Democrats are going to be held to a higher standard on haressment. We better learn to live with it.

[louis c]

Our base includes educated white woman, minorities of both genders, gays and liberal men. We cannot just turn away from sexual, social or racial complaints. Addressing those complaints are who we are. Republicans, on the other hand, despise and denigrate those constituencies I have mentioned. They can dig in and ignore, and still get elected. We can not.

We better stop complaining about the problem, embrace it and figure out how we can lead everyone into a better society. I love Al Franken and his politics, but the accusations against him are credible and hit at the heart of our constituency. Roy Moore and Donald Trump, on the other hand, have a better chance to "tough it out", because their constituency in more tolerant of bigotry and misbehavior.

We know we stand for the right position in tolerance. It has been Liberal Democrats who have led the way for civil rights, women's rights, workers' rights and gay rights in every aspect of society. I remember when the "Solid South" referred to voting for Democrats. We threw out the bigots and their votes in 1965 when we supported the Civil Rights Act. We have taken the side of choice for woman, and protection for everyone in the workplace.

We have called on the better angels of our nature, often to our own political disadvantage. This is another time. Our position will be universally accepted, as has civil rights and gay rights. But, in the short run, the other side will have the advantage of a double standard, as we will have to live up to our ideals, and they do not. In the end, we will be judged by history as those who took the moral stand. However, history is not today, life is not fair and we better learn to live with it.

[KPN]

1. Ummm ... nice pep talk about the long arc of history. Big problem though --

we are on the verge of losing our democracy forever (whatever is lef of it anyway). Not a good time for high minded idealism.

[louis c]

4. It's actually political reality

If we stand by our men, as Republicans do, we will split our constituency. They don't.

Their misbehavior can be 100 times worse, and Republican White Women will still vote Republican. Our constituency will abandon us if we don't hold ourselves to stricter standards.

[KPN]

8. You are assuming intent and guilt.

You are wrong. This will harm the party equally if not more. We have no backbone. High minded ideals don't matter one iota to sharks, crooks or the imbeciles who want to MAGA.

[louis c]

15. What do we do with the 3 dozen Democratic Senators who asked Frankin to resign? (NT)

[bagelsforbreakfast]

2. To paraphrase George Bernard shaw - Democrats changing the party name to assh*les is not

An improvement!

[Wwcd]

13. + 1000

[flamingdem]

3. Harrassment and unwanted touching is NOT as important as having our country back!!

Franken has been set up by the right wing starting with Roger Stone and the democrats favoring his ouster are gullible and easily swayed in some politically correct wishful thinking about female votes.

They just lost mine

[mn9driver]

5. It would have been nice to take back the House or the Senate in 2018.

Using this strategy, that won’t happen. But we can feel good about ourselves, so at least there’s that.

[ollie10]

6. Better angels of our nature means shafting an innocent man?

Come off it.

Franken is no angel.

But what he did was not sexual assault or harrassment. A prank picture? A kiss? A half dozen anonymous "victims" who may or may not have even been female, all we have is their word for it, which they will not put their names beside?

What we see here is not better angels, we are witnessing cowardice on the part of alleged Democrats. some of which have a political iron in the fire.

Do you think ....really....that anyone is going to look higher on the Democratic Party now that we have turned on ourselves? Do you think anyone out there are going to call us angels?

Franken is forced to resign, the devils get their way and will be enabled to do this again to someone else in the future.....

We delude ourselves.

The Republican hate machines is laughing their arses off at us.

Because we eat our own, even the innocent ones.

Then we wonder why we keep on losing elections.

[louis c]

16. Yes, our base (NT)

[CrispyQ]

7. Nice words, but I'm having a hard time hearing them, what with this boot on my neck,

cutting off blood flow to my brain.

Fuck this shit! We are about to lose our country & the dems just helped the other side take out one of our best bulldogs. Who will the GOP go after next? Schiff? I mean why the fuck not? The dems will do the dirty work for them.

[Wwcd]

9. True. This whole Franken lynching is exactly what Rove did to

President Clinton.
The 1 gotcha set-up by Linda Tripp/Lewinski evolved into combing the country for opportunists willing to accuse without proof.
That snowballed into the same ordeal Franken is dealing with.

It was Kellyanne Conway's husband (today) that scoured the State of Arkansas, checkbook in hand, for as many Paula Jones's as he could gather.

This is straight out of Rove's playbook.
Is this Roger Stone's "redemption" with the RW?

S.O.B.'s

[bigtree]

10. these are politicians making political judgments and decisions, not necessarily moral ones

...and dirt-dumb political strategy, at that.

'Zero-tolerance' is being used here as a slogan, not a responsible policy which will judge accusations on merit and degree. Due process isn't some dodge, it's an integral function of our democratic system of justice.

[louis c]

19. My assessment in the OP is strictly political

I find all of these accusations problematic concerning due process. Although it's my inclination to always believe the accuser, there will certainly be innocent men's lives ruined by the lack of due process in decades old accusations, or new ones that are not corroborated.

As far as justice is concerned, a union contract is the only protection in cases of the less famous. The company will have to prove "just cause" for termination. Employees at will are on their own. Any accusation will be a pink slip.

"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is only applicable in a criminal trial. Harassment in the workplace is treated as a civil infraction and has the lower threshold "preponderance of evidence" or even the lower standard than that of "what was most likely to have occurred".

[wisteria]

11. Where is the due process?

We are just to take your word on the women ‘s credibility. This entire poorly executed plan is going to backfire on the Democrats. This is just a phoney movement to highlight Gillibrand. We look like the party of fools. And, this will end up making it more difficult for women to gain positions of power and promotions. What man is going to hire a woman if it could mean his job? All she has to do is make an accusation, and he is out..
You do as you want, I became an Independent today. I refuse to be a part of a party that acts like a lynch mob.

[Wwcd]

14. She will run for President. Good Luck. Judging by comments on her FB & Twitter feed,

she has zero chance to make it through the primary.
Or anyone who put their name on the list calling for Franken's resignation.

Gillibrand just happened to be the 1st one out of the gate.
It hangs on her shoulders.

[Skittles]

18. she has miscalculated badly

I would NEVER vote for her

[Thrill]

12. Thats because they cant handle criticism

They’re weak. Republicans just say a fuck it and keep going

[Skittles]

17. the party of "family values" gives real sexual predators a pass