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Judi Lynn

(160,545 posts)
Thu Jul 7, 2016, 08:12 PM Jul 2016

Shooting of "Mr. Phil" shocks Minnesota school colleagues

Source: Associated Press

Shooting of "Mr. Phil" shocks Minnesota school colleagues

Carla K. Johnson, Associated Press

Updated 7:03 pm, Thursday, July 7, 2016

Philando Castile put on a suit and tie to interview for a supervisory position in the school district where he had worked since he was a teenager. He told the interviewer his goal was to one day "sit on the other side of this table." His upbeat disposition won him the job.

"He stood out because he was happy, friendly and related to people well," said Katherine Holmquist-Burks, principal at J.J. Hill Montessori in St. Paul, Minnesota, who hired him to oversee the school cafeteria.


Now, colleagues and family members are trying to understand why a police officer in a St. Paul suburb fatally shot Castile, 32, after stopping his car Wednesday night. The Justice Department announced it would conduct an investigation, which Gov. Mark Dayton said would look at whether Castile's race played a role in the incident. Castile was black.

. . .

Students at the magnet school came to know him as "Mr. Phil," a gregarious man who sneaked students extra Graham crackers and other treats in the lunch line.

Read more: http://www.chron.com/news/crime/article/Shooting-of-Mr-Phil-shocks-Minnesota-school-8346774.php

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Shooting of "Mr. Phil" shocks Minnesota school colleagues (Original Post) Judi Lynn Jul 2016 OP
. Cooley Hurd Jul 2016 #1
Although there are already too many, longship Jul 2016 #2
The officer appears to be very much in the wrong Blandocyte Jul 2016 #3
No question. This was murder. fbc Jul 2016 #5
If you watch the video RoccoRyg Jul 2016 #6
MY personal opinion passiveporcupine Jul 2016 #23
Even worse -- there were multiple officers, and the one they attended to pnwmom Jul 2016 #7
That really stunned me; happened on the live feed BlancheSplanchnik Jul 2016 #10
Nauseating is a perfect word for it. calimary Jul 2016 #13
I didn't see this part...but forgotmylogin Jul 2016 #14
I don't know...it didn't sound that way from the live feed BlancheSplanchnik Jul 2016 #18
I saw the shooter standing there for literally minutes saying things like f*k pnwmom Jul 2016 #20
GEEzuss. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Jul 2016 #25
Because they have an awoke_in_2003 Jul 2016 #22
I think that's the truth. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Jul 2016 #26
I'm so sorry... whathehell Jul 2016 #4
Ohhh. I heard the story this morning on Amy Goodman, SheilaT Jul 2016 #8
^. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Jul 2016 #11
This was a cold, calculated lynching, I'm sure of it. Odin2005 Jul 2016 #9
As I mentioned in another thread, Chemisse Jul 2016 #12
Thank you passiveporcupine Jul 2016 #24
If he panicked and "feared for his life" and reflexively fired a drawn gun forgotmylogin Jul 2016 #15
Sure seems like it to me. calimary Jul 2016 #16
"paid administrative leave" is a paid vacation kiri Jul 2016 #17
"Paid Administrative Leave" forgotmylogin Jul 2016 #19
Welcome to DU, forgotmylogin. Good point, too. calimary Jul 2016 #21
Noticed by Mid Day the next day Wellstone ruled Jul 2016 #27

longship

(40,416 posts)
2. Although there are already too many,
Thu Jul 7, 2016, 08:42 PM
Jul 2016

one of these days I fear that there will be one too many after the many too many.

Then, this country may turn into chaos.

Consider what may happen with Drumpf in the White House and the pitch forks and tar and feathers come out in earnest.

This is a very scary year.

Blandocyte

(1,231 posts)
3. The officer appears to be very much in the wrong
Thu Jul 7, 2016, 08:51 PM
Jul 2016

Why didn't he try to give first aid? Hell, why not just move away to the back of the car before drawing his gun? Maybe the police department can be held liable for poor training. Tragic shit. So many lives ruined.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
5. No question. This was murder.
Thu Jul 7, 2016, 09:44 PM
Jul 2016

He should be drug tested immediately to see if steroids played a role.

RoccoRyg

(260 posts)
6. If you watch the video
Thu Jul 7, 2016, 10:26 PM
Jul 2016

You'll hear the cop swearing to himself, panicking and making excuses to the live-streaming audience. You can tell immediately that he knows he screwed up.

Even while he's doing that, he continues to aim his gun at the unarmed woman with her daughter in the back of the car. This goes beyond unprofessional... it's insanity.

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
23. MY personal opinion
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 07:33 PM
Jul 2016

He was afraid for his life the moment Phil said he had a gun. Why? Because black people are scary.

That's it. He was conditioned to think a black man with a gun was going to try to kill him.

Period.

that is racist...but it was probably something the whole police department shared in.

