Donald Trump calls Pope Francis 'disgraceful' for questioning his faith

[Xipe Totec]

Source: The Guardian

Donald Trump has called Pope Francis “disgraceful” over the pontiff’s suggestion the Republican presidential frontrunner was “not a Christian” for his plan to build a wall at the Mexican border.

Flying back to Rome from a trip to Mexico, the pope said: “A person who thinks only about building walls, wherever they may be, and not building bridges, is not Christian.”

Trump responded swiftly at a campaign event in South Carolina, saying: “For a religious leader to question a person’s faith is disgraceful.”

“No leader, especially a religious leader, has the right to question another man’s religion or faith,” he told a packed room at a golf course resort. Trump then accused the Mexican government of “using the pope as a pawn”.

Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/feb/18/donald-trump-pope-francis-christian-wall-mexico-border

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Please explain to American Catholics how berating the Pope is a good idea.

[Gregorian]

1. He's an egomaniac.

The all omnipotent, know it all.

I would hate to be on his shit list. I'll bet he's a lousy loser.

[William Seger]

3. ...

[DesertRat]

5. Absolutely perfect

[Dont call me Shirley]

13. Maybe we will see his balloon this October at the ABQ International Balloon Fiesta, LOL!

[William Seger]

36. Oh, I hope so -- I'll be there. (n/t)

[Dont call me Shirley]

38. Me too.

[Gregorian]

43. Self-inflating!

There's a Creative Speculation group? Wild.

[William Seger]

48. Yep, the fire in his belly produces hot air (n/t)

[asiliveandbreathe]

2. Pope Francis is seen as trying to do the most

good for the most people....

Donald...not so much......only what is good for Donald....

[Xipe Totec]

4. I wonder how many Catholic voters he's pissing off per minute

tick tock, tick toc.

He has simply no idea how much damage he is causing himself.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

8. Right wing catholics don't like the pope; call him communist, globalist, are cheering TheRump. nt

[Xipe Totec]

10. I don't think so. Those are by definition apostates. nt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

23. They write they are disgusted, dumbfounded, he's a turncoat, ...

I am Catholic but my disappointment in the church seems to be NEVER ending, they scream about abortion YET always vote DEM, the coverup of the molestation of young boys, and now this pope is just to much for me to handle!!! It has become such a battle within myself to have been raised in a religion that I find myself disgusted with!!! I do NOT like this pope!!!

I’m a Catholic and I don’t put any stock in anything that Francis has to say....turn coat to his people....

I am a Catholic and frankly, this is very embarressing.

Trump needs to make a deal with the Pope. We won’t build a wall if the vatican agrees to tear theirs down. As a catholic disgusted with this current Pope....this almost makes me want to join the trump team.

The Catholic church is leaving me. How can this be?? I can’t believe what is coming out of this man’s mouth. Aren’t there any true Catholics out there in the hierarchy to take this on? Benedict was pushed out. Why not push this Pope out? DUMBFOUNDED is the only word

It’s so disturbing....at least for this Catholic. The Vicar of Christ is attacking a private citizen and the whole U.S. He’s supposed change hearts, not involve himself in politics. Capitalism works when people of VIRTUE are participating. Socialism/communism are the antithesis of virtue and the Ten Commandments. Sheesh.

"This Pope says capitalism is “the new tyranny,” and “the dung of the devil.” Nevertheless, the people from dysfunctional Catholic countries who have disdained Capitalism in favor of (1) right-wing feudalism upheld by the military and/or (2) left-wing socialism upheld by the military, have a right to migrate to capitalistic countries and get welfare benefits. Same thing with Muslims and Greek Orthodox. All the holy people of the world, who are too holy to have a functioning society, have the right to the fruits of the labor of the evil people of the world."

As a devout Catholic--best comment of the day! This Pope is a disgrace! Never does he talk about tyranny is the South American countries.

I am french , catholic , and i DISAGREE with that pope and his shamefull and hypocritical statement . I think more over that this pope is not a gift for the catholic church in our times !
GO TRUMP ( btw TRUMP is perfectly Christian because christianism is not a confusing lunacy .... This pope is confuse and probably a TOOL )

Here is an actual apostate:

The battle within myself is I DO NOT believe in social justice and I am finding myself more and more against the beliefs of my church than I am for the beliefs of my church!!! This pope has just been the absolute icing on the cupcake!!!! I wonder if other Catholics are having this same turmoil within themselves!! I have today decided I am going to seek out another church to attend!!!

