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blue-wave

(4,351 posts)
Sat Mar 5, 2022, 11:51 PM Mar 2022

Defiant Putin warns the west: your sanctions are akin to an act of war

Source: The Guardian

Vladimir Putin delivered a chilling warning to the west over the imposition of sanctions on Russia on Saturday, warning that measures designed to cripple his country’s economy were “akin to an act of war”.

In comments that were both defiant and threatening, the Russian president also told Ukraine’s leaders that their nation risked being dismantled as an independent sovereign state if they continued to resist Russia’s invasion.

“The current leadership needs to understand that if they continue doing what they are doing, they risk the future of Ukrainian statehood,” Putin said. “If that happens they will have to be blamed for that.”

His intervention, in which he hinted the conflict could soon spread beyond Ukraine unless the west changed course, came as Moscow broke a ceasefire agreement to allow Ukrainian civilians to flee after 10 days of bombing and devastation.

Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/05/defiant-putin-warns-the-west-your-sanctions-are-akin-to-an-act-of-war



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Sounds to me as if the sanctions are a real thorn in Pooty's side.

You poor baby Pooty. Next time don't start an immoral, unprovoked war against your peaceful neighbor.
115 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Defiant Putin warns the west: your sanctions are akin to an act of war (Original Post) blue-wave Mar 2022 OP
Haven't thought this through but Jarqui Mar 2022 #1
BIDEN: If war, sanctions; PUTIN: Who cares?; BIDEN: Sanctions; PUTIN: Whaaaaahh Mommy! Nukes! TheBlackAdder Mar 2022 #17
I'm hoping it is only a short term future. LiberalFighter Mar 2022 #84
Days or weeks COL Mustard Mar 2022 #89
"You better give me free reign without consequences, or I swear I'll...uh...." Grokenstein Mar 2022 #2
Anyone who has lived with an abusive adult understands him. dixiegrrrrl Mar 2022 #14
Absolutely correct moniss Mar 2022 #21
This was also Trump to a T. He made my skin crawl from the get-go. nt Hekate Mar 2022 #27
Mental health professionals moniss Mar 2022 #28
Hillary's e-mails and Trump's sheer entertainment value for cable TV. Hekate Mar 2022 #30
Yup. The American public was being primed - inured - to abuse bucolic_frolic Mar 2022 #78
I have experienced this also. EndlessWire Mar 2022 #39
It's taken me decades to figure out my toxic family dixiegrrrrl Mar 2022 #115
Divorce happened legally w breakup of USSR onetexan Mar 2022 #61
It's kind of like COL Mustard Mar 2022 #90
Agree 100% duforsure Mar 2022 #68
yep "Look what you made me do!" nt prodigitalson Mar 2022 #109
They were OK peacefully co-existing. But you're right. That's all gone now. Evolve Dammit Mar 2022 #112
World Leaders who verbally threatened Nuclear War like a child: Kim Jung's, Putin & Trump TheBlackAdder Mar 2022 #15
he'll call TDFG & bitch that he's not doing his job in the PR dept. !! monkeyman1 Mar 2022 #23
Oh! Do you remember EndlessWire Mar 2022 #40
not off hand ? monkeyman1 Mar 2022 #43
Here's a link to the story EndlessWire Mar 2022 #48
thank's for the info- summary in a nut shell ! as far as Biden , agreed ! monkeyman1 Mar 2022 #56
Neah neah-neah neah neah booga booga booga. DinahMoeHum Mar 2022 #3
Post removed Post removed Mar 2022 #4
According to Putin, anything can be "an act of war" Freethinker65 Mar 2022 #5
Putin, your war is an act of war. n/t OnlinePoker Mar 2022 #6
Exactly StarryNite Mar 2022 #31
Putin been around TDFG to long! he rubbed off on him ! monkeyman1 Mar 2022 #46
Exactly. Collimator Mar 2022 #49
OMG! Can I laugh? EndlessWire Mar 2022 #57
Yes, true...tho sanctions on Iran Cuba are definitely NOT act of war...big difference, right? Alexander Of Assyria Mar 2022 #93
From "Sanctions? Pshaw!" to "Sanctions? War!" in 6 weeks,,, thesquanderer Mar 2022 #7
Great Point!! blue-wave Mar 2022 #8
Excellent post, thesquanderer Hekate Mar 2022 #16
+1 chowder66 Mar 2022 #51
wish he'd step out in Red Square & see how long he'd last rite now ? monkeyman1 Mar 2022 #9
WW3 has begun. We can fight Putin in Eastern Europe or in North America olddad65 Mar 2022 #10
No Fly Zone would have been a definite act of war first time it was enforced localroger Mar 2022 #19
You are correct about the explosion moniss Mar 2022 #24
"The best end for this... discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2022 #83
I agree. EndlessWire Mar 2022 #59
This is WW3. Texaswitchy Mar 2022 #114
This is how free markets work... orwell Mar 2022 #11
does this nasty little despot agingdem Mar 2022 #12
"this war is visceral and personal" Justice matters. Mar 2022 #41
he's like a two year old.. agingdem Mar 2022 #52
You want war, fuckface? orangecrush Mar 2022 #13
Can you call Putin something other than fuckface agingdem Mar 2022 #18
