Colombia's poor won't value free housing: Giuliani .

[Judi Lynn]

Source: Colombia Reports

Colombia's poor won't value free housing: Giuliani .
Friday, 15 June 2012 15:25 Seth Robbins

Former New York mayor Rudolph Giuliani indirectly criticized the Colombian president’s plan to give 100,000 houses to the country’s poorest citizens, saying that people do not value objects they obtain free of charge.

Warning that he does not know the full details of Colombian President Juan Manuel Santos’ plan, Giuliani, speaking at a conference in Cartagena Friday, said that “people only value what they earn,” local news media reported.

~snip~
Giuliani said the key to helping poorer families is to offer them work that allows them to earn income for housing, calling handouts “disrespectful," according to Portafolio.co.

“Reward them if they evolve and earn a place in society through effort,” Giuliani said. “And take away the benefits if otherwise.”

Read more: http://colombiareports.com/colombia-news/news/24630-colombias-poor-wont-value-free-housing-giuliani.html

[malthaussen]

1. Oh, I dunno, Rudi-baby

Most of us value our lives. And they were sure-enough free.

-- Mal

[marmar]

2. Only handouts to corporations and those who think they're entitled to all they've stolen.....

...... are acceptable to this miserable wretched egomaniac disgraced former mayor.

[Kalidurga]

3. It is so rare to hear certain types criticize brutal regimes...

but give the poor a place to live now that is disrespectful. I am surprised he didn't try to go before a human rights commission to complain.

[ashling]

4. Giuliani is such a pompous waste of oxygen

If the Columbian president came here and said we should be housing the poor not only would he be right, but Giuliani would have a hissy fit about how arrogant he was being.

[Mosaic]

17. Ok we need to correct your spelling of Colombia

Spain sent Colon. Colombia took the Italian spelling. Us idiots in this continent mispell it often. It's time to get respect for Colombia or shut the hell up!

His name in Italian is Cristoforo Colombo and in Spanish it is Cristóbal Colón.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Columbus

[JDPriestly]

19. Yes. Colombia is the S. American country. Columbia, the gem of the ocean, is the U.S.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia,_the_Gem_of_the_Ocean

Columbia, the gem of the ocean was, apparently, a civil war anthem. It's childish, I suppose, but I've always loved the song.

It's easy to confuse this.

[Lars77]

5. "Earn a place in society"

In other words, poor people do not deserve a place in society unless they work their way out of it with no help.

This is typical right wing thinking. There is no society, just individuals. Therefore poor people deserve to be poor, because it is only their own flawed character that is to blame.

[treestar]

38. It is very cruel

PLenty of people are BORN with a place in society, such as the children of the rich and powerful. Why don't they have to "earn" it? Everyone deserves a place in society. Guilani inadvertently shows the true Republican heartlessness - they want there to be people are who left out of society so they can enjoy being in it.

[Ken Burch]

6. I'd be a little more impressed with his arguement

if Rudy had ever done anything to create employment for the poor in NYC. All he ever did was send them to jail.

[nobodyspecial]

7. He obviously does not know how hard it is to be poor

When you simply can't buy things, you have to work twice as hard and use even more ingenuity just to get by.

Perhaps if people had houses, they would have enough stability to focus on succeeding in work. Imagine trying to make it through a day at work when you did not have a safe, comfortable place to get a good night's sleep, place to store clean clothes, take a shower and brush your teeth or eat and prepare nutritious meals that will get you through the day.

[Enrique]

8. Santos's response to Giuliani

"who are you again?"

[robinlynne]

9. fine. Then ban estates. period. let them earn it. How about everything over

a million dollars per person goes directly to the government?

[Marie Marie]

14. That was a perfect response.

Robinlynne - take a bow!

[4th law of robotics]

32. I happen to think inherited money *ought* to be taxed heavily

I have no problem with an individual earning tremendous sums of money through luck, or skill, or hard work, or whatever. But that doesn't mean they can pass it on.

Let everyone rise to the level that is appropriate based on their own skills, not their ability to choose parents.

[airplaneman]

34. How about

"I have no problem with an individual earning tremendous sums of money through luck, or skill, or hard work, or whatever."

So are you in favor of living wages and sharing the wealth or is it OK to do whatever you can so that you benefit the most and your employees benefit the least?

Not trying to be mean just asking.

-Airplane

[4th law of robotics]

39. Living wages, yes

I think the min wage ought to be tied to inflation.

Actually if I had my druthers I would say that it should be increased every year automatically by inflation. But then on alternating years either reduce the work week one hour (and increase wages additionally to cover that lost hour, so 1/40 would be an additional 2.5% on top of inflation) or increase it by say 5% (on top of inflation).

That way we gradually can work our way up to a 35 hour or so work week (to account for increases in productivity) or even less and increase the minimum wage to a very fair level but we do it gradually so there aren't mass layoffs or economic uncertainty. And it's something employers have a year to plan for: this year we'll have to account for one less hour per full time employee (or pay the overtime), next year we'll have to pay them 5% more, year after we'll have one less hour per full time employee and so on.

That seems fair to me. Obviously we'd have to stop at some point (we shouldn't work our way down to a 0 hour work week). But for the next decade or two to account for stagnant wages and high level of hours worked.

And as for sharing the wealth, how do you mean? Better education, transportation, health, and the like? Sure. Just flat out handouts? That I am less in favor of.