Their conspiracy theory is that Benedict was forced to resign by bankers because of the financial scandal.

[Xipe Totec]

25. They are not Catholics. By definition

The very act of challenging the Pope's authority makes them profane and ineligible for communion.

The Pope, Bishop of Rome and Peter's successor, "is the perpetual and visible source and foundation of the unity both of the bishops and of the whole company of the faithful. For the Roman Pontiff, by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered.


http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a9p4.htm

[Bernardo de La Paz]

28. Maybe technically, but it is rarely enforced. Your original point is unsupported. Ball in your court

You claim that catholics would leave TheRump over this.

I think it only hardens the positions of catholics who are in TheRump camp, and I posted quotes to support that. You have only made assertions with nothing to back it up. You are indulging in wishful thinking.

Your main point is about believers leaving TheRump. You do not get to conveniently suddenly relabel them as non-catholic as a way to buttress your point.

[Xipe Totec]

32. Just because you say you are Catholic doesn't make it so. It does not work that way

If these assholes want to follow The Trump and still pretend to be Catholic, then more power to them.

But they are not Catholics.

And we shall see what we shall see, and it will happen when it happens.

Right now, it just started. Let's give it a few days for the news to percolate. Then let's talk again about damage and impact.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

34. I am not catholic! . . . nt

[Xipe Totec]

35. I didn't say *YOU* were. But since you've appointed yourself spokesman for 'Conservative Catholics'

My response is directed at your flock.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

37. I have not appointed anyone. I only quote them. You provide no evidence, only wishful thinking.

You wishfully hope that catholics leave TheRump. I wish everyone would. But I look for facts. You are simply asserting based on your wishful thinking.

Ball has been in your court for a while now.

But I think I may depart this conversation with you since it remains fruitless. Underhanded veiled character assassination ("your flock", "appointed yourself their spokesman&quot is not meaningful debate.

[Red Knight]

49. In today's "religious" world

It's like a buffet table. Pick what you like--leave the rest.

I'm sure they consider themselves "good" Catholics.

[elljay]

31. Conservative Catholics

I once asked an extremely conservative Catholic what he would do if the Pope made an infallible doctrinal pronouncement that women could become priests. He told me that he would leave the RCC. I suspect there are many Catholic Trump supporters who are similarly capable of such extreme rationalization.

[Xipe Totec]

33. Conservative Catholics are as common as virgin prostitutes. nt

[maxsolomon]

50. Can I ask you where you live?

Because I am from the German/Irish Catholic West Side of Cincinnati, where nearly every Catholic votes a straight Republican ticket, including all my Relatives: Aunts, Uncles, my Cousins (save 1 who moved to Alaska to get away), & Father. My siblings are all dope-smoking Pantheists, like me.

I knew liberal Catholics growing up, but without exception, they've all fallen away from the Church. Including ordained Priests.

Meanwhile, my daily-Mass-attending cousin sends her teenage sons to Pro-Life Marches in DC. They're obsessed with the issue.

[Person 2713]

55. Huh? Not around here

[Xipe Totec]

61. If you ask a prostitute if she is still a virgin she will say of course.

Likewise, if you ask a conservative if he's still a Catholic he will say of course.

That does not mean the prostitute is still a virgin, or the conservative a Catholic.

[rpannier]

11. You can never be totally sure how that plays out

It's one thing for those inside the Church to criticize
Another thing for an outsider to do so
I know several more conservative friends from my Church who are okay with O' Reilly criticizing, but bristle when the Anglican, Varney runs his mouth

[Act_of_Reparation]

7. "Seen as", being the operative phrase in that statement. n/t

[gregcrawford]

6. The Donald's narcissism...

... and distinct sociopathic tendencies will be his undoing... I hope.

He can insult just about anyone and get away with it because no dares to call him on it; the big, bad Donald, or some of his psychotic sycophants, might say nasty things about them. But badmouthing the Pope might just be a step too far, even for the jerk-offs that admire him.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

9. Huffington Post calls him on it in *every* article:

They write on every article about TheRump:

Editor's Note: Donald Trump is a serial liar, rampant xenophobe, racist, misogynist, birther and bully who has repeatedly pledged to ban all Muslims -- 1.6 billion members of an entire religion -- from entering the U.S.

