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Martin68

(22,802 posts)
4. Hamas was trained and armed by Iran. In addition, there were certainly given advice regarding how to
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 09:32 AM
Oct 2023

breach the perimeter defenses. On the ground however, it was Hamas fighters alone who achieved the penetration of Israeli defenses. I have yet to see any evidence that intelligence regarding the Iron Dome was used in the attack. The invading troops caused a great deal more damage than any missiles the Iron Dome failed two shoot down. The Israeli perimeter defenses proved to be a Maginot Line that provided a false sense of security and led to the complacency that resulted in the successful attack by Hamas. Israel had moved troops to the West Bank in anticipation of violence there because of settlement activity, leaving the Gaza border undermanned..

flashman13

(666 posts)
10. And your intelligence on Iranian involvement is ??? And you apparently think the Palastinians and
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 02:02 PM
Oct 2023

Hamas are too stupid to plan and stage this attack without outside help. The real culprit here is failure is that Israel totally underestimated Hamas' capabilities. Hubris played a part.

Starting a conflict with Iran would be an even bigger disaster than our attack on Iraq. I commend the Biden administration's desire to tamp down Iranian war fever.

Martin68

(22,802 posts)
11. I most definitely do not think they are too stupid to plan the attack without outside help, but I
Fri Oct 13, 2023, 04:50 PM
Oct 2023

was addressing IronLionZion's statement to that effect. My opinion, not based on intelligence I have access to, is that Hamas could very easily have received advice from bigger players in terms of intelligence and information. I agree that the failure is Israel's, both politically and militarily. I agree that a direct confrontation with Iran would be in on one's interest. At the same time, I also believe killing thousands of Palestinian civilians in Gaza would be extremely counter to Israel's long term interests. I don't think our views are very different.

pwb

(11,275 posts)
2. The just used smaller dumb rockets.
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 09:19 AM
Oct 2023

The dome was for bigger rockets like scuds? Israel is shooting million dollar rockets at regular artillery.

Martin68

(22,802 posts)
3. The headline is false, the Iron Dome is neither mentioned nor a topic in this discussion. It focuses
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 09:27 AM
Oct 2023

on the border perimeter, defenses and US policy decisions.

T_A

(604 posts)
5. The Iron Dome
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 09:41 AM
Oct 2023

wasn't breached, it was merely swamped. Several experts previously predicted it could be accomplished. Hamas merely launched so many thousands of missiles at it, I don't know what the threshold is exactly, but at some point it cannot respond. Any further missiles launched right behind this barrage will hit their targets.

aggiesal

(8,915 posts)
6. OK, this guy being interviewed is a RW hack. ...
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 09:50 AM
Oct 2023

He keeps hammering Biden & states that the (R) are hammering Biden's policy, then says we need to look at Obama's policy as well, never mentioning Pendejo45 policies or that he probably passed classified info about Israel to the top spies in Russia.

I had enough of hearing it.

Captain Zero

(6,806 posts)
8. He was born in South Africa and raised in Toronto
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 10:22 AM
Oct 2023

He has lots of degrees and seems to pose as some kind of expert voice on Iran.
No Democrat admin seems to make him happy.
I can't tell what he really thinks would work over there.
Dubovitz is generally a Lithuanian name in origin and they are Sephardic Jewish in origin too.

aggiesal

(8,915 posts)
9. Thanks, but he obviously was parroting 🦜 RW talking points ...
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 10:52 AM
Oct 2023

got to about 5 min., when he mentioned looking into Biden & Obama policies, completely skipping Pendejo45's policies.

IronLionZion

(45,447 posts)
7. Iron wall is their fortified perimeter fence
Thu Oct 12, 2023, 10:13 AM
Oct 2023

Iron dome is their missile defense system.

I expect better reporting from BBC.

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