When you are silencing MY voice, I have a right to know your name (thoughts on Franken)

[nadine_mn]

I am a woman

I am a survivor of childhood rape and sexual abuse.

I am an adult survivor of sexual assault.

I am liberal.

I am a Minnesotan.

I am a Franken supporter.


Normally, I am the first person to say that no victim of assault owes anyone anything. They only owe it to themselves to do whatever it takes to heal. Some choose speaking out and seeking justice (despite the cost on their personal lives) and some choose not to relive the trauma, not to have their lives torn apart and instead choose silence. I always defer to their choice. I hate tv shows that have detectives pressuring victims to testify saying it is on them to prevent it from happening again. Not on the perpetrator to NOT commit another crime - but on the victim. It is the worst form of victim blaming.

But when your anonymous allegations that conveniently come out to deflect from a damn pedophile WHO THE WHOLE DAMN TOWN KNEW ABOUT INCLUDING POLICE, and lead to calls for resignation of my senator...I deserve to know your name. Because you are nullifying my voice, my vote. Because if you felt his behavior was so egregious then you had your chance to say something [anonymously even] when he ran for office, 2x. So like the Alabama voters, Minnesotans had the chance to decide. And if you think Franken was a shoe-in, then you don't remember how ugly his first election was (that was settled via recount). If you, anonymous accuser, think no one would believe you or there would be backlash - you are stupid. Because Coleman and the GOP went through every joke, SNL skit, every word from his books - they looked and tried to throw everything at him.

To say "it was not my intent for him to resign" is a LIE. Because of course he would be called on to resign, esp after Conyers.

I have been outspoken in my support of Franken and will continue to do so. Not just because he is a Democrat, not just because he is my Senator. But because the stories and allegations don't make sense. They don't fit logically with behavior of known predators (I laid this out in other posts). They are conveniently time and follow some weird script that just happens to fit into Fox news' whataboutism. "It's my right as an entertainer" sounds a lot like "When you are a star you can do anything"

The first 2 accusers who were named, weren't attacked viciously - their stories were looked at and each closer look showed them to be suspect. So then, the next accusers were anonymous. This isn't about Franken's right to face his accusers, this isn't about innocent until proven guilty. This is about 7 women (5 anonymous) making unsubstantiated allegations and silencing the vote of thousands of Minnesotans. What is the point of an ethic investigation if he resigns now? If any of the accusers are found to make false allegations - no consequences for them. But the consequences for those of us who Franken fought for and stood for, who we chose to have represent us - we lose our voice.

Bullshit. Franken is probably going to resign and he will never be able to be in the Senate again. No matter what happens from this day forward.

I don't hate women. I'm not a hypocrite - this story stinks no matter if you are D, R or I.

This is going to do more to harm women in the long run, and if you can't see that we are doomed to lose more strong voices.

It won't stop with Franken.

[still_one]

1. Sorry for what happened to you. I also think this is very unfair to Al Franken, and I agree, this

won't stop with Al Franken

[humbled_opinion]

53. Exactly if Franken resigns it is going to set

a precedent, and when the entire list of Politicians that paid off accusers comes forward, this precedent will be set, so who knows who is actually on that list.

[Hortensis]

66. Agree the senate ethics investigation should have

gone forward, and those anonymous women had been required to testify, closed session or whatever.

But the "silenced"? Nadine, I hope that, if you don't like the person your Democratic governor appoints to replace him until the special election next fall, you'll free to speak up all you want. Get a permit before stationing yourself on a busy boulevard with a big sign, though.

[dalton99a]

2. No, it won't stop with Franken.

[Amaryllis]

6. Yes.

[GaryCnf]

3. This n/t

[AlexSFCA]

4. it will set a low bar precedent

when we go high, they go lower

[Pathwalker]

5. Thank you! Righteous rant. Amen.

[dsc]

7. Overturning the results of an election should take more than anonymous

charges. It should take more than even non anonymous charges for the very reason you state. You and your fellow Minnesotans chose him for the Senate. Your rights are being denied here, in that you have the right to be represented by the person you chose.

[Yavin4]

8. Franken would never refer to himself as an "entertainer"

I listened to his show on a daily basis, and I never heard him refer to himself in that way. Ever.

[dalton99a]

11. +1

[orleans]

35. same here n/t

[ollie10]

81. Quite Frankly, this "entertainer" bit is a take off on what Trump said ....

This isn't even original!

[Pacifist Patriot]

9. This. A thousand times this!!!

[AmericanActivist]

10. I am 5 of 6 of your list the only

Exception being Minnesota. I agree with you and thanks for your post. “Well said.”

