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Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
Mon Jul 13, 2015, 10:14 PM Jul 2015

STIGLITZ: 'Asking even more from Greece would be unconscionable.'

July 12, 2015

Addis Ababa (AFP) - Prominent economist and Nobel laureate Joseph Stiglitz accused Germany on Sunday of displaying a "lack of solidarity" with debt-laden Greece that has badly undermined the vision of Europe.

"What has been demonstrated is a lack of solidarity by Germany. You cannot run a eurozone without a basic modicum of solidarity. It is really undermining the common sense of vision, the sense of common solidarity in Europe," the Columbia University professor and former World Bank chief economist told AFP.

"I think it's been a disaster. Clearly Germany has done a serious blow, undermining Europe," he said.

"Asking even more from Greece would be unconscionable. If the ECB allows Greek banks to open up and they renegotiate whatever agreement, then wounds can heal. But if they succeed in using this as a trick to get Greece out, I think the damage is going to be very very deep."

Stiglitz is in the Ethiopian capital Addis Ababa for this week's international development financing summit, which is presented as crucial for United Nations efforts to end global poverty and manage climate change by 2030.

He is supporting the creation of an international tax organisation within the UN to fight against tax evasion by multinationals, although this has yet to win Western agreement.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/afp-germany-showing-lack-of-solidarity-over-greece-stiglitz-2015-7#ixzz3fpOZB2PI

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Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
1. Is Greece's New Debt Deal Worse Than Plan Rejected By Referendum?
Mon Jul 13, 2015, 10:26 PM
Jul 2015
University of Athens' Creston Davis argues that the Syriza party platform looks more like the Democratic Party in the '60s rather than a leftist party - July 13, 2015

PAUL JAY, SENIOR EDITOR, TRNN: Welcome to the Real News Network. I'm Paul Jay.

In the wee hours of Monday morning Greece's Prime Minister Tsipras struck a deal with the leaders of the Eurozone. Amongst the things that was agreed to, the Greek parliament must immediately adopt laws to reform key parts of its economy. Of course, they use the word reform. By Wednesday the reforms must be approved by the Greek parliament. These reforms include streamlining the pension system, boosting tax revenue, especially from VAT. That means the consumer tax, not income tax or corporate tax. Liberalizing the labor market, we'll get into a minute what all that means, and privatizing the electricity network. Extending shop opening hours, we'll explain why that seems to matter.

The eurozone agrees in principle to start negotiations on a loan package for Greece worth about $82-86 billion. That's maybe somewhere in the range of $91-96 billion US. The loan will come mainly from the European Stability Mechanism, ESM, the Eurozone bailout fund. But the International Monetary Fund will also be asked to make a contribution from March 2016. That's something that Mr. Tsipras had said he didn't want to agree to. I guess there's a whole list of things he said he didn't want to agree to, and wound up having to agree to.

One of the most controversial things that had been proposed, according to all the rumors coming out of the negotiations, was a dealbreaker, in fact is in the deal. A new trust fund will be set up, managed by Greece. That's a difference. Originally this trust fund I think was supposed to be managed by Europe. In fact, managed in the end by a company that was controlled by the German finance minister. Now it seems according to the language we're hearing, Greece will manage this fund. It's $50 billion of Greek national assets. That means things that's public property. This property is either going to be privatized in some way, or they're saying this fund will manage these resources in order to create income. Half the fund will be used to fund the debt, the other half is supposed to go towards investment.

But this fund which was originally, as I say, supposed to be managed by Europe, perhaps this is a significant compromise or maybe a small victory by Tsipras that it looks like it will be Greece and not Germany that manages this.

At any rate, to help us unpack all of this and joining us from Athens is Creston Davis. Creston is the founding director of the Global Center for Advanced Studies. And he's co-author with Slavoj Zizek of Paul's New Moment. That's Saint Paul, not this one.

Thanks very much for joining us.

CRESTON DAVIS, GLOBAL CENTER FOR ADVANCED STUDIES: Hey Paul, how are you doing.

JAY: Very well. Let's start unpacking. Well, first give me your overall impression of the deal and how it's going to be received in Athens, and then maybe we can dig into some of the difference.

DAVIS: Sure. The overall impression is defeat, honestly. Straightforward defeat. Syriza looks ridiculous. They're contradictory, given how they brand their campaign. And ultimately they folded a week after the oxhi celebratory referendum that really brought together the populace of the Greek people.

So in light of this kind of bipolar, schizophrenic moment of the high of the oxhi to a very, a very demoralized atmosphere here in Athens.

JAY: So that's the no vote, oxhi, where the Greek people were asked to vote yes or no on a proposal that Europe had given, and something like 61 percent of Greeks said no. And it seems to me that proposal was not even as onerous as this one. Is that true?

DAVIS: That's right. The first--the referendum that the no vote won a week ago was far less in terms of austerity measures and far less sinister than what was just agreed upon a week later by Tsipras and the Greek government.

JAY: Now, what else could he do in this particular moment? It seems to me you can go back to errors that were made from the beginning. But you said something to me off-camera maybe we should talk about first before we get into this, which is just the kind of party Syriza is. Because I think a lot of people outside think of Syriza as a very left-wing party. And you're saying it's actually far more complicated than that.

