Patrol spots Chinese, Russian naval ships off Alaska island

[Omaha Steve]

Source: AP

By MARK THIESSEN

ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) — A U.S. Coast Guard ship on routine patrol in the Bering Sea came across a guided missile cruiser from China, officials said Monday.

But it turned out the cruiser wasn’t alone as it sailed about 86 miles (138 kilometers) north of Alaska’s Kiska Island, on Sept. 19.

Two other Chinese naval ships and four Russian naval vessels, including a destroyer, were spotted in single formation, the patrol boat, known as a cutter called Kimball, discovered.

The Honolulu-based Kimball, a 418-foot (127-meter) vessel, observed as the ships broke formation and dispersed. A C-130 Hercules provided air support for the Kimball from the Coast Guard station in Kodiak.



In this photo provided by the U.S. Coast Guard, a Coast Guard Cutter Kimball crew-member observes a foreign vessel in the Bering Sea, Monday, Sept. 19, 2022. The U.S. Coast Guard cutter on routine patrol in the Bering Sea came across the guided missile cruiser from the People's Republic of China, officials said Monday, Sept. 26. (U.S. Coast Guard District 17 via AP)


Read more: https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-china-alaska-honolulu-coast-guard-54638cccc30d5a0f8879022f493a6302

[Irish_Dem]

1. When will the world wake up to what Russia and China are planning?

They are determined to be the sole 21st century superpowers.

They are destroying democracies.

With the help of the GOP, look what they have done in the US.

In Gt Britain, they engineered Brexit.

Putin will try to punish Europe for supporting Ukraine by withholding heating oil and using nukes.

China is establishing a military presence in Asia and has already bought off big chunks of Africa and Latin America.

Time to face reality.

[Trueblue Texan]

2. I've been fearing...

...Chinese/Russian cooperation for more than 20 years. I was scoffed at, told I was being paranoid and ridiculous to worry about Russia. Maybe they thought my fears were rooted in Cold War issues. There weren't. They were rooted in what we are seeing today. I'm just a housewife in Texas (or back then I was) but I see things.

[ColinC]

3. Fortunately Russia is a bit preoccupied, and likely won't be much help to China

China, by itself, could be formidable, tho. Still, against the numbers and far more advanced weaponry of the west, I doubt China could do much without use of nukes and a strong ally.

[IronLionZion]

5. China doesn't have much war experience

they use their numbers to intimidate but when's the last time they were in combat with anyone?

For China, we're more likely to face economic issues like supply chain disruptions.

[Irish_Dem]

18. China has plans to remedy their lack of military experience. :(

[sarisataka]

25. Last major conflict

Was with Vietnam in the late 80s. As I recall the PLA was not very impressive.

Still China has a lot of troops and as it is said quantity has a quality of its own

[Irish_Dem]

17. China now has the largest military in the world and technology the US does not possess.

And this is just the starting point for them.

It has the US over a barrel in terms of our dependence on the goods they produce.

China has bought off a big chunk of Africa and Latin America. And will soon have dominance in the Pacific.

All the while the US is bogged down with internal conflict and corrupt leaders (GOP) who will take any bribe China offers.

I could go on and on but you get the drift.

Russia is not a problem for China, they understand Putin's limitations now with great clarity.

And they will turn it to their advantage. They are bailing out Putin now, and will most certainly expect
payback. Putin may have no choice but to hand over to them what they want.

[PortTack]

34. China May have the largest number of soldiers, but they are far from superior to US forces

Just for starters, the US policy since WWII Is to be ready at anytime to fight on two fronts.

Our carriers are far superior- military experts agree we are king of the skies and we “own” the oceans..the Atlantic and the Pacific and can respond within hours. The Chinese will never have dominance in the Pacific.

Their military budget is half of what ours is.
Approx 320 billion
Russia 67 billion
The US 768 billion

There are several very knowledgeable military experts that have spoken on this. I particularly like CP Scott. Retired officer, trained Ukrainian troops and NATO troops at Ramstein AF base. You might want to look too at some of George Friedman’s work, and Peter Zeihan, both geopolitical experts on China. China cannot afford to make war. The sanctions and the strain on their failing economy would finish them.

[sarisataka]

37. Interesting how the wind blows

Not so long ago the military was mocked on DU for not being able to handle a rag tag group in one of the poorest countries in the world.