[gregcrawford]

24. I should have been more precise...

... the majority of Trump's semi-literate supporters – at least the ones I've met – do not read Huffington Post; it's just for us librul ee-leets. Pox News has been something less than fawning when speaking of him, and the other three networks have been muted in their criticism, to say the least. The Donald is a loose cannon, or whatever explosive metaphor you care to employ, and I just want to see him taken down before he does some real harm.

[AngryOldDem]

71. How many times have we thought that his mouth finally overshot his ass?

Remember the poke at McCain? Mexican rapists? ANY of what has come out of his mouth would have undone any other candidate MONTHS ago. His comments about the Pope will be no different.

You are absolutely right -- until the media stops treating him like a sideshow act, and seriously starts calling him out on his shit, as well as making him speak in specifics rather than in tired adjectives and insults, I'm convinced nothing will change.

It is truly scary and appalling at the degree of visceral, blind hate that Trump is tapping into in this country. ("He's sayin' what I'm thinkin'!!!!&quot That hate and ignorance, just like the media, has him steamrolling. I don't know what can -- or will -- stop this man.

[mainstreetonce]

12. I have been reading comments from the religious right

They side with Trump against the Pope.

[Xipe Totec]

14. The religious right are not Catholic.

Show me a criticism of the Pope from a Catholic Bishop or Cardinal.

Then we'll talk.

[former9thward]

66. How many votes do the Bishops have?

Oh that's right ...

[Android3.14]

15. Well, Trump is the expert on disgraceful

Of course, El Papa is the expert on grace.

It's like Ted Nugent accusing Mother Theresa of being reckless with guns.

[Botany]

16. Good going Don you have now pissed off the Catholics and ...

.... the Vietnam Vets and their families.

Trump: All That Sex I Had While Dodging Vietnam Was Just Like Being In Vietnam
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017331127

[IrishEyes]

59. We can add them to the list groups of people he has specifically offended.

Let's see. Here are the ones so far. I'm probably missing some.

1. Hispanics
2. Gays
3. Women
4. Black People
5. Jews
6. Veterans
7. Catholics

St. Patricks Day is next month. I wonder if he will insult the Irish soon.

[Jefferson23]

17. lol Time will tell if the Pope guy can take down The Donald.

This election period is incredible.

[Xipe Totec]

18. So far the Donald is vying for the post of Anti-vicar-or-Christ nt

[SDJay]

19. Not Getting Fooled This Time

I don't know how many times this insufferable gasbag has said something way out of line against groups and/or individuals and I've thought, "Well, he may have finally gone too far this time." I've been wrong every single time, as his poll numbers have actually gone up. That was the first thought I had when I saw this idiot taking on the pope this morning, but I'm not going to say it. Instead, I'll wait for his poll numbers to rise again.

It's really incredible and something I've never seen before.

[Xipe Totec]

20. ...

[2naSalit]

21. I don't subscribe to any religion but the donald just needs to be told off

So to quote Kurt Vonnegut, the chumpster can go "Take a flying F'k at a rolling doughnut" or something equivalent.

[Xipe Totec]

22. Me neither but as a recovering Catholic I think I have some insight into the catechism nt

[Thinkingabout]

26. Trump can't be helped, he just can't control himself.

[Xipe Totec]

27. Knee-Jerk reaction. He has no idea who he's dealing with. nt

[Manifestor_of_Light]

29. Even Bill Maher, atheist, likes this pope!

For saying nice things about helping the poor, railing against greed and unregulated capitalism in general, and stuff like that. Trump is a narcissist egomaniac who has no conscience, no empathy for anyone else.

[doc03]

30. Just a guess but that will probably go over good with his followers

they probably want to deport all Catholics anyway.

[Xipe Totec]

40. You would have to deport half of Massachusetts and most of Louisiana

Not that they wouldn't want to, but good luck

[doc03]

47. Just sayen in South Carolina there are probably not a whole lot of Catholics

mostly fundamentalist so called Christians that don't like Catholics. Fox news and the right wingers don't like this Pope anyway.
All totaled probably a plus for Trump in SC.