Does that make it right? NO. He's still guilty of manslaughter if nothing else, in my eyes. I'd say murder for racist thoughts.

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
7. Even worse -- there were multiple officers, and the one they attended to
Thu Jul 7, 2016, 10:33 PM
Jul 2016

was the shooter -- not the victim.

BlancheSplanchnik

(20,219 posts)
10. That really stunned me; happened on the live feed
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 08:37 AM
Jul 2016

of the interview/protest in front of the mayors house.

Whaaaaattttt???? Back up cops rushed to aid The Shooter??? No one attended to the woman and her kid?

Nauseating is too mild a word for all this.

calimary

(81,320 posts)
13. Nauseating is a perfect word for it.
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 10:24 AM
Jul 2016

They all hurried to him and tried to comfort him. Left HER in the back of the cop car and her fiance shot and killed in the front seat of her car. Certainly nobody was bothering to check on him.

forgotmylogin

(7,530 posts)
14. I didn't see this part...but
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 10:27 AM
Jul 2016

if "aiding" the shooter meant calming him down and de-stressing the situation so he wouldn't shoot into the car again where there was obviously an innocent child, I get it. I'm hoping at least one of them immediately called for medical backup as well.

BlancheSplanchnik

(20,219 posts)
18. I don't know...it didn't sound that way from the live feed
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 11:32 AM
Jul 2016

But that was the girlfriend being interviewed. She didn't sound like the attention to the cop was for public safety, but I guess it could have been. I dunno. Clearly though, no one gave a crap about her, her kid and her partner that had just been murdered right in her lap.

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
20. I saw the shooter standing there for literally minutes saying things like f*k
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 01:48 PM
Jul 2016

with his gun aimed at the victim while the girlfriend calmly reported what was going on. I could hear another officer saying comforting things to the shooter -- not saying "put your gun down now!"

Or not grabbing the shooter from behind and disarming him.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
8. Ohhh. I heard the story this morning on Amy Goodman,
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 02:06 AM
Jul 2016

and have since since the video on line.

Earlier he was simply an anonymous black man who was murdered. This makes it far more personal, and as if I knew him.

Which is actually the point. It's so easy to gloss over the murders of people who have no connection to us, especially if they are of a different race, ethnicity, or simply live a very long way away. But if it can be personalized, as this has, he becomes connected to me. The fact that he's black and I'm white disappears. He's a man who could have been in my life: a brother, a cousin, an in-law.

The sad thing about everything connected to "war" is that it depends on demonizing and, more importantly, dehumanizing the enemy. Without that demonizing and humanizing it's very difficult to persuade people to kill the enemy. This is why programs to bring children of "enemies" together can be effective.

Right now the bombings that have been occurring depend very tightly on that dehumanizing and demonizing. If you understand that those you want to kill are people just like you, your parents, your children, your cousins, you will find it hard to kill them. But if you can transform them into "the other" you can kill at will.

I also think there's an anthropological issue here, In our distant past we tended to live in small groups, maybe 30-40 humans. That was our core group, the ones we were most tightly affiliated with. We also hooked up on a regular basis with several other such small groups, topping out at best at a couple of hundred. Beyond that, we had no sense of affiliation, connection, or affinity. Even though in the modern world many of us belong to very large groups, I honestly think that at our core we can best connect to small groups of 30-40.

I can't think of a solution to this problem, other than education, deliberate training, helping us to understand that our core allegiance could easily be to a much larger group. Yes, many of us feel that core allegiance to the larger group, but I'd argue that most of us are still caught in the earlier, primitive stage of the much smaller group identity/allegiance. It's possible that human evolution is simply working against us here, but I hope that if enough people become aware of this problem, that it can be solvable.

Odin2005

(53,521 posts)
9. This was a cold, calculated lynching, I'm sure of it.
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 08:29 AM
Jul 2016

The officer will claim that he panicked and "feared for his life", that is BS and is the usual excuse given when the cops decide to murder a black guy they decide is too "uppity" (in this case being that Castile daring to be a black guy with a CCW permit).

Chemisse

(30,813 posts)
12. As I mentioned in another thread,
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 09:11 AM
Jul 2016

White men who legally carry a weapon are 'good guys with guns'; black men, on the other hand, are 'armed,' and inevitably 'the bad guys.'

It is pre-judging at its worst. This officer may not have done this intentionally. He and others, are allowing their prejudices to control their emotions - and their actions.

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
24. Thank you
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 07:37 PM
Jul 2016

I don't think he intended to kill him because he had a gun or because he was a black man with a gun. I think he killed him because he was a afraid a black man with a gun wanted to kill him. And that is racist profiling allowed by the police department.

This is what needs to change. This man had a legally licensed weapon and was only trying to inform the officer, so it wouldn't become an issue, and he was killed for it. Because as soon as he (a black man) said he had a gun, it WAS an issue.

