Ex-U.S. Ambassador to USSR: Ukraine Crisis Stems Directly from Post-Cold War Push to Expand NATO

[Uncle Joe]

[JohnSJ]

1. That is the trump/Putin argument, and it is nonesense. Not surprised this is coming from

Democracy Now

[Uncle Joe]

2. It's coming from Former Ambassador Jack Matlock,

the only questions should be is he speaking the truth or not and why isn't the corporate media covering it?

[JohnSJ]

3. Please spare me a Joe. An ambassador under bush and Reagan. And it has nothing to do with

the corporate media

They helped f**k up Afghanistan with their policies, and indirectly a prelude to our vulnerability in 9/11

Democracy now has its own agenda

The poor innocent Russians being threatened by Ukraine



This has nothing to do with NATO expansion, this has everything to do with Putin wanting to bring back the good old days of Russian dominance over Ukraine

[Uncle Joe]

5. So are all Ambassadors suspect now depending on which President they served under?

Last edited Thu Feb 17, 2022, 09:39 PM - Edit history (1)

The current (chilly war) dynamics that are heavily influencing if not dictating the course of our nations' path was the foreign policy initiatives first brought about by George W. Bush.

He's the gift that keeps on giving whether it was waging war in Iraq based on lies or thoughtless NATO expansion.

The corporate media have obvious conflicts of interest depending on their corporate conglomerate ownership, major commercial buyers and shareholders.

[JohnSJ]

7. This has nothing to do with NATO expansion, that is pure president for life, Putin propaganda

We wouldn’t even be in this situation if Hillary was president

I am so thankful Biden is president

I am sure Jill Stein is thrilled with what she accomplished in 2016

Why not interview representatives in Ukraine?

[Uncle Joe]

10. Putin, Putin, Putin on a river,

I believe we wouldn't be in this situation if Al Gore had been President instead of the SC appointed George W. Bush; but too many nationalistic Americans are enthralled by his foreign policies.

I also believe President Biden can be a great President but even more than that, my first love is for democracy.

[JohnSJ]

13. Is it really?

[Uncle Joe]

14. Yes. I believe our focus should be expanded to the Russian People.

That's one of the things that I liked about how President Biden had spoken directly to them.

[L. Coyote]

24. Focus also on the price of a barril of oil. Putin and Russia have already won on that front.

And, I suspect, that is the real reason war is being threatened, to enrich Putin and Russia to avoid becoming a failed state and politically unpopular. Russia's dependence on income from the West is a deterrent to war, but going to the brink of war without the dangerof war breaking out, because Russia controls if war starts, is proving to be immensely profitable each and every day this goes on. Crude oil prices hit a 18-year low before this started, threatening Russia's economy because their extraction costs are relatively high.

[Uncle Joe]

34. Wouldn't that same reasoning apply to all the major oil/fossil fuel people regardless of nation?

They make a killing on it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_oil_production

[L. Coyote]

35. Exactly, and probably why we aren't hearing about it on the M$M.

Who bought oil futures a month ago? If they start selling, you know the march to war is over.

[Uncle Joe]

36. Well this article is a bit dated so I'm wondering how much things have changed since April 2020?

Petroleum expert says oil futures indicative of larger problems on Wall Street

(snip)

He says the main problem is that the main U.S. oil storage facility in Cushing, Oklahoma is nearly at capacity.

He says that's where the price can go negative.

"We're not talking about the price of a tangible oil," Robertson explains, "we're talking about the price of a future delivery of oil."

With no place to store the oil, the futures that will become real in May posed a serious problem for "buyers"

(snip)

https://www.kbtx.com/content/news/Petroleum-expert-says-oil-futures-indicative-of-larger-problems-on-Wall-Street-569836761.html

[L. Coyote]

37. That's why I added the charts, so you could see the change, about a 50% increase.

Link to tweet

[Uncle Joe]

38. And so much of it can't be burned without destroying life as we know it.

[George II]

16. Not just "former ambassador" but former ambassador to the USSR, which hasn't existed for 31 years...

That was the last time he was an ambassador.

A lot of things have changed since 1991, and inasmuch as he hasn't had insider briefings for at least those 31 years, how can he be considered a reliable source of information in 2022?

[Uncle Joe]

18. The Cuban Missile Crisis was about sixty years ago, do you believe

the U.S. would be more relaxed now if an adversarial nation put missiles there as so much has changed since the early 60s?

[George II]

31. Has nothing to do with this discussion. Right now Russia is massing troops and military equipment...

...on their border with Ukraine, and the speaker in that video is trying to indirectly justify that because of US actions many years ago.

That's simply not true.

[marie999]

4. National Security on NATO expansion is a good article to read.

Read this article, left-click across this, and then right-click on it. NATO Expansion: What Gorbachev Heard

[comradebillyboy]

6. Indeed Republicans are quick to blame America first.

[blue-wave]

8. NATO Is a defensive organization

NATO has never attacked another country unless a NATO country was attacked first. It's NATO's article 5. There is no threat to Russia of NATO attacking Russia unless NATO is attacked first. Putin is overreacting and it's my suspicion he's being pressured by the Kremlin war machine to invade Ukraine.

The escalation of NATO troops in countries that neighbor Ukraine is in direct response to Putin's threat. He has verbally threatened NATO at present. This is all on Putin and Russia. Blaming NATO is an absurd accusation.