[houston16revival]

39. Casino values

that lighten people and families of their hard earned money

is not Christian in any sense

[benld74]

41. Shutup Trump and place more coin on the Communion plate

[valerief]

42. You can't write this comedy gold!

[houston16revival]

44. A Video for The Fall Election

you couldn't make this stuff up if you tried, you'd have to assume
no politician would go there

Trump will inflame everything if he's head of state

[Marcuse]

45. The Pope doesn't question one's faith, but he may "inquire".

[Judi Lynn]

46. He's not bright enough to realize he has drawn an image of himself his worst enemy couldn't manage.

He couldn't look less intelligent, responsible, or moral.

[DesertFlower]

51. i'm from a catholic family. grandpa was president

of a democratic club for most of his adult life. aunts and uncles were all catholic and practised birth control. grandma and grandpa obviously didn't because they had 8 kids. my aunts and mom did not receive communion until menopause or a hysterectomy.

i'm 74 and left the church in my early 20s.

[Peregrine Took]

52. His followers tend to be Scots/Irish orangemen. Figures they would hate the Pope.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/17/opinion/campaign-stops/donald-trumps-secret-channelling-andrew-jackson.html?_r=0

[randys1]

53. All part of the plan to make sure no teaparty moron is president

[olddots]

54. beef up your security Donny

this kind of attention can get very scary .

[keithbvadu2]

56. Does The Donald call Billy Graham and son Franklin "disgraceful"

for saying that the Pope and Catholics are not Christians?

[olddad56]

57. I'll bet the women in Trumps live question his faith-fulness. with good reason.

why isn't that an issue.

[840high]

58. I'm Catholic - my

dear Pope - stay out of politics. The church has many problems - focus on fixing them.

[Xipe Totec]

63. I don't think the Pope reads DU. Write him a letter

Better yet, tell your parish priest how you really feel about the Pope instead of hiding behind the veil of anonymity of the web.

[840high]

65. My priest knows - I go to confession.

Thank you for your suggestions. When the Vatican takes down it's huge wall - then I'll probably listen more. How many migrants has the Vatican taken in?

[DeeBunker]

60. POLITICS & RELIGION;

Will always overlap, one calls Ethics, the other calles Morals. Humanity really needs a sane alternate voice right now; What with all the messed up shit Polititians always screw up anyway!

'sides, Pope Francis was Speaking Metaphorically about 'Cultural' Bridges, Thus Metaphorically about 'Cultural' Walls too, Duh!
Fine; throw real walls too, into the conversation, it's a deep subject anyway. But Pope didn't use 'The Donald' by name, yet Trump invoked the Pope by using the "Vatican" Word in His Stupid Reply.

btw; People may not dig the Trumper being disrespectful to their Pope!

[LiberalElite]

62. American Catholics are not monolithic - (I was raised RC)

the conservative ones don't like Francis anyway.

[truthisfreedom]

67. Hahahaha. So now the donald has to admit he's not a leader, by his own standards. Look.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/robert-schlesinger/articles/2016-02-18/trump-slams-the-pope-after-questioning-obama-and-cruzs-christianity

[Dr. Xavier]

68. It comes down to this,

a con artist like the Donald insults the Pope, who is a very, highly respected man around the world. It may not cause Catholics, who don't respect the Pope, to not vote for Trump, but it will cause others to shut him down. And that's a good thing.

[jmowreader]

69. There's no question as to Trump's faith

Donald Trump worships money and only money. I have no idea why the Pope would "question" that.

[AngryOldDem]

70. Guess what, Donald? Christ challenged people's faith ALL THE TIME.

And I really think that the Pope is beyond being anyone's "pawn".

But, as we all know, the Pope is just a BIG LOOOOOSER.

For the life of me I've never seen a more stupid, immature, petulant manchild EVER in my life than Donald Trump.

[leftyladyfrommo]

72. You know, the Pope is right.

Not many people really practice Christianity. They twist things around to fit their wants and needs and then build elaborate rationalizations.

That's why the Pope ruffles so many feathers. He follows a very strict interpretation of the gospels. And he's right. That is what Christianity really is. Give away your wealth and go help the poor. It's very radical.

This Pope is questioning a lot of people's so called Faith. And a lot of people really don't like it.