LA Times 7/28 --- Was The 2016 Election Legitimate?
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-heffernan-trump-illegitimate-20180728-story.htmlWe need to talk about a forbidden subject: the legitimacy of the current president.
Theres been a code of silence around President Donald Trumps shady victory in 2016. Its one of those tiptoe-around-it things that the American family just doesnt talk about. And with good reason. Whatever your politics, its perilous to question the soundness of an American election.rder and grow harder to ignore.
A nation devoted to majority rule has a minority president. Who squeaked into office on an electoral college technicality. Against most data projections. Using dark money. Using voter suppression. Using Russian disinformation.
As more and more facts about Trumps incongruous victory emerges, the doubts gnaw harder and grow harder to ignore.
Iliyah
(25,111 posts)A big fat NO.
Mme. Defarge
(8,027 posts)indeed!
Grasswire2
(13,565 posts)George W* has carried his asterisk for 18 years now.
DoctorJoJo
(1,134 posts)aeromanKC
(3,322 posts)Diebold
OMGWTF
(3,951 posts)yurbud
(39,405 posts)It drives me nuts that they are only now taking this seriously when it can be used to drum up a Cold War with Russia like our democracy isn't that important when ONLY Republicans are rigging the game.
Grasswire2
(13,565 posts)calimary
(81,209 posts)I'm with the folks who'd make that TWO asterisks. Stolen election in 2000 and another one in 2004.
The ONLY way the CONS can win is if they cheat. If somebody with power and/or influence and/or strategic placement places a thumb on the scale. Let's not forget - those two times they had both. Katherine Harris who was Florida's republi-CON Secretary of State in 2000, WHILE AT THE SAME TIME serving as bush/cheney's state campaign manager. Then four years later, Kenneth Blackwell who was Ohio's republi-CON Secretary of State in 2000, WHILE AT THE SAME TIME serving as bush/cheney's state campaign manager. Neither of whom faced any conflict-of-interest challenges as they should have faced.
And then, 2016. And we ALL know what happened that year.
yurbud
(39,405 posts)as well as firing up the racist base.
That celebrity trick worked once here in California with Schwarzenegger, but you can only pull that scam about once every generation and a half.
Grasswire2
(13,565 posts).....but I really have more than 50,000 posts and joined in 2002. Was absent for more than a year, and then I simply couldn't access my old email account to reset the password and so DU recommended opening a new account.
calimary
(81,209 posts)I've loved your stuff - and your unique sense of humor - for years.
Grasswire2
(13,565 posts)....thanks again! It's nice to see old friends. But I'm sad that Octafish is apparently gone.
Grasswire2
(13,565 posts)Ferrets are Cool
(21,106 posts)just don't call me Shirley.
procon
(15,805 posts)Public opinion will begin to shift as suspicion about Trump and Russia grows. The questions are evolving to take on a classic Nixonian theme: What did the president know, and when did he know it?
kairos12
(12,852 posts)NBachers
(17,099 posts)Duppers
(28,118 posts)NRaleighLiberal
(60,014 posts)kennetha
(3,666 posts)Last edited Sat Jul 28, 2018, 05:04 PM - Edit history (2)
In fact, it has been a question worth asking since the beginning. On my view, it has been the ONLY question worth asking since the beginning. Only the vapidness of our access-seeking press stopped it from, in fact, being THE question, and the only question from the start.
Strangely, the one person who seemed to get it was Trump himself. He and he alone knew from the beginning that the question would come to the fore, and come to the fore with trumpets blaring eventually. That is why he dismissed the Mueller probe from the very start. That is why he bragged about his crowd size. That is why he switched gears from 2012 when he predicted that Romney would win the popular vote but lose the electoral college and that this would be an outrage against democracy. Suddenly, he saw the "wisdom" of the electoral college.
The Media, though, was dying to let him off the hook. They wondered aloud again and again why he wouldn't just distinguish between legitimate questions about the Russian attempt to sabotage our democracy from pseudo questions about his own legitimacy, as they themselves were willing and eager to do. Just get on with being president, they urged him. And let us get on with covering you in your role as president. But here Trump had it right and the vapid, access seeking media -- who were at first eager to normalize Trump, so that they could get on with the playing their role as color commentators on the passing political show -- had it completely utterly wrong.
