Russia Sends Its 'Heavy-Duty' Sukhoi Su-34 Fighter To Ukraine Ops
Source: DefenceAviationPost
Sukhoi Su-34 Fullback strike aircraft are thought to have been sent by Russia to bolster its military offensive against Ukraine.
Online videos show up to seven SU-34 fighter-bombers flying over Kharkiv, Ukraines northeastern metropolis. Images of FAB-500 unguided bombs, apparently dropped by Su-34s on a civilian target in Kharkiv, were also widely circulated on the internet.
This was seen by experts as a foreshadowing of things to come, hinting that the Russian military has begun using tactical aviation for bombing operations. Only Su-25 assault planes were thought to be used for support missions previously.
...
Despite its efficacy as a counter-insurgency aircraft in Syria, the Su-34 could be vulnerable due to its radar visibility and role in breaching hostile airspace to strike vital targets behind enemy lines.
Read more: https://defenceaviationpost.com/russia-sends-its-heavy-duty-sukhoi-su-34-fighter-to-ukraine-ops/
Bombers like this won't be reached by Stinger anti-aircraft missiles at high altitudes.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)Sapient Donkey
(1,568 posts)I wondering about those CRAMs and if they would be useful against the MLRS attacks. But those would have to get close to the fighting. Even if they were deemed to be useful and if they were willing, if they could even get those where they are needed.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)saying he's been asked about sending in Patriot Missiles, but it would take months of planning and training to get Ukrainians up to speed, so they (probably) aren't doing it. This should have been planned out a couple of months ago when they had the initial intelligence.
Sapient Donkey
(1,568 posts)I figured that wouldn't be an easy task to pull off quickly or in the middle of battle.
All of our more advanced SAM systems require significant training -- too long for them to be of use. We would either have to send NATO soldiers to operate them or more likely send our F-35s.
We don't really have land-based mobile SAM batteries like the Russians, we rely on our airpower for AA. Patriot and THAAD are more dedicated to defending against missiles than aircraft.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)the main thing. No need to escalate. Just prevent.
There are pilots in the EU. This need not wait until papers are signed to make Ukraine's EU entry official. There is a war on the EU's eastern border. They'd better get off their runway butts and help.
Evolve Dammit
(16,632 posts)speak easy
(9,101 posts)brer cat
(24,402 posts)Thanks for the link.
WarGamer
(12,106 posts)BidenRocks
(813 posts)Bombers like this won't be reached by Stinger anti-aircraft missiles at high altitudes.
It sucks when you depend on Russian Rookies to fuck things up.
Go Russia! (no Ukranian flag)
Yorkist
(59 posts)
..Russias thus far almost absent Air Force
.
https://rusi.org/explore-our-research/publications/rusi-defence-systems/russian-air-force-actually-incapable-complex-air-operations
ZonkerHarris
(24,156 posts)Response to ZonkerHarris (Reply #7)
Mary in S. Carolina This message was self-deleted by its author.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)If Russian wanted nuclear war it would have done it by now and "won." Okay? Don't give credence to Putin's threats.
MarineCombatEngineer
(12,092 posts)ancianita
(35,816 posts)MarineCombatEngineer
(12,092 posts)at the time, Khrushchev, who was willing to negotiate, unlike Putin, who has shown no inclination to negotiate.
I trust Pres. Biden, his Military advisors and NATO leaders are doing the right thing by not escalating the situation with a move that would assure open combat with Russia, which would more than likely end up in a nuclear exchange with the resulting millions upon millions of lives lost, a world destroyed, mass famine, mass radiation.
No thanks
Strangling the Russian economy is, IMO, the smarter way to go.
.
EndlessWire
(6,377 posts)But, if we cave to this, all the rest of our lives, the world's lives, we'll be held hostage to any nuclear threat Putin and his successor cares to make. If he succeeds, it will be noted by other adverse nuclear powers.
The sanctions are hurting Putin and Russia, but they are only slowing down the action, or making it look like we are fighting back. I have high hopes of something happening to make Putin withdraw, but it seems dim at the moment.
I think that the most positive action we have taken (and by WE, I mean the world) is the fact that we sent tons of war materials to Ukraine. We need to keep that coming, as well as massively deploying NATO troops to surrounding, vulnerable areas, including Sweden and Finland, even though they are not currently NATO. They should be offered instant NATO membership. And, Georgia should also be taken in to both EU and NATO. And Moldova, if they request it.
