Joe Biden responds to criticism after calling Pence a 'decent guy'

[pnwmom]

Last edited Fri Mar 1, 2019, 04:49 AM - Edit history (3)

Source: CNN

Former Vice President Joe Biden responded to criticism Thursday after he called Vice President Mike Pence a "decent guy" during a speech in Omaha, a comment that frustrated some on the left because of Pence's position on LGBTQ rights.

Biden's comments about Pence came as he discussed foreign policy and how the international community had reacted to Pence during the vice president's speech at the Munich Security Conference earlier in February.

"The fact of the matter is it was followed on by a guy who's a decent guy, our vice president, who stood before this group of allies and leaders and said, 'I'm here on behalf of President Trump,' and there was dead silence. Dead silence," Biden recounted Thursday at the Chuck Hagel Forum in Global Leadership at the University of Nebraska at Omaha.

The "decent guy" comment prompted a round of criticism on Twitter. Actress and activist Cynthia Nixon tweeted, ".@JoeBiden you've just called America's most anti-LGBT elected leader 'a decent guy.' Please consider how this falls on the ears of our community."

Read more: https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/28/politics/joe-biden-mike-pence-decent-guy-criticize-respond/index.html

---

Joe Biden is a decent guy, so he projects his decency on everyone else. Unfortunately, not everyone deserves the label. This is how we ended up with Clarence Thomas on the Supreme Court. Joe Biden viewed him, and all the rest of the members of the Senate Judiciary Committee, as fundamentally decent men. So he didn't do everything he could have done to prevent him from being seated on SCOTUS.

And so now he views someone as extremist as Mike Pence as a decent guy.

Is it possible to be a decent person if, in 2019, you STILL oppose LGBT rights? Not in my opinion.



https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/02/10/mike-pence-gay-cure-therapy-fact-check-lgbt-rights/

[div class"excerpt"]There's also evidence dating to Pence's time as Governor of Indiana between 2013 and 2017.

While serving as Governor, Pence signed Indiana's controversial 'Religious Freedom Restoration Act', a law which allows religious people and businesses to cite their conscience as a defence in legal disputes.

Activists warned the law would be used by individuals and businesses to legally discriminate against the LGBT community on the basis of religion.

And Pence was fairly clear that the law was intended to "protect" organisations who wanted to refuse services to same-sex couples.

He said: "I support the freedom of religion for every Hoosier of every faith.

[TeamPooka]

1. Say it ain't so Joe! He's been giving too many GOPers props recently

Biden needs some conversion therapy to re-embrace his Democratic roots.
It's not 1992 and these ain't the same Republicans that he served with for many years.
The current GOP is crazy and Joe doesn't seem to get it.
This is why we need to look forward with our candidate in 2020, not backwards.

Harris 2020

[msongs]

2. Im hoping joe will continue to enjoy his well earned retirement from elected public office nt

[LittleGirl]

3. same here eom

[TeamPooka]

4. agreed. if he stays retired then fine be the across the aisle guy but we need a warrior in 2020

a warrior that gives no quarter.

[LittleGirl]

5. I think he's served our country well

and I like Joe a lot.
I am almost 60 so I want the younger generation to lead us going forward. We old white people need to help those up the ladder to success and let their idea shape our future.

[NotHardly]

34. He needs to stay retired ... obvioursly... he's become tone deaf

[workinclasszero]

51. Yes he needs to retire with all the good feelings he has garnered over the years

He is going to ruin all that if he steps into the ring and runs.

It's already happened with this terrible misstep about Pence unfortunately.

[CrispyQ]

23. Agreed.

These decades old friendships are part of the dems problem. They view their GOP counterparts as basically decent human beings with differences in opinion. That may have been the case in the past, but not any longer. The GOP actively works against representative government. They believe & have pushed policies that prove this belief, that only some people deserve to vote - mostly white, rich people. Representative government was fine as long as the uppity women & people of color kept to their place.

The dems need to wake up. The GOP is the enemy of the People. This is a fight for a government of, by, & for the People.

[thegoose]

28. Bingo

There's no way to have any of that "hands across the aisle" bullshit today. Pukes are pure, unmitigated evil. Period.

[workinclasszero]

52. Agree 100%

We are in a fight for freedom and democracy themselves which the GOP works daily on destroying.