Now I see posts that the US is an invincible superpower that will easily defeat any opponent or combination of opponents .

[PortTack]

42. Feel free to reference the ppl and numbers I put forward

[sarisataka]

44. Just an observation

As for ppl, simply read the replies here. I do not doubt your numbers but wars are not always won by who spends the most.

[PortTack]

47. True...its about logistics and trained soldiers. Along with high powered equipment that

Money does buy

[former9thward]

38. Sanctions on China would finish us as well.

We are too tied in with the Chinese economy. And we certainly can't win a land war in Asia We have been defeated in every Asian war since the end of WW II.

[PortTack]

40. I don't believe the US has any intention of fighting a war with China..why would we at this point?

As far as supply chains from China, more and more companies are switching their contracts for products from China to India and north and South America.

The Thomas Publishing Company conducted a survey in the spring of 2020. That was right about the time the pandemic began turning the world on its head. In it, fully 64% of the 878 manufacturing and industrial sector professionals said they “are likely to bring manufacturing production and sourcing back to North America.” In other words, manufacturers are leaving China in droves. That’s great news for the United States, Canada, and especially Mexico, which due to its lower labor costs, is likely to win most of that business.

https://www.kentusa.com/leaving-china-why-manufacturers-are-reshoring-to-north-america/

[former9thward]

43. Well most of those areas are unfriendly to the U.S.

India, Mexico, and most of the countries in S. America have rejected the sanctions on Russia.

[PortTack]

48. Modi flat out told Poopin at their big conference to knock it off! Go home and leave all of Ukraine

Yes, S american countries are not part of russian sanctions, but it doesn’t mean they don’t want to be our trading partners. Strange bed fellows.

[PortTack]

49. True..but doesn't mean they won't trade with us

Discussing security issues, Jaishankar praised the US for adopting a more “international” approach and becoming “more open to engaging with countries like India” in initiatives such as the Quad Security Dialogue – a four-nation bloc including the US, India, Japan and Australia – that hope to counter China as its influence grows in the Indo-Pacific.

Love us or hate us, they need us as trading partners


https://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy/article/3194048/eye-beijing-india-and-us-make-show-unity-amid-fissures

[Irish_Dem]

4. Yep. Some of us have seen it coming and been laughed at.

Maybe now people will start paying a bit of attention, and get serious about the issue.

Some ordinary people can put two and two together and get four.
So many people cannot.

What other things are you seeing?

[d_r]

15. way more than 20 years

My father was a POW in the korean war, he said there was a Russian officer who came to the prison camp and took other POW's away on a train.

[onetexan]

16. You forgot far right party's new PM Giorgia Meloni's win in Italy

The world's gone to hades in a handbasket. Human beings never seem to learn the lessons from history.

[Irish_Dem]

24. Yes, fascist psychopaths are now coming back to world power.

Here in the US we don't even know what to do with the GOP psychopaths on a permanent crime spree.

[dalton99a]

19. +1

[grantcart]

26. Malarkey

Yes, China, the largest fucking country in the world, plans to become a major super power. They don't give a flying crap about Russia, had they they would not have invaded Russia's number 1 client state, Vietnam which they did with 7 divisions in 1978.

China engineered Brexit? Lol. China prefers to have a united trading structure to expedite it's exports.

Russia always wants to cause divisions and probably assisted pushing social media but that doesn't account for why the UK didn't reverse course afterwards.

There are severe and unresolved problems with the EU that cannot be overlooked. Unlike the US they don't have one currency and one central bank they have one and 30. And if one central bank, like Greece, screws the pooch then the workers of France and Germany have to send hundreds of Billions to bail it out. Britain, who never joined the Euro felt there was too much exposure and not enough control.

UK also was left with questions on secondary refugee movement. Two million Syrian refugees entered Germany with very few having any German,a difficult language to learn, while all of them had workable English. They were concerned about becoming the overwhelming final home for refugees who move after resettlement like CA did with the Vietnamese.

I have best wishes for the EU but it has the same structural problems the Article of Confederation have.

Oh and these joint operations in the Pacific? They mirror , in a minor way, joint Japanese/US operations which have been ongoing at 10times the scale for decades, and which was announced is going to see a substantial increase.

