After same-sex couple victory in Collegedale, church ousts gay detective's family

[d_r]

Source: Chattanooga Times Free Press

Collegedale's decision to grant benefits to same-sex couples was a victory for Kat Cooper, a gay detective who championed the months-long effort that made the Chattanooga suburb the first city in Tennessee to offer benefits to same-sex spouses of its government employees.

Cooper's mother, Linda, stood by her side throughout the process. She held tight to her daughter's hand at a July meeting over the issue. And the two embraced after the City Council's 4-1 vote on Aug. 5.

But those small acts of support translated into collateral damage that left Linda Cooper and other relatives separated from their church family of more than 60 years. And one local advocate for gay families says the church's stance was the most extreme he's heard of in years.

Leaders at Ridgedale Church of Christ met in private with Kat Cooper's mother, aunt and uncle on Sunday after the regular worship service. They were given an ultimatum: They could repent for their sins and ask forgiveness in front of the congregation. Or leave the church.



Read more: http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2013/aug/21/repent-or-leave/

---

Not much more I can say - the church kicked out Cooper's mother, aunt and uncle because Cooper is gay and came out in public to fight for equal rights.

[knightmaar]

1. "And I hereby promise ...

... not to let the door hit me in the ass on the way out."

Well, that's what I'd go with, but I'm not a really churchy guy.

[hobbit709]

2. I would have told the church what they could do with themselves.

[Tyrs WolfDaemon]

9. They should have taken the offer to repent

Just so that they could tell everyone to F off.

If it were me, I would have shown up with a trailer full of real cow $hit.
I would be tempted to start by saying 'Thank you for this opportunity' and then tell them that there is a large pile of steaming manure outside for their lunch. Then I would tell them to F off.

[icymist]

36. Now, now, now!!!

Get a little more creative Tyrs, like find some aphrodisiacs for cats. Make tinctures of these and anoint the doors of the church. Just imagine all the church goers having to navigate to way inside past all the humping cats! And don't get me started about the noise they would make! http://www.catchannel.com/cat-videos/watch-video-5e69ac63897c6ca7bcef713151adc35f.aspx

[Bluenorthwest]

3. Ah the faith community in all it's glory

nt

[warrant46]

6. OOH Mommy it's the American Taliban

In action no less

[Bernardo de La Paz]

4. This is the North Korean tactic: punish three generations of a family for one transgression.

Right Wing Christianists and Dominionists and your general TeaBaggers share a lot in common with the Taliban dictatorship and the North Korean dictatorship.

[atreides1]

5. Another Neo-Xtian church

That isn't hesitant on showing what it really stands for...intolerance, hate, and no concept of the real teachings of Christ!

Maybe the entire congregation needs to move to Africa, where gays go to prison and are treated as pariahs?

[roody]

7. They can attend the Church

of the Sleeping Goddess on Sunday mornings. It's my favorite.

[muriel_volestrangler]

8. They're better off outside a church like that

If they have any true friends in the church, they'd leave it too.

[Kber]

10. I'm so sorry they had to go through this

It's very hard when your illusions are shattered is such a way. Makes you question the foundations of your being and wonder if what you spent years building and believing in was a fraud.

All for some "I really know what God thinks and you don't" power trip.

I wonder if others will leave the church in support of the family.

[Hekate]

50. What you say is true, and so sad. Her mom can't stop crying -- that's what being shattered is

I hope that the family will find a new spiritual home soon -- I can certainly think of some liberal denominations -- but it won't be easy on them. How kind it would be if some fellow Christians from other denominations paid a visit to invite them in.

This is literally like being suddenly and brutally disowned by one's beloved family, or finding out some truly ugly family secret that others have been co-dependently keeping a secret. In this case, the ugly secret was the sheer depths of intolerance, homophobia, and lack of following Christ's teachings about love.

My heart goes out to them as they work their way through this betrayal.

[bluemarkers]

11. sad for the family, but have to wonder about eating pork, shrimp, wearing

clothes with different thread blends, etc etc

The Coopers will be better off in a different place. I hope they get grand dad's picture off the wall though!

[theHandpuppet]

13. How about this first step?

1. No hate, no problem.

[Treant]

14. Too Easy

And you don't get to feel superior to the sinner you're ejecting, so it wouldn't fly.

I grew up extremely liberal UCC, so had no problems. Gays and lesbians were common and considered unremarkable. In the 1970's.

[dbackjon]

22. Hate is hate

So you would be fine with a church sacrificing virgins?

Any anti-gay action is HATE.

[dbackjon]

41. Yet gays get killed in the name of religion all the teim

Christians, Jews, Hindus, Muslims all kill Gays because "God" told them too.


The same passages you are defending also call for gays to be put to death.


So no, not hyperbole.


And how the hell do you get hypocritical?

[bluemarkers]

32. sad, but churches will be able to use separation of church

and state to justify almost anything that isn't specifically illegally, ie sacrificing virgins, if they could find any that is.

I imagine more and more churches will be kicking out members over things like this... and then as it impacts tithing... you know lets follow the money... we will see churches becoming more accepting. For "churches" that are mega rich, they will just do whatever they want.

btw, I feel like justification for actions such as this are also rooted in the misguided notion "hate the sin. love the sinner". Using it as an excuse to focus on the perceived sin rather than real love.

[hoosiers1976]

16. Congregational independence

I am also very familiar with the CofC and the Restoration movement.
The key and VERY accurate point of the linked article is that CofC does not have a governing body. No diocese, no classis, etc.
Each congregation makes its own choices.
Their pastors are not ordained (most attend CofC affiliated colleges and are "bible" or "preaching" majors) and they have no governance that determines what they preach or how they preach or worship (with the exception that some CofC's believe or do not believe in the use of instruments in worship).
So bottom line. This local congregation's leadership could have made a VERY different choice and no one would have been the wiser.

[dbackjon]

21. You must have overlooked the overwhelming hate

That comes from the Church of Christ.

In Nashville, they competed with the Southern Baptists to see who could be the most anti-gay.


You can't be for equality and be a member of each church.

[hoosiers1976]

23. Not overlooking anything

Each congregation makes its own choices. That is a fact. Do the vast majority of congregations make bad choices in regards to equality? Of course.
If you go north of Kentucky you can find much more tolerant (not liberal by any means) CofC's who make a point to not address the issue from the pulpit.
Not that that is a great compromise but it is a pretty typical approach for most Protestant churches.
All that being said I left the CofC years ago for a demonination that has a governing body that specifically supports AND accepts its LGBT members and visitors.

[dbackjon]

25. Good for you!

[hoosiers1976]

58. Thanks!

[blackspade]

26. What is the Romans passage?

Regardless, this is one of the big reasons why I am an atheist.
Groups of people that use religion as a tool to demean and discriminate are one of the biggest social ills in the world.

[blackspade]

35. Which version of the NT is this from?

There are several.
I'm curious what the actual direct Hebrew translation is rather than the rewritten western language versions.
It appears from the passage that Romans is referencing a specific time and incident within the ancient world.
Does it take place within the NT time period? The time of Jesus?
Also, what is the 'due penalty?'

[blackspade]

43. Thanks for the info.

[Hekate]

52. You are asking all the right questions, blackspade

I can't see what Name Removed was saying, but from your end of things he sounds like my ex-unlamented-son-in-law. That bozo had been to a "Christian" high school, and had so little acquaintance with contents and history of The Bible that I wondered if the preacher/teacher had simply waved a copy over his head. He was absolutely certain he knew what was in it and could not shut up about it when he was with us, because we, as non-Christians, obviously were in error.

Too bad for him that both dh and I are very interested in religion, and scholarship, and both of us had actually read not only the King James Bible but more recent translations, and that my husband had a Jewish education which he continued on his own as an adult. (We raised the kids Unitarian -- I still don't know what our daughter saw in this guy.) We could not get ex-SIL to understand that in the original languages there are several "voices" and povs, and that "the Book" is actually a library. It's only when it's translated into one modern language or another that it all sounds like the same unified pov; plus translation itself involves choices.

I have nothing against Christians or Christianity, but I do object to stupidity and ignorance. Ignorance can be cured -- stupidity, alas, cannot.

[blackspade]

56. Exactly

The removed poster sort of answered some of my questions but with a bit of dodging and weaving.
But I think s/he missed my point that the bible in it's numerous forms is open to different readings and interpretations.
I decided to cut my loses after the last post for my own sanity......

[Hekate]

57. You cannot win with the willfully stupid. nt

[bluemarkers]

27. I illustrated my point poorly, thank you

I'm so used to the bathwater being thrown out so to speak....

but using Romans is problematic imo as well.

Paul....ugh imo, Peter (and Paul for that matter) forget about Jesus and inserts themselves and manmade law into his writings. Paul mentions a host of "sins" that will bring about the "wrath of God". (including gossip) So the CofC throws out all who gossip as well? It is just so hard to pick and choose especially when all sin is equal.

My point of course is that anyone can use the Bible to justify anything. Seems silly to kick people out - as that just reinforces a cult like feeling. However, churches can do that.

