BREAKING: SCOTUS TO HEAR MAJOR CHALLENGE TO AFFIRMATIVE ACTION

[kpete]

BREAKING: SCOTUS TO HEAR MAJOR CHALLENGE TO AFFIRMATIVE ACTION | The Supreme Court just agreed to hear a major case that could potentially end affirmative action programs in public schools and universities. Justice Kagan is recused. More commentary will follow
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/02/21/429159/breaking-scotus-to-hear-major-challenge-to-affirmative-action/

UPDATE:
Supreme Court will consider challenge to affirmative action at University of Texas
By Associated Press, Updated: Tuesday, February 21, 7:10 AM

WASHINGTON — The Supreme Court will once again confront the issue of race in university admissions in a case brought by a white student denied a spot at the flagship campus of the University of Texas.

The court said Tuesday it will return to the issue of affirmative action in higher education for the first time since its 2003 decision endorsing the use of race as a factor in admissions. This time around, a more conservative court is being asked to jettison that ruling and outlaw affirmative action in the university setting.

A federal appeals court upheld the Texas program at issue.

The case will be argued in the fall.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts-law/supreme-court-will-consider-challenge-to-affirmative-action-at-university-of-texas/2012/02/21/gIQADJ1CRR_story.html

[zbdent]

1. I would think that conservatives would want to keep "Affirmative Action" in place since

they keep pointing out that "whites" are going to become the "minority", if it hasn't already ...

[JustAnotherGen]

6. I've thought this for a long time

Or rather questioned it . . . Since Republicans believe White Christians are a dying culture/people in the US - why would they not want laws in place to protect white Christians in according to them - the Very Near Future.

[DebJ]

51. Maybe because they still believe they are the "Silent Majority"? n/t

[southernyankeebelle]

7. You might be right but the conservative court will change the rule until the white population really

becomes a true minority party. Then they will turn it back. Only the great white republican way.

[noiretextatique]

38. so true

when whites are the minority, affirmative action will return.

[southernyankeebelle]

42. LOL, and I am white and I can see the reading on the wall. But I am not worried because some of

them deserve what they have dished out. I just hope things will finally calm down when it finally takes place. We all need to get along and it doesn't matter what color you are. At least that was the way I was brought up. To be honest the world is a better place when you have diversity.

[n2doc]

16. You forget, reality doesn't matter to them

And they will have plenty of other ways to keep themselves at the front of the line.

[rfranklin]

2. Isn't hearing arguments a waste of time?

I suspect the vote will be no different before or after.

[Liberal Veteran]

4. Surely you are suggesting our esteemed justices are biased?

Perish the thought.

[unblock]

19. they don't just vote, they write up a whole opinion.

even where the vote for the case itself is a foregone conclusion, what they actually change may still be up in the air.

will they knock down affirmative action only in certain contexts, and keep it in others?
will they decide the case on some other grounds?

etc.

[jillan]

3. How much more divisive are these Republicants going to get? This is unbelievable!

[The Croquist]

23. Maybe divisive enough to actually read the Constitution

Amendment XIV - Citizenship Rights.

1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Discriminating on the basis on race is unconstitutional.

[Scootaloo]

25. Good thing affirmative action isn't discrimination, then.

[24601]

44. Isn't that what the court will decide? Actually, it's always been discrimination - the question is

whether it's Constitutionally permissable or not.

The last time the court visited the issue, it was allowed to remain in part - but several justives in the 5-4 majority have been replaced. Stevens by Kagan (who is recused) and O'Connor by Alito. I'll go out on a limb and predict it's unconstitutional by a 5-3 vote.

[link:http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-supreme-court-affirmative-action-20120221,0,7177633.story|

[Scootaloo]

50. Again, it is not discrimination; don't repeat lies from the right

Affirmative action is a good-faith system wherein an employer, when faced with a choice between two more more sufficiently qualified candidates for a position, agrees to hire the one least-represented in his current crew or most reflective of the community his business is in.

