Debate over removal of Confederate monuments stirs passions

[Omaha Steve]

Source: AP

By CAIN BURDEAU

NEW ORLEANS (AP) — Impassioned residents heckled each other and at least one man made an inappropriate gesture that got him escorted out of City Hall during a heated debate Thursday over whether city officials should remove prominent Confederate monuments from some of New Orleans' busiest thoroughfares.

Those arguing before the City Council to keep the monuments included preservationists who valued them as pieces of history and military veterans who said they were a way to honor American soldiers. Those opposed included pastors who called them symbols of racism and African-Americans who called them offensive. Opinions often appeared to divide along racial lines.

Before the meeting, a handful of people held Confederate flags in support of the statues while a larger group gathered next to them and held signs demanding removal.

The monuments in question include imposing statues of Robert E. Lee and P.G.T. Beauregard, Confederate generals, and a dedication to Jefferson Davis, the Confederate president.

FULL story at link.


A demonstrator who did not want to be identified by name holds a sign disapproving of Confederate heritage supporters who were bearing Confederate flags in front of City Hall in New Orleans, Thursday, Dec. 10, 2015. City Hall became the scene of competing opinions over the removal of prominent Confederate monuments along some of New Orleans' busiest thoroughfares. The City Council set aside time to let the public voice feelings over a proposal to remove four monuments linked to Confederate history. Woman at left is Arlene Barnum, of Oklahoma, with a group calling themselves Confederate Veterans Lives Matter. (AP Photo/Gerald Herbert)

Read more: Debate over removal of Confederate monuments stirs passions

[busterbrown]

1. Wow.. What can you say about the Black Women

carrying the confederate flag.... Hard to say anything.. However she certainly has the right to do what she’s doing.
I found this relevant piece

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/06/30/why-some-black-defenders-of-the-confederate-flag-believe-slavery-was-a-choice/

[blackspade]

2. They should be removed and put in a museum were they belong.

A museum explaining how these Southern 'luminaries' almost destroyed the United States so that they could maintain the system of chattel slavery.

"Those arguing before the City Council to keep the monuments included preservationists who valued them as pieces of history and military veterans who said they were a way to honor American soldiers."

These preservationists don't seem to understand that these statues and monuments can be preserved in a museum for all that want to see them. And the assholes that claim that they "honor American soldiers" are full of shit. The Confederates are not American soldiers. they were part of the armed forces of a failed separatist state fighting for the enslavement of fellow human beings.
Fuck Robert E. Lee, P.G.T. Beauregard, and Jefferson Davis and the horses they rode in on.

[Omaha Steve]

12. WTF an alert on this and got 2 hides???

I just found out. blackspade somebody had your back!

Here are the results: On Thu Dec 10, 2015, 11:17 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

They should be removed and put in a museum were they belong.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=1286474

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

I'm sorry but "Fuck Robert E. Lee....."is rude and not constructive debate.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Thu Dec 10, 2015, 11:22 PM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Oh, please. Frivolous alert; don't waste our time.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: it is okay to say fuck you to people who fought an killed to defend slavery. it really is.
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: "Fuck Robert E Lee" is fine. "Fuck you, fellow DUer" is not. Robert E Lee is neither a poster or current Democratic candidate or politician. Nor is it a sexist attack, though I would leave the poor horse out of it.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Really ridiculous alert.
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given

[blackspade]

13. Holy crap!

I love how the "Hide it" folks have no defense for their position.
Thanks for the backup!

And to Juror #5, my apologies to the horses.

[houston16revival]

3. Erasing history

has never been very successful

Conquering civilizations sacked ancient cities and monuments

Germany made the swastika illegal

I think these things should be public as a constant reminder of wrong-headedness

Sometimes suppression creates a rebound effect

Or an underground effect, an invisible empire

People and time periods and classes each have their own realities

Perhaps freedom and self-determination the only endurable universal human pursuits

[LanternWaste]

7. Pretending the removal of a plaque is erasing history has never been a rational thought

Pretending the removal (as opposed to the destruction) of a plaque is the equivalent of erasing history has never been a very rational thought.

[houston16revival]

15. Pretending to post rational thoughts

has never been very successful either. It's as bad as trying to erase history.

[yellowcanine]

8. Not celebrating it isn't the same as erasing it.

The public square celebrates and commemorates. You can record history in museums, on the actual battlefields and in history books. No need to have the offensive parts of history in the public square.

[dhill926]

4. I think they (we)....

should own it. Don't whitewash history....deal with it...

[ShrimpPoboy]

11. We can own it

without celebrating it.

[paleotn]

5. To the vets mentioned in the article.....

....the monuments don't honor American soldiers. They honor traitors. You know that oath all US service personnel give on entering the military? Lee and the rest broke it and took up arms against our country. For that, they get nothing from me but my disgust.

[Judi Lynn]

14. Well expressed. Common sense, as well. Thank you. n/t

[romanic]

6. The Confederacy is apart of an ugly aspect in US History

but it is still history and should be treated as such. If we remove every single thing about the Confederate South, how will future generations learn of it's history and learn how to not repeat it?

[Aristus]

9. In museums.

See above comments.

[Doctor_J]

10. Totally agree

From songwriter David Lynn Jones

"When the road just gets longer, and you feel like you're going nowhere...
Take a look behind you, see how far you've come"

We need those dinosaur bones to keep a benchmark of where we were. Same thing with George Wallace and the rest of the segregationists. Next thing you know Nixon will be taken out of the history books