There are ZERO decent republicans in my book. They are no longer a political party. They are a fascist cult that will break any law and any bounds of decency to force their idiot evil ways on the American public!

[Me.]

30. Precisely

What he can't seem to understand is...they are not his friends and wouldn't treat him with the same respect. They will also do, what they have in the past, and use this in an ad to promote Pence just as they did to get another GOPer elected to Congress.

[Honeycombe8]

6. It seems like he meant "decent" in that he's not like Trump.

Pathological lies, con man, vulgar, name-calling, etc. When you look at his sentence, that's the way it seems to me.

One of those people (or the OP?) says Biden thinking everyone is decent is how we ended up with Clarence Thomas on the Supreme Court. But Biden voted against confirming Thomas.

[pnwmom]

7. Biden voted against confirming Thomas -- AFTER preventing Anita's corroborating witnesses

from testifying publicly before the committee. (As the chair, it was his decision.) His excuse? That he had promised the Republicans that the hearing would end on XX date, so there was no more time to have those women testify.

But he DID have time earlier in the hearing to have some Rethug witness testify that Anita had a syndrome called "erotomania."

[Honeycombe8]

21. Those who voted for Thomas were going to vote for him, no matter what.

A conservative Af. American was hard to find, and they were determined to get him in the Court.

You can parse how somehow chairs a committee, after the fact. I watched almost the whole hearing. He went overboard being nicey nicey to the Republicans and Thomas, but I didn't see anything he did wrong.

Part of the problem is when women pop up years after the event, so it's hard to discern the facts. Had this been known about him before, he may never have been nominated. I am a woman and take the offenses personally and know what she's talking about. I also know the men back then didn't take these things seriously, or even wonder why she had a problem with the things Thomas said to her. Still, he did a decent job at chairing the hearings.

[pnwmom]

37. The Democrats on the committee held the majority, so if enough pressure had been brought to bear,

especially through creditable witnesses, the outcome could have been different.

As it is, Biden let Anita Hill down when he refused to call those women -- who didn't just "pop up" years later. We heard about them at the time, and I couldn't understand why they weren't being called. The implication was that they had changed their minds -- which was the wrong implication. They hadn't.

And yes, he played "nicey nicey" with the Republicans -- and that's what I'm talking about. Some people would like a return to that era but it won't be happening. And even if the Dems all began to be "nicey nicey," the R's would just take advantage of it to roll over us.

[Honeycombe8]

38. I disagree.

They were going to vote to confirm the first Af. American nominated to be on the S.Ct., unless he had been shown to have been guilty of a felony...something like that.

These were all men, remember. All white men on the committee. They could not understand the Anita Hill allegations for what they were (I'm sure they were perplexed, since "all he did was maybe talk a little dirty to her, if that" ), and they did not want to be responsible for not letting the first Af. American get on the S.Ct.

I suspect that some of the votes for no would have changed to yes, if they didn't know the votes were there to confirm.

We can't know. But you can't blame Biden. He chaired the committee and chaired fairly and respectfully to everyone. He voted no. Blame the ones who voted to confirm.

[pnwmom]

39. Biden himself said he believed Thomas wouldn't have been confirmed if Wright had been allowed

to testify.

Do you not believe Biden?

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/schuster-institute-for-investigative-journalism/what-they-didnt-tell-you-_b_5070620.html

Another witness was waiting to testify against Thomas, with information that could have helped corroborate Hill’s allegations. But Angela Wright, then a North Carolina journalist who had been subpoenaed by the Senate Judiciary Committee and left waiting in a Washington hotel for three days, was never called to testify.

SNIP

In 1994, Florence George Graves cleared up those mysteries in the Washington Post, revealing the intricate — and bipartisan — behind-the-scenes maneuvering by several Senate Judiciary Committee members to discourage Wright’s testimony. The article, entitled “The Other Woman,” uncovered a surprising agreement among top Republicans and Democrats not to call Wright, apparently because they feared either that her testimony would create even greater political chaos or that it would doom Thomas’ nomination.

The article also revealed evidence suggesting that Thomas lied to the Committee. Several senators — including then-Republican Senator Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania, then-Senator Joe Biden (D-Del.), and several other key senators — told Graves they believed that if Wright had testified, Thomas would not have been confirmed to the Supreme Court, where he has repeatedly voted to narrow the scope of sexual harassment law.