DAVIS: Yeah. I mean, to put it in American terms--and I grew up right near Baltimore, where you are. But to put it in American terms basically the platform of Syriza looks very similar, very similar, 90 percent the same as the basic JFK platform in America in the 1960s. The difference is that we live in a new era, an era that began in the 1970s called neoliberalism.

And that neoliberalism really came to fruition, started in Chile in the '70s under military regime actually backed by professors like Milton Friedman from the University of Chicago. And they installed neoliberal policies in the dictatorship of Pinochet in the '70s. And then you have Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher adopt these same basic premises of the neoliberal outlook that, it must be understood in contrast to a Keynesian outlook where you have a much more democratic way in which you can regulate exchange and commerce and markets.

So what you have here is you have Syriza looks very much like a Democratic party in the '60s in the United States that in today's terms, in hyper-neoliberalized capitalist terms, looks radical. But in fact it's not radical at all. It simply calls for basic social services and a democratic process by which to regulate economic [inaud.]

JAY: So the leadership of Syriza was never prepared for or wanted a more radical solution, which a lot of people argue was the only alternative to what's transpired. But let's dig into the deal a little bit and then we'll go big picture again. So is this deal any better than what would have been signed at the very beginning of this whole process?

DAVIS: This feels much worse, actually, than anything that's been put on the table since Syriza came to power. And that's the humiliating part. Paul Krugman in the New York Times just wrote about how humiliating this deal is to the Greek people and also to Syriza.

Basically what you have here is the Troika, the European Union, really putting Syriza under their boot, and making a statement kind of like Truman making a statement when he bombed Hiroshima, let's say, to the Russians if one wants to follow that thesis. It's a statement. What we have here is an example of how other countries in the EU who might, like Spain let's say, or Portugal, or Italy, Ireland, who might want to think about activating and energizing the populace, you better not do that. That's the signal here.

http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=14237
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
2. It's institutional. Germany and Greece have no business being in the same currency.
Mon Jul 13, 2015, 10:30 PM
Jul 2015

And everyone is feeling the effect of the mistake of having Greece join in the first place. Everyone in Europe knew that Greece's entire economy was a giant Ponzi scheme, and they went ahead anyways.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
5. Okay. I begin to see why Greece should never have been allowed in EU. The organization does
Tue Jul 14, 2015, 08:24 AM
Jul 2015

not work for the poorer countries with no real industry base. Heck if we in the USA keep sending our manufacturers overseas we will be in the same boat.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
7. Demonizing the deadbeats
Tue Jul 14, 2015, 11:42 AM
Jul 2015

---

Michael Lewis, in his seminal Vanity Fair article in 2010 entitled ‘Beware of Greeks bearing bonds’, covered many of these problems. Yet, the Europeans so taken in by their grand vision of a project to unite everyone, forgot the basics of credit management and ignored all these issues until it was too late.

So how does a creditor deal with a borrower like this?


Accept that you will not get most of your money back
Ask for hard assets as collateral for anything further you lend
Take specific measures to monitor progress frequently
Charge punitive rates of interest for every failure

As I write this, there is news of a new deal in Europe to keep the Greeks in; requiring more asset sales that are ring-fenced from the government budget, and various other austerity measures. As with all the previous plans, this one also fails to take into account the essential lack of character in the borrower – and hence, is another exercise in futile romanticism.

This plan will also fail, in the fullness of time – or a year, as it happens in the case of Greece.

http://atimes.com/2015/07/demonizing-the-deadbeats/

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
10. It was.
Tue Jul 14, 2015, 07:39 PM
Jul 2015

I don't agree with all of it and I'm not going to critique it either, but he makes some good points.

I think it is far from over.

We are past the point where I'm willing to try to figure out what everybody is thinking, but I do think they are all nuts. And that has a lot to do with why I think it is far from over, and why I'm not going to try to figure them out. "Reason can only take you so far." There is just nothing to suggest that everybody will suddenly come to their senses or do anything, anything at all, that might tend to make the situation improve.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
11. Well to be fair, no one seems to be able to..but how can one do that? I mean, when you have
Tue Jul 14, 2015, 07:46 PM
Jul 2015

a gun pointed at your head you can freak out and then the shit gets worse.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
13. I'm talking more about the Eurocrats, the non-Greeks in this.
Tue Jul 14, 2015, 07:57 PM
Jul 2015

Tsipras government had a very tough hand to start with, but it has been very naive too, at best. I am not getting into that either, but theories abound as to whom the mastermind of it all so far is. My guess is they all stumbled into it and are just being who they are, so to speak. Which is not to say there are no plots, just none of them are really working, and they are all more concerned with butt-covering than any great ambitions.

It's hard to point to anybody that has behaved well in this. Cyprus maybe.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
14. Understood. Tsiparis was not prepared from what I have read for the no vote, nevermind the
Tue Jul 14, 2015, 08:07 PM
Jul 2015

large percent. That he had a back up plan? Doesn't appear he did. I was interested in
an article by Stiglitz laying out leaving the Euro..said it would not be easy but to use
his words, would not be the end of the world.

The other characters were predictably shameful..statesmen, anyone? Not going to happen.

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