[geardaddy]

12. K & R

From someone who is represented by Franken and voted for him.

[BannonsLiver]

16. They're linked because Dems are the only people paying for their sins.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

64. 👍🏾👏

It’s time that stopped.

This whole thing about Al Franken stinks of GOP malfeasance.

[byronius]

14. Backlash.

If Franken resigns, it cheapens #MeToo to the point of absurdity, which is the GOP's plan. I was heartened by the campaign; now it seems meaningless and a harbinger of our doom.

I cannot help but feel that the rush to judge Al without investigation is an incredible mistake on the part of well-meaning #MeToo supporters. I think it sets the movement back decades.

Not that it will matter in the coming conflagration to be sparked by Franken's absence. We may not survive as a species, but --

[BannonsLiver]

18. #metoo is over as far as I'm concerned

It's a one-way street aimed solely at Dems, apparently.

I've lost interest.

[rsong71]

36. I think it sets the movement back decades. AGREED!

[LoveMyCali]

63. I also agree

but sometimes it makes me wonder if we were too conditioned to think all these little things are just a part of life. I am ferverantly against Franken stepping down, he is one of our strongest voices.

The biggest mistake of the #metoo movement was pretending every act is the same.

[ollie10]

82. It will soon be called #Everyone I don't Like Too

[mountain grammy]

15. Thank you.. and you're right, it won't stop with Franken

and it won't stop until we lose every Democrat who stands up and speaks out.

[Bettie]

17. I am all the things you listed, except for the Minnesotan

part.

And I agree with you 100% on everything.

I feel like I'm watching the death of our party, but it won't be final until 2018 when we win no seats and lose a whole bunch of them to unsubstantiated, anonymous allegations.

[BamaRefugee]

19. I know these aren't litigations, but what happened to "innocent until proven guilty"?

And if resigning or staying (or being elected regardless in Moore's case) is OPTIONAL, then freaking STAY for cripe's sake, the opposition isn't going anywhere!

Play the exact same card that the Repugnantcans will play, "everyone can change, everyone can lear and mature and move on, everyone deserves forgiveness"!

Because in the case of someone like AL Franken I truly believe that would be the truth.

[mahannah]

20. Yes.

[ananda]

21. Thank you!

Agree 100%.

[smirkymonkey]

22. Hear, Hear!

Thank you for your post!

[Jakes Progress]

23. This is a matter of the Democratic party

screwing its own voters.

[cp]

24. Yes

Thank you for your thoughtful post. Ever since the accusation first was aired--with no corroboration, no verification, and by RW vehicles--it did not pass the SMELL test. This feels like a set-up.
I continue to support Al Franken.

[zeusdogmom]

25. Amen!!!!

eom

[Texin]

26. Once again the Dems are playing right into the rethugs' hands.

If I give them the benefit of the doubt here and believe they are trying to do what they believe is the ethical and moral "right thing", they are missing the greater point in all of this. This most recent allegation is brought forward anonymously. Franken asked the Senate to investigate him in the senate immediately and that must be ongoing. Let that proceed and take its course. If the allegations are all proved to be true and not something that Bannon and Fox have conveniently hurled around to deflect from their favorite pedophile, then let the Ethics Committee have him removed. But to start the process of dumping every Democrat now serving if there is even a whisper of scandal or impropriety is premature and the public won't reward them for their integrity, they'll sneer at them in contempt for their stupidity in allowing themselves to be suckered.

[tazkcmo]

27. I was raped when I was 4.

And I am a male. I support Sen Franken. Nobody needs to have experienced that to understand the utter nonsense his resignation would represent. He speaks for me everyday and he's not even my Senator.

[lunasun]

40. He speaks for me everyday and he's not even my Senator

same for me

[bdamomma]

28. I sympathize with your

situation. Great post also.

I have already called Senator Franken's DC office, but I will also place a call to his home state office. I am not even a constituent of your state but this is a rallying cry for those who support Senator Franken and those Senators who are calling for his resignation they are hypocrites why set a different standard for the POS who is squatting in the WH, who does have multiple women saying that trump did assault them.

This is very unfair. Senator Franken even asked for the Ethics committee for investigation into these statements.

[Behind the Aegis]

29. Thank you!!

The disgusting behavior, without question, is that of the democratic senators demanding he resign. NO! That is why there is an ethics committee! Democrats need to stand for JUSTICE and TRUTH, not SPECULATION and INNUENDO! Let the Ethics committee meet and adjudicate the situation, then if found in violation, they should call for Franken's resignation. These calls for him to leave the senate simply demonstrate the weakness of the Democratic party. People have to be asking themselves; "If they can't stand up for one of their own, how can they stand for us? If they only demand blood from their own, but not of those in the opposing party who have done the same, or, in many cases, WORSE, how can we believe they will fight for us!"

An investigation MUST take place! If he is guilty, then he MUST resign. If he is not, and this is, as I and many suspect, a set-up, then JUSTICE must still be done!

[sinkingfeeling]

30. Amen

[FakeNoose]

31. You need a name? I can give you one.

Steve Bannon

I can almost guarantee you Bannon is behind this.

[lark]

32. God, I hope Franken and Schumer stay strong on this.

Franken should not leave or no dem will ever be sae again. Lies can't win the day!

[pazzyanne]

33. Thoughts on Al Frankin

As a woman, a teenage assault survivor, and a fellow Minnesotan, I applaud your post. You did a much better job of presenting your (and my) take on what is happening with these allegations. I strongly believe that the ethics investigation needs to go forward to conclusion. Al Frankin has been a champion of citizens in Minnesota and in the United States and he deserves to be heard. Thank you for your eloquence.

[rsong71]

34. Bravo Sister! Well Said!!

I am also a woman and a progressive. I have experienced sexual harassment in the workplace firsthand - in the national guard and in a university setting.

I agree with you 100%.

"This is going to do more to harm women in the long run, and if you can't see that we are doomed to lose more strong voices." EXACTLY!

[ancianita]

37. Eloquent and strong as hell. You're right. This oppo machine won't stop with Franken.

And the Democrats are suckers for not standing up for his due process rights.

Even the sexual predator from Alabama is promised that much.

[Polly Hennessey]

38. Anonymous accusers

now have all the power. This is going to backfire on women big time. The #MeToo movement is going to lose credibility and once again we are the losers. Bannon and Trump must be laughing their heads off. Kristen Gillibrand is setting herself up to run in 2020. She will not have my vote. Does anyone remember a year or so ago, Gillibrand said that she had been sexually harassed by some of her male colleagues. It was when she was pushing for military women who had been sexually assaulted by their superiors. I also remember she would not name her Senate male colleagues who she claimed had sexually harassed her. Time to step up to the plate Ms. Gillibrand.

[bigbrother05]

39. Hope that Franken demands that the ethics committee acts

and pledges to pay settlements out of his own pocket if it comes to that. As noted, if he was such a bastard, why did they let him get into office in the first place?

I'm sure Al has his faults like all of us, but please show us the strength he's come to represent in the Senate.

[Alice11111]

41. Thank you. I have represented victims in sex harassment

cases 30 years, and it has been all around me, personally & professionally.

I support Al Franken too. This is a RW set up to get rid of our best and brightest, again.

Dems, don't fall for this! We are complicit in letting them destroy us. Show some backbone an give this guy an investigation... due process.

[Mr. Evil]

42. With your permission,

I'd like to copy your post and send it to Rachel Maddow. I sent her an email about an hour ago addressing your very concerns. I'm hoping for her to make reference to this issue on tonight's show. I'm sorry for some of your life experiences but, you seem to have persevered and come out stronger. I've had my share of shitty experiences with some women in my life. They proved that they can be every bit as vile and disgusting as any man can be. I've tried to learn from them and continue to hope to meet better people.

[Duppers]

43. That's a good idea!

[Mr. Evil]

45. At this point what do we have to lose?

[nadine_mn]

46. go for it - we need to stand for justice

we can't keep backing down from fights.

[Mr. Evil]

48. I'm on it! And thank you!

[Duppers]

44. K & R

[zentrum]

47. K&R++++

[Rocky888]

49. Me too.

I am a survivor of child molestation.
I am a survivor of date rape.
I am a survivor of a violent home invasion and sexual assault.
I am a liberal.
I support Al Franken.

I spent 25 years working a male dominated physically challenging job. My male co-workers teased me on a daily basis, but at the end of the day, they always respected my ability to hold my own in a job that few women were able or willing to do.

I emailed McCaskill with my disapproval of her and other female senators taking this route without the benefit of an ethics investigation Al Franken has earned.
Then I emailed Al to tell him to fight and not quit.

What is really going on here? It sure has a rotten smell all over it.

