Iran troops to join Syria war, Russia bombs group trained by CIA

[jpak]

Source: Reuters

Hundreds of Iranian troops have arrived in Syria to join a major ground offensive on behalf of President Bashar al-Assad's government, Lebanese sources said on Thursday, a further step in the rapid internationalization of a civil war in which every major country in the region has a stake.

Russian warplanes that joined the fight this week bombed a camp run by rebels trained by the CIA, the group's commander said, putting Moscow and Washington on opposing sides in a Middle East conflict for the first time since the Cold War.

The U.S. and Russian militaries will hold talks at 11 a.m. EDT via video link to seek ways to keep their militaries apart as they wage parallel campaigns of air strikes in Syria, a U.S. defense official said.

Russian jets struck targets near the cities of Hama and Homs in western Syria on the second day of their surprise air campaign.

<more>

Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/10/01/us-mideast-crisis-russia-syria-idUSKCN0RV41O20151001

[Lychee2]

1. Clusterf**k!

Are these the End Times?

[newfie11]

5. ++++++++++++++

Boy is that the appropriate word!

This will escalate and will not end well!!!!

[TwilightGardener]

2. Hot mess that we're involved in, but don't control. That's the worst position to be in.

[Fred Sanders]

3. The CIA "rebels" are attempting to overthrow Assad and not fight ISIS.

Last edited Thu Oct 1, 2015, 11:44 AM - Edit history (1)

Russia can freely attack ANY of the rebel groups....all of whom need to leave Syria so that the regime change refugees can go home....isn't that a good thing?

[Joe Chi Minh]

4. .. and the Russians are wise to it - doubtless always have been.

[newfie11]

7. Yes you are right

The MIC has a major desire for WW111

And our government is apparently owned by them!

[ozone_man]

8. "rebels" are terrorists

Surely if another country trained "rebels" in our country to overthrow it, would they not be terrorists?

[DetlefK]

10. Those rebels fought this torturing, mass-murdering dictator long before the CIA got involved.

Those are Syrians fighting a syrian regime that literally tortures people to death and literally bombs it's own civilians to kill the few rebels hiding among them.

[Fred Sanders]

11. So..much like the military government of Egypt and the dictators of Saudi that America supports?

[DetlefK]

15. What are you talking about?

Please remind me of the instances when the militaries of Egypt and Saudi-Arabia got into gun-fights with their respective citizens.

[Fred Sanders]

17. Not my job to repeat the history of Egypt and it's history of oppression folks are oblivious to.

Seriously, folks need to also look up the history and politics of Egypt and Saudi before commenting on Syria.

And not trust the mass media to do the thinking for you.

[DetlefK]

21. So, you came here to tell me I'm wrong but refuse to tell me why I'm wrong?

[Joe Chi Minh]

30. Why bother? If you don't understand something so simple, you are beyond help.

[happyslug]

35. You right the Miliataries of Egypt and Saudi Arabia did NOT get into fire fights with their citizens

They just shot them down like dogs.... the civilians being killed were unarmed so they could NOT shot back.

Egypt kill at least 817 people in Rabba, the people being shot say it was over 2000 people killed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/August_2013_Rabaa_massacre

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/monkey-cage/wp/2014/08/22/why-egypts-military-orchestrated-a-massacre/

This year the Egyptian Military killed over 500 civilians in their war agaisnt the insurgents in the Sinai:

https://bayareaintifada.wordpress.com/2015/09/28/egypt-500-civilians-killed-during-the-military-operation-retribution-for-the-martyr-in-sinai/

https://news.vice.com/article/egypts-military-is-killing-civilians-in-its-war-on-terror

In 1987 the Saudi Army killed 402 Shiite pilgrims:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1987_Mecca_incident

During the fight to form Saudi Arabia (around 1900-1932) one estimate is 400,000 people were killed in Arabia:

https://books.google.com/books?id=jm6WBgAAQBAJ&pg=PA9&lpg=PA9&dq=Saudi+Arabia+Massacre&source=bl&ots=0Nr1eUoJLy&sig=haEVu_DjX0L1-l8nWv_faegNyZY&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CD8Q6AEwBjgUahUKEwijjPuYx6LIAhXMHD4KHdtwBSw#v=onepage&q=Saudi%20Arabia%20Massacre&f=false

The above took just a few minutes, the Egyptian and Saudi Governments have thought NOTHING of killing their own civilians. Yes, in most cases the Armies of both countries did NOT have a shoot out with their civilians, the troops just shot down the civilians.