Does the ex moniss Mar 2022 #26
like honorifics?...oh, no... agingdem Mar 2022 #45
LOL! n/t EndlessWire Mar 2022 #44
See you next Tuesday? Brainfodder Mar 2022 #58
Daaaayyyyuuuuummmmm!!!!!!! oldsoftie Mar 2022 #74
Perfectly cool! orangecrush Mar 2022 #99
He says everything is an act of war. C Moon Mar 2022 #20
classic abuser bullshit line - fuck him, he's done and knows it bringthePaine Mar 2022 #22
bad as that squirrel at MAR-A- BUNK-R compound ! monkeyman1 Mar 2022 #25
Don't look now Mr Putin . . . Aussie105 Mar 2022 #29
Yeah, yeah Pooti. We thought that sanctions were of no consequence to you. TeamProg Mar 2022 #32
If sanctions are "akin to an act of war," then... 3catwoman3 Mar 2022 #33
Probably a "Legitimate political discourse" in his alt-universe Justice matters. Mar 2022 #47
"Putin delivered a chilling warning" Chilling? I think not. PSPS Mar 2022 #34
Question is: Aussie105 Mar 2022 #36
Global economy can make -or- break someone it seems. Baked Potato Mar 2022 #35
Our answer is: Go F Yourself mass murderer! nt Justice matters. Mar 2022 #37
Who does Putin sound like? Metro135 Mar 2022 #38
Just like trump, putin doesn't give a damn about anyone or anything... C Moon Mar 2022 #42
So much for occupying Israel as prophesied in that book that nothing beats? czarjak Mar 2022 #50
Notice how he's not doing anything about it... regnaD kciN Mar 2022 #53
Blah blah blah, your threats are meaningless BigmanPigman Mar 2022 #54
An act of war is it? How about invading Ukraine in the first place? PatrickforB Mar 2022 #55
With all due respect ... which in this instance is NONE NotHardly Mar 2022 #60
I cannot tell you... NotHardly Mar 2022 #62
+100 blue-wave Mar 2022 #64
You started this, мудак edbermac Mar 2022 #63
Putin is taking the statehood away or trying to from the Ukrainian people already with his invasion cstanleytech Mar 2022 #65
Damn bastard's running out of leverage so the only one now is escalating the brutality of the fight onetexan Mar 2022 #66
bullshit. What is he going to do about it? Next week his country is going to economically implode. JohnSJ Mar 2022 #67
Well zippy what do you think you have done or are you that fucking stupid..... turbinetree Mar 2022 #69
The sanctions are not going away. LiberatedUSA Mar 2022 #70
+1 -K&R. Off w putty's head! onetexan Mar 2022 #71
Oh, really? DFW Mar 2022 #72
re: "... is an act of....what?" discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2022 #85
We're OK here, but no one is overlooking our proximity to the conflict. DFW Mar 2022 #87
Very glad that you're okay. discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2022 #98
I assume some of my ancestors were from what is Ukrainian territory today, but I don't know DFW Mar 2022 #100
I'm trying to learn German but man, I'm having a tough time. Elessar Zappa Mar 2022 #103
It definitely takes some getting used to. DFW Mar 2022 #105
We are all countrymen. discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2022 #104
Always figure that what is "out there" as you so aptly put it, is 90% BS and 10% reality DFW Mar 2022 #111
Firstly, it's late in your neighborhood so have pleasant evening. discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2022 #113
It is NOT. They are "special operations" ck4829 Mar 2022 #73
+1 ffr Mar 2022 #92
Pick a day and time. The Jungle 1 Mar 2022 #75
Sanctions and other actions Marthe48 Mar 2022 #76
In the past, Putin has threatened and the world has backed down. Lonestarblue Mar 2022 #77
he is like his puppet llashram Mar 2022 #79
Po Po Pooty, does it hurt and have a temperature? Awwww, too too bad! XacerbatedDem Mar 2022 #80
Yeah, because what you are doing is nothing of the kind, right? (n/t) OldBaldy1701E Mar 2022 #81
Don't start nothin', won't be nothin'. ancianita Mar 2022 #82
i don't think we care what this mass murdering imbecile says samsingh Mar 2022 #86
Your sanctions are akin to an act of war COL Mustard Mar 2022 #88
It is true, that economic sanctions now is a form of warfare TomWilm Mar 2022 #91
You could just leave Ukraine and send your troops home IronLionZion Mar 2022 #94
For clarity; Invade a country, drop bombs, kill civilians, not a war. Economic sanctions, WAR. cayugafalls Mar 2022 #95
The mentally diseased psycho who is unfit to govern, squawks on cue. 58Sunliner Mar 2022 #96
"akin to an act of war" patphil Mar 2022 #97
And we're just getting started, asshole. world wide wally Mar 2022 #101
So being a terrorist to a neighboring duly elected government is not an "act of war" turbinetree Mar 2022 #102
So's invading another country Pooty Poot. Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Mar 2022 #106
And bombing the sh!t out of Ukraine is not an act of war?/nt Jetheels Mar 2022 #107
Are his buddies having a sad about their yachts? nt prodigitalson Mar 2022 #108
Good. Putin's whining means the sanctions are working. nt SunSeeker Mar 2022 #110

Jarqui

(10,123 posts)
1. Haven't thought this through but
Sat Mar 5, 2022, 11:58 PM
Mar 2022

it strikes me that this kind of reaction affirms the sanctions are having an effect.
If the sanctions remain, Putins long term future is grim.

The scary part is how he'll react.

Grokenstein

(5,722 posts)
2. "You better give me free reign without consequences, or I swear I'll...uh...."
Sat Mar 5, 2022, 11:59 PM
Mar 2022

Or what, Pootler? Go nuclear?

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
14. Anyone who has lived with an abusive adult understands him.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:22 AM
Mar 2022

Certainly understandable why Ukraine wants a divorce.

moniss

(4,213 posts)
21. Absolutely correct
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:53 AM
Mar 2022

and also fits the typical sociopath. They blame you for not stopping them from their abuse and destruction. I remember one such person in my life. As we sat with the psychologist in a counseling session trying to "save the marriage" I brought up all of the bald faced lying. The guy asked what "Honey" had for a response. It was "So I lied to you, so what?" with a detachment as cold as ice. No remorse, sense of guilt, empathy or conscience are the hallmarks of that kind of person. They could stab you to death and open a beer and watch TV right after and not think they had any blame. Thankfully the psych dude recognized it all and said to me privately that I had best get out of that relationship because the emotional abuse was never going to end.

moniss

(4,213 posts)
28. Mental health professionals
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:18 AM
Mar 2022

tried repeatedly to warn everyone even before the 2016 election. As we know all too well the media was focused on "her e-mails".

EndlessWire

(6,513 posts)
39. I have experienced this also.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:10 AM
Mar 2022

With my step father, he would do something heinous, and then blame ME for the happening. I was the family scapegoat. I was often bewildered as to what I had "done" to provoke this condemnation. It wasn't until I grew up and practiced self analysis and calming techniques that I was able to at least understand what had happened to me. I am still shaking it off. And, all the anxiety I experienced over wanting a normal and happy family that could NEVER be, wasn't something that I could change, but I was too young to understand that at the time. Today we call his cruelty "projecting the blame" onto some third party.

Thank you for posting that response. It has been helpful to me!

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
115. It's taken me decades to figure out my toxic family
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 09:19 PM
Mar 2022

and to make changes I needed to make. And I am a retired MH therapist!

Actually, in that regard, personal experience has helped me help others.

onetexan

(13,036 posts)
61. Divorce happened legally w breakup of USSR
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 03:27 AM
Mar 2022

Ukraine along w the other newly formed countries are sovereign states in their own right. The madman has no right & now, sick as he is with power, is threatening the whole world. We are already in a WW3. Theres no descalation given the price to pay for ukrainians is so great & the rest of europe.

EndlessWire

(6,513 posts)
40. Oh! Do you remember
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:17 AM
Mar 2022

when tRump said, We have nukes, why not use them? or something like that? Remember that?

Response to blue-wave (Original post)

Freethinker65

(10,009 posts)
5. According to Putin, anything can be "an act of war"
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:02 AM
Mar 2022

Putin with his threats is starting to sound like Trump threatening to sue everyone.

Collimator

(1,639 posts)
49. Exactly.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:31 AM
Mar 2022

What did he expect the rest of the world to do? Write him a thank you note?

His statement reminds me of a line from an SNL character on the Weekend Update feature. Character talks about stabbing her friend then complains that the friend, "took it the wrong way" and "started bleeding."

And just to add my personal account of dealing with a troubled person: At age 11, my 13 year old sibling came into my room and started whipping me with a length of rubber clothesline. I covered my face and begged him to stop. I was told that he would if I stopped screaming.

