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Omaha Steve

(99,663 posts)
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 04:54 PM Jan 2021

Senate rejects GOP motion to dismiss Trump impeachment trial

Source: AP

By LISA MASCARO and MARY CLARE JALONICK

WASHINGTON (AP) — The Senate has rejected a Republican attempt to dismiss Donald Trump’s historic second impeachment trial, a vote that allows the case on “incitement of insurrection” to move forward but also foreshadows that there may not be enough votes to convict him.

The 55-45 procedural vote to set aside an objection from Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul puts the Senate on record as declaring the proceedings constitutional and means the trial on Trump’s impeachment, the first ever of a former president, will begin as scheduled the week of Feb. 8. The House impeached him two weeks ago for inciting deadly riots in the Capitol on Jan. 6 when he told his supporters to “fight like hell” to overturn his election defeat.

At the same time, it shows it is unlikely there will be enough votes for conviction, which requires the support of all Democrats and 17 Republicans, or two-thirds of the Senate. While most Republicans criticized Trump shortly after the attack, many of them have rushed to defend him in the trial, showing the former president’s enduring sway over the GOP.

“If more than 34 Republicans vote against the constitutionality of the proceeding, the whole thing’s dead on arrival,” Paul said shortly before the vote.” Paul said Democrats “probably should rest their case and present no case at all.”



In this image from video, Sen. Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., the president pro tempore of the Senate, who is presiding over the impeachment trial of former President Donald Trump, swears in members of the Senate for the impeachment trial at the U.S. Capitol in Washington, Tuesday, Jan. 26, 2021. (Senate Television via AP)


Read more: https://apnews.com/article/trump-impeachment-senate-eeff16bd40a4fe3b65b5efc9f1582289

55 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Senate rejects GOP motion to dismiss Trump impeachment trial (Original Post) Omaha Steve Jan 2021 OP
Oof. bearsfootball516 Jan 2021 #1
Well, they will have to stand trial with their constituents. This trial puts them on trial. lagomorph777 Jan 2021 #15
Exactly... put the entire party on trial. Zoonart Jan 2021 #45
and this suggests trump will not be convicted, the importance of the trial still_one Jan 2021 #2
Exactly. This is all about showing the public. They are the real jurors. nt SunSeeker Jan 2021 #9
and I would add for the historical record also still_one Jan 2021 #12
True. nt SunSeeker Jan 2021 #13
+1 The GOP is on trial here, not only Trump. lagomorph777 Jan 2021 #16
Absolutely still_one Jan 2021 #35
Yup...there will be witnesses this time. Lucky Luciano Jan 2021 #37
I hope so still_one Jan 2021 #38
We have to many issues that require immediate attention Brown Feather Jan 2021 #3
Punting it to the DOJ, will open up the possibility that a Trump appointed judge ... aggiesal Jan 2021 #26
Let's see what happens. At least this time, truth will out. (Nt) FreepFryer Jan 2021 #4
Republicans really don't want to be forced to vote on the impeachment charges Zorro Jan 2021 #5
Fascism will help them in the primary; democracy (usually) in the general election. lagomorph777 Jan 2021 #18
Overt fascism can at least be argued against... AntiFascist Jan 2021 #20
Putin is in trouble at home now. He can't save them anymore. lagomorph777 Jan 2021 #21
Let's hope! n/t AntiFascist Jan 2021 #22
The Senate GOP seems to think ignoring two impeachment trials won't damage them. FreepFryer Jan 2021 #6
So 45 Republicans Just voted that the President can do ANYTHING in their last weeks! mackdaddy Jan 2021 #7
More like 45 voted this way to blunt a future Trump attack. cstanleytech Jan 2021 #33
The fact that Republicans tried to dismiss the trial shows that they don't care what Trump did sakabatou Jan 2021 #8
Congress was the target! VP Pence, one of their own! Still no brains? bucolic_frolic Jan 2021 #23
They can't proclaim to be the party of Law and Order now. Lock him up. Jan 2021 #46
Trump must be forced to admit he lost torius Jan 2021 #10
Even if he did admit he lost.................. secondwind Jan 2021 #34
How come everyone just skips over the criminal culpability Trump has for theneworiginal Jan 2021 #55
Republicans love the contradictions of an impeachment: no_hypocrisy Jan 2021 #11
What Five? ConstanceCee Jan 2021 #14
Toomey, Collins, Sasse, Murkowski and Romney, I think nt sweetloukillbot Jan 2021 #17
You're correct Native Jan 2021 #19
The 5 GOP votes were: Collins, Murkowski, Romney, Toomey, Sasse That is, the votes thought to most riversedge Jan 2021 #24
45 members of the jury voted to dismiss the case given everything thats gone on. Mr. Sparkle Jan 2021 #25
Maybe a group of Repubs will find a reason to not be present that day. n/t FSogol Jan 2021 #27
Gotta wash (that tRump right outta) their hair that day. /nt flibbitygiblets Jan 2021 #31
and Shame on the 45 who stuck with Paul. riversedge Jan 2021 #28
"Democrats "probably should rest their case and present no case at all." Yeah, I'm sure Nitram Jan 2021 #29
" it shows it is unlikely there will be enough votes" Not necessarily. cstanleytech Jan 2021 #30
+1000 Most of their supports are ignorant of how gubmint works, feels like a win-win. flibbitygiblets Jan 2021 #32
Assuming my rough math is right I think it's something cstanleytech Jan 2021 #36
Yep Gives them cover and that also allows the "evidence" to change their mind Lucinda Jan 2021 #42
Convict him or not, I don't care. Get their vote on record. keithbvadu2 Jan 2021 #39
Well Mr. Paul here's the thing; Dyedinthewoolliberal Jan 2021 #40
The number doesnt foreshadow anything. It lets the GOP have room to change their Lucinda Jan 2021 #41
Is there any way to get the ex-president impeachment constitutionality question in front of SCOTUS? Shermann Jan 2021 #43
Why would Trump's side want to do that they'd lose. It's constitutional. n/t PoliticAverse Jan 2021 #44
Right. So how do the Democrats get the question in front of SCOTUS? Shermann Jan 2021 #47
Unless a Democrat challenges the constitutionality and takes it to the court PoliticAverse Jan 2021 #49
Not unless he's convicted, no. FBaggins Jan 2021 #48
I don't think they'd find it to be a 'political question' I think they'd simply find the impeachment PoliticAverse Jan 2021 #50
it's great to see so many GOP senators that won't fulfill their oath mdbl Jan 2021 #51
REE-JECted! LudwigPastorius Jan 2021 #52
Shouldn't the 45.. ahimsa Jan 2021 #53
The five that did not vote to dismiss question everything Jan 2021 #54