[DetlefK]

36. I still don't think this is comparable to Syria.

Egypt and Saudi-Arabia killing a few hundred protesters is IMO not comparable to straight-up violence against all syrian civilians and actual war-fare between syrian rebels and syrian military.

[NuclearDem]

12. People do seem to forget the Arab Spring spread to Syria for a reason.

And it wasn't because a lot of Syrians liked Assad.

[Oneironaut]

19. And their victory would virtually guarantee ISIS taking over and killing them all anyways.

[leveymg]

26. Incorrect. The CIA, DOS and DIA were involved with Syrian exile groups for years before

actual fighting broke out in early 2011.

Our "friends" the Saudi paramilitary did the same during the last Sunni uprising in Syria ('78-'82) along with the Muslim Brotherhood.

Saudi intelligence used the Brotherhood for its irregular operations (read, terrorism). The two merged and morphed into al-Qaeda in the late 1990s, and the Islamic State a few years ago. Even if there had never been a 9/11, they have become as much our problem as Russia's; that we can no longer ignore.

Because of the remnant hostilities of the Cold War, after we built up the Saudi paramilitary capabilities in Afghanistan, the US again aided the Saudis in their holy wars against Russia and Yugoslavia. Now, it's Syria's turn. We have literally been aiding the buildup of the worst terrorist army in the world, provoking the Russians for decades after the Cold War officially ended. This has and will continue to cost us. This madness must stop, now.

There would never have been an armed uprising in Syria had it not been for the opposition the CIA has been cultivating along with the Saudis.

[leveymg]

28. Here are some details on US support and direction of Syrian exile groups before the Civil War

The record is clear on who within the Administration was pushing regime change in Libya and Syria

The opposition in the Syrian civil war was armed, trained and directed by Qatar with the blessings of Washington -- moving weapons and Jihadis from Libya to Syria -- beginning in 2011. That was a joint CIA-State operation approved through the NSC pursuant to a pair of Presidential findings early that year.

But, we have to go back further to find the origins of the uprising. The Syrian exile groups who carried out the first stage of the uprising were supported, trained and directed by agencies of the governments of the US, UK, France, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia -- and that began years before 2011. The State Dept had multiple programs directed at Syrian exile groups for at least five years. Of course, the covert CIA activities with the opposition in Syria are still classified, but an inside glimpse of this was provided through the Wikileaks release of State Department cables several years ago.

by Washington Post staff writer Craig Whitlock.

The State Department has secretly financed Syrian political opposition groups and related projects, including a satellite TV channel that beams anti-government programming into the country, according to previously undisclosed diplomatic cables.

The London-based satellite channel, Barada TV, began broadcasting in April 2009 but has ramped up operations to cover the mass protests in Syria as part of a long-standing campaign to overthrow the country's autocratic leader, Bashar al-Assad. Human rights groups say scores of people have been killed by Assad's security forces since the demonstrations began March 18; Syria has blamed the violence on "armed gangs."

Barada TV is closely affiliated with the Movement for Justice and Development, a London-based network of Syrian exiles. Classified U.S. diplomatic cables show that the State Department has funneled as much as $6 million to the group since 2006 to operate the satellite channel and finance other activities inside Syria. The channel is named after the Barada River, which courses through the heart of Damascus, the Syrian capital.

- more -
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/wikileaks-us-secretly-backed-syria-opposition/

Without the regime change patronage of Madame Secretary and Director Petraeus, there would be no Syrian and Libyan refugee influx, and no ISIS anyone outside the Defense Intelligence Agency ever heard of.