[Honeycombe8]

40. That's his belief. I believe differently.

We see things differently.

I'm convinced that the white males were going to confirm Thomas, unless something was proven that showed something criminal he'd done. And the charges by Hill were not criminal at the time, even if proven true. He didn't touch her, make her do anything to keep her job, etc. He said some dirty things a couple of times.

We need only look at the Kavanaugh hearing to see what happens, even when it's proven true.

I don't blame Biden at all and don't see how anyone can, any more than Cummings is responsible for the way the Republicans acted during the open Cohen hearing.

What matters was his vote. Biden voted not to confirm Thomas. That's all I care about regarding that subject.

[pnwmom]

41. You don't see how anyone can? Well, Anita Hill gives Biden a share of the blame, and she was there.

She knows what he did and what he failed to do.

And Rep. Patricia Schroeder and Senator Barbara Mikulski also criticized his handling of the hearing.

He was in charge of how the Committee hearings were run, and he made the final decision not to call three women who would have corroborated Anita. He also refused to call a panel of expert witnesses to educate the all-male Senate panel about sexual harassment.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/10/anita-hill-testimony-crime-bill-haunt-biden-2020.html

After the hearings, as well as years later, Hill and other women’s rights advocates expressed dismay that Biden did not call a panel of expert witnesses to inform the committee of 14 men about the pressure women felt to keep such incidents to themselves for so many years — their fear of reprisals, that men in power wouldn’t care, that women simply had no choice.

https://www.salon.com/2017/11/22/anita-hill-still-blames-joe-biden-for-the-clarence-thomas-disaster/

Anita Hill still blames Joe Biden for the Clarence Thomas disaster


Although Biden did succeed in getting a delay in the hearing so that Hill would have time to testify, other aspects of his conduct aroused more controversy. Here's what Rep. Patricia Schroeder, D-Colo., had to say:

We went to see Biden, because we were so frustrated by it. And he literally kind of pointed his finger and said, you don’t understand how important one’s word was in the Senate, that he had given his word to [Sen. John Danforth (R-Mo.), Thomas’s chief sponsor] in the men’s gym that this would be a very quick hearing, and he had to get it out before Columbus Day.

Sen. Barbara Mikulski, D-Md., also recalled that while Biden may not have planned to attack Hill, he stood by and allowed his Republican colleagues to do so:

With the traditions of the Senate and the committee, Biden thought he was going to conduct a hearing, but the Republicans knew — led by Arlen Specter — that they were going to conduct a trial. And Professor Hill would be the one on trial.

[Vinca]

14. He's abetting Trump which, in some ways, is even worse. Pence is not "decent."

[oldsoftie]

16. I read it the same way; as a dig at Trump.

[saidsimplesimon]

8. pnwmom, I logged it just to

comment on your post. Well, also because I have had some things on my mind about Former VP Biden for some time now.

My first concern is the number of candidates in the primary race. My reason is that a candidate could win our primary with a minority of Democrats who support them. This situation favors candidates like Senator Sanders and Former VP Biden, imo. This concern may disappear as candidates drop out before the primary for lack of funds or support. I remain undecided because there are so many qualified candidates on my plate that it will require me do more research and create the dreaded spread sheet titled the best choice.

I did not pay attention (lazy) to the reforms made in party rules as it relates to the power of super delegates to override the will of the party electorate should a candidate like tRump win the primaries.

My second concern is evidenced by Joe's comments in the OP. Mr. Biden is notorious for frequent, unforced political and messaging errors.

[pnwmom]

9. Yeah, unfortunately many people love him for the same quality that can get him into trouble.

He seems to want to get along with everybody, no matter what. And it's important to be able to get along with people . . . but there's a limit.

[saidsimplesimon]

10. Getting along with everyone comment above

I agree

[oldsoftie]

17. But Biden sits at the top of the polls even though he hasnt declared.

The scenario of someone winning with a minority doesnt seem too plausible, because the lower tiered candidates wont be able to afford to continue a campaign if they're not winning primaries. Biden winning wouldnt be with a minority, as he's already favored by many. But he needs to make up his mind.

[pnwmom]

43. Democrats have fond memories of the Obama years. n/t

[oldsoftie]

44. But wasnt he a top candidate from the start?

I remember telling my mom, after watching his speech at the '04 convention, "Hillary is going to have trouble beating this guy in '08"

[pnwmom]

45. It never seemed that way to me.

He started to run for President in 1987, but got derailed by a plagiarism issue.

