people didn't like. He seemed more like he was out for himself than a champion of the people he was supposed to represent.

[bettyellen]

85. Okay, I've only heard about the creating a socially responsible investment fund for Baine part....

And some buzz that "Obama likes him" which of course wasn't a good thing.....

[smirkymonkey]

86. Do you live in Massachusetts?

I don't think you can really say anything unless you were here when he was governor.

[bettyellen]

87. No.... but I'd sure weigh in if I knew more about his career, but I don't.

Booker's my local guy, bit I'm excited about California's own, Kamala Harris. Her I have been following and I like what I see.

[adigal]

83. No. It isn't that she is black. It is that she is a woman. There is NO WAY she wins

We lose again if she runs.
And maybe we should work on 2018 first??

[bettyellen]

84. You're seriously saying Dems should forget running a woman? That's sexist. GTFO w that.

[ZX86]

5. Just like the last three elections

The most populist/anti-establishment candidate will win. Race, gender, or age, will not matter.

[bettyellen]

7. I think the backlash against non-establishment is here. The incompetence is too much.

[ZX86]

8. Disagree

People want change. The old days are over and they're not coming back.

[bettyellen]

9. LOL. The "change" they want is to turn away from the bigotry and hatred to women and POC.

We are the majority and we're going to save the country from the morons who tried to make achievement, experience and competence dirty words.

[ZX86]

13. You're wrong.

The most populist/anti-establishment candidate will win. Just like the last three elections. Race, gender, or age will not matter.

[bettyellen]

24. Obama was anti- establishment? Huh?

[ZX86]

31. Compared to McCain and Romney?

Most certainly.

[bettyellen]

32. He was not seen as the outsider populist yet was incredibly popular and successful... so that rips

Your argument apart. Obamas success has nothing to do w this hatred for the "status quo" that the bots have now rendered meaningless.

[ZX86]

41. Reality check.

Obama Touts His Outsider Theme

MANCHESTER, N.H. – It has become clear, by now, that Senator Barack Obama is hoping to brand himself as the not-from-Washington candidate in the Democratic presidential race.

https://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/09/03/obama-touts-his-outsider-theme/

[bettyellen]

45. Ooh you googled one blog post! LOL

[ZX86]

49. Obama's outsider status is part of his identity.

The first Black President and all that.

[bettyellen]

51. Are you kidding? We have Harris Booker and Patrick all saddled with "establishment"

And "corporatist" labels by the same folks who smeared Obama with those labels. I'm not saying any of it was right, but it was there the whole time.

[ZX86]

55. And that's the nature of politics.

It's a competition in the marketplace of ideas where opponents will use your associations (especially the moneyed ones) against you. Whether you think it's fair or not. This is not new. Our time is better spent on changes that will foster wins rather than intrinsic characteristics of political debate.

[Caliman73]

11. Please define "the old days"

If you are espousing an argument about some trend in politics, let us know what that means so that we can at least know what we are discussing or debating.

Otherwise, ambiguous phrases like "the old days", "drain the swamp", "hope and change" can be anything.

[ZX86]

14. Candidates chosen by the mega wealthy donor class.

The days of Koch Bros picking the Republican candidate or the latest Hampton's society party choosing the Democratic candidate is over. That ship has sailed and it's not coming back.

[GulfCoast66]

53. That news to me

There was a time when the Democratic Party picked their candidate in back rooms. But for my entire life it has been the voters of the various states that have made that decision.

Do voters often pick people who have been loyal to the Democratic party, worked to make the party stronger and labored away at various offices and posts? Of course we do. It shows commitment to the party and its members.

I like Booker of the 3 mentioned here. He has a compelling story and has local and national experience.

But overall I am probably going to be a supporter of a Democratic Governor if they choose to run. I think they make better presidents all told and are often easier to get elected.

Have a nice evening.

[Caliman73]

70. When did that happen?

When did that ship sail, never to return? Was it the ship that dumped all of the right wing supposed populists into congress in 2010 and defended in 2012, 2014 and again in 2016? That ship is gone for good now?

Do you think that Koch's are the only mega donors? You think that Trump was actually a populist candidate? He was backed by Sheldon Aidelson and the Mercer family who are also mega donors. Just because the one set of billionaires that we all know and love to hate, did not get their man into the candidacy, doesn't mean that Republicans are now in a new era. You also seem to forget that Trump had a special benefactor that is estimated to be worth over 200 billion dollars and though he may not have put dollars or rubles as it were, into the race, he certainly provided material support that was worth more than the few hundred million that the Kochs put into helping some national but mostly state and local candidates (they've shifted focus).

Democrats may be a different story, but that is debatable. We are a hot mess right now because we keep waiting on the perfect, pure candidate that has never voted on anything that someone might find offensive. We were so happy with President Obama, until he wasn't progressive enough, so we threw a tantrum and stayed home in 2010, during a census year, so that Republicans could rewrite the district maps. That showed us!! See, piss us off Hampton society set and we will stay home and our opponents will elect people who will...um lower your taxes, allow you to hide your money overseas, okay I know, they will overturn abortion rights so you will have to go to France or Switzerland to get an abortion which you could totally afford to do anyway.