[PortTack]

35. Yup...following President Biden's announcement regarding our policy in Taiwan which is no longer

The policy of Nixon…one China, and that we will defend Taiwan, Xi put out a statement saying they were going to dial down any aggressive exercises in the straits of Taiwan. They want a peaceful resolution. In other words, they think in a few decades, they can move in enough Chinese residents, hold a referendum and suddenly, Taiwan and China are one. Taiwan is not having any of it.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10142972095

China is in deep deep trouble financially and they know they cannot afford any US sanctions…a paper tiger!

[former9thward]

39. True but what does face reality mean?

War? We can't win a war with China.

[Heather MC]

6. Anybody else sick and tired of a couple of men deciding what happens to the rest of us?

When these idiots are defeated can we have a discussion about stop putting people like that in power.

Like a global discussion because the s*** is annoying

[Irish_Dem]

20. Yes we are allowing a handful of psychopaths to destroy us and the planet.

[Heather MC]

23. It's literally exhausting,

6 months after Joe Biden finally ends an unnecessary war in Afghanistan, Putin just decides to invade Ukraine. Literally

Frankly I believe the war mongers were angry at Biden for ending their plans for 30 years of war, so so they teed up Putin to start another one.

[gab13by13]

7. Isn't it the granddaughter of Mussolini

who is now the leader of Italy? It is what the Magats want for America.

I expected it would be Sister Sarah who made the sighting.

[sl8]

8. No.

You may be thinking of the granddaughter that's a member of Rome's city council.

[wnylib]

9. No, but she belongs to a party that was founded by

Mussolini supporters after WWII.

[AntiFascist]

52. Those who support Mussolini won't last for long n/t

[wnylib]

10. My guess is that China is flexing its muscles

after Pelosi's visit to Taiwan. Russia is along for a show of unity. The message is, don't mess with Taiwan.

[Alexander Of Assyria]

12. The message is...any military can hold joint exercises with another....like America does

every month with dozens of military alllies in dozens of countries it has massive military presence in…open your eyes folks, it’s all in front of you.

[NJCher]

13. Cheap way

For Putin to look strong as his citizens flee the country.

I would not, however, discount Irish Dem’s point.

[The Jungle 1]

14. Our military is way further advanced than even the combination of China and russia.

Think about it, Ukraine was getting bombed into submission. We sent 14 HIMARS missile systems to Ukraine and completely changed the direction of the war in a couple of weeks. Our satellites and intelligence operations are targeting the missile systems. Russia is communicating on CELL PHONES! They have little or no encrypted communication. This war is being operated by remote control. We have the remote. The russian generals are being picked off one by one.
That is just one of our weapon systems. Our Air Force is so far advanced that we own the skies in the entire world. NO ONE would put their planes in the sky against us.
That is us standing alone. However we do not stand alone. We are part of NATO. China and russia are not going to F with NATO.
I used to be very critical of our military expenditures. I have changed my position on that.

[Irish_Dem]

21. China is the largest military in the world and has technology we don't possess.

The Pentagon has been warning us about it.

And this is just the starting point for China.
Give it another decade.

[The Jungle 1]

30. I would disagree with your position

Yes China has more people in its military. However...
We spend 750 billion on our military China 237
China has ONE aircraft carrier. It will not be deployed until 2024. ONE!
China has more navy hulls than we do. But that does not really matter. We have 11 aircraft carriers. They have ONE broken aircraft carrier!
China's air force is ranked 7th in the world. They would not last one day against us. No one is even close to us.
We have 13,247 aircraft China has 3,285.

What technology does China have that we don't have? I will say this, our public does not know what we have.
The Pentagon always cries wolf. That is how we became the most powerful military the world has ever seen.
"we believe that the recent clamor over China’s strategic ambitions is greatly overblown." Brookings
https://www.brookings.edu/articles/chinas-hollow-military/
That is a very good article describing the paper tiger that is China's military. Brookings is a respected nonpartisan source.
Give them another decade you say. Ok well consider this, give us another decade while we spend 500 billion more a year on our military. We are way ahead now!

[Irish_Dem]

31. Everyone one said the same thing before China's economic and social miracle 20 yrs ago.

A country in abject poverty, horrendous brutal repression.

In a very short period of time it was transformed into an entirely different country.
People said it couldn't happen but it did.

You can google the Pentagon warnings about Chinese military technology.

The US continues to weaken, China becomes more powerful.

We ignore China at our own peril.

[The Jungle 1]

50. Nixon started the capitalism that changed China and destroyed American manufacturing.

I don't believe it was a miracle and it was started around 50 years ago. Capitalism works. China is nothing but a source of cheap labor. America has churned through several countries this way. We did the same thing to the coal miners in Pa. As soon as the workers started demanding more money the mines just hired a different nationality and made them a bunch of promises. Now we just switch countries. None of this is new.

Again the Pentagon always cries wolf. Brookings however is a respected and independent source of information. They disagree with you.

The number of personnel in our military is shrinking. That does not mean we are getting weaker. Industry is more productive with less people now a days. Our military is also way more productive with less people. Very shortly there will not be people fighting. There will be unmanned machines fighting! I would guess 10 years, maybe less.

Again 14 HIMARS missile systems completely changed the Ukraine war. How long until that missile system operates without people? I would bet we already have that system. Ukraine was getting bombed without mercy. The HIMARS cut the russian supply lines. No bullets no bombs no war. Just 14 HIMARS did that. Russia can't fly their jets because we gave Ukraine stingers. Point and shoot. What I am reading is that russia has yet to take out a single HIMARS. They have no answer to 14 HIMARS. HIMARS were produced in 1993. It is an old system. Just imagine what we have now that they aren't telling us about.

America has a strong, motivated and honest military. Russia and China are corrupt and unmotivated.

[former9thward]

41. You are throwing around dollars like it means victory.

We were defeated in Afghanistan by people who have no military budget and very little technology.

[The Jungle 1]

45. We clearly won the war in Afghanistan!

We did not win the people. We made an offer of change and they rejected it and stood down in 11 days. We were suckered and used. That is a political loss not a military loss. Our military had complete control of Afghanistan they won their assignment.
Afghanistan still produces 90% of the worlds heroin. They continue to abuse women and boys. They are hungry because they do not produce enough food. But that is what the people want. They get what they want. We are done with them.

[former9thward]

46. Our military never had full control of Afghanistan.

Not even close. Anytime in the 21 years we were there. We controlled Kabul (just barely) and a few provinces here and there. Don't re-write history. You can't separate the political (or the people) from the military. They go hand in hand. We lost.

[The Jungle 1]

51. Ok we disagree.

While we where in that country we controlled it. They went prostrate in 11 days. The people do not want freedom.

[PortTack]

36. Absolutely..China and Russia are well aware of it too

See post #34

[The Jungle 1]

56. We pretty much said the same things.

I really do not think the average American understands how superior our military is.
Integrity, moral, training and equipment our military is far superior than any other country. The order listed may not be correct but those are our strengths.

[PortTack]

57. Definitely....in these difficult times it's the ONLY thing idiots like Poopin and far RW governments

Understand. We should be grateful

[David__77]

22. So, very far from US waters.

…

[sarisataka]

28. Kiska is part of Alaska

Which is a US state so no, not very far from US waters.

They however were in international waters so while we observed their passage we acknowledge they have the right of free navigation.

[David__77]

29. Right, 86 miles away.

…

[sarisataka]

27. It's a free ocean

And China has stated they have interest in the arctic

[WestofDenver]

32. Did the Kimball

just stumble over a convoy of 7 ships? I see air support was offered after discovery, but wouldn't some form of US surveillance have already seen them coming?

[Chainfire]

33. I am more worried about us being destroyed from the inside than China or Russia.

I only have so many rooms in my worry hotel. With MAGA we face a real and present danger of national suicide without any outside interference.

As far as Russia and China tag teaming us, they can never trust each other enough to become solid allies. The Russian Army has shown itself to be rather impotent on a world scale and without nuclear weapons they would be a third world dictatorship with a clown despot leader. Their nuclear weapons are only good for a bluff, because if they used them they would end as a smoking bowl of glass, and they know it. MAD is a great peace keeper.

[AntiFascist]

53. You're ignoring medium and short-range nuclear weapons which are a particular threat to Europe...

meanwhile, Europe has been busy developing hydrogen and solar energy sources as an alternative to natural gas from Russia. This will allow them to better depend on US nuclear deterrence. I wish them luck.

[Chainfire]

55. No ignoring it at all. As soon a the first nuke is used I don't thing that the escalation stops

until the arsenals are empty.