Straight-up Lunacy From Arizona: Legislature Wants Study Of Pipeline From The Mississippi River

[hatrack]

Words fail me when I try to comprehend the galactic fucking stupidity of this concept.

The Arizona Legislature on Tuesday made a formal request asking Congress to fund a study to determine the feasibility of pipelining Mississippi River floodwater to the Colorado River.

House Concurrent Memorial 2004 passed the Arizona Senate by a 23-7 vote and the Arizona House by a 54-6 margin. A memorial is not a law, but a legislative measure containing a request or proposal, asking other parties outside the Arizona Legislature's jurisdiction to take action. HCMs have no official standing or effect, but serve as a public record of the request presented for consideration. The memorial was introduced by Rep. Tim Dunn, R-Yuma. Rep. Leo Biasiucci, R-Lake Havasu City, is among co-sponsors.

It asks that “the United States Congress fund a technological and feasibility study of developing a diversion dam and pipeline to harvest floodwater from the Mississippi River to replenish the Colorado River and prevent flood damage along the Mississippi River.” It also states that “If shown to be feasible, the United States Congress implement the diversion dam and pipeline as a partial solution to the water supply shortage in Lake Powell and Lake Mead and the flood damage that occurs along the Mississippi River.”

Lake Powell and Lake Mead are the two major reservoirs on the Colorado River. Both are at historically low levels and likely will trigger a Tier 1 water emergency in Arizona later this year or in 2022. The memorial notes the low water levels of both reservoirs and the “historic flooding in 2011 and 2019 along the Mississippi River” that caused 11 deaths and more than $9.5 billion in damage.

EDIT

https://mohavedailynews.com/news/131764/arizona-legislature-wants-feasibility-study-for-long-distance-pipeline-to-replenish-colorado-river-supply/

[PortTack]

1. It's a desperate situation there. A shorter distance would be to desalinate ocean water and pipe it

[hatrack]

3. Or maybe they could stop watering 250,000 thirsty acres devoted to feeding the global cotton surplus

Or half a million acres devoted to growing hay for livestock?

https://www.nass.usda.gov/Quick_Stats/Ag_Overview/stateOverview.php?state=ARIZONA

[PortTack]

4. True...if you are from there then you know that it is so dry the saguaro cactus are falling over

From lack of water.

Irrigation for alfalfa or cotton is not unique to AZ and is a problem.

[4Q2u2]

2. There is a reason

That Arizona is starving for water.
Their access to the Colorado River was removed because they backed the Confederacy during the Civil War and land was taken from them and given to California and Nevada.
Given their recent history. I say it was a sound judgment.

State Moto "Arizona, making bad choices before we were a State"

[ret5hd]

5. Thousands of miles, a 3000+ feet up...

invasive species, electric generation for pumps…

Yeah, hell…what could go wrong that a high schooler couldn’t predict.

Edit: 3000 feet of water pressure is over 1,300 psi.

[Budi]

6. AZ should be more worried in the effects of Nevada's Lithium mining

Processing of Lithium Ore

The lithium extraction process uses a lot of water—approximately 500,000 gallons per metric ton of lithium. To extract lithium, miners drill a hole in salt flats and pump salty, mineral-rich brine to the surface. After several months the water evaporates, leaving a mixture of manganese, potassium, borax and lithium salts which is then filtered and placed into another evaporation pool. After between 12 and 18 months of this process, the mixture is filtered sufficiently that lithium carbonate can be extracted.

South America’s Lithium Triangle, which covers parts of Argentina, Bolivia and Chile, holds more than half the world’s supply of the metal beneath its salt flats.
But it is also one of the driest places on earth. In Chile’s Salar de Atacama, mining activities consumed 65 percent of the region’s water, which is having a large impact on local farmers to the point that some communities have to get water elsewhere.