 

Alexander Of Assyria

(7,839 posts)
93. Yes, true...tho sanctions on Iran Cuba are definitely NOT act of war...big difference, right?
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 11:27 AM
Mar 2022

The invasion of Ukraine is also invading the comfortable hypocrisy of the West and it’s enslaved pro-capitalism white privileged media.

olddad65

(599 posts)
10. WW3 has begun. We can fight Putin in Eastern Europe or in North America
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:11 AM
Mar 2022

He is a madman with his finger on the trigger of the largest nuclear arsenal in the world.

We should have created the no fly zone over Ukraine on day 1.

Fuck Putin.

localroger

(3,626 posts)
19. No Fly Zone would have been a definite act of war first time it was enforced
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:50 AM
Mar 2022

Putin's finger on the nuclear trigger is not what most people think. Like the US, Russia has a command and control structure designed to prevent one madman from launching an attack. (Which is why Trump couldn't, BTW.) Russia has an early warning system which must signal an incoming threat before Putin's "nuclear football" becomes active, and even then it takes two of three people with those "footballs" to agree to trigger a launch.

I do believe the attack on the nuclear reactor may have been an attempt to create a pretext for this early warning system, either to fool it or bypass it because of radiation flooding. Problem is, as the principal characters of Chernobyl believed, it is actually true of most reactors that it's really hard to get them to do anything dramatic. The remaining Chernobyl-like RBMK reactors have had the design flaw that allowed the explosion to happen fixed, and even with that flaw dropping a bomb on the Chernobyl reactor wouldn't have caused the explosion. It was a very stupid plan, but a very telling one.

Flooding Ukraine with man-portable anti-aircraft weapons is a much better solution. They've been keeping their own sky dangerous enough to be expensive and discouraging to the invaders and Putin can't point any fingers at NATO or anyone else.

The best end for this is for Putin to be alone in his bunker of solitude when his own generals tell him he's retiring. And that may happen sooner rather than later if things keep spiraling downhill.

moniss

(4,213 posts)
24. You are correct about the explosion
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:02 AM
Mar 2022

but spent fuel rods on site, if any, could have had their containers breached etc. Thankfully it didn't happen. I think Vermin Vlad wants to take somewhat of a scorched Earth approach here and he is willing to do any damage as long as it harms civilians and might have a long lasting effect.

discntnt_irny_srcsm

(18,479 posts)
83. "The best end for this...
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 10:09 AM
Mar 2022

...would be for the oligarchs and generals to send in a pack hyenas and lock the doors.

EndlessWire

(6,513 posts)
59. I agree.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 03:04 AM
Mar 2022

I also think that WW3 is already here. We are just not recognizing it. This is the run up.

I don't know. I am just glad that I am not President. China is now starting up. Back to back warnings against the West. I believe that China and Russia are working together, and this is it. I pray every night and every morning to let it all be just a nightmare that isn't true.

Let Xi and Putin rot in the dirt. All the money in the entire world will not be enough to bring back any part of whatever pleasant life and times that someone might have.

I want Putin indicted as a war criminal for shooting civilians trying to flee. Also for shooting up nuclear reactors.

Texaswitchy

(2,962 posts)
114. This is WW3.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 05:23 PM
Mar 2022

It is the land war part of it.

With Trump it made it possible.

A Russian asset in the White House.

A second term was planned.

First weaken NATO.

orwell

(7,771 posts)
11. This is how free markets work...
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:14 AM
Mar 2022

...nothing compels us to work with you if you're a bloodthirsty psycho who kills innocent civilians because you have a fucking inferiority complex.

It is a free market. We choose not to work with you.

Go fuck yourself!

agingdem

(7,845 posts)
12. does this nasty little despot
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:14 AM
Mar 2022

not understand war, especially war in 2022?...retaliation is the name of the game, be it boots on the ground, air support, cyber, and, yes, withholding goods and services, cutting off aid and avenues of funding the war...and does Putin not get that the financial institutions are globally interconnected?.. this war is visceral and personal .."touch" one ally and all will defend

Justice matters.

(6,925 posts)
41. "this war is visceral and personal"
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:18 AM
Mar 2022

And it was totally un-necessary to begin with.

Unless that multi-billionaire war criminal wanted to steal more of Ukraine's natural resources than he did in 2014 in Crimea, because he can't stand the idea of not having more money than he's already stolen.

agingdem

(7,845 posts)
52. he's like a two year old..
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:36 AM
Mar 2022

if I want it, it's mine..if it's mine it must never appear to be yours...if I had it a little while ago, it's mine..if I can take it away from you, it's mine.....if I think it's mine, it's mine...once it belongs to me it will never belong to anyone else, ever...

agingdem

(7,845 posts)
18. Can you call Putin something other than fuckface
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:48 AM
Mar 2022

like maybe assface?..my daughter’s ex-husband is fuckface and has been for 15 years (may he die a slow excruciating death…a flesh eating disease would be ok)..so, are we good with assface???

agingdem

(7,845 posts)
45. like honorifics?...oh, no...
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:23 AM
Mar 2022

we do refer to him as "FF" when we text..however, I would have no problem calling him the late Mr. Fuckface

Aussie105

(5,380 posts)
29. Don't look now Mr Putin . . .
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:19 AM
Mar 2022

but war was declared as soon as you pointed your troops at the Ukrainian border, when they crossed, and the first shot was fired.