The Anita Hill hearings were in 1991, and left millions of women deeply unimpressed.

He ran again for President in 2008 and quickly had a major gaffe involving Obama. He dropped out after his 5th place in the Iowa caucuses. (And Obama helped heal the party by asking Biden to be his running mate and Hillary to be SoS.)

But on the same day that Biden launched his campaign in January of 2007, he spent much of the day trying to clear up a gaffe, after he described then-rival Obama as the “first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy” during an interview with the New York Observer.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/happened-times-joe-biden-deciding-run-president/story?id=34605046

[oldsoftie]

47. Oh i'm sorry, i thought you were referring to Obama !!

[still_one]

11. Funny, Sanders said similar things about trump supporters, he campaigned for an anti-abortion rights

Democrat in Nebraska, and wouldn't characterize someone who wouldn't vote for an African American Candidate in the midterms as racist, solely because they were black, using the excuse that instead it was because the "felt uncomfortable for the first time in their lives about whether or not they wanted to vote for an African-American"

Forget get the fact that Biden was way ahead of many, including President Obama on gay rights

You want to slam Biden, then to be consistent you might as well slam Obama and Sanders. Of course while we are at it we need to go after Klobuchar for the way she treated her staff, Warren for the Native American word parsing, the maturity of Beto instagraming the cleaning of his teeth, etc. etc. etc

Is Pence anti-gay and homophobic? Absolutely. Does Biden agree with Pence on those views? Absolutely NOT.

Cynthia Nixon, please tell us how to win elections, you did so well in yours.

While we are at it let's get a few more candidates running in our primary, many duplicating each other on the same issues, jump on anyone of those candidates if they say something that isn't inflammatory against the opposition, and see what happens?

I am more and more convinced we are going to have a brokered convention, and while some may think that is a good thing, let's see how well that works out for us in 2020

We don't need trump or the f**king republicans, we have each other

[dsc]

13. would Biden, or any one else, call a politician who defended his wife working

at a school that refused to serve or employ Blacks a decent man? The answer is of course not. So why is that OK when Black is replaced by LGBT?

[workinclasszero]

53. Good question

[Honeycombe8]

24. Excellent examples. Is there anyone pure enough? Perfect enough?

Who says exactly what each and every liberal voter wants him/her to say?

I'm looking for an ability to go toe to toe w/someone like Trump, experienced or having shown an adeptness to be fast on the feet in responding to insults and lies, likable (i.e., having people skills), and the like.

If I wanted perfection, I'd never be able to vote for anyone. Even Obama, with all his qualities and charisma, wasn't perfect.

Really, if this is the biggest complaint about Biden, he's doing pretty well. I have some concerns about Biden, and they're a lot more important than this, IMO.

[still_one]

26. this was Biden's response...................................

"You're right, Cynthia. I was making a point in a foreign policy context, that under normal circumstances a Vice President wouldn't be given a silent reaction on the world stage," he said. "But there is nothing decent about being anti-LGBTQ rights, and that includes the Vice President."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/28/politics/joe-biden-mike-pence-decent-guy-criticize-respond/index.html

[Honeycombe8]

27. Just as I thought. That's how I read it.

That Pence wasn't to blame for the lack of response by the crowd after Pence relayed Trump's greetings.

I'm getting tired of the petty complaints against the various candidates or possible candidates. This was petty, IMO. There are legitimate issues with Biden and all the others. All of them. But not something like this.

[oldsoftie]

48. And as the years, go by its going to get worse. As every part of one's life is on the internet.

And ripe for criticism. Candidates who were born in the 90s are going to see it. From the time they could walk they've had a phone & internet. Couple that with the fact that some people think everyone HAS to be perfect (doesnt apply to them though) & some great people are going to stay out of races all around the country.

[pnwmom]

46. I think with so many candidates it's not very likely one will head into the convention

with a majority.

So, yes, we might end up with a brokered convention.

[JonLP24]

49. Biden said Obama was clean looking articulate African American

Hillary Clinton noted her support among working class whites in 2008 and said you can't win without them if you're a Democrat

Clinton rejected any idea that her emphasis on white voters could be interpreted as racially divisive. "These are the people you have to win if you're a Democrat in sufficient numbers to actually win the election. Everybody knows that."