[dbackjon]

42. Paul was not a follower of Christ

He was the first charlatan preacher.

He is the old time equivalent of Jerry Falwell.

His writings do NOT follow Christ, and should be ignored.

[icymist]

47. That's exactly what I was thinking as I read this!

The only law I saw in the New Testament is Love One Another. As for Paul, didn't Christ warn his disciples that others would be coming in his name, but were not from him? Almost immediately, Paul goes from stoning disciples to becoming one that begins to rewrite everything that Jesus said!The evangelists, Popes, scribes, and anyone else wanting to influence the new religion's 'laws' have been doing this ever since!

[2ndAmForComputers]

39. Goodbye, BIGOT. May your extremely short stay here be frustrating and unpleasant.

[Hekate]

51. I think reclaiming grandad's portrait might be a good move, too. nt

[rdking647]

17. the should have done teh following

1. say they will repent in front of the church
2. stand up in front of teh church and start french kissing before telling the church to go fuck themselves

[YOHABLO]

18. Why have sympathy for people who attend the Church of Christ? Especially in Tennessee?

There are other churches. Move to a different part of the country and join a church that's open and welcoming to the LGBT community. I think they'd all be much happier.

[ButterflyBlood]

28. just picking up and moving isn't that easy

Though I agree they could've easily just gone to a more tolerant church even in Tennessee. Its similar to what I say to Catholics who bemoan their church's stances and decisions: You can leave.

[Marrah_G]

19. And yes they have a facebook page

[dbackjon]

20. Sounds right for Tennessee

Had a friend that my partner and I rented a room to when we lived in Nashville.

His preacher dad had freaked out when he came out in HS - tried to beat the gay, sent him to ex-gay therapy and camps, kicked him out of his church, etc.

If they will do that to their own flesh and blood, they will do it to anyone.

[Trillo]

24. What a sad story. NT

[RKP5637]

29. In the big picture, IMO, best they are gone from this church, there are better, why

settle for a bunch of bigots.

[Gormy Cuss]

31. The church did them a favor.

Now they can seek a congregation that isn't so peculiar with elders who are hiding their own discomfort by claiming it's a scriptural mandate.

[geek tragedy]

38. Is there conversion therapy available for people to cure themselves

of being fundamentalist assholes?

[Hekate]

53. Yes, and it can work. But they have to want to change.

I'm sincere about that. I believe ignorance, including spiritual ignorance, can be "cured." But stupidity -- no.

[stillwaiting]

40. Horrible, nasty, anti-Christ fuckers. nt

[grattsl]

44. Isn't nice to see a church following Jesus' example of compassion and empathy for others.

Good thing that they haven't forgotten the Golden Rule, and continue to treat others with the respect that they would want to have shown to them. Otherwise they may do something ugly, and others might have to question if they had actually read the gospels.

[2ndAmForComputers]

45. They did them a big favor.

Hope they eventually realize that and become grateful the poisonous people in their lives kindly chose to remove themselves.

[tomm2thumbs]

46. Christ was always in a habit of kicking out sinners, remember? I mean ALWAYS

They are only doing the Lord's work

[d_r]

48. and especially

kicking out the sinner's mother, uncle and aunt. Jesus was all about that.

[Mopar151]

49. Shunning and shaming

Stock in trade for fundamentalists of all stripes. They'd have no qualms about stoning and burning at the stake, except for all us pesky liberals.

[DeSwiss]

54. Best thing that could have happened.

- Because if she was looking for a Christian church, that wasn't it. Of course very few of them are......

K&R

[d_r]

60. yes, but

it was her mother, aunt and uncle who were kicked out of the church - they are older and had been going there their whole lives, their father having been one of the founders.

[DeSwiss]

61. I understand the church family/politics.

I was brought up in it as a PK.

- Still, blood's thicker.

Matthew 10:16 Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. 17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues; 18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. 20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

[d_r]

62. yeah it is

I hope their friends leave.

[dickthegrouch]

55. If "religion is the opiate of the masses" ...

Why isn't the war on drugs being waged on churches?

Fuck that church and all its hokier-than-thou sinners.

I prefer to live my life with integrity. An organization dedicated to nothing but sin and its consequences is as poisonous as sin itself. We're ALL better off without them IMHO.

[libodem]

59. Wow

This is partly why I cheered when Barney Frank came out as an atheist. He doesn't have to put up with repressive rejection from a source claiming to bestow unconditional love and acceptance on all believers. Eff that!!!

If they must believe, I hope they find q loving respectful place to worship, this fabulous Being, who loves all without measure. Go Goddess. Or Mother/Father god, as they called it when I went to Science of Mind. (Way back in the day)