'Don't threaten me with sanctions! But see if I care!'

- sanctions happened, he cares.

'Don't make me angry! You won't like it if I get angry!'

- the rest of the world goes out of it's way to make him angry.

'I have a big red button! Don't make me push it!'

- other countries have big red buttons too.

But seriously, will the button get pushed, and will those more sane people in the Russian military follow orders and push the launch buttons and see Russia and half of Europe go up in radioactive clouds because a mad dictator isn't getting his way?

History is watching . . .

TeamProg

(6,117 posts)
32. Yeah, yeah Pooti. We thought that sanctions were of no consequence to you.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:39 AM
Mar 2022

Guess we were all wrong.

Poor baby.

Did someone Tread On Ewe?

3catwoman3

(23,973 posts)
33. If sanctions are "akin to an act of war," then...
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:56 AM
Mar 2022

…what in the ever-loving hell does he call his armed invasion of Ukraine?

Aussie105

(5,380 posts)
36. Question is:
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:06 AM
Mar 2022

Will Putin continue to sail into this storm, or head out to calmer waters?

Does he have it in him to back down? Or will he continue to sail into this storm of his own making, and when it gets too much, will he order his crew to go down into the bowels of the ship and open the stopcocks and so scuttle the ship?

And will his crew have the guts to go . . . No Way, Man!

Metro135

(359 posts)
38. Who does Putin sound like?
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:09 AM
Mar 2022

“The current leadership needs to understand that if they continue doing what they are doing, they risk the future of Ukrainian statehood,” Putin said. “If that happens they will have to be blamed for that.”

THEY will have to be blamed for that?

Yeah, just like Hitler blamed the Jews for starting a world war. He had nothing to do with it.

C Moon

(12,212 posts)
42. Just like trump, putin doesn't give a damn about anyone or anything...
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:19 AM
Mar 2022

the only important matter, is what he wants.

BigmanPigman

(51,584 posts)
54. Blah blah blah, your threats are meaningless
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:47 AM
Mar 2022

You small, small, small man/baby. Mr Macho no more. He is a loser and no one takes a word he says seriously anymore since he lies constantly and every truce he makes he breaks within minutes. No one cares what that eunuch threatening anymore. He is a world class loser and his days are numbered. He knows it too.

NotHardly

(1,062 posts)
62. I cannot tell you...
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 03:32 AM
Mar 2022

How tired I am of this shite from every goddamn republican that has a mike.

This dude is a piece of shite...these threats... I have read about the same from WWII when that other dick-wipe was raging in the 40s.

Apparently, there was a lesson we missed and to which we are being further educated.

Something, something... allowing evil to live next to you.

blue-wave

(4,351 posts)
64. +100
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 03:57 AM
Mar 2022

TY!! I'm just as tired of the gaslighting and projectionism. They are all peas in the same pod sticking together with their bullshit.

cstanleytech

(26,281 posts)
65. Putin is taking the statehood away or trying to from the Ukrainian people already with his invasion
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 04:45 AM
Mar 2022

so how exactly are the Western nations responsible for that?

onetexan

(13,036 posts)
66. Damn bastard's running out of leverage so the only one now is escalating the brutality of the fight
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 04:51 AM
Mar 2022

Well there are more weapons, planes & foreign fighters joing the UKR forces coming. The only way to stand up to a bully is give him a taste of his own medicine - outgun him, arrest him, try him for war crimes & atrocities against humanity, or his own ppl turn on him & take him out.

I cannot stand Lindsey Graham but in regards to putin he's right. There's gotta a brutus & it is the western alliances.

JohnSJ

(92,136 posts)
67. bullshit. What is he going to do about it? Next week his country is going to economically implode.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 04:54 AM
Mar 2022

World opinion is universally against him and his unprovoked attack and brutality against Ukraine.

More sanctions are coming against Russia, and more weapons are being delivered into Ukraine against the Russian tyranny



turbinetree

(24,695 posts)
69. Well zippy what do you think you have done or are you that fucking stupid.....
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 07:14 AM
Mar 2022

your just like that asshole in Mar A Lago....your a malignant narcissist, you think that your great Russia empire from days gone by started in Kyviv..........your losing and you know it......you made your bed now sleep in it.....asshole...

 

LiberatedUSA

(1,666 posts)
70. The sanctions are not going away.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 07:29 AM
Mar 2022

So if you are gonna launch nukes over it, then I guess everyone is gonna die; but those fucking sanctions are staying.

Lifting those sanctions over the threat of nukes would be giving dictators the way to do what they want, when they want and how they want; always with the threat of “you defy us, that is war and we will launch.”

DFW

(54,341 posts)
72. Oh, really?
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 07:49 AM
Mar 2022

And a hostile armed invasion of a neighboring country, bombing of its civilians, annexing its territory, is an act of....what? Mercy?

discntnt_irny_srcsm

(18,479 posts)
85. re: "... is an act of....what?"
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 10:19 AM
Mar 2022

I think where he's from they call that liberation.

What Ukraine needs 100k of each S&S, Stingers and snipers.

Are things in your area okay?

DFW

(54,341 posts)
87. We're OK here, but no one is overlooking our proximity to the conflict.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 10:49 AM
Mar 2022

As I have mentioned elsewhere, we have ex-pat Ukrainian friends here, and they all have family back home. One who was here at our house yesterday showed us photos on his cell phone from his mother-in-law. Her house was OK, but the one right across the street had been hit by a Russian artillery shell and was in ruins. if the wind had been blowing slightly in the other direction, it might have been her house, and if she had been home, she would have been killed.

My Ukrainian friend in Spain said her family was all in small towns near the Hungarian/Slovakian border. They have been in constant communication, but they hadn't seen any Russian invaders (yet).

The fact remains that between us in Germany and the Ukrainian border, there is only Poland. Poland isn't huge. Its is only fifteen miles wider across than Kansas. If you want a comparable scenario, figure you live in Denver, and there is a full-blown war going on in Missouri, who is being invaded by a country as powerful and as well-armed as the whole United States east and north of Missouri, and who is also threatening nuclear bombs on anyone who "interferes."

So, yes, we're OK, but the distance to "not OK" is nowhere near big enough to let us sleep easy. Yesterday, I flew back here (Düsseldorf) from Barcelona in northeastern Spain. It was about a two hour flight. From here, if you fly the same amount of time due east, you are in Kyiv.

discntnt_irny_srcsm

(18,479 posts)
98. Very glad that you're okay.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:51 PM
Mar 2022
Family is most important.

I am very familiar with the geography and I've driven an equivalent distance (Cedar Rapids to Denver) in a day.

Regarding "not OK"... everyone in the world now needs to accept that their own distance from "not OK" is never big enough when tyrants and terrorists are killing at whim. IMO, politics and religion have something in common which is: why is there always enough of either to incite violence but they can seldom instill tolerance?

My paternal grandparents were born in Ukraine. If my father was alive today he would be worried, miserable, crushed and angry. His cousin was DP person in the '40s eventually reaching him in Philly. I remember his eyes.

For myself I started loving the study of history within a year after that activity was no longer graded and tested by folks who never put any heart into the their teaching. It seems there is always a generation somewhere on the planet that hasn't learned from history. It's always been the same. You just need to fill in the blank, "Ich bin ein ____."

I hope your daughters and other family stay safe and well.

DFW

(54,341 posts)
100. I assume some of my ancestors were from what is Ukrainian territory today, but I don't know
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:16 PM
Mar 2022

I am basically an Eastern European mongrel. I know that one of my great-grandfathers was born in a small town in what is now Slovakia, about 12 miles west of what is today the Ukrainian border. In those days, it was just the eastern edge of the Hapsburg Empire. His family brought him as a small child to New York in 1876. One of his daughters married a poor tailor's son from Charleston, South Carolina, and they became half of my grandparents.

As a precaution, ditch the "ein." German grammar has its quirks, and one of them (ignored by JFK or his translator) is that if you want to say you are from somewhere, or are of a certain nationality, you don't use the "ein" when talking about a person. If you want to say, "I am a Frenchman," you say "Ich bin Franzose." To say I am an American, you say, "Ich bin Amerikaner." To say I'm from London, you say "Ich bin Londoner." You use the "ein" when referring to an object, cultural relic, or iconic local food that Germans associate with the place.

Examples:
Ich bin Hamburger (I am from Hamburg) vs. Ich bin ein Hamburger (I am an all beef patty on a bun)
Ich bin Frankfurter (I am from Frankfurt) vs. Ich bin ein Frankfurter (I am a hot dog)
Ich bin Pariser (I am from Paris) vs. Ich bin ein Pariser (I am a condom)
and the classic Ich bin Berliner (I am from Berlin) vs. Ich bin ein Berliner (I am a jelly-filled donut)

Elessar Zappa

(13,964 posts)
103. I'm trying to learn German but man, I'm having a tough time.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:50 PM
Mar 2022

I learned Spanish easily but German is rough. Trying to learn which article goes with which noun, learning the cases, all the verbs with “aus”, “auf”, etc.

