What exactly is forgiveness?

[LuckyCharms]

I've been "no contact" with some family members for about fifteen years.

A huge event related to their mistreatment of two other family members made me decide to go no contact. Those mistreated family members have now passed on.

Subsequent to this substantial event, I told the "no contact" family members that all I wanted was a recognition of what they did, and an apology.

I got a reluctant "I'm sorry" from one of these people. The other person had no words for me.

So I decided that they were toxic to me, and I ghosted them. They ghosted me as well.

Over the past 15 years, I've had time to reflect on my entire life and my relationship with them, and I slowly recall past actions that were performed by them, that at the time, I didn't give a second thought to. But as I recall them now, and I put everything together, they did some heinous shit that when taken as a whole, was absolutely horrible. On a personal level, the events represented years of gaslighting. Slow and methodical gaslighting.

On a non-personal level, I believe that their actions caused a non-related third party to take their own life, because the same thing was done by these people to this third party.

The problem is, these actions are so complicated, and appear so innocuous on the surface, that it would take me two hours to explain this to someone who was not involved.

I am at peace with being "no contact". However, people who know that I am no contact with these family members encourage me to "forgive" them, because "not forgiving them only hurts yourself".

Do I forgive them? I'm not sure. I don't know what that is.

I have no apology, or recognition from them of their their deeds. So I don't have a "vehicle" that will carry me to that place called "forgiveness".

I don't wish them harm, so I guess that might be a form of forgiveness, I don't know.

Sometimes I miss them, until I realize that I'm missing something that I never had, but rather, only thought that I had.

We're all getting older, and one or more of us will inevitably die soon. Will I feel grief when one of them dies? I'm not sure, but I don't think so.

The whole situation probably took 5 to 10 years off my life, even though I'm at peace with it now.

I don't really know what forgiveness is. All I know is that I kind of don't give a shit anymore. I'm more or less apathetic to the situation. I think I'm just feeling some frustration towards the people who have no chance of understanding the situation telling me that I need to "forgive". I mean, it already fucked me up, the damage has been done. Saying that I "forgive" someone isn't going to increase my life expectancy.

[PoliticAverse]

1. The people that strongly argue you should forgive people seem to mainly do so based on

what they believe the anger is doing to you.

You seem to have reached "ambivalence".

[LuckyCharms]

4. That's right.

I never had true, furious anger over this.

It was more of "I can't be part of this shit anymore".

But people seem to interpret my feelings as anger, when there's a lot more to it than that.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

2. I try to forgive early and often, even when the offender hasn't asked forgiveness

or even admitted fault.

encourage me to "forgive" them, because "not forgiving them only hurts yourself".

I subscribe to this idea as well. Might have something to do with years spent in the rooms of AA and NA back in the day though

The basic idea is that holding grudges (which is what happens when we don't forgive) is unhealthy to our own minds and bodies. I agree on this account. Grudges can eat a person up, I've seen it happen.

But then if you're now just apathetic about it now, that kinda signifies forgiveness.

You don't have to go get all buddy-buddy with the other person(s) just because you forgave them. It's really just a process (or even more optimally, developing a habit) of not letting yourself feel badly/angry over what someone else (who you do not control) ... did.

Don't let other's shitty actions affect your mental health is the bottom-line. Forgiveness is a euphemism for that larger-picture view.

[Moostache]

3. If you spend more time than it took to write that on them, reconcile...

Otherwise, pay them no mind and focus on the people in your life who you make and receive positive impacts from daily.

Life is short. Family is not chosen, but time spent on people in our lives is precious. Treat it as such and you can't go wrong.
Good luck with your decisions.

[TheRealNorth]

5. Not sure how you forgive someone....

Who is so twisted that they would blame Democrats for the Iraq war in 2013, while in 2003 they were calling you a traitor for opposing the war.

I don't feel any compulsion to reconcile with such people. Not until they apologize and seek forgiveness.

[Fla Dem]

6. Close the book and move on. You have found peace.

[Scrivener7]

7. "Do I forgive them? I'm not sure. I don't know what that is." I am SO with you on this.

I feel the same about one family member. I don't wish them ill. I just wish them away. And my experience is the same as yours: an abusive act caused an estrangement, then with distance I realized how toxic they had always been.

I agree about not knowing what forgiveness is. At least the forgiveness espoused by the "you must always turn the other cheek" folks. Always turning the other cheek is masochistic.

I can't un-know what this person did, and therefore is capable of. I know that, if given a chance, they would do it again.

Occasionally I regret the need for our estrangement, though not the estrangement itself. Because I understand that if you don't want to get mauled by the bear, you stay out of the bear cage. That was a hard lesson for me to learn.

You're fine. You dealt with it. You've brought the situation to where you aren't hurting them and they aren't hurting you. What else can you do?

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

8. Some very smart folks have said some wise things.

Forgive your enemies, but never forget their names. - JFK

Not sure who said this: