Russia-Ukraine war live: Kyiv applies for Nato membership after Putin annexes Ukrainian regions

[speak easy]

Source: The Guardian.

Ukraine has formally submitted its application to join the Nato alliance, its president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, has announced.

In a video update, Zelenskiy said Ukraine was "taking a decisive step for entire security of free nations".

Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/sep/30/russia-ukraine-war-live-news-biden-and-zelenskiy-reject-expected-annexations-ahead-of-putin-speech

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Obviously Ukraine would not have made an application without consulting the United States.

Statement by President Zelensky
https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news/mi-robimo-svij-viznachalnij-krok-pidpisuyuchi-zayavku-ukrayi-78173

[FelineOverlord]

1. Yes!

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[JohnSJ]

2. With Russia's annexation move, this makes perfect sense as a counter to that. I wonder if NATO will

agree.

With the new leadership in the UK and Italy it will be interesting if that changes anything

[lamp_shade]

3. I thought they had already applied.

[speak easy]

4. No.

There were ongoing negotiations about what 'security guarantees' Ukraine could be given after the war.

[lamp_shade]

6. Thanks. nt

[sarisataka]

5. Acceptance is not happening

Unless NATO want to go to war with Russia

[speak easy]

8. The question is, does Russia want war with NATO?

[Lancero]

9. Considering that they're lining things up to justify dropping nukes...

They're either gunning for a war, or banking on the West appeasing them. Again.

[sarisataka]

13. They probably don't

But Russia is at war with Ukraine, regardless of what Russia calls it. If NATO joins they are choosing to go to war. Russia has not attacked a current NATO member.

[Pachamama]

31. The Sabotage of the Nordstream pipelines?

Could that possibly be considered an attack on NATO members?

Jens Stoltenberg and the various members of NATO realize the significance of this. Putin already has fired the first shot.

[OneCrazyDiamond]

26. The people of Russia, or

The Madmen who sent their troops to die by US made warfare? I don't think the latter cares.

[BeyondGeography]

10. Acceptance or not

NATO is already part of Ukraine’s future. All of its weaponry and training will come from NATO members and security guarantees from within the alliance will be part of any settlement with Russia.

[Bayard]

15. Agreed

Nobody wants that. Can't afford it in all kinds of ways.

[Beastly Boy]

11. My guess is that Nato will reply with accelerated (or immediate) acceptance of Finland and Sweden

And officially take Ukraine's application under advisement.

Even if Nato doesn't intend to advance Ukraine's application in the near future, a lot may change in a few months. In the mean time, the threat of Ukraine asking for Nato membership may be enough to shut Putin up with his nuclear attack rhetoric.

Putin genuinely fears Nato expanding into Ukraine. All his gloating over his fake annexation of parts of Ukraine pale in comparison with his angst over Nato troops being stationed within 500 miles of Moscow.

[Lovie777]

12. UGH . ..

Hungary Orban is a ass kisser for Putin.

[AZLD4Candidate]

14. Putin just started WW3

[Duppers]

28. Been thinking about that.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1016333399

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1017728947


Folks agree with you, including me.

[Torchlight]

16. Fascinating language the western leaders

are using to inform Moscow of potential consequences to their continued invasion. I think this is more a statement of intent, a declaration of what could come should Putin keep his current course.

Interesting to note that a month after Zelenskyy winning the presidency, Ukraine joined NATO's enhanced opportunity partner interoperability program


And bear in mind as well, NATO Secretary General Stoltenberg has publicly stressed more than once that Russia will not be able to veto Ukraine's accession to NATO "as we will not return to the era of spheres of interest, when large countries decide what smaller ones should do."

[blue-wave]

17. Should have been done years ago

long before Pooty's 2nd invasion of Ukraine, better known as his war of terror and genocide. Heck, even before the first invasion in 2014.

[Sogo]

18. I think this means an abrupt halt to the RU/UKR war.

especially if NATO were to give an accelerated approval to UKR membership....

[sarisataka]

19. Or WWIII

[Sogo]

20. I prefer to see the glass half full.

[sarisataka]

21. Risk analysis has taught me

To look at what is the worst possible result and mitigate the chances of it happening.

[Beachnutt]

23. Wouldn't the risk be russia taking over Ukraine

and expanding it's reach into Europe and beyond ultimately ?
Adolf Putin has to be stopped asap.

[sarisataka]

24. That is 'A' risk, not the worst

The worst is an all out strategic nuclear war. Many want to just hand wave that away with wishes. "Putin would never do that" or "the missiles probably don't work" however the same also said he would never invade. Do you want to stand in the city with 6-10 megatons inbound hoping the warheads won't go boom?

It is a moot point if they work because if Russia launches we are not going to wait to see if they explode before we launch. Russia is not going to have a 100% failure to launch rate.

So the solution is how to avoid that while stopping Russian expansion and returning occupied territory to Ukraine.

[colorado_ufo]

22. Russia does not have the capacity to fight NATO. Period.

Putin will have to do some "fancy dancin'" to back out of this disaster graciously, or else the oligarchs will find a way to send him on a permanent vacation. He has already damaged his own country terribly.

[sarisataka]

25. Not a conventional war

Which is why Soviet/ Russian battle plans always include options for NBC use. Even then NATO would be likely to win.

So how many millions of casualties make the fruits of victory taste like ash?

[ripcord]

27. Maybe the U.S. needs to give NATO a little reminder

When the U.S. enter WW2 in Europe we were under no obligation to do so, in fact since we had been attacked in the Pacific it would have made more sense for us as a nation to concentrate there first. We focused on the war in Europe because helping them was the right thing to do, NATO should remember that.

[Duppers]

29. They're not?

[ripcord]

30. We could have just kept Lend Lease going and not committed troops

Our President and countrymen chose to enter an existing conflict, to sacrifice, bleed and die to save the rest of Europe from Germany, they were under no obligation and could have left them to die but they chose to do the right thing. Before the war there were a groups of Americans opposed to getting into the war, they wanted to leave Europe to settle their own business, they went by the name American First, now we seem to have NATO First.

[BrightKnight]

32. NATO might take time but it would take minutes for Ukraine to become Nuclear power again.

Ukraine could easily be provided with tactical and strategic nukes. It would not make sense to just provide them with tactical weapons.

I would make sure they know that Russia knows that Ukraine would be fully armed if the were dumb enough to play that card.