Now, I am not that cynical as to think that we can't pull the Party to adopt more policy focused on the needs of the working class, middle class, and the poor. We have and we can, but this whole idea that we are having a revolution and are transforming the Party from the top down and will do it in the span of 18 months, is pretty ridiculous.

We need to start voting for progressive candidates for school board, for city council, for local and state positions, so that in time, the only candidates coming through the system are more progressive. That takes time. In the meanwhile, we need to get the candidates that will inch us closer to where we want to be. We need to get behind the best candidates available. We should be having discussions about what our values are, what we stand for, and what we need to have better lives, not just about "who is tainted by talking to someone from Goldman Sachs" or who supported some law (that is complicated) that my brother's wife's cousin's nephew wrote about in their blog, or worse, that some Russian ratfu@er is feeding us.

I don't mean to sound hostile, but this is something that has really started to weigh heavily. We keep fighting each other and doing our real opponents' work for them. These up coming elections are the prelude to 2020, and if we do not do something to win back control of state houses and at least get even or within distance for the census year in 2020, we could be looking at another decade of Republican rule by the minority.

[ZX86]

79. Vote shaming and voter blaming did not work the last time.

And it won't work in the future. The "We need to get behind..." and "Waiting on the pure candidate is bad" attitude is what is losing election after election. I don't care what business you're in or what product or service you're selling, you're not going to be successful by claiming, "We know this isn't really what you want but the other guy is worse".

The idea that instead of giving the people what they want we're going to reverse human nature and convince people to vote for candidates whose policies don't address their wants or needs is insane. The Ossoff is the perfect example. Millions of dollars spent and he lost. Clinton out spent Trump. She lost. Money does not win elections.

Mealy mouthed half measures delivered in a word salad filled with vague platitudes and weasel words DOES NOT WORK! How many elections do we have to lose before it sinks in. Doubling down on vote shaming will only lead to more losing.

80% of Democrats want Single Payer Healthcare. Now. Today. Where is Pelosi and Schumer? You seem to be saying it's too much to ask our leaders to reflect the will of the people. "Why don't you go vote for some school board members and dog catchers and who knows? Maybe in 10 or 20 years we might consider getting you some healthcare." That is inspiring no one. The rest of the western world has had universal healthcare for decades. Voters know this and behave accordingly. Mostly by staying home.

[DoodAbides]

26. Haven't the populist on the left consistently lost? nt

[ZX86]

50. Who? Like FDR?

From what I recall they had to change the law to include term limits because he won so many elections.

[DoodAbides]

52. Seriously going back to FDR is suppose to warrant some kind of an answer? Or just filler? nt

[ZX86]

58. Was there some cultural revolution between today and FDR's administration?

I must have missed it. Far as I can tell people are still putting on their pants one leg at a time and FDR's economic agenda makes as much sense today as it did then. And it's just as popular.

[DoodAbides]

61. "cultural revolution"? Yes. You missed it. nt

[ZX86]

63. The Reagan Revolution was just a bumper sticker slogan.

It wasn't real.

[GulfCoast66]

56. You think FDR was a populist?

Well, that is not the way I read history. One of the hallmarks of a populist is creating a boogie man and uniting people in fear of that boogie man. FDR's message was one of unity. He actually held off the populist by not finding a enemy to blame and punish for the depression. Populist pick out one group of people or ideas and rally their followers against that group.

Prior to FDR's election there was considerable questioning whether or not liberal, capitalist Democracy was sustainable. Stalin was consolidating power, Hitler and Mussolini had coming to power and they had followers on both the left and right in the US. Hell, FDR saved capitalism from itself according to many people.

Huey Long...now there was a populist.


Have a nice evening.

[ZX86]

62. He used populism to retain the White House.

And that's the point. Rejecting populism leads to electoral losses.

The Populism of the FDR Era

For all their demagoguery and for all the dangers they posed, these sundry movements were helpful in keeping Roosevelt's feet to the fire. "I am fighting communism, Huey Longism, Coughlinism, Townsendism," the president despaired at one point. To his aide Raymond Moley he vowed to "steal Long's thunder."

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1906802_1906838_1908686,00.html

[bettyellen]

73. HA ha ha ha ha ha. Can you name a Dem you've liked since then?

[johhnydrama]

15. Please don't say we MUST vote for a POC

My fear is that the common establishment believes that a POC is required to bring out the AA vote. Please don't write ANYONE off. Vote for the best candidate, not the candidate that most looks like you.

[yallerdawg]

16. What I've seen, Hillary got the same numbers as Obama in 2012.

Trump pulled out more votes than Romney in 2012.

We went though this for the last couple years.

"Don't vote for a candidate JUST because she is a woman or a person of color."

We need to turn that around - "Don't NOT vote for a candidate just BECAUSE she is a woman or a person of color.

45 men and counting...