The questions of Russian sabotage and Trump's legitimacy could not possibly be separated, not for long, and not by people wiling to to take a cold hard look at what our dysfunctional political system has become. A people's media would have dug and dug from the beginning. It would have sought to lay bare how ripe for the pickings by malevolent agents both internal and external the electoral college makes us. A little voter suppression here, a successful influence operation there, a little corruption over here, and --presto chango -- the electoral college nullifies the collective vote of the people. And this time all it took was the swing of a mere 70,000 votes ... a rounding error ... out of the 130 or so million that were cast. And all this In the name ... of what? Only God, if he exists, now knows.
Once upon a time, the Founding Fathers knew. And knew well. In the name of enticing the reluctant South, with its minimal suffrage and its peculiar institution of slavery, to join the new Union and to set aside its inordinate fear that the political weight of the North within that new Union might, with a different electoral scheme, force the suffrage-stingy, slave rich South to abandon its beloved institution. But once the bloody war that that bargain made all but inevitable finally came, and slavery was finally abolished, and there was nothing left of the peculiar institution to preserve, what was the enduring point of the electoral college? To guard the nation against the will of the people, considered as self-governing corporate body, and to keep the choice of the presidency in the hands of a narrow cabal of wise electors? But by that time the narrow cabal had long been exposed as a mere hope and wish of the founders, a reality that was never to be. It had long been replaced by a merely mechanical vote weighting mechanism, devoid of even the pretense of being a deliberative body that would act on behalf of the nation and with greater wisdom than the people themselves could possibly muster.
That after two highly problematic elections, one decided by a usurping Supreme Court, in the name of "equal protection," one decided by an archaic dysfunctional mechanism that has no present day justification, the so-called American people have not taken to the streets en mass to demand better, but instead servilely and hopefully wait in an infantilized stupor for Mueller or perhaps the slumbering Congress to save them from this nightmare shows how devoid of true political agency we have become.
But this too was part of the founder's design all along. It never ceases to amaze me how a nation born of revolution managed to give birth to a constitution that so disempowered the very people in whose name that revolution was supposedly fought and won.
tomp
(9,512 posts)...would you please consider using paragraphs? thank you.
LiberalLovinLug
(14,173 posts)I might suggest though for future that it is much easier to read longer posts on a message board if you separate such a long post into say at least 4 separate sections. It becomes just a wall of words and many will just scroll down past it. Which is a shame because you raise some good points.
cheers
Edit: I see someone else made much the same suggestion while I was writing mine and posting. Don't mean to pile on.
Amaryllis
(9,524 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)kennetha
(3,666 posts)calimary
(81,209 posts)Last edited Tue Jul 31, 2018, 12:51 AM - Edit history (1)
But I definitely do hope to see stuff like this pop up more and more in places like the Washington Post and the NYTimes. And internationally, too.
On edit - I'm glad to see that reference to trump's illegitimacy in print now. That's REALLY good to see. And may it be only the first of legions of such references from here on! The legitimacy of his so-called "pResidency" SHOULD be questioned. Because it's as questionable as can be.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Hekate
(90,642 posts)The world does not end at The Rockies.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)bucolic_frolic
(43,125 posts)all of which would never have occurred if the election were copper-bottom
AlexSFCA
(6,137 posts)SunSeeker
(51,550 posts)That was clear since 2016 to anyone paying attention.
ailsagirl
(22,893 posts)Last edited Tue Jul 31, 2018, 08:04 PM - Edit history (1)
And I know nearly everyone on DU did as well
I have friends who say, "yes, but the electoral college says he won..."
I don't buy it
I never will
This has been an absolute NIGHTMARE
calimary
(81,209 posts)100% with you.
1000%.
ailsagirl
(22,893 posts)Racerdog1
(808 posts)Exit polling is now coming out in key states. Anyone looking at this can see that this is not a legitimate outcome.
malaise
(268,913 posts)Grasswire2
(13,565 posts)Amaryllis
(9,524 posts)calimary
(81,209 posts)suston96
(4,175 posts)What do we do to remedy such an event?
Must there be action taken before the electoral votes are turned in?
Talk about a badly framed government.