First, it is by no means mandatory. An establishment engages in the system out of its own volition, and can alter its position any time it likes.

Second, a key factor is the candidates must be qualified for the position; the idea of unqualified minorities getting positions over qualified non-minorities is simply a dog-whistle, amounting to bigots saying minorities are never qualified.

Third, it measures "minority" in a location-by-location basis. My pale ass would be covered by affirmative action if I sought employment in, I dunno, South Los Angeles.

Basically it's "discrimination" in the same way "Well, they're both qualified, but I like this one's positive attitude more" is discrimination.

And yes, I wouldn't be surprised to see a strictly partisan split, if it comes to a ruling. By now we should all understand that just 'cause th Court says so, doesn't mean its actually so...

[24601]

53. It's not lies from the right. People and governments legally discriminate all the time.

Definition of DISCRIMINATE
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/discriminate

transitive verb
1
a : to mark or perceive the distinguishing or peculiar features of
b : distinguish, differentiate <discriminate hundreds of colors>
2
: to distinguish by discerning or exposing differences; especially : to distinguish from another like object
intransitive verb
1
a : to make a distinction <discriminate among historical sources>
b : to use good judgment

The motive - either good or bad - does not change the meaning of the word. it is lawful discrimination for example, to deny driver's licenses to the blind or gun ownership to the insane because there is a sufficient public purpose.

The court ruled that seeking a diverse student body in 2003 was a sufficient public purpose to allow race to be considered in admissions. It also said that one day, that might cease to be justified.

So like it said - that is what the court will decide.

[Scootaloo]

54. Please, spare me the dictionary

We both know that when speaking of race issues in America, "discriminate" carries more weight to it than "to distinguish, differentiate."

[Bandit]

35. When that was written blacks were not considered persons...

Sometimes things change, even the Constitution.. It also states in the constitution that in the USA you have the right to a speedy trial and the right to an attorney, and the right to confront your accusers. sionce the Patriot Act came into being, actually even before under Bush* all of those "rights" are no longer in existence. Just ask Joseph Padillo about that.. A US citizen picked up on the streets of Chicago and whisked off to Gitmo to be tortured and held for years without charges or an attorney..

[noiretextatique]

39. that's the problem with quoting the constitution...those lovely words didn't apply to everyone

when they were written, and for a long time after they were written. to use them to justify attempts to correct the problems created by those words not applying to everyone is hypocritical.

[earthside]

5. With Kagan recused ...

... this is a done deal.

There won't be a ruling until next spring, after the election.

But the end of Affirmative Action is written.

[MrBig]

9. Even with Kagan it doesn't look good

Kennedy has been pretty consistent in voting with the conservatives on Affirmative Action issues. It'll probably be a 5-4 vote with Kennedy joining Scalia, Thomas, Alito and Roberts.

[Shrek]

11. 5-4?

If Kagan recuses do they replace her with someone else?

I wasn't aware of that.

[MrBig]

13. Apologies - it would be 5-3 without Kagan

I should have clarified that even with Kagan it would be 5-4 against Affirmative Action

[Liberal Veteran]

15. Yeah, I think it will be 5-3-1

Either way, Thomas should recuse himself as well, but he won't.

[mopinko]

17. why should kagan recuse herself?

just because she might have some real experience?

[handmade34]

30. she shouldn't...

but she is upstanding and moral, and will...

"...Justice Elena Kagan, has disqualified herself. She was the U.S. Solicitor General in March 2010, when the Justice Department filed a brief in this case in the Fifth Circuit Court. The Solicitor General must approve government filings in courts at that level. Kagan was nominated to the Court in May 2010..."

[usregimechange]

8. Remember O'Connor was replaced with Alito, she was the swing vote on these

[AlbertCat]

10. a white student denied a spot at the flagship campus of the University of Texas.

"White Texas sports fans are outraged at the challenge! "Who's gonna play for the Longhorns?!?!"

(just in case)


I wonder how the student convinced everyone race was the deciding factor in his denial.
"A federal appeals court upheld the Texas program at issue."
Oh that right's.... he didn't.