[YoungDemCA]

35. Hillary did NOT get the same numbers as Obama. Turnout was way down among PoC and Democrats overall.

That is not a good sign for the current state of the Democratic Party. Not a good sign at all...

[yallerdawg]

36. Let's take a look, shall we?

Obama 2012 62,611,250

Hillary 2016 65,853,625

Romney 2012 59,134,475

Trump 2016 62,985,106

https://www.nytimes.com/elections/2012/results/president/big-board.html

https://www.nytimes.com/elections/results/president

I distinctly remember, Hillary got more votes than any white presidential candidate ever.

In just those 3 states that turned the Electoral College, rural Trump supporters came out of the wood work. And 3rd party candidates soared compared to 2012. But we won't talk about THAT.

[YoungDemCA]

37. Rural Trump supporters coming out of the woodwork ie the collapse of the rural Democratic vote.

[JI7]

43. That happened with civil rights. The fact they support trump says it all

[johhnydrama]

59. Raw numbers don't mean squat. It's the Electoral college.

The electoral college is the only thing that matters. Trump not receiving a single vote in California or NY would not have mattered. Conversely letting the south determine the Democratic candidate aka Super Tuesday isn't a good idea either because the south still isn't going to bring the Dems that many electoral votes. Virginia was a nice surprise.

[crazycatlady]

17. I don't see it happening again in my lifetime

Electing a black president brought racists out of the woodwork and lead to a vile, racist, womanizing, lying, cheating reality TV star succeeding him.

[WinkyDink]

18. No. I'm taking bets.

[yallerdawg]

19. I seriously lost my ass last November.

I'm out.

[TheDebbieDee]

21. As an African-American Democrat, I hope to have in my lifetime

the opportunity to vote for a Presidential nominee/candidate with a last name like Chin or Hernandez or White Fox!

[Beartracks]

54. President White Fox. That would be cool. :D n/t

[MoonRiver]

22. Yes, and I'm for Kamala!

[yallerdawg]

27. 3,500 comments at link!

Something about the subject has got Alabamians riled up!

I haven't seen this many comments since Auburn beat Alabama on a missed field goal with time expired!

[CK_John]

28. IMO, Oprah is the only one and she has stated not to run.

She is the only one who could go toe to toe with Trump because she is in the same line of work, non political and a TV reality person.

[yallerdawg]

30. 9 months ago...

I would have disagreed with you.

[bettyellen]

34. Trump is deeply unpopular and faced unprecedented resistance, is racking up failures.

Someone else here argued he's such an asshole it doesn't matter if we run someone seen as ill tempered. Now I'm hearing it's going to take an oligarch to beat him. LOL.
Wow.

[YoungDemCA]

33. Herman Cain? Allen West? Sheriff David Clarke?

[johhnydrama]

69. Bobby Jindal: But only if he posses as a black man and trashes Affirmative action.....

ok yes this was a joke.

[bettyellen]

74. You named three total losers w no shot at all because.....

This is funny to you for some reason? WOW.

[Warren DeMontague]

42. Booker shot up in my ranking by introducing Federal cannabis reform.

I like Harris, too.

I don't honestly know too much about Patrick, but Booker and Harris are both formidable.

[Nevernose]

57. A personal anecdote:

A "coalition" if you will of diverse, black students (diverse in ways beyond race) came to me in my classroom after school one day. The bravest, their spokesman I guess, came u and said, "Can I ask you a question? What would you do if your daughter brought home a black guy?"

"I hadn't really thought about it. I guess it would depend on the black guy, now wouldn't it?"

The kid goes back, confers with her associates, and says, "Ok. Best possible answer."

My point is: I guess I'd have to know more about this hypothetical black candidate. None of those people in the picture are "pure," but they'd all be a damn sight better than any Republican. I'd certainly like to see who'll be in the primary field.

(And the outcome of the anecdote? If you don't want to be faculty advisor for the Black Student Union, keep your damn mouth shut )

[aikoaiko]

64. Sure, why not?

An Obama candidacy was special but not unreplicable.

[madokie]

65. I'd give preference over anyone besides an old white guy

and I'm an old white guy. Our first Black President was awesome, need I say more?

[Magoo48]

67. Perhaps, we might back a truly progressive candidate...black or otherwise.

Neo-liberal, corporate, and moderate Democrats are not motivated to tackle the dramatic, damage control changes our nation will need in a post 45 era.

[DFW]

75. As long as our next president is a Democrat, he/she could be blue and yellow polka-dotted

For all I care. Competence, intelligence, humor, benevolence, honesty and stamina count. Race and gender do not.

I watched during the last election campaign in dismay as many so-called Democrats use every epithet in their book (corporate, corporatist, oligarch, war-monger, establishment, etc., etc., etc.) to trash our OWN nominee, in favor of the current nightmare. Next time, it won't be in dismay, but in anger, since we all now know just what kind of a nightmare can ensue.

[David__77]

88. Barbara Lee!

I think she would make a great president!

[Raine]

93. No, not going to happen. nt