[leveymg]

29. Apr. '11 - NYT, WP, CSM reported US covert support of Syrian exile groups since '06,

Last edited Thu Oct 1, 2015, 05:40 PM - Edit history (1)

at least five years before the uprising "began". In fact, the Syrian Spring was part of a long-term US clandestine action.

Many Americans still cling to the notion that the United States came into the game of mass murder in Syria after the killing started, and that somehow "our hands are clean." Nothing could be further from the truth. In April 2011, just days after gun battles first broke out between the Syrian military and defecting units, the NYT and the Christian Science Monitor both ran articles detailing the role of the CIA and the State Department in cultivating the rebellion.

The stronger and more informative Monitor report cited reports in the WaPo that US State Dept cables released by Wikileaks revealed that the US had covertly been aiding and directing the Syrian opposition for at least five years before the same exile groups declared "Days of Rage" sparked the rebellion: http://www.csmonitor.com/World/terrorism-security/2011/0418/Cables-reveal-covert-US-support-for-Syria-s-opposition

[div class="excerpt"]Newly released WikiLeaks cables reveal that the US State Department has been secretly financing Syrian opposition groups and other opposition projects for at least five years, The Washington Post reports.

That aid continued going into the hands of the Syrian government opposition even after the US began its reengagement policy with Syria under President Barack Obama in 2009, the Post reports. In January, the US posted its first ambassador to the country since the Bush administration withdrew the US ambassador in 2005 over concerns about Syria's involvement in the assassination of former Lebanese prime minister Rafik Hariri.

The Obama administration has been trying to draw Syria away from its key ally Iran and closer to the US and its regional allies. The effort seems to have been largely unsuccessful so far, and antigovernment protests sweeping the country have complicated the issue. The US is struggling to determine how to support Syria's democratic protesters while not alienating the Assad government, which has cracked down brutally on demonstrations and blamed them on "foreign saboteurs," as The Christian Science Monitor reported last week.

That is a dilemma that concerned the US government even before the protests began. The author of an April 2009 cable expressed concern that some of the projects being funded by the US, if discovered by the Syrian government, would be perceived as "an attempt to undermine the Asad regime, as opposed to encouraging behavior reform."

The Post reported that much of the money – as much as $6 million since 2006 – has been funneled through a group of Syrian exiles in London, known as the Movement for Justice and Development. The group is connected to a London-based satellite television station that is broadcast in Syria, known as Barada TV, which has recently expanded its coverage to include the mass protests.


Several other civil society initiatives in Syria received secret US funding, but by 2009, US officials were concerned that the Syrian government had discovered the US funding. The Post was unable to confirm whether programs are still being funded, but cables indicate the funding was planned at least through September 2010.

The WikiLeaks disclosure comes a week after US officials disclosed that Iran has been providing the Syrian government with assistance in putting down the protests and monitoring protesters' actions. Syria has become one of several proxy battlegrounds in the region between Iran and the US, the Monitor reported.

The rivals are constantly vying for the upper hand in Syria, which is the main conduit for weapons and funding flowing from Tehran to Hezbollah in Lebanon as well as the Palestinian group Hamas. While the US would like to end the friendly relationship between Assad and Iran, there is also great concern among US officials that, should Assad fall in the protests, the resulting power vacuum would given Iran an opportunity to broaden its influence in Syria.

< . . .>

[jamzrockz]

33. Are you sure?

I have read some time ago in The Christian science monitor that is was climate change that caused the uprising. Guns literally started growing out of the ground instead of crops. And this just happened to occur only in Sunni extremist areas, no CIA involvement whatsoever, just blame it on climate change

That or it was all Bush's fault. Cos last time I checked, Syria was a peaceful, secular, tolerant Middle East country several years after Bush left office. The Libyan weapons hadn't arrived in Syria and the veterans of Libyan war intervention hadn't decided to test their luck on Syria. They got help from NATO bombing is Libya and am sure they were thinking of having the same luck in Syria.

