South Dakota Law Will Allow Guns in Classrooms

[alp227]

Source: NYT

Gov. Dennis Daugaard of South Dakota on Friday signed into law a bill that would allow teachers to carry guns in the classroom.

While some other states have provisions in their gun laws that make it possible for teachers to be armed, South Dakota is believed to be the first state to pass a law that specifically allows teachers to carry firearms.

About two dozen states have proposed similar bills since the shootings in December at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., but all of them have stalled.

Supporters say that the measure signed by Mr. Daugaard, a Republican, is important in a rural state like South Dakota, where some schools are many miles away from emergency responders.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/09/us/south-dakota-gun-law-classrooms.html

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Welcome to the new America.

[Warren Stupidity]

1. What could possibly go wrong?

[olddad56]

59. why handguns, I think hand gernades would more of a deterent.

[unblock]

2. hmm, how to handle severely stressed out teachers with 30 maniacs tormenting them daily...

i know! give 'em gunz!

[Bay Boy]

4. If you truly feel that way you should...

...pull your kids out of school RIGHT NOW!

Serious, if you have that little respect for teachers, you should start homeschooling your children.

[unblock]

5. well i suppose you're entitled to misinterpret my post any way you care to.

i have nothing but respect for teachers, who have helped me in my own upbringing, and are currently helping mini-unblock in his.

i have further respect and sympathy for them as they have to handle stress from kids, parents, administrators, and at times, politicians, regulators, the media, etc.

i'm merely noting that in a sufficiently large population, some people won't handle stress with the grace and responsibility that the vast majority of teachers would.

that's not a sign of a lack of respect in any way.

omitting the "ly" from the end of "serious", now THAT's lack of respect for one's teachers /snark!

[valerief]

28. I believe the poster has a justified lack of respect for guns, not teachers. nt

[RiverNoord]

42. That's some low-grade bullshit you're shoveling

I have a great deal of respect for teachers. My sister and brother-in-law are teachers, as are several of my closest friends. I have spoken with all of them since the calamity in Newtown, and, without exception, they all told me that allowing armed teachers would be a terrible idea.

Two friends, both teachers, told me that they would not allow their children to attend class with a teacher who is armed.

Teachers are people too - like everywhere else, some are not so particularly balanced at times, and most experience very trying times with students at times.

The incredible stupidity of directly blending firearms possession with classroom instruction is astounding. Period.

[Bay Boy]

47. So these teachers who "aren't so particularly balanced"...

...are they like a ticking time bomb ready to go off at any time?

If so, what is preventing them from bringing a gun to school right now?

Nothing.

[Neoma]

50. That's happened before.

[RiverNoord]

60. Does anyone think that George Zimmerman

would have chased down Trayvon Martin and shot him if he wasn't aware of the Florida 'stand your ground' law? When the law endorses something stupid, there are always people who take it much too far.

I would like to know if anyone here endorses the idea of allowing anyone who wanted to exercise their 2nd amendment rights by carrying an AR-15 onto a passenger airliner to do so. Pretty stupid, isn't it? Who'd fly?

What makes schools different? Endorsing the carrying of firearms by teachers, who are, on a daily basis, in very close contact with children in an largely enclosed environment, an environment which is mandated by law for virtually all young people, is stupid. It's stupid on the face of it, and it's doubly stupid because common sense indicates that some teachers would end up going well beyond what was intended by the enactment of the law.

In fact, it's stupid that we're even discussing it.

[Bay Boy]

3. Isn't it uncomfortable walking around with your panties in a bunch all day?

Ever since concealed carry started to spread around the country people (like you) have said that 'blood will run in the streets'. And all these years they've been wrong.

Only a small percentage of teachers will ever take advantage of the ability to carry concealed in school but that small percentage just might discourage the next whack-o from even considering a rampage at a school.

[russspeakeasy]

6. Back to your comic books.

[Bay Boy]

62. That's kind of freaky...

...I was just rummaging through some storage boxes laying around the house and found an old Superman comic of mine from the 1960s that I read. So to make you happy I'll look for some more and read them too.

[russspeakeasy]

65. Yeah, it is !

[donquijoterocket]

8. and that rock

but that small percentage just might discourage the next whack-o from even considering a rampage at a school.
And that special rock I keep in my back yard has kept elephants away all these years. I've never seen one in my garden plot yet.

[Aerows]

64. I have one that keeps tigers away.

I haven't seen a tiger yet in my backyard, so obviously, it works

[olddad56]

10. whether teachers carry concealed weapons or not isn't going to prevent the next whacko.

the whacko will more than likely be carrying a semi automatic weapon. So what are you thinking, arm the teachers with semi automatic weapons also so that the teacher and the whacko can shot it out and the kids get killed in the crossfire?

I don't care if the teachers carry a concealed weapon or not, and it is possible that a teacher with a gun could prevent a shooting at a school, but not very probable.

If we, as a society have gotten to the place where teachers need to carry loaded guns in class, I'm about out of hope for this nation.

[Jenoch]

29. It's been done before.

http://rogersparkbench.blogspot.com/2012/12/how-armed-asst-principal-stopped-school.html#.UTqDQkaJfO8

[donquijoterocket]

11. You'd need

To provide a direct quote with the source for that "blood in streets"statement. I've never heard anyone but wingnut gunners use it as a hyperbolic take on what they thought the more guns more potential for accidents and other violence meant. But since I know you can't do it just curl back up and dream your Wyatt earp dreams.

[noiretextatique]

12. or they might accidentally shoot themselves or someone else

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/28/glenn-geddie-texas-school-employee-shot_n_2781762.html
http://www.9news.com/dontmiss/299943/630/Employee-charged--after-accidental-shooting-at-CU-dental-school

stupid, stupid law, in a stupid state, in a stupid gun-obsessed country.

[apocalypsehow]

13. "Lazarus, come forth!"

Someone's been rummaging around in their sock drawer.

Enjoy your, ummmm, stay.

[Nihil]

71. For anyone who is missing the point ...

Bat boy's stats:
> Member since: Thu Jul 21, 2005, 06:43 PM
> Number of posts: 384
> Number of posts, last 90 days: 377

(Whoops ... that should actually read "Bay boy's stats" ... )

[AlbertCat]

18. 'blood will run in the streets'.

Well, to be fair it's not always in the street






Besides, it seems to me those who think we should live in a country where everyone needs to carry a gun everywhere they go, all because of some 18th century provision designed to stop the British when they come back (like they did in 1812) are the ones with their panties in a wad.

[beevul]

19. Which of those had anything to do with CCW? N/T

[AlbertCat]

20. Which of those had anything to do with CCW?

The ones that have to do with the lackadaisical attitude toward guns. (often demonstrated by disingenuous nitpicking while ignoring the big picture)

[beevul]

66. And red herrings and disingenuous references to events unrelated to the discussion at hand...

Yeah, those are just fine.

[AlbertCat]

67. See?

I was right!

[KamaAina]

21. I'm sure Adam Lanza took time to make sure that none of the teachers were armed

before he went up there. Maybe even before he killed his mom.

And if you believe that, I've got a bridge I'd like to show you, and it isn't the one that carries I-84 across the Housatonic River from Sandy Hook.

[Jenoch]

31. Lanza killed himself

when people with guns showed up at the school.

[KamaAina]

41. How many people? And with what type of guns?

You can't possibly be comparing carloads full of fully armed law enforcement officials to a handful of teachers with guns underneath their desks in cases labeled "OPEN ONLY IN CASE OF EMERGENCY", that they'd fired once in their lives, if that, can you?

[Jenoch]

43. No, I am not.

I do not understand how you can trivialize the topic with your attempt at sarcastic humor.

[AlbertCat]

68. Lanza killed himself

Which is why it wouldn't matter if it was a gun free or a gun-full zone. These people don't care if they survive. Guns everywhere are no deterrent.

[Warren Stupidity]

22. Dude, the blood is running in the streets. 30,000 gun deaths a year.

Year after year after year. All out of proportion to any other developed country.

[mokawanis]

26. Another possibility

is that a teacher will accidentally fire their gun and put a bullet in a kid's head. Then people like you can explain it away and continue with the absurd argument that guns make us safe.

[TheCowsCameHome]

57. Not any more than you chewing on yours.

Moran

[Historic NY]

7. How many times will we see this...gun goes off in school....

This was a few miles north of me....

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/06/guns-school-officer-shoots/1966639/

[mainstreetonce]

9. Liability?

Teacher verbally disciplines student. Parent claims mental anguish child suffered from gun wielding teacher. Parent sues school. Lawyers get rich. Children are not safer from intruder armed as the one in CT.

What an awful idea.....

[ManiacJoe]

27. The gun did not "go off".

> How many times will we see this...gun goes off in school....

The user pulled the trigger.

[Historic NY]

36. Well I was going to say an attempt to make him macho he goes out and gets ...

a 45.cal...which requires it be cocked & locked. He hasn't got a clue since most depts. don't use them but Part time Barney who should know better decided to play Quicks Draw with a gun that should never have cleared leather. Does that work for you... I'm talking from 30+ yrs and its no weapon for some "knob" to be carrying. I'm willing to bet he doesn't return to duty once the town decides this guy is a liability. I'm also willing to bet the town specifies exactly just what kind of weapon its officer will carry. IMHO.

[ManiacJoe]

37. Chances are it was a Glock.

He was playing with it when he should not have been. When he attempted to put it back into the holster, his finger was still on the trigger.

[Historic NY]

38. It has to be a conscious decision to put your finger in or on the trigger....

why would it have ever been unholstered? I've handled them from 1986 to date.

[ManiacJoe]

61. Thus the ongoing investigation....

[Blandocyte]

72. Not when the gun's falling and you grab it

That happened to one of my local cops. Also there has been an issue with some holster parts hitting the "safe action" trigger upon reholstering. Limit the teachers to double action only if any decide to carry in school.

[Brayshawna Williams]

14. Doesn't surprise me coming from that part of the country

Sadly, conservatism there is a lifestyle.

[CokeMachine]

24. Nice

Regional bigotry fail

Welcome to DU

[alp227]

30. I visited the Rapid City/Mt Rushmore areas back in summer 2008

and I remember seeing a store somewhere either in rural western SD or somewhere around the SD/WY border that had a sign "Armed old granny inside". So I've seen "conservatism as a lifestyle" in that area, in the poster's defense.

[CokeMachine]

44. You lost me

One store somewhere OK. How did you know "conservatism as a lifestyle" is what you noticed somewhere? Where I grew up you'd see the same signs everywhere. Did you ever think it's just a regional/local thing? I grew up in one of two counties in Idaho that is progressive. Shit there is a plaque in Mom's kitchen that says "the cook is armed so don't complain". People do, do stuff just for fun -- maybe. You city folk take everything to heart -- no wonder nothing gets changed. Your comment is why people in remote areas see CA plates and just brush you aside as they would an 8 year old that said his/her first fuck word. Little children experimenting with what they heard.

Regional bigotry sucks but those of us that live (a little north of SF) in the "correct places" are true progressives. Cities suck -- wide open places where you can actually see the stars above the lights are primitive? How are those Grizzly bears doing in California (they are on the flag)? Oops you don't have any, any more. I realize you are better than us that grew up in small towns (rural areas) but we have something you'll never have and that is wide open Sky's and the ability to laugh without being thought of as morons/back wards. We laugh at jokes -- not at people. Everyone is funny as long as you're laughing with them and not at them.

Done here -- Good God you make me wonder why I even participate in Progressive causes when City folks are perfect and rural folks are primitive.

I probably read more into your comment than you actually meant but I see so much regional bigotry on this forum that I had to let it out.

Have a good weekend.

[primavera]

48. But different regions DO have different demographics

I don't think anyone here is saying that every single person in South Dakota is conservative. But, as a state, South Dakota does legitimately have a long and well-documented history of conservative voting behavior. That's not bigotry, it's just the reality, and most South Dakotans, I daresay, would agree that they vote conservatively and are probably proud of that.

Likewise, there is a significant division between urban and rural political behavior. In the last election, 27 of the 30 largest cities in the US voted for Obama. Urban areas are the main source of the Democratic Party's base; the GOP has its base chiefly in suburban and rural areas. It's not prejudice to merely state what is a well-established, undisputed fact.

[prairierose]

51. Hate to burst your bubble but that sign is a joke and gift shops....

in this area sell most of them to tourists. However, the occasional local buys one for a joke too. A more popular one is " No Trespassing We don't call 911" And silly signs have nothing to do with '"conservatism as a lifestyle"' which,by the way, pretty much does not exist here except in the form of rwnj churches, just like everywhere else.

However, there are many of us who work or have worked in the tourist industry who really, truly enjoy telling whoppers to visiting city folks. It's amazing what so many of them will swallow as true. After all, we haven't had running water here for very long.

[Eleanors38]

52. At least the "regional bigots" got interrupted from their Florida duties.

[AlbertCat]

15. Yes! This is way better than.....

..... spending money on more emergency responders. Right?

[Jenoch]

32. Huh? Don't tell me you really don't understand the point they are trying to make.

They have emergency responders. But some rural schools are miles and miles from those responders. Have you ever BEEN to South Dakota?

[AlbertCat]

69. Don't tell me you really don't understand the point they are trying to make.

Yes yes. You're so right. Having teachers carry guns is the ONLY solution.

[Jenoch]

70. Where has ANYONE

said arming teacher 'was the only solution'?

[Blandocyte]

16. Arithmetic: Crazy shooter bursts into classroom, kills gun totin' teacher, now has 2 guns

Simple arithmetic.

[timdog44]

17. When the first teacher kills a student or two,

they will call it collateral damage?

[obama2terms]

23. This is bizarre

Why not have trained policeman instead? I showed this to my very pro-gun, NRA loving friend ( we NEVER agree on anything gun related) and even he thinks arming teachers is crazy. If everyone here on DU knew him like I do, you all would know that means something. I couldn't believe my ears when he agreed with me!

[slackmaster]

25. <cough> Trained policeman? <cough>

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022479858

[Eleanors38]

53. There are already 10K> armed LEOs in U.S. schools.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

33. OMG!

It is way too dangerous for teachers to carry guns.

[reteachinwi]

34. It's way too sad for teachers to carry guns.

I always thought protecting my students meant compassion, caring, nay love...

[Bay Boy]

63. Agreed. And occaisionally...

...a teacher comes across a situation that requires more. Some of the teachers for example did heroic things at Sandy Hook. Shielding their students for example. It would have been better if instead of sacrificing their lives for their kids that they could have stopped the madman.

[Nanjing to Seoul]

35. I will never teach in the States again!

[Brigid]

39. If I had kids . . .

I would yank them out of school and start homeschooling immediately if this crap started around here. It's way too dangerous. Classroom full of kids
+ gun = trouble. Here endeth today's math lesson, boys and girls.

[reteachinwi]

40. ...

[union_maid]

45. Thinking back to some of the teachers I had in school...

not a great idea. Not to malign teachers - my mother was one and my son hopes to be one - but there were too many I wouldn't have trusted around sharp objects let alone with guns in school. And then, I'm just imagining my mother, armed, defending her classroom against armed intruders. It doesn't compute.

[Blandocyte]

73. I imagine my timid literature teacher in a shootout

and want to write a poem about it.

[Blandocyte]

46. Gets crazier sounding the more I think about it. n/t

[underpants]

49. in BOTH classrooms??

Sorry I couldn't resist. I am sure that South Dakota has at least 50 or so classrooms statewide.

[valerief]

54. Insanity reigns. nt

[olddots]

55. heres whats wrong with this picture

Say you're a student that's going to commit suicide in a blaze of bullets after offing other students,teachers and school staff.You won't care if the teachers had guns ,this would make your insane mission all more news worthy .

We have to try to understand the problem and not make it worse ---this country is becoming totally reactionary as it gets dumber and fuck these states that want to remain in time period that was very different than a John Wayne cowboy film .

[olddad56]

56. Just curious, does anyone know if there has ever been a shooting in a school in SD?

[olddad56]

58. found one

looked at list from 1700 until this decade. This one happened 52 years ago.

January 4, 1961: Delmont, South Dakota Donald Kurtz, 17-year-old senior at Delmont High School, was fatally wounded by a .22 caliber bullet from a rifle. The shot, intended as a sound effect for a school play, hit him in the chest during a rehearsal just minutes before the play was to take place.

All I'm saying is I think that SD is probably one of the safest states in the US. Maybe not now that fracking has brought in a new element to the population.