DFW

(54,341 posts)
105. It definitely takes some getting used to.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:10 PM
Mar 2022

If you can, either read some of the easier literature (Borchert, e.g.) and spend as much time with some friendly natives (my best solution) as you can. Familiarity is the key to getting such a feel for it that you will find yourself automatically making the right decision.

i had an easier time with Spanish, too, I must admit, but I lived in Spain for a year, and so got used to it pretty quickly, even if I lived in a part of Spain where the people didn't speak Spanish. They knew it, because they had to, but never spoke it among themselves.

With German, I got a head start with sort of a linguistic "halfway house." I started learning Swedish before I started with German. Swedish is also a Germanic language, so many of the words are similar or even the same. But Swedish grammar is simplicity personified, so within a year of starting, I went back to Sweden and didn't even need people to translate any more for me. It is THAT easy. But German is the old perverted grammar that the Scandinavians (except the Icelanders) ditched long ago. You'd have to go up to the extreme northwest (where my wife is from) to find a version of German with simplified grammar, and even then, no one speaks that version outside of the small farm communities where it still survives. If you're trying to learn standard German (Hochdeutsch), grin and bear it, and slog on through. If you end up spending any time here, the rewards of your efforts will become obvious--take it from one who knows!

By the way, good luck if you want to learn German in Switzerland. They may WRITE it the same way, but what they speak is so different, you might as well start over again from the beginning, because you will understand NOTHING! It took me almost ten years of frequent visits to Switzerland before I could hold a coherent conversation in a Swiss dialect, not helped by the fact that each German-speaking canton has their own version!

discntnt_irny_srcsm

(18,479 posts)
104. We are all countrymen.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:58 PM
Mar 2022


The language is confusing for me at best. My German is decades out practice. Add to that everyone is an apologist:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ich_bin_ein_Berliner#%22I_am_a_doughnut%22_urban_legend

I remember the speech from when I was much younger. I'm terrible with languages in any case. Thanks for the clarification. I trust first hand knowledge more than most of what else is out there.

DFW

(54,341 posts)
111. Always figure that what is "out there" as you so aptly put it, is 90% BS and 10% reality
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 02:57 PM
Mar 2022

As far as German goes, I have been with my German wife now for almost 50 years (married for 40), and we have always spoken German with each other. At this point, I can cut through the BS. I know in some quarters, it's fashionable to claim that the jelly-filled donut is an urban legend. But nope, I live in Germany, and live the language. It isn't.

I remember on DU, about 6 years ago, it was fashionable to wish the USA was more like Germany, because everything is "free" here. The way some of those posts read, you'd think health care, education, food, housing, and everything up to and including air conditioning for your car were all free here. NOTHING is free here. Doctors don't work without pay. Teachers don't work without pay. Houses aren't built without being paid for. Many things are financed differently from how they are in the USA, but my wife is a social worker by profession. She knows from decades of her work: there are LOTS of Germans who do NOT have educations, health care, housing or food.

discntnt_irny_srcsm

(18,479 posts)
113. Firstly, it's late in your neighborhood so have pleasant evening.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 04:39 PM
Mar 2022

90/10% - I remember this Murphy's law corollary that says something like '90% of everything is crud.' I suppose the relative depth of the crud varies around the world but, as far as I can tell, my little corner is not the shallow end of the crud pool.

Guten abend.

ffr

(22,669 posts)
92. +1
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 11:14 AM
Mar 2022

Exactly! NATO and many other nations and companies are simply liberating the world of a murderous criminal through the use of a special operation. I'm surprised he even used the word WAR. There's no war here. Anybody see war? I don't. So therefore it can't be. What's he even talking about?

 

The Jungle 1

(4,552 posts)
75. Pick a day and time.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 08:40 AM
Mar 2022

We the world will all stand outside and flip off russia.
Perhaps puketin will get the message.

Marthe48

(16,935 posts)
76. Sanctions and other actions
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 08:42 AM
Mar 2022

are fair to use to limit your depredations, vlad. You got a wild hair up your ass and decided you wanted to dominate the world, starting with Ukraine. The world does not want to be dominated by the likes of you, you venal, souless criminal.

