Former TWA Flight 800 crash investigators want federal government to re-examine case

[UpInArms]

Source: Star Tribune

MINEOLA, N.Y. — Former investigators are pushing to reopen the probe into the 1996 crash of TWA Flight 800 off the coast of New York, saying new evidence points to the often-discounted theory that a missile strike may have downed the jumbo jet.

The New York-to-Paris flight crashed July 17, 1996, just minutes after the jetliner took off from John F. Kennedy Airport, killing all 230 people aboard.

The effort to reopen the probe is being made in tandem with the release next month of a documentary that features the testimony of former investigators who raise doubts about the National Transportation Safety Board's conclusion that the crash was caused by a center fuel tank explosion, probably caused by a spark from a short-circuit in the wiring.

"We don't know who fired the missile," said Jim Speer, an accident investigator for the Air Line Pilots Association, one of those seeking a new review of the probe. "But we have a lot more confidence that it was a missile."

Read more: http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/travel/212232731.html

[babylonsister]

1. I don't believe it.

The NTSB took years to reconstruct the plane and determine what happened. I think their reputation is pretty sound.

Maybe someone wants to plug a movie, too.

[Blue_Tires]

25. The film is being shown on one of those newer channels

trying to get a niche for itself...

The cynic in me says they're exploiting the tragedy to draw viewers, but no one wants to hear that.....

[Politicalboi]

2. I prefer them to investigate

How 2 110 story buildings fall without resistance, and nowhere near how NIST animation showed with core beams still intact, but that's me.

[AtheistCrusader]

3. TWA 800 has nothing at all to do with 9/11.

And the NIST model is perfectly fine.

[hlthe2b]

6. NTSB has not immediately discounted this petition for reopening of the investigation

I think that says something...I'm certainly not going to discount so quickly either.

The NTSB issued a statement Wednesday morning saying it is aware of the upcoming documentary.

"All petitions for reconsideration are thoroughly reviewed, and a determination is usually made within about 60 days," spokeswoman Kelly Nantel said. "While the NTSB rarely re-investigates issues that have already been examined, our investigations are never closed and we can review any new information not previously considered by the board."

[AtheistCrusader]

10. Ok, but even if it is reopened

it still has nada to do with 9/11.

Perhaps you meant to respond to someone else? I can't tell.

[hlthe2b]

12. where in any of my posts have I even mentioned 911? HUH?

I am responding to those discounting out-of-hand, the TWA Flight 800 request by some of its OWN investigators to reopen.. I see that some are trying to hijack the thread to discuss 911 conspiracies, but I took the OP at face value.

[AtheistCrusader]

13. Well, you responded to me.

I was responding to a 'truther' that brought up 9/11 for no reason.

You responded to me, which usually indicates some sort of counterpoint, but honestly, it looks like maybe you just picked the wrong post to hit reply on? I'm not sure what happened there.

I am not a truther, and am not discounting the TWA800 investigation request.

[dixiegrrrrl]

5. I think you mean

how 3 buildings fall without resistance.
Remember bldng 7.

[AtheistCrusader]

9. Except that none of them fell at 'free fall'.

One corner of WTC 7 approached free fall for about 2 seconds. Towers 1 and 2 took CONSIDERABLY longer than requisite 9.2 seconds to collapse.

[KansDem]

11. And how passport(s) survived the huge fireball...

...to be found on the street.



http://www.historycommons.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&investigations:_a_detailed_look=penttbom

[NutmegYankee]

14. The plane was traveling at 400+ MPH

Lots of debris was going to pass through before it could be burned.

[KansDem]

16. Yes, I’ve heard this theory

But let’s assume for a moment that the attacker had his passport on him. That would mean it was tucked away inside a clothing garment or perhaps an attaché case. Then that garment or case was inside a plane. And, and the time of explosion, the plane was inside a building.

We’re not talking about something lying in the open that is flung away by an explosion. The passport would have to escape the confines of the body (clothing or case), then the confines of the plane and then the confines of the building without burning up in the explosion.

I just find that hard to believe.

But let’s not stop there. Let’s consider Bush’s actions on that day. When asked about the first attack—

He "saw" it on a TV (0'24&quot —

Then he "heard" about it (0'52&quot —

I wish someone in the media would ask him to clarify himself.

Finally, this is the President of the United States, Commander in Chief of its Armed Forces, and Leader of the Free World upon learning his country was under attack—



But you can see his "response" more vividly in the first video above.

I’m just not buying the “official version” anymore…

[NutmegYankee]

17. LOL.

Not that hard for a small book to escape a bag that is getting shredded open. Spare me the woo. I'm an engineer. I know that truthers are just full of shit.

[KansDem]

18. Truther, eh?

Soon after 9/11 I attended a forum of so-called "truthers." Two attendees doubted the "official story" and believed there was controlled demolition involved. One was an ex-military demolition expert, the other worked in construction. I thought at the time these two fellows sounded credible but doubted the controlled-demolition theory. I still do.

However, given that Bush can't remember how he learned of the first WTC attack and given that he sat on his butt and did nothing when informed by Andrew Card speaks volumes to the incredulousness of the "official" version.