[Mr. Evil]

52. Email your story to Rachel.

I've sent the link to this thread and the original post with the permission of the OP. I also sent another earlier. I'm trying to get her to address this on tonight's show. Here's the link. http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/send-it-rachel

[chowder66]

50. You should email this to Franken or at least email the link.

I agree with you and what they are describing as harassment doesn't quite fit. If any of this were true it sounds more like a guy failing miserably at a pass. It should be relegated to anecdotal status in telling funny or weird stories.

Grabbing a waist? That isn't harassment in my book. If she thinks it is, it makes you wonder how protective she is about her physical space. There is nothing wrong about being protective but if she infers harassment based on those parameters then certainly there will be others who she could deem inappropriate. How could anyone know? If he put is hand around her shoulder could that also be deemed harassment in her book? What if another person came out and said he grabbed her shoulder and she felt it crossed a line?

Ms. Tweedon exhibited the nearly the same behavior she ascribed to Franken, but importantly she was taped doing it several times in different ways.

Is Franken overly friendly? Maybe. Does he not understand boundaries, maybe. He doesn't come off as threatening.

Each woman was able to respond, say please don't touch me there or walk away and say they are disappointed. They all had the chance to demand an apology or put him in his place. This wasn't a man trying to overpower them or threaten their jobs.

My concern is that there will be some women who will create harassment where there is none; maybe because the don't understand what it is, maybe they overthink it or maybe the want to be part of something. There are those that truly go through it some a little, some a lot but there are grey areas and those areas may not fit the definition of sexual harassment.

[nadine_mn]

59. I emailed and also left many tearful voicemails

Ever since this mess started.

I believe in justice and the rule of law. We have due process for a reason. And I am done with anonymous accusations that just pop up conveniently.

[traladeda]

65. grabbing the waist...

I agree with your assessment. The equation of putting your arm around someone while taking a pic and "grabbing" their waist with sexual harassment/assault by this accuser can easily be regarded as an overreaction, and that is the type of thing that topples a movement into irrelevancy. Nothing would please the right-wing more than for that to happen.

As you note, Al is/was physically affectionate, he was unaware it had been received badly. He won't be doing those things ever again.

He is entitled to an ethics investigation; hell, I'm entitled to it since I'm a constituent. I am so disappointed in the party leadership. They should be aggressively pursuing the ethics investigation making it VERY clear they will get to the truth. Show the right-wingers Dems aren't easy marks. If it's real, he can suffer those consequences; if it's a hit job, that will be revealed. Democrats have to start fighting back and stop fighting each other.

[rainin]

51. Why would any democratic public servant

EVER stick their head out and bravely fight for us. EVER!! From now on, only wimps need apply. Strong candidates will be targets of Republican dirty tricks --- then fellow democrats will call for their resignation.

THIS IS CRAZY!!

Every democrat should turn to the Republicans and ask them to pass a law, or make a rule for government officials that applies to everyone, including Trump. The law must be applied fairly across the board.

Do that, BEFORE Frankin is every called on to resign.

SHAME ON ANY DEMOCRAT WHO SUPPORTS FRANKEN'S RESIGNATION WITHOUT FIRST DEMANDING TRUMP RESIGN!!!

[RandomAccess]

54. Thank you. Well said. If not their names --

The very LEAST we need -- if not names -- is a whole helluva lot more information, aka: corroborating evidence or at least testimony.

I'm just heartsick over what's happening to Franken. IF THE ALLEGATIONS ARE TRUE, then fine. But I don't believe they are. And I started out agnostic, chastising those who doubted his first accuser. The slut-shaming deserved chastisement, but other than that they had a point and won me over.

[trof]

55. Thank you. I still believe in Al.

[BlueMTexpat]

56. Thank you for your OP!

I too support Franken.

[msdogi]

57. Thanks for this

We all need to make it clear to Al, and to those calling for him to resign, that we want and need him to stay in the Senate!

[barbtries]

58. it stinks to high heaven

i am disgusted with all the democrats signing on to this injustice.

[Randomthought]

60. Another Minnesotan here

and I agree with you completely. The very foundation of our legal system is the right to face your accusers. Even though this isn't a trial the same rules apply.

[marieo1]

62. random thought

Then why doesn't this work with the republicans? They started accusing Al Franken after he got very aggressive in the senate!! I worked with all men many years and Al Franken is not a predator!!

[Randomthought]

68. Because

Republicans do not believe in law or democracy.

[marieo1]

61. terrible

I agree totally!! I have watched Al Franken in congress. He has become a real fighter and immediately when he started getting more aggressive, the allegations started surfacing. I worked with all men for many years and believe me Al Franken is not a predator but I doubt there is a thing we can do to help him. The republicans are running scared and are going to bring down one of our best senators. Sad. Also, I have checked up on some of his accusers and they are DJT supporters. Go figure!!!