Lonestarblue

(9,971 posts)
77. In the past, Putin has threatened and the world has backed down.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 09:10 AM
Mar 2022

Why? Because oil and gas, because nukes, because business profits, because rich oligarchs investing in stuff, because people who launder illegal money make a lot of money. But it seems that Putin crossed the world’s red line, and the world is saying enough is enough. Time to stand up to this bully because he will not stop and will only get worse. Even if Putin stops the war now, the sanctions should stay in place as punishment. The West must not let Putin recoup his losses and then do this again. It is time for Russia to lose its status as a world power and its evil threat to the safety of the rest of the world. Let it collapse. Perhaps then its people can build a better nation.

llashram

(6,265 posts)
79. he is like his puppet
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 09:19 AM
Mar 2022

in marred-a-leggo, a narcissistic murderous psychopath. If a world war is started by him, he will bear total blame for the cause of total war.

ancianita

(36,023 posts)
82. Don't start nothin', won't be nothin'.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 10:00 AM
Mar 2022

Pretexts to commit evil and violence come out of baseless fear.
Defensive words & deeds against evil & violence are not violence.

Like J said, don't start nothin', won't be nothin'.


samsingh

(17,595 posts)
86. i don't think we care what this mass murdering imbecile says
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 10:30 AM
Mar 2022

the truth is that he's killing innocent people in Ukraine in a completely unprovoked attack. But russia is also going to get slaughtered - it's soldiers, civilians who will fight each other, and the russian economy will be devastated for all time. No one will trust russia again - it may disintegrate into tiny fourth world republics.

COL Mustard

(5,897 posts)
88. Your sanctions are akin to an act of war
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 10:50 AM
Mar 2022

You mean, Volodya, like actually INVADING another SOVEREIGN country????

Putin is acting more irrational every day. This started scary but it's getting worse.

Hey Putin, sit on a dick (Idi Na Khui)!

TomWilm

(1,832 posts)
91. It is true, that economic sanctions now is a form of warfare
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 11:07 AM
Mar 2022
Economic sanctions have long been viewed as a nonviolent strategy for deterring a host of threatening actions. ... But what was initially adopted as a peacekeeping tool in the years following World War I has ironically become that now resembles a form of warfare. ...
https://news.cornell.edu/stories/2022/01/economic-sanctions-evolved-tool-modern-war

While economic] sanctions are often portrayed as a kinder, gentler option than war, they result in devastating impacts on the health and well-being of communities. ... Sanctions are often framed as ways to put pressure on states to change their behavior, but they are most often ineffective as a diplomatic tool. ...

States rarely change their practices as a result of sanctions — and political and military elites usually remain insulated. Ultimately, it’s the most vulnerable communities that suffer the harmful effects. ...

Not only that, sanctions often lend power to repressive regimes, who capitalize on people’s suffering to cast themselves as liberators in the face of foreign oppression. ... When people are plunged into poverty, they more readily turn against the immediate source of that pain: US policies.

https://www.madre.org/press-publications/article/sanctions-are-act-war-qa-about-economic-sanctions

But it do feel good to see yet another Russian luxury yacht being towed away...

cayugafalls

(5,640 posts)
95. For clarity; Invade a country, drop bombs, kill civilians, not a war. Economic sanctions, WAR.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:18 PM
Mar 2022

Fuck you, you murderous sack of dna...

Just, fuck you.

I wipe my shoe on your smooshed remains.

58Sunliner

(4,381 posts)
96. The mentally diseased psycho who is unfit to govern, squawks on cue.
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:35 PM
Mar 2022

Too effing bad. You sound scared Putrid.

patphil

(6,169 posts)
97. "akin to an act of war"
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 12:39 PM
Mar 2022

OK Puty, so it won't matter if we do a few more things that are akin to acts of war...like provide planes, weapons, munitions, and volunteer soldiers to fight off your invasion of a sovereign state, which, by the way, wasn't akin to an act of war...it was and act of war.
No "akin" about it.

It's looking more and more like Putin is realizing he can't seize Ukraine, and that he will accept grabbing a couple chunks of it.
I think the Ukrainian people should reject that, and demand full withdrawal, with reparations. In return for...nothing; no concessions!

Ukraine must remain in tact, and be brought into NATO and the EU.
The scope of Putin's failure will haunt his few remaining months in office. Yes, I said months. My opinion, but it seems to me he has stepped in it big time with this ill-conceived war, and his ego won't let him just cut his losses and withdraw. At least not until the Russian Army loses a lot more men and equipment.
The generals must be getting worried about how this failure looks to the rest of the world. It makes Russia look weak.

Regardless of the outcome, this is one of Putin's defining moments. History will judge him harshly.

turbinetree

(24,695 posts)
102. So being a terrorist to a neighboring duly elected government is not an "act of war"
Sun Mar 6, 2022, 01:47 PM
Mar 2022

when you just invade it......you sound like that orange hair asshole in Florida that thinks your savvy and a genius. you seriously need to help and need seek medical attention.....your menace just like him to the planet,,,,

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