[Neue Regel]

46. The student is a 'she', not a 'he'

"Texas has a unique system. It provides admission for those in the top 10 percent of their Texas high schools. Abigail Noel Fisher of Sugar Land did not make that cut and was put into a pool of applicants in which race is considered along with other factors, such as community service, leadership qualities, test scores and work experience."

[ProfessionalLeftist]

12. Buh-bye Affirmative Action. n/t

[AngryAmish]

14. I think Asian parents will be pleased by this news.

[PRETZEL]

18. I don't know, Texas might just win

this case.

I think they'll argue that race is just another factor that for those students who are not automatically accepted due to them being in the top 10% of their graduating class.

They could easily argue that other factors such as test scores, community involvement, extra cirrucular activies weigh equally as race and as such, acceptance is not based purely on Affirmative Action.

[Festivito]

20. We live in anation where people don't know the difference between

being at the top of a hill going down, and
being at the bottom of that hill going up ...
when trying to go over a mountain.

[graham4anything]

21. Dems only in office to change SCOTUS to a liberal court

keep repeating after me, there is no difference between Bush and Gore
there is no difference between Bush and Kerry
etc.

all youse 3rd party people keep repeating

ONLY ANSWER IS TO VOTE DEMS
VOTE OBAMA
VOTE the retake the house and keep the senate

and then in the next 12 years, with retirements, the Dems will move the court back to a humane position

[handmade34]

28. +1

[BlueDemKev]

48. A-MEN!!!

I've been saying that for YEARS!!!

[Mz Pip]

22. We don't have affirmative action in CA

and Prop 209 that eliminated it was upheld by SCOTUS. Race, ethnicity and gender cannot be used for college admissions or hiring in state funded postions. This has been in place for over 15 years. Racial/ethnic diversity took a big hit. Private institutions can recruit and offer scholarships to top minority students. The State schools can't.

[chelsea0011]

24. What I never can figure out in these cases is how this student knows it was

affirmative action that denied him a spot and not one of many other reasons he could have been denied a spot.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

27. They simply assume that it's about giving us knee-grows something that we don't deserve

and "discriminating" against the entitled white kids.

White women have been the primary beneficiaries of affirmative action programs, and yet, the conservatives loves making this all about race. They make this assumption about black students benefitting primarily due to race because they believe that blacks are inherently intellectually inferior.

[handmade34]

31. I don't mean to laugh...

but I was in the middle of a google search to figure out what a "knee-grow" was???? when it hit me...

I never thought I would get this old and still be fighting this fight

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

33. You have to laugh to keep from crying. I was talking to a good friend of mine who

just happens to be a white male, conservative, late 40s...

He has lived through the debate concerning contraception, the Loving v. Virginia case, and Title IX fights, ERA, etc.

Even he cannot believe that we are going down this road. And it's all because Republicans have nothing...NOTHING...else to run on. These very deep and painful wedge issues are the ONLY route they have left to dip into the Democratic Party stronghold.

[maximusveritas]

40. Easier to blame black people than blame themselves

If this girl had studied harder and gotten into the top 10% of her class, she would have been accepted. But she didn't, so now she has to find someone else to blame. And all the racists will be with her.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

26. White women benefit the most from affirmation action programs, not racial minorities.

They should be concerned about this and join in the fight with others in this.

[handmade34]

29. obviously...

the conservatives are also fighting against women these days....

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

32. Great point!! They ought to be concerned, since they now make up the largest

enrolled group in colleges/universities, outpacing men and all other race/Ethnic groups. This should be a major concern.

[boppers]

37. The suit was *brought* by a white woman, who wasn't in the top 10% of her graduating class.

More details:
http://www.scotusblog.com/?p=129451

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

43. WOW!! Thanks for this!! I really appreciate it! :)

[TBF]

34. I think we ought to add the Supreme Court to the ballot in November -

this is not good news for affirmative action.