[leveymg]

42. It's a lot like Kissinger stated reason for destroying Chile in '73 - no attractive alternatives to

Last edited Fri Oct 2, 2015, 12:51 PM - Edit history (1)

the standard US model of dependent state is permitted. Try to create one for yourself, and we will impose ruin on you.

Allende's government also posed no strategic threats to the United States. In 1970, a high-level interdepartmental group concluded that the United States had no vital interests in Chile, and that Allende posed no likely threat to the peace of the region. Allende pursued a policy of nonalignment, entering into relations with Cuba and the Soviet Union, and demonstrating independence from the United States. United States intelligence estimates agreed that - none of this was of strategic concern.

Yet to Henry Kissinger it might as well have been 1948, with the Red Army looming just over the horizon. On September 16, 1970, he told a group of editors in a "background" briefing that an "Allende takeover" (i.e., victory in a democratic election) was not in United States interest. "There is a good chance that [Allende] will establish over a period of years some sort of Communist government," warned Kissinger, and that could pose "massive problems for us and for democratic forces and for pro-US forces in Latin America." In a stretch of his geopolitical imagination, Kissinger specified Argentina Bolivia, and Peru as countries that would be adversely influenced by an Allende victory. Moreover, Kissinger feared that the "contagious example" of Chile would "infect" NATO allies in southern Europe.

Kissinger was worried about the question of dominoes "infection," and Western stability. Chile, like Vietnam before it and Angola after, had become a test case for America's imperial will. Not surprisingly, for the man who urged the carpet-bombing of Hanoi in order to "punctuate" his negotiating position against North Vietnam, Kissinger had little interest in either the condition of the Chilean people or their fate. "I don't see why we need to stand by and watch a country go Communist due to the irresponsibility of its own people," said Kissinger in 1970 at a supersecret meeting of the 40 Committee (the White House group chaired by Kissinger, which was supposed to approve major projects to manipulate other countries' internal affairs).

Kissinger set the CIA against Allende, not to preserve democracy or to counter a Soviet puppet in Latin America, but to prevent a charismatic socialist from providing a democratic alternative to American policy. "Henry thought that Allende might lead an anti-United States movement in Latin America more effectively than Castro, just because it was the democratic path to power," commented an ex-staff aide. In fact, it was precisely because Allende was widely regarded as a believer in democratic institutions that there was so much shock connected to his overthrow, especially in the Third World and southern Europe. What Kissinger was saying-and backing up with covert American power-was that adherence to democracy wasn't enough; that countries would not be allowed to switch over to a socialist way of running their economies even democratically. The message of Chile was: no matter how unjust or corrupt the alternative, the United States would not allow meaningful economic or social change, at least with a Marxist label, and a willingness to have good relations with Cuba, China, and the Soviet Union.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/NSA/CIA_Allende_LS.html

[leveymg]

45. Unfortunately, we've been doing this since 1945. The 1890s if you count Philippines

The Model 1911 Colt .45 auto was invented because standard sidearms didn't kill the Huks immediately. Read Landsdale on the psyops programs directed at them in the 1950s. Chile was an extension of that imperial adventure and Guatemala '54, another CIA production.

[GreatGazoo]

37. another source adds this

Syrians know there were abuses against demonstrators in early 2011; they also know that the President dismissed the Governor of Dara for this. They know that the armed insurrection was not a consequence of the protests but rather a sectarian insurrection that took cover under those rallies. Saudi official Anwar el-Eshki admitted to the BBC that his country had provided weapons to Islamists in Dara, and their rooftop sniping closely resembled the Muslim Brotherhood’s failed insurrection in Hama, back in 1982. Hafez al Assad crushed that revolt in a few weeks. Of the incident US intelligence said total casualties were probably ‘about 2,000’ including ‘300 to 400’ members of the Muslim Brotherhood’s elite militia. The Brotherhood and many western sources have since inflated those numbers, calling it a ‘massacre’. Armed Islamists posing as civilian victims have a long history in Syria.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/why-syrians-support-bashar-al-assad/5405208

[leveymg]

39. Unfortunately, without footnotes, sources cited or links, this article loses most of its value.

Frustrating.

