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question everything

(47,486 posts)
Thu Oct 5, 2017, 11:03 PM Oct 2017

Attended a depressing presentation

We have a group in our area, called Westside Progressive. About once a month we have an interesting presentation: using heat pump to lower carbon footprint; planting pollinators to save the bees; civic forfeiture, etc.

Last month the organizer announced that he removed the "non partisan" part of the description, that we are clearly liberal.

Our speaker is a professor of political science, often invited to local TV stations to offer commentaries. We've had him before. He is an engaging speaker and last year told us the sad news that local elections to capture Republican Congressional seats would probably fail. He was right. He also suggested that Hillary was going to win Pennsylvania, the Scranton region, because Biden is from this region as was Hillary grandfather, or grand grandfather. (It was a voter from that area, after the elections, who expressed his opinion that a president is a man's job..)

No, I did not take notes. I like to listen, but here are some of the main points:

First, about himself, he worked on the Carter campaign is a young college freshman. In 1988 he participated in the New York primaries and chose Jackson. His Rainbow coalition. And he loved Standers' campaign because it excited many voters.

He started by referring to a biography book by Tip O'Neal who ran for JFK seat in the House in 1953. He was walking shaking hands and then ran into an old teacher and asked her to vote for him. She replied that, yes, she would, but that she was glad he asked.

Our speaker conclusion was that Hillary never asked us to vote for her. I don't know. I was going to vote for her no matter what so I don't remember. He added that she never clearly explained why she was running. Not "Hope and Change" not even "Make America Great Again." Yes, about 100 reasons that one could find in her campaign literature, but not one major specific cause.

Yes, I know, we, Democrats have problems with simplicity. We consider ourselves rational, thinking individuals and we want to address the voters the same way. We really don't like to talk down to them. This is how it was with Dukakis, Gore, Kerry, and Hillary. Bill Clinton was different. Really, there is no one like him, a rare combination of smart and compassionate and ability to interact with everyone at every level. And Obama - don't kill me now - many were excited by having a black president and this was enough. Of course, he is smart and funny and eloquent but how many were really taken by this?

He then mentioned another book by an Obama speech writer, I think, who detailed the winning campaign of 2008 and this was used by.... the Trump campaign. As far as where to visit.

He actually started by pointing that it is not just the 10 states that determine the winners;, it is specific counties within the stated and I think that this approach is gaining tract. I cannot remember the counties, but he gave examples from many states. I am sure that political scientists know them.

And, yes, he admitted that misogyny was a factor. I think that 42% of white women (don't remember whether college educated or not) voted for Trump. And I am thinking: why are we thinking Kamala Harris or Elizabeth Warren? Just to make a point?



He mentioned how McCain and Palin concentrated on safe Republican counties, or states, and this, for him indicated that they were scare. That they realized that they had to secure their base. He observed something similar with Hillary. Don't remember the specifics. He did question her visiting Arizona just days before the elections. Why, he wondered? Arizona? Because, she apparently said, Bill won Arizona..

He is not impressed with the "Better Deal" promoted by Schumer and Pelosi. What is it, he asked?

And I realized that Schumer, Pelosi, Harris, and Warren are all from the coast. And I have to wonder whether this really is the way go go. Sanders, too, for that matter.

The reality is that there is a reason why the White House changes hands every 8 years, more or less. Whether the candidate is a sitting V.P. - as it was with Nixon, Humphrey and Gore, or just a natural heir - Hillary, the candidate has to, on one hand promise to continue the policies that worked, while distancing himself or herself, to offer something new and exciting. And it is not going to work. The only recent exception has been Bush I and he lasted only one term. Voters, for some reason, loved Reagan and wanted to continue but, of course, Bush was no Reagan. Does not work when a V.P. is elevated to the post after the death of the president. He may win one elections, but then chooses not to run for a second term as we've seen with Truman and with LBJ. (Yes, Truman had Korea, LBJ had Vietnam, still.. (This are my thought, not the speaker)

At the end there was one question about the coal miners: Hillary was straight with them, saying that these jobs were gone forever. While Trump promised to bring them back. Aha, was the response. I am from this area. I talked to a cousin of mine, there has not been coal mining for decades. But Trump offered hope.

Told you it was depressing. But I think that these were sobering observations. That somewhere there are lessons to be implemented.