Zoonart

(11,870 posts)
45. Exactly... put the entire party on trial.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:25 PM
Jan 2021

More will be revealed between now and Feb. 9th. Indictments are supposedly coming in this week for the most egregious acts by the mob.

still_one

(92,242 posts)
2. and this suggests trump will not be convicted, the importance of the trial
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 04:58 PM
Jan 2021

will be for the American public to see exactly what happened, and what the Republican Party really is

Lucky Luciano

(11,257 posts)
37. Yup...there will be witnesses this time.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 07:04 PM
Jan 2021
https://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/el-chapo-outraged-that-his-trial-included-witnesses



FLORENCE, Colorado (The Borowitz Report)—The convicted drug lord known as El Chapo said on Thursday that he was “outraged” his 2019 trial had included witnesses. He also revealed that he was demanding a new trial without them.

Speaking from ADX Florence, a maximum-security facility in Colorado, the former drug kingpin complained that his trial would have resulted in a speedy acquittal had it not been for the irritating presence of witnesses.

“If I had to point to one reason why I was convicted of all of those crimes, it would have to be witnesses,” he said. “Once the decision was made to include witnesses, things really went downhill for me.”

El Chapo said that, at the time of his trial, he had been totally unaware that it was possible to have a trial without any witnesses at all.

“I didn’t know that was a thing,” he said. “If someone had told me that you could have a witness-free trial, that’s the route I would have gone, for sure.”

The former criminal mastermind said that he was now actively seeking a new trial without witnesses because, in his opinion, “witnesses ruin everything.”

“For the good of the country, it’s time to move on,” he said.

 

Brown Feather

(71 posts)
3. We have to many issues that require immediate attention
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:01 PM
Jan 2021

Trying to convince 12 more RETUGS is only eating time, time much better devoted to the economy and COVID relief. Toss the Orange Meanace off to the DOJ to deal with!

aggiesal

(8,919 posts)
26. Punting it to the DOJ, will open up the possibility that a Trump appointed judge ...
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:27 PM
Jan 2021

could hear the case.

He committed crimes as a pResident and was impeached while pResident.
This is a Congressional matter.

What the case has to lay out that Pendejo45 conspired to other turn the election and
if there is some evidence that the WH or campaign directly communicated and financially supported
the insurgents, 12 more Senators should be easily swayed.
Or their constituents will force them to sway towards conviction.

Zorro

(15,740 posts)
5. Republicans really don't want to be forced to vote on the impeachment charges
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:02 PM
Jan 2021

They're damned if they do, and damned if they don't.

Time to get them on the record on whether they support democracy or fascism. (Although we already know the answer to that.)

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
18. Fascism will help them in the primary; democracy (usually) in the general election.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:41 PM
Jan 2021

Or you could state it inversely; damned either way.

AntiFascist

(12,792 posts)
20. Overt fascism can at least be argued against...
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:56 PM
Jan 2021

the real problem is the hidden fascist agenda of Putin's government: sponsoring all the crazy social media conspiracy theories and anti-Democratic crap that is stirring up the Trumpist idiots, plus the influx of dark money that is undoubtedly supporting GOP campaign efforts. Republicans are clinging to this Putin-sponsored lifeboat in a last ditch effort to save their party, sinking the US in the process.

FreepFryer

(7,077 posts)
6. The Senate GOP seems to think ignoring two impeachment trials won't damage them.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:02 PM
Jan 2021

They are very wrong. The Dred Scott party is fucked.

mackdaddy

(1,527 posts)
7. So 45 Republicans Just voted that the President can do ANYTHING in their last weeks!
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:05 PM
Jan 2021

Good to Know.

So Basically there is NO impeachment of a president during those last weeks.

Fuck them.

cstanleytech

(26,299 posts)
33. More like 45 voted this way to blunt a future Trump attack.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:49 PM
Jan 2021

Then assuming they want to secretly get rid of him they can simply have enough of the ones that voted not to proceed to boycott the trial.
That then lowers the number of total senators present to vote to reach the 2/3 that is needed to convict.

Lock him up.

(6,934 posts)
46. They can't proclaim to be the party of Law and Order now.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:27 PM
Jan 2021
If they ever claim that again, they will get laughed at in their hypocrite faces.

torius

(1,652 posts)
10. Trump must be forced to admit he lost
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:10 PM
Jan 2021

and the election was free and fair. We know that won't happen, since he knows there will be no repercussions no matter what, but how nice it would be.

secondwind

(16,903 posts)
34. Even if he did admit he lost..................
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:49 PM
Jan 2021

unless we can convict him in the Senate, he will want to run again in four years...

I have high hopes that NYS will take care of this problem, with the 67 indictments that Letitia James has waiting for him in SDNY.

theneworiginal

(302 posts)
55. How come everyone just skips over the criminal culpability Trump has for
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 10:55 PM
Jan 2021

his central role in the Insurrection, murder and related charges?

Simply focusing on Impeachment is giving tRump a pass right out of the gate. He deserves no quarter. This was the biggest crime ever committed against our democracy. Period. He Cruz and the rest of the pols who coordinated this should stand trial in a criminal court for their roles.

no_hypocrisy

(46,130 posts)
11. Republicans love the contradictions of an impeachment:
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 05:12 PM
Jan 2021

A) You can't impeach and try a President while s/he's in office b/c s/he is busy running the country. It would be distracting.

B) You can't impeach and try a President AFTER s/he's been in office b/c it's too late. S/he can't be removed from office.


So, IOW, you can't impeach a Republican President at any time.

But it's ALWAYS a good time to impeach a Democrat in the WH.

riversedge

(70,245 posts)
24. The 5 GOP votes were: Collins, Murkowski, Romney, Toomey, Sasse That is, the votes thought to most
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:23 PM
Jan 2021





The 5 GOP votes were: Collins, Murkowski, Romney, Toomey, Sasse

That is, the votes thought to most be in play. No surprises.

?s=20

Mr. Sparkle

(2,935 posts)
25. 45 members of the jury voted to dismiss the case given everything thats gone on.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:24 PM
Jan 2021

you couldn't make this shit up. The level of corruption and moral bankruptcy is off the scale. And Rand knows full well what's he is doing. Through this vote he is applying pressure on the republicans to acquit trump in a few weeks time.