[GreatGazoo]

41. Agreed. They lay out some big round numbers for Assad "55%", "70%", and casualties "2000"

which can't be confirmed. But even with reservations about their angle and their specifics, I think their contrarian perspective helps to round out an understanding of the social/military/political dynamics in Syria.

[pampango]

18. What? ISIS has fought much, much more with other rebels than it has with Assad's army.

His forces have concentrated on non-ISIS rebels for a long time and Assad is smart to have done so.

If a dictator claims that the rest of the world should support him at least partly because he is the "lesser of two evils", it makes sense that the worse the other "evil" is the better the dictator looks. The lesser the other "evil" the worse he looks by comparison. If ISIS is defeated the really bad "evil" by comparison is gone. The dictator may not look like such a great alternative at that point.

In 2011 when there were tens of thousands of Syrians protesting in the streets, there were plenty of 'lesser evils' than Assad in Syria. Now that they have been largely killed or driven from the country the opposition, particularly ISIS, is indeed a 'greater evil' than Assad. That's a win for the Assad strategy (which is proof that he is a smart man) for dealing with popular protest. He has been much better at retaining power than Ben Ali, Gaddafi, Mubarak or others were.

[Xithras]

6. All five of them?

In all seriousness, one HAS to wonder how any air command...ours, Syrias, Russia's, France's, or any of the others...can tell who is who when they're bombing people on the ground. It's not like they're in uniforms or are marching in neat little groups under easily identifiable flags.

For anyone who hasn't seen it, here's the current list of ALL the armies currently involved in the Syrian civil war: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_armed_groups_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War

When you're looking down at targets from 15,000 feet, how the hell do they know who they're shooting at?

[Bradical79]

9. Yes, that's one advantage Russia has in getting involved

Allying themselves with Assad really simplifies things for them. All rebels = terrorists. The whole supporting of the rebels thing with some training and small arms was a pretty terrible idea to begin with. These weak half measures never seem to end well. I feel like a number of people here predicted this very early on.

[DetlefK]

13. Turkey also pretends to fight ISIS and bombs the Kurds instead.

Turkey bombs the Kurds, so they can't fight ISIS, so ISIS can weaken Assad.

Russia bombs the secular syrian rebels so Assad can stay in power.



The mythology of ISIS speaks of a great final battle of the forces of light (Muslims) against the forces of Rome (the West) who are commanded by Satan. And when ISIS is losing that means that the victory really is right around the corner.

But now... Who is Rome?

[roamer65]

32. The Christian faith says we are all going to meet up on the plains of Megiddo...

for the "big party". Who knows...

[PatSeg]

14. This is not going to end well

It is like Syria has become the site for a proxy war between some major powers in the world.

[roamer65]

31. Yup, that "not ending well" will the beginning of World War III.

The banksters are pushing for it, as they crave the profits from it.

[PatSeg]

34. Yes, that's how it feels

Much more surreal than I would have pictured it.

[Lychee2]

16. Russia and the US must be coordinating these strikes to some degree.

Otherwise they could get in each other's way.

[Jesus Malverde]

20. What the article is likely missing and the cause of all the outrage

is "rebels trained by the CIA" AND THEIR ADVISORS.

It's possible the Russians dropped a big one on the CIA boots on the ground.

Otherwise who would complain about killing Jihadist.

Not me.

[geek tragedy]

22. Russian bombs killing CIA personnel would create some serious blowback for the Russians

Such as advanced SAMs targeting their planes in Syria.

[NuclearDem]

23. Putin could bomb an orphanage and you would believe they were CIA babies.

[rug]

24. Proxy war.

[PSPS]

25. "group trained by CIA"

Yes, trained and armed, then they say "thanks" and laugh all the way back to the ISIS.

[rtracey]

27. US OUT NOW