[JohnSJ]

11. Exactly. It is interesting they talk to an ex-ambassador to the USSR under Reagan and bush

but not interview those representing Ukraine today

This is the Putin position they are representing on Democracy Now

[Uncle Joe]

12. Better than following George W. Bush's polices. n/t

[JohnSJ]

15. Equally bad.

[Uncle Joe]

19. Not between the U.S. and Soviet Union/Russia

[George II]

22. There have been no disputes between the US and Soviet Union for at least 31 years, and now....

...the US is defending Ukraine. Remember, Ukraine WAS a component of the Soviet Union until the 1991 breakup.

[blue-wave]

27. Ukrainians have had an independent

Country in the past and have been fighting off foreign powers for over 500 years. Your point is not valid. To accept your point is saying every country in the world has a claim over others. I call bullshit.

[George II]

28. My point is not valid? The point of the speaker in the OP's video is that the current friction...

...between the US and Russia goes back decades to NATO expansion. That's false, and the person making this claim (ex-ambassador to the USSR) has been out of the loop for more than 30 years.

Did you mean to respond to someone else? I'm essentially agreeing with you (or you're agreeing with me)

[Uncle Joe]

29. Precisely to George W. Bush's statement on April 1st 2008 as I referred to on post #25 n/t

[George II]

17. Indeed, and he was an ambassador to a country that no longer exists but formerly contained Ukraine.

[marie999]

23. Maybe not NATO as a whole, but NATO countries have invaded other countries

and tried to keep other countries subservient to them. Vietnam is a prime example. So how can an organization be completely defensive if the countries making it up aren't?

[blue-wave]

26. Again, NATO has not

But Putin wants us all to believe that NATO is threat to Russia. It is not.

[George II]

30. The NATO organization itself is defensive. If you're referring to the US "invading" Vietnam...

1. The US involvement was "defensive" in nature, defending South Vietnam
2. Neither South or North Vietnam were NATO countries.

A NATO country cannot invade a non-NATO country and then expect the other NATO countries to go along with it.

[George II]

9. Why did you post a video that blames the US and NATO for the current Ukraine crisis?

[Uncle Joe]

20. I took it as blaming George W. Bush's foreign policies. n/t

[George II]

21. It is blaming the expansion of NATO, which is not governed only by American foreign policy....

....it was done by NATO as a whole. bush didn't expand NATO unilaterally.

There have been eight expansions to NATO since their inception. Seven of those occurred under presidents other than bush.

In a sense he's justifying Russia's military buildup on NATO (not American) policy from almost 20 years ago.

[Uncle Joe]

25. George W. Bush called for it on April 1st during the last year of his Presidency 2008 and then

shit started hitting the fan in Georgia.

April 2, 20086:00 AM ET

As NATO opens its summit Wednesday, leaders face decisions about countries far afield from NATO'S original membership: President Bush is calling for them to do more in Afghanistan, and to do more to bring in former Soviet states like Ukraine and Georgia. Russia doesn't like that idea, but President Bush says it should realize the Cold War is over.

He may be a lame duck president, unpopular in Europe for the war in Iraq, but he didn't seem to shy away from dealing with some of the most troublesome issues in the trans-Atlantic alliance. Speaking in an ornate bank in Romania's capital Bucharest, President Bush told NATO members that they should give ex-Soviet states Ukraine and Georgia a path toward membership. He argued that would help them consolidate democratic gains and cement their independence.

"NATO should welcome Georgia and Ukraine into the membership action plan, and NATO membership must remain open to all of Europe's democracies that seek it," the president said.

France has said it will not give a green light to Ukraine and Georgia because it would upset the balance of power between Europe and Russia. White House officials said only this could be a clarifying moment for NATO.


https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=89300373

(snip)



On 16 April 2008, official ties between the Russian authorities and the separatists in Abkhazia and South Ossetia were sanctioned by an order of Russian president Vladimir Putin. The separatist-authored legislative documents and the separatist-accredited bodies were also recognised.[106] After a United Nations Security Council session on 23 April convened at Georgia's demand, the United States, the United Kingdom, France and Germany stated in a declaration: "We call on the Russian Federation to revoke or not to implement its decision." However, this was labelled a "tall order" by Vitaly Churkin, Russian Ambassador to the UN.[107]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War


(snip)

[FreepFryer]

32. THIS.

It's agitprop, the claim Putin is only responding to US imperialism, held by The Nation, and others.

They blamed President Obama for this back in 2014 - they long ago ran out of justifications for Russia’s behavior, all they can do is the one sided bothsides.

[prodigitalson]

40. Look what you made me do

is what abusive men often tell their victims.

[McKim]

33. I ask....

I ask myself why would we need to be involved at all. Let Germany and France do some diplomacy. Our S.O.S. has a personal family history against Russia and he is pushing this. Is he really representing our interests?

[prodigitalson]

39. What an incredibly ironic name

for an organization blaming Democracies for the aggression of fascists.

[Uncle Joe]

41. What an incredibly ironic defense of democracy

by blaming the free press for bringing forth the critical policy views of a former U.S. Ambassador as to the motivations of the nation that may be waging the most devastating war in Europe since WW2, whether one agrees with his counsel or not.

[prodigitalson]

42. Well that was as clear as mud. nt

[Uncle Joe]

44. Did you actually view the video? n/t

[elleng]

43. Fascinating discussion; thanks, Uncle Joe.

[Uncle Joe]

45. elleng

[LetMyPeopleVote]

46. I hate it when people do Putin's work for him

This ex-ambassador is clearly auditioning for a slot of Fox/tucker