Not that hard for a small book to escape a bag that is getting shredded open. Okay, escaped a bag engulfed in fire; escaped a plane engulfed in fire; escaped a building engulfed in fire. And landed on the sidewalk below?

Whatever...

[Mika]

19. Ever heard of 911 pilots for truth?

The planes couldn't travel @ 400+ mph at low altitude w/o breaking up due to high air density.

Why repeat the false myths?

[Ter]

31. Falsers have an answer for everything

n/t

[CreekDog]

7. because the core beams didn't fail, the attachments to the supports failed

and that started a chain reaction as the upper floors became unmoored.

[uppityperson]

22. Well, dang. You're no fun.

Good post

[CreekDog]

27. well thanks

[WovenGems]

28. Construction Techniques

Do you know of two ways to support a floor? And which method was used in the trade centers? That tells the whole story as why the collapse looked like it did.
It seems that in order for a wacko conspiracy theory to gain traction an unhealthy dose of ignorance is required.

[hlthe2b]

4. Those calling for a review of the investigation include former NTSB accident investigators

Those calling for a review of the investigation include former NTSB accident investigator Hank Hughes and Bob Young, a former senior accident investigator for the now-defunct TWA. Tom Stalcup, a physicist and co-founder of a group called Flight 800 Independent Researchers Organization, also questions the NTSB's original findings and is featured prominently in the documentary, which is slated to air on the 17th anniversary of the crash next month.

Maybe this is boundless, maybe they are wrong, maybe some will toss this off to self-interest, given the upcoming documentary, but given the questioning of former involved investigators, I'd like for them to review the remaining questions, at least.

[Blue_Tires]

24. Stalcup, who is also the film's producer

comes across as a complete nutbar to me after glancing at his site...I don't know why the retired investigators would go within ten feet of him or anything he's saying...

If these people really want to re-open this wound, there'd better be something concrete and scientific backing them up...If this whole stunt amounts nothing more than some highly speculative, conspiracy theory wankfest; then they are the lowest forms of shit...

[avebury]

8. Pretty interesting. I was living in Maine when this occurred.

Not long after the incident I was talking to someone who had friends who lived in the NYC area. Her friends swore up and down that they saw something shooting up into the air from the water and that there were a lot of other people who were saying the same thing. It would be interesting to see if they do reopen the investigation. I don't know what they will find but it seemed like there were way too many unrelated people making the same claim.

Lord knows that if the incident happened during a Republican administration, it would have been used to send us to war somewhere.

[DRoseDARs]

15. I remember the footage back then of the fireline behind the plane. Jet fuel my ass.

The "flames" were clearly racing up TO the aircraft, much faster than if it WERE fuel that had been ignited, and in that ridiculous scenario it would still require ... duh... an outside ignition source. From well-below the aircraft. And well-behind. And the fuel stream would have to have been coherent for hundreds of feet rather than dispersed in an expanding cloud.

No two ways about it, military fuck-up or terrorist attack it was a missile. I'm not even going to bother with YouTube. I'm not sifting through 17 years worth of people jabbering, computer animations and Time Cube-esque conspiracy theories all piled on like so many layers of poo just to find one tiny little clip.

[dave502d2]

20. What was on the flight 800?

I'll tell you what was on it, their was the first sample of aides virus that France took
the U.S to court for 2 years to get.

[mallard]

21. Interesting development ...

Evidence deleivered in US court in Springfield Mass included pellets found in victim bodies that had no origin within the aircraft. It was still dismissed.

[BillyRibs]

23. Knew it!

Thought the NSTB was compromised then. Now I know it. the entire apparatus is designed to make us all look the other way.

[rightsideout]

26. It wouldn't have been the first passenger jet we've blown up.

[trof]

29. I've flown that airplane. There were and are many questions.

I flew for TWA for about 30 years.

1. The FAA never (to my knowledge) issued an Airworthiness Directive (AD) due to that crash. If, indeed, there was faulty wiring, normally the FAA would issue an AD to have it inspected on all of the same or similar models of the 747. Many times the fleet would be grounded until this was accomplished. That didn't happen.

2. Normally the NTSB conducts the investigation. The FBI is called in if there is evidence of a crime and/or foul play. If memory serves, the FBI was there from the get go.

3. I saw some credible eye witnesses on TV in the immediate 24 hours following the crash. In particular a National Guard major flying a helicopter in the area at the time. Never saw or heard them again, nor any testimony.

4. I've flown the same model (and possibly the one involved) in the same configuration. Empty or near-empty center fuel tank, hot weather, aircraft on ramp for several hours prior to take off, etc. Never any problem.

I have no idea what happened, but I think there's more to this than the original investigation indicated. I know several of the TWA officials and investigators involved at the time, and some of them disagreed with the NTSB findings.

I look forward to seeing the documentary.

[Ter]

30. This is the one story that got me into conspiracy theories

I was only in my early 20's, and knew at the time that the official story was BS. Everyone knew it was a missile. There was even film of it, that the FBI confiscated and never said a thing about it.

[mallard]

32. Re: the concept of official corruption in this case ...

... seems valid, well beyond plausible anyhow. Why then do similar observations about 9/11 lead rather to counter accusations of misperception and false 'conspiracy theories'? All such arguments are quite actively sidelined.