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-05-07-clintoninterview_N.htm

The midterm quote is taken out of context. He corrected the reporter and blamed the loss on racism from Desantis campaign.

Link to tweet

[yerop]

12. "Joe Biden is a decent guy, so he projects his decency on everyone else." Good point.

I think he's a little bit too nice to be president. We need a Dem that's ready to go gangbusters on the RW/GOP. Having said that, if he was the candidate I'd vote for Biden in a heartbeat.

[comradebillyboy]

35. Yes Joe is much too accommodating of republican shenanigans.

[thesquanderer]

15. Missing context...

Biden's response to the criticism:

"You're right, Cynthia. I was making a point in a foreign policy context, that under normal circumstances a Vice President wouldn't be given a silent reaction on the world stage," he said. "But there is nothing decent about being anti-LGBTQ rights, and that includes the Vice President."

In a bigger context, virtually every Republican currently in congress has taken positions and/or voted to support terrible and arguably immoral (and Trump-aligned) policies, whether on LGBT rights or gun control or immigration or women's health... Are we at the point where if any Dem candidate declares any Republican in Congress to be a "decent" person, s/he is disqualified from being our nominee?

[littlemissmartypants]

18. Lie down with dogs, wake up with fleas, Joe.

[TheCowsCameHome]

19. Pence is not a decent guy.

Period.

[KPN]

20. Pence is in no way a "decent guy". That's like saying bigots are decent people. They are not.

I like Joe Biden a lot. But what I like about him is his personality and decency. He is someone I would enjoy having a beer with. But it's this kind of attitude that makes him a non-starter for me going into 2020.

Joe is just too willing to compromise on values in order to achieve a semblance of camaraderie in DC in my view. That is exactly how we got to where we are today: a white supremacist, misogynistic P; a bigoted religious zealot as VP, Gorsuch/Kavanaugh on the SC, and supercharged inequality in America.

Cooperation and compromise only works when both sides do it. That hasn't been the case for decades now.

[Kashkakat v.2.0]

22. Oh here we go with the little snippets of words taken out of context. By my guess this is 90% of

what passes for politics these days. Reallly tired of it.

[Honeycombe8]

25. +1. nt

[Doodley]

29. If we are to win Republican votes, Biden looks like the ONLY person to do it.

[harumph]

31. Decent with this crop of republicans means

they don't eat babies

...

in public.


...and they know their salad fork from a dinner fork.

[comradebillyboy]

36. +++

[Gothmog]

32. Joe is a good man and I would likely support him if he runs

[stonecutter357]

33. Joe Biden 2020 !

[Yeehah]

42. Joe is definitely too "middle of the aisle" for me

It's time to fight the republi-nazis, not kiss their asses.

[workinclasszero]

50. How could you say this evil bastard is a "decent guy" Joe???

Pence Goes Wild at CPAC: Democrats Stand For ‘Late-Term Abortion and Infanticide and a Culture of Death’
by Ken Meyer | Mar 1st, 2019, 3:30 pm

Vice President Mike Pence used his speech at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) Friday to tear into Democrats and accuse the left of “infanticide and a culture of death” with their positions on abortion.

After lauding President Donald Trump as the most pro-life president in American history, Pence turned towards “the radical agenda of abortion on demand” supposedly becoming mainstream among Democrats.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/pence-goes-wild-at-cpac-democrats-stand-for-late-term-abortion-and-infanticide-and-a-culture-of-death/

That shows an appalling lack of judgement on Joe's part IMO. Really sad.

[R B Garr]

54. Did you even watch the speech where Biden made that

comment? You are trying to take it completely out of context here. It was an excellent foreign policy speech and the comment was barely noticeable. Biden is a former VP, and he was talking about his successor and the segue to yet more criticism of Trump/Pence was a slight comment about Pence.

It’s amazing that people are going off on tangents for something they haven’t seen. The foreign policy speech was about a lack of presidential leadership and the dire consequences it has caused. It was an excellent speech.

[R B Garr]

55. Biden's entire speech was a long-running criticism of Trump/Pence

The foreign policy speech was about the failure of presidential leadership. It was an excellent speech. The comment came as a brief seque when he was trying not to demean the office of VP since he was a former VP. It was a barely noticeable comment.

His entire speech was critical. It looks like people haven’t watched the speech.