[58Sunliner]

67. Yes!!!! I too have survived all kinds of abuse and assault, and rape.

I would never demand an injustice like this!!!! This is bullshit.

[stuffmatters]

69. 1000% agree with you, Nadine

[McCamy Taylor]

70. This is the Red Scare all over again.

[SunSeeker]

71. K & R

[MadDAsHell]

72. Ugh...I respect your beliefs but hate that this is where Democrats now stand.

Politics is fun until the moment when it should be shut off but isn’t. That’s when we lose credibility.

[angrychair]

73. Question

What proof is enough?

You obviously don’t believe them as it stands now so what can they possibly say or do that would change your mind?
Must they lay bear their entire lives and have every choice analyzed to ensure it meets a certain standard?

What was the lighting? What were you wearing? Why were you alone?

What gauntlet must they beat? What crucible is sufficient?

The crimes against me were years ago and I was very young and I very little vivid memories of what happened. I just remember the fear, anxiety and shame as vivid as any actual memories of the physical events.
My attackers were caught in the act but for many that doesn’t always happen.
I don’t kbow if these women are telling the truth or not but how people feel about their statements is very clear.

To me it’s like the myth that people are living in style and enjoy being on welfare. No one that has ever been on assistance has ever enjoyed it, no more than I would think that a victim of sexual assault enjoys exposing themselves and their every action to the criticism and analysis of complete strangers.

[nadine_mn]

74. In this case, more than just an anonymous account of being squeezed

Around the waist or that he tried to kiss her or his hand touched her butt.

That is not enough for a resignation.

Other predators have a pattern of before that runs similar across named and unnamed sources: trolling the mall, slipping qualuudes, asking the victim to come to his room to read a script, etc.

Franken's accusations have no common thread other than they pop up whenever it's time to deflect from Moore.

Or if they found that he had installed a button under his desk and would lock women in his office..I really wouldn't need to hear too much more than that. Or if he paid thousands of dollars to settle accusations.

But these current accusations are just too vague and bizarrely timed.

[blimablam]

75. Nicely said

[bagelsforbreakfast]

76. Thank you for this thread. Good too see the lynch mob is a small minority. Nm

[NanceGreggs]

77. Beautifully written. n/t

[betsuni]

78. K&R

[JI7]

79. that's one of the most fucked up things in all of this

the whole reason for it was to deflect from the piece of shit going after underage kids. does one really have to be so morally pure in order to fucking condemn that.

can't one at least agree that whatever differences that going after kids is fucking wrong and fucked up ????

so we can't be critical of pedophiles unless we condemn every moral failure. they are even bringing up clinotn and lewinsky. so one has to have a pure stand on adultery to condemn a fucking pedophile ?????????????

[MrModerate]

80. It was obvious from the git-go that Tweeden was lying, and continues to lie . . .

And that the second accuser maliciously or otherwise misinterpreted Franken positioning himself for the best photo. And the other accusers are anonymous -- i.e., lying.

If we fall for this obviously orchestrated political assassination, then I begin to wonder whether Dems can govern at all.

And genuinely abused women will face increased doubt if they try to come forward, because it's so obvious that Franken has been set up.

That's a lose-lose-lose.

Franken should not resign: he should fight back.

[PatrickforO]

83. If Franken resigns, the Dem party can forget about donations from me.

Sorry, but the hundreds of dollars I've given have gone to this spineless bunch of fucks???

From now on, when the Dem party calls me, we're going to have a conversation about Franken instead of how much money they need from me.

Because this is bullshit and I'm really fucking mad about it.

[nadine_mn]

87. Yup we've already canceled our monthly donations

The people who are Democrats (non-politicians) are diverse, hardworking, strong individuals who have faced a myriad of difficulties from poverty, racism, homophobia, ageism, sexism, misogyny and discrimination of every type.

Yet we elect spineless cowards who cave at the slightest thing...yet demanding we be strong and have their backs.

[world wide wally]

84. The people of Alabama get to have their voice heard.

Not the people of Minnesota!

[Honeycombe8]

85. Anonymous allegations are on their face NOT credible, to me. And not this "He tried to kiss me."

"He tried to kiss me" is NOT harassment, in my book, if he's not in a position of power, which he wasn't. However, Franken categorically and strongly DENIED that happened & said the story is preposterous.

[Jan Levinson]

86. Great point

Excellent post!