6 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,862 posts)
1. It is crucial that a candidate very specifically ask the voters to vote for her.
Thu Oct 5, 2017, 11:49 PM
Oct 2017

Or him.

I learned that lesson a decade ago when I was running for office. I was pretty good at going door to door and introducing myself, but I can tell you that the actual question, "Can I count on your vote?" is really quite difficult to ask. I wasn't very good at asking that, which is one of the several reasons I lost my race. I was also up against a 1. popular 2. incumbent 3. Republican (the preferred party in my state) 4. moderate.

But I did learn a lot running for office.

And for those of you here who run for office (and I hope many of you do), asking specifically for the voter to vote for you matters.

ProudLib72

(17,984 posts)
2. That part of the OP was particularly interesting to me
Fri Oct 6, 2017, 12:02 AM
Oct 2017

And your follow up brings it home. Asking if you can count on someone's vote forces them to make a promise. It's not a strong promise, but it must be in the back of their minds when they go to cast their ballots. It's definitely something to consider moving forward.

question everything

(47,486 posts)
3. Indeed. Many years ago someone running for local office asked us to help making calls
Fri Oct 6, 2017, 12:18 AM
Oct 2017

asking for money, I think.

We met with a woman who has done it before many year and she gave us a script: So and so would be grateful for a donation, but the most important thing - please vote for him!

LisaM

(27,813 posts)
4. I have a thought on this.
Fri Oct 6, 2017, 12:20 AM
Oct 2017

I think women ask for things differently from men. They are much more likely to say people to vote for ideas and plans, vote for what I can bring to the table, but not, "vote for MEEEEE!

It would have frankly been off-putting if Hillary had done that, and I think it would have backfired spectacularly.

I saw her on TV a couple of nights ago and she said she ran because she thought she was the best person for the job. She said it quietly and matter-of-factly She was not bursting with ego. It would have not looked good on her.

I do think this was death by a thousand cuts but sexism was one of the deepest ones. I hope we can evolve as an electorate so that we don't just want women to act like men.

It's depressing to me that we aren't there yet.

NBachers

(17,119 posts)
5. I kept waiting to hear the Democrats ask for people to vote for them.
Fri Oct 6, 2017, 04:05 AM
Oct 2017

They'd lay out all the reason why their candidate was the best - they'd lead right up to asking for the vote- and then, they'd conclude without asking for the vote. They left it hanging. It was a noticeable error in the last election cycle.

Demsrule86

(68,586 posts)
6. With all due respect for your speaker. Hillary did ask, and I for one am sick of the blame directed
Fri Oct 6, 2017, 06:03 AM
Oct 2017

Hillary's way....she had Sarandon and Turner ET AL whining about how the parties were the same-God knows how many voters were influenced by Stein and the Russians. There were enough votes cast for Stein to have saved the election for Hillary ...and the Russians filled our media with propaganda and in the end stole the election.Both Russians and Republicans were involved in this endeavor I think...finally someone has reported that the voting numbers were basically impossible...election stolen in PA in the rural areas and in Michigan by spoiling thousands of ballots and if Hillary was just not the right candidate as people seem to hint but not say anymore than why did such staunch liberals as Feingold lose in Wisconsin?

Hillary lost three states by a combined number of 33,000. I would think now is the time for working hard and with unity of purpose to take every seat we can...not predict gloom and doom...consider that in the seats we lost (and we won some) that the margins were lowered considerably...it should be all hands on deck for 18. It is our best chance to stop Trump...take back the House and maybe the Senate with all these retirements. But what do we see the same old same with groups like Our Revolution primarying sitting Democrats and attacking the Democratic Party...even Move on got in the act by primarying Tim Ryan who is a good guy and the best we can do here in Ohio. I won't give one dime to these organizations that are helping Republicans really and need to turn in their progressive 'card'.

The doom and gloom and your reporting it here does not help with the arduous task of saving our country and probably humanity by getting Trump and as many republicans as we can out of office. I fear with all this talk about the 'calm before the storm' that the most stupid corrupt president in our history is about to embark upon a war that could kill millions...a Korean war. And to all those who didn't vote for Hillary Clinton, I say to you...whatever he does you enabled him...and there is already blood on your hand, and it seems as if more is coming. God forgive you because I cannot.

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