[airplaneman]

40. I appreciated the reply.

I like you ideas. In the 70's there were far fewer millionaires and companies were happy with 6 or 10 percent profit and they were willing to share the wealth with the employees. Then along came outsourcing, creative banking, derivatives, and major greed. Now 30 to 50 percent profit is the norm and companies are no longer willing to share with the employees. Add to that is the fact that productivity has gotten a lot more efficient with technology and the whole norm of who gets the wealth has changed. Taxes have gotten a lot more unfair 50 percent of individuals and 67 percent of corporations pay no taxes. Those in power have made it very difficult for those not in power to get in. Laws now favor the rich and there is no transparency in medicine for profit. I am not proposing free handouts but we need to address all of these items, and more, so that the playing field is more fair for the masses. Every law affects the distribution of wealthy - I want to see the law benefit society as a whole and not specifically the rich. Taxes need to be broad-based and fair to the masses including a tax on all derivative and stock trades. The money should be used for the benefit of society as a whole including infrastructure, medicine, education, and social safety nets to name a few.
-Airplane

[rocktivity]

10. They'll be more likely to value what they have

with the kinds of jobs and wages that will allow them to upkeep and maintain housing worth having.

P.S. "Reward them if they evolve?" What are they, monkeys? And are they supposed to sleep in the street in the meantime? Give them what they need, a way for them to keep it, and evict the ones who aren't interested in doing their share!


rocktivity

[tabatha]

11. I guess bribery and corruption are "earning".

Maybe that is the way he regarded his first wife - a handout.

[siligut]

12. RW meme, it absolves them of giving charity to those who really need it.

He can rationalize it all he wants, but the truth is, he thinks people are poor because that is what they deserve.

[KG]

13. piss on Giuliani

[Catherina]

15. Wow. n/t

[Eljo_Don]

16. Giuliani

People like Giuliani caused the French revolution.

[pennylane100]

18. This is the guy that got a free place to live paid for by NYC

and if my memory serves me correctly, tried to move his girlfriend in while his wife and children were still living there. He certainly abused that handout.

[JI7]

20. delete

wrong thread

[Zoeisright]

21. Is that asshole still lurking?

What a complete douchebag. Doesn't know the details and says something stupid about it anyway. Fuck you, Giuliani, and your 9/11 messianic complex.

[jtuck004]

22. That could be a great economic development plan. It's a lot easier to "earn"

when one has a house to do it from.

[Smilo]

23. As if Guiliani knows anything

about work.

Of course, they could always do what Rudy's Dad did............

Harold Giuliani had trouble holding a job and had been convicted of felony assault and robbery and served time in Sing Sing;[5] after his release he served as an enforcer for his brother-in-law Leo D'Avanzo, who ran an organized crime operation involved in loan sharking and gambling at a restaurant in Brooklyn.[6]

Wikipedia

Guiliani POS big time.

[roody]

24. hilarious response from cross post

MiniMe (13,131 posts)

That can't possibly be the complete quote, 9-11 is not mentioned once.

[airplaneman]

25. I understand what he wants.

He wants them to work extremely long hours for poverty wages. Then sometime during the evolution they will realize it might be better to commit suicide than continue this kind of life and you know maybe things will get better for their children or some other generation if enough of them kill themselves. You could have have 800,000 people working like this and Steve Jobs will tell the President that these jobs are not coming back to the USA and pretend he is unaware that conditions are terribly bad. But besides huge profits in the USA there is also at least one Billionaire over there so it was probably a cool idea. You know if you just give them a house that might have a big enough yard to grow the food to feed a family then you wouldn't have low wages for high profits and people committing suicide for better working conditions. I mean having people housed, fed and happy, when you could be making them work 10 hours a day standing up and forbidden to talk to each other doing the same monotonous thing every day with no hope of anything ever getting better and expenses so high there is no money to send back to their family at the end of the month. Come on now what kind of a Capitalist are you? Probably one of those Pinko, Communist, Socialist, Liberal scum you hear about these days.
-I hope I don't have to do the sarcasm sign here-
-Airplane

[bemildred]

26. Selfish ass. nt

[JustAnotherGen]

27. To be expected

Of someone with a low moral character.

[joshcryer]

28. Santos has really turned out to be a really fantastic president.

Glad we have him especially when he was so often slandered as another Uribe...

[DCKit]

29. Rudy reads Dickens, and thinks Oliver is the villian. nt

[DBoon]

30. You mean the same way Mitt Romney earned his every penny by the sweat of his brow?

and was not given a cent by his family?

[lsewpershad]

31. Heartless jerk.

[Canuckistanian]

33. I've never heard a better rationalization for keeping the inheritance tax

"people do not value objects they obtain free of charge"

They're not too consistent on the logic, are they?

[Incitatus]

42. +1

Beat me to it

[Zero Division]

35. Narcissistic, elitist asshole.

I doubt Colombia's poor have much, if any, choice in the matter. Not that Giuliani would care either way. Something is deeply wrong with our society when people like Giuliani rise to positions of leadership and earn the respect of our institutions. Even worse when they're regarded as voices of moderation. What a sick joke!

[Jkid]

36. I think I found the reason why there has been no new public housing in NYC for a long time...

The illusion of work is enough to get housing or afford rent. Problem is that in order to live affordability you have to move out of NYC. Wonder why the wait lists are so long? They haven't built any new public housing.

[marias23]

37. He put the NY police force emergency response headquarters in the WTC

He knows real estate: From the man who put the NY police force's emergency response headquarters IN the WORLD TRADE CENTER!

[Incitatus]

41. What is his position on the estate tax?