[alp227]

36. Further down is reported the student grades were outside top 10%

"Most entering freshmen at Texas are admitted because they are among the top 10 percent in their high school classes. (Abigail) Fisher's grades did not put her in that category."

Furthermore...

"...following the high court ruling in 2003, the university resumed considering race starting with its 2005 entering class. The policy at issue applies to the remaining spots beyond those filled by the top 10 percent and allows for the consideration of race along with other factors.

"Texas said its updated policy does not use quotas, which the high court has previously rejected. Instead, it said it takes a Supreme Court-endorsed broader approach to enrollment, with an eye toward increasing the diversity of the student body."

I think the Bakke v UC case from '78 ended quotas.

Another interesting thing. Guess who was governor Texas in 2005? That's right, Rick Perry, 2012's clone of George W Bush. If Perry were still campaigning now, would this AA issue be thrown around in campaign ads? Would be a great popcorn night.

My approach to AA is that while diversity is not evil, merit always comes first. Closing achievement gaps should start at the K-12 level. Another note re the primaries this year: wouldn't it be AMAZING to see Perry the affirmative action enablet vs Gingrich who wants poor kids working for pennies for life and Santorum who wants to gut the public schools.

[Major Hogwash]

41. ^ Post of the day! ^

That's a great comment.

Merit should always come first. Obviously, she ran to the courts after she could not enter the old-fashioned way, by "earning it".

[alp227]

45. And I wonder if GWB's kids got into UT Austin via AA

for the well connected ESPECIALLY since Bush was governor of TX when his kids were in high school.

Funny how Republicon artists embrace Herman Cain's blame yourself POV unless it's politically profitable not to do so.

[aquart]

56. So she wouldn't get in without affirmative action, either?

[bluestateguy]

47. Suing her way into the university

Yeah, I'm sure that will elicit a lot of respect for her around campus.

[alp227]

49. WaPo replaced AP copy with an original story, and student follows Obama on twitter

titled "Supreme Court agrees to reconsider use of race in college admission decisions"...

also i found [link:twitter.com/abbyf2012|Abigail Fisher's twitter], she follows President Obama's twitter, and she retweeted this tweet by Stephen Colbert "CBS has a clear liberal bias. Why else would they be pushing "The Big Bang Theory?"" here's her linkedin, apparently she's an accounting major with an interest in law school.

[donheld]

52. This scares me.

I'm fearful of what this supreme court will do. It could be very ugly.

[FarCenter]

55. Colleges should admit on the basis of ability

And then flunk out the 50% who can't or won't do the work.

[MD20]

57. Meritocracy is what we all want

It is very interesting that a White woman would challenge Affirmative Action efforts when so many White women owe their success to it. I smell a rat. Looks like a setup to me. Some curmudgeon in the application process was just waiting for the opportunity to use a White women instead of a White male as the patsy.

I am not familiar with the procedures used at UT to announce who is or isn't accepted for admission. But, since the institution is state run , I assume most documents used in the application process would be subject to scrutiny under the FOIA. Whether Fisher used that avenue to gain access to the pertinent information, I cannot say. Apparently White student’s ability to gain access to the scores of Black students is an easy task. I wonder, though if such information would be as readily available to an erudite Black student who “believes’ some lower scoring Whites were admitted ahead of him/her.

Meritocracy is what we all want… as well as a fair shake. But, with recent scandals indicating that wide spread cheating occurs with alarming frequency in even our most prestigious learning institutions, test scores of the “best qualified” could be inflated. Elements in the system have been corrupted in that regard; Some more so than others.

The history of Texas is rife with tales of atrocities against Blacks and that legacy has continued into modern times. So, one can assume from those history lessons that if some of the good people of the Lone Star State would use or condone gerrymandering, murder, and intimidation to keep their fellow Black citizens down… why stop there? For many, MERIT is just an illusion: an ethereal tool used to mask the demon of exclusion. What good is merit when there are so many ways to manipulate it? Among those who bray the loudest against Affirmative Action are the same people who are silent when they see discrimination against Blacks.