Nitram

(22,822 posts)
29. "Democrats "probably should rest their case and present no case at all." Yeah, I'm sure
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:35 PM
Jan 2021

that's what he'd like to see. We Democrats, on the other hand, want that evidence laid out plain for all to see. History will judge the traitorous Republicans who value their party more than our democracy.

cstanleytech

(26,299 posts)
30. " it shows it is unlikely there will be enough votes" Not necessarily.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:39 PM
Jan 2021

If most of the Republicans want him gone they can rig the trial to convict him simply by having enough of his supposed supporters boycott the trial.
That reduces the number of total Senators needed to get the 2/3 vote.
That way it makes it harder for Trump to attack many of them.

cstanleytech

(26,299 posts)
36. Assuming my rough math is right I think it's something
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 06:56 PM
Jan 2021

like 28 to 34 that have to not attend.
Best way to probably do that is for 4 to 7 to use COVID as an excuse and needing to quarantine for 2 weeks.
The rest can then use the excuse of boycotting that it’s because it’s not the full Senate and thus the trial should be delayed or simply point to their vote here as an excuse and claim it’s in protest against the Democrats.

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
42. Yep Gives them cover and that also allows the "evidence" to change their mind
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:02 PM
Jan 2021

to convict later. Lots of theatre going on with this initial vote.

Dyedinthewoolliberal

(15,579 posts)
40. Well Mr. Paul here's the thing;
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 08:27 PM
Jan 2021

given it appears your party is comprised of people without backbones, even if the trial doesn't result in conviction it will result in every Senator's vote being recorded. Thereby recording for posterity the absolute abhorrent dereliction of duty by the Republican members of the Senate. This should help speed along the death of your 'party before country' political organization. I'll not shed tears.

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
41. The number doesnt foreshadow anything. It lets the GOP have room to change their
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:00 PM
Jan 2021

mind after the evidence is presented - and not get screamed at by their constituents beforehand

Shermann

(7,423 posts)
43. Is there any way to get the ex-president impeachment constitutionality question in front of SCOTUS?
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:12 PM
Jan 2021

I realize they have no jurisdiction over the impeachment outcome itself.

But is there any way to get them to weight in on this specific question beforehand?

That would be interesting. They don't have the luxury of spouting talking points. They would have to come up with some legal justification that is at least plausible.

Shermann

(7,423 posts)
47. Right. So how do the Democrats get the question in front of SCOTUS?
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:30 PM
Jan 2021

Can't they just ask them? That would be all they need.

I'd love to see what Rand Paul has to say after his talking point is taken away.

PoliticAverse

(26,366 posts)
49. Unless a Democrat challenges the constitutionality and takes it to the court
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:58 PM
Jan 2021

and the court finds the Democrat has standing to challenge the question it won't come before the court.

FBaggins

(26,748 posts)
48. Not unless he's convicted, no.
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 09:54 PM
Jan 2021

If he's convicted and tried to challenge it in court, his sole argument (at least the only one I can think of) must be that the Senate lacks the power to try an ex-president - and thus the results are illegitimate.

It's likely that such a case would be thrown out as being a political question outside the purview of the courts.

Your obvious goal is a good one. Get Republicans on the record as for/against disqualification without the excuse of saying they're just voting to acquit because they lack the constitutional authority to convict. Unfortunately, SCOTUS doesn't make advisory opinions (the constitution doesn't allow it), and once the vote to convict fails... there is no appeal.

PoliticAverse

(26,366 posts)
50. I don't think they'd find it to be a 'political question' I think they'd simply find the impeachment
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 10:00 PM
Jan 2021

of someone no longer in office to be constitutional.

mdbl

(4,973 posts)
51. it's great to see so many GOP senators that won't fulfill their oath
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 10:29 PM
Jan 2021

they are a bunch of lying fucking hypocrites. They don't defend the constitution, they hate democracy, they follow a suck dictator and are just worthless human beings in it for themselves.

question everything

(47,487 posts)
54. The five that did not vote to dismiss
Tue Jan 26, 2021, 10:51 PM
Jan 2021

Pennsylvania Sen. Pat Toomey was one of the five Republican senators joining with Democrats in opposing the dismissal. He was joined by Mitt Romney, Susan Collins, Lisa Murkowski and Ben Sasse. All have previously expressed openness to the House impeachment effort.

https://www.mcall.com/news/pennsylvania/capitol-ideas/mc-nws-pa-pat-toomey-senate-trump-trial-20210126-za2uqkxgknbpzj5ai2hl7upuxi-story.html

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