MarineCombatEngineer
(12,092 posts)the US/NATO should do everything in it's power to reasonably avoid escalating this illegal war perpetrated by Putin while at the same time, making it quite clear where the line is drawn, which I think Pres. Biden has done, and make no mistake, the Russian Military leaders are under no illusions of the power of the US Military, especially in partnership with NATO forces, they know that in a conventional war, they would get their clocks cleaned, they also know that in a nuke war, nobody wins, that's why I hold out hope that if Putin gave the order to use, say, a tactical nuke in Ukraine, those Military leaders will remove him, along with the FSB.
It has to be Russia that removes him from power, any foreign attempt to remove him will unite the Russian people like it did in WWII.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)Kennedy was willing to risk wiping out the human race. If he couldn't answer yes to your question, he wouldn't have been president.
Now we have to get on with making sure that never happens.
If you have any suggestions, make them. The Ukrainians made the air cover request and they are the ones who are listening.
MarineCombatEngineer
(12,092 posts)nuclear weapons, Khrushchev knew it and was willing to negotiate getting our Jupiter missiles out of Turkey, which was his whole intent in the first place.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)You saw that advisor table seating. That's how far both Putin and his circle trust each other.
We can help him with that. Give him an off ramp and a plan to get him to his retirement year, 2024.
No one here has yet to suggest anything the Ukrainians haven't thought of.
To be silent in the face of Ukraine asking for air support is to appease Putin and his hardliners.
Ukrainians and the Russian people are the ones as risk. Us, not as much.
MarineCombatEngineer
(12,092 posts)of Putin and his todies, I wouldn't trust him to honor any agreement, he's too drunk with power.
The US itself does not far outmatch the Russian nuclear arsenal,
https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/28/politics/russia-nuclear-threats-putin-what-matters/index.html
Russias total nuclear stockpile is larger than the United States, at around 6,250 total nuclear warheads, according to the Arms Control Association. The US has more than 5,500.
Most of those warheads in both countries are not deployed on missiles or at bases. According to an assessment by the Arms Control Association, in terms of deployed nuclear warheads:
Russia has 1,458 warheads on 527 intercontinental ballistic missiles, submarine-launched missiles and bombers.
The US has 1,389 warheads on 665 intercontinental ballistic missiles, submarine-launched missiles and bombers.
No other country known or thought to have nuclear weapons the United Kingdom, France, Israel, Pakistan, India, China and North Korea has anywhere near those numbers of warheads.
NATO countries combined that posses nukes outmatch Russian nukes, but Russia outmatches the US in nukes.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)Which is why deployment speed of the intercontinental numbers are more important.
Maybe this is why Putin is threatening to go nuclear. He's got more nuclear subs than we, but we know where they are, and we've got speed.
Admittedly, people in the DoD have the comparative speed and locations numbers, not us. If his own people, or Ukraine, can't stop him, eventually we'll have to.
EndlessWire
(6,377 posts)Putin will have to contend with most of the free world. Other friendlies also have nuclear power, don't they? I think as a combination Putin can be defeated.
The Russian people have to do something about this. They will be cooked in a nuclear exchange. Better to die taking Putin out than to be sitting there fighting a war they do not want.
And, I am on the WC, which means I do not expect to live through it, either.
ancianita
(35,816 posts)EndlessWire
(6,377 posts)I think Putin is another "President For Life."
ancianita
(35,816 posts)I hope we make sure it's life in prison or by assassination, whichever comes sooner.
TomWilm
(1,832 posts)... just as Ukraine now have the "right" to attack military target all over Russia.
Historic NY
(37,449 posts)if the lauded American missiles can target a Russian Soviet Aircraft from miles out, why not establish a perimeter around the NATO Countries and shoot down anything approaching. fire and forget.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)and possibly protecting Lviv?
marie999
(3,334 posts)NATO only has to help a NATO country if Russia is the aggressor.
EndlessWire
(6,377 posts)that concept by firing on a Turkish ship, a Romanian ship, and sinking a Finnish ship. All of them noncombatant and just going around and minding their own business. Russia is definitely the aggressor, and NATO has ample reason to engage, which they haven't done. So, something else must be going on.
gab13by13
(20,867 posts)Here is a scenario, Ukraine makes an expert American drone navigator an Ukranian citizen, dual citizenship. The dual citizen can go into Ukraine and give on the job training how to fly drones. We need to explore all options, people are going to die.
Maybe even give dual citizenship to F35 pilots?
Why not?
Because the Russians know you didnt sell the Ukrainians any f35s.
Karadeniz
(22,283 posts)olddad65
(599 posts)To give his army some valuable training to prepare them for their next assignment.
Sooner or later, NATO, including the US is going to have to engage Putin's war machine.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)ancianita
(35,816 posts)in the bud, and ending Kremlin forays into the West altogether.
The West had better make autocracies get used to democratic states near their borders.
"Training grounds" work both ways.