And that is racism.

forgotmylogin

(7,530 posts)
15. If he panicked and "feared for his life" and reflexively fired a drawn gun
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 10:29 AM
Jul 2016

when confronted by a non-aggressive couple and child he pulls over for a busted tail light, he needs to be dismissed and banned from any profession that carries weapons whether he is prosecuted or not.

calimary

(81,320 posts)
16. Sure seems like it to me.
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 10:31 AM
Jul 2016

What I'm most afraid of is that this is another white cop, like Darren Wilson (the now-former cop who shot young Michael Brown in Ferguson MO), who will somehow wriggle out of being held to account. This guy will probably get off, too. And where's Timothy Loehmann now? He's the cop who shot that child, Tamir Rice, without even stopping to think for a moment. Has he EVER been brought to justice?

Btw - I looked up Tamir Rice on Wikipedia. You're gonna love this part:

"Police officers involved[edit]
In the aftermath of the shooting, media outlets reported on the background of the police officers involved. Both officers were placed on administrative leave.[34]

On December 28, 2015, Grand Jury returned their decision declining to indict the police officers.[35]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Tamir_Rice

kiri

(794 posts)
17. "paid administrative leave" is a paid vacation
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 11:10 AM
Jul 2016

This 'leave' is in no way a punishment or even a reprimand. Some cops actually use this on their job resumes as a sign of being tough and aggressive.

On leave, they get a paycheck, can sleep late, never go to work, fly to Hawaii---what's not to love?





forgotmylogin

(7,530 posts)
19. "Paid Administrative Leave"
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 12:14 PM
Jul 2016

When that involves a potential crime, the government should capture 70% of the employee's income and hold it until it is determined whether they are coming back to work or not. It should not be an opportunity for vacation.

calimary

(81,320 posts)
21. Welcome to DU, forgotmylogin. Good point, too.
Fri Jul 8, 2016, 03:13 PM
Jul 2016

I would HOPE that one of the many things that authorities actually do tackle is the problem of the information sharing. When that rogue cop with the control issues

( "In the aftermath of the shooting, it was reported that Timothy Loehmann, in his previous job as a police officer in the Cleveland suburb of Independence, had been deemed an emotionally unstable recruit and unfit for duty.[19]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Tamir_Rice )

can just transfer to another department or another police squad and pick up with his emotional instability and lack of fitness for duty, that does NOT solve ANYTHING!!!!!!!! That stuff HAS TO go ON that officer's record, and it HAS to be transferrable to whoever he or she is trying to get a new job with - PARTICULARLY if it's another sort of law enforcement or security-guard type job where the potential for firearm use is part of that job, or firearms are part of the equipment for that job. No gun range jobs, either! The point needs to be - people like that, who have itchy trigger fingers or short fuses or other emotional shit going on - HAVE NO BUSINESS being in jobs that include access or exposure to firearms.

That information HAS TO be on the record, in their files, and automatically transferrable from former employer to potential employer in law enforcement or security details or any of that. NOBODY with emotional instability should be employed in ANY area that involves access or exposure to guns!!!!

From the coverage of that particular story, the Tamir Rice killing, what I remember was that the new police dept Loehmann hired into - had no idea about his full background, his emotional instability, or his having been deemed unfit for duty. My memory may be faulty on that, but I do remember that was a rather strong takeaway for me, from the coverage of that tragedy. I do distinctly remember reacting - GOD! If they'd only known BEFORE they hired him!!! But it was reported as "he flamed out in the first police department, so he simply moved and applied for a job in a second police department, and minimal checking was done because he'd come from the earlier police department, so he was presumed to be okay."

Again, my memory could be faulty on that one, but then again, too, you have to consider how a lot of these police departments, and many of our law enforcement organizations are NOT interconnected and do not share info, oftentimes because they can't. They don't have the electronic infrastructure, they're not modernized in information sharing, there hasn't been the funding to bring them up to date. I have heard that SO DAMNED OFTEN about government work. The money isn't there to modernize! The funding Is NOT There! Shit, I've heard this again and again about the federal government, how their computers are old, their mainframes are old, things operate more slowly because the technology has not been upgraded or updated. Costs too much. Congress won't do anything in general and this inertia has just metastasized everywhere. And besides, nobody wants to pay taxes so there is no funding for stuff like this anyway.

Because, remember, we all need to starve the government until it shrinks down so small that we can drown it in the bathtub. You can thank that vile pile of vomit-covered shit, anti-tax hard-on grover norquist, and all his nice little republi-CON "let's keep those cuts a'comin'" apostles and disciples for that. They say money is the root of all evil? Well, funding cuts comprise another root of that same evil!

 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
27. Noticed by Mid Day the next day
Sat Jul 9, 2016, 01:46 PM
Jul 2016

the Officer was Lawyered up,and that being Tom Kelly. And reading TV interviews from local P.D's Chief and EX-Chief,something went terrible wrong with Training or Personnel Issues,or is it Might is Right and I and my men have a Badge and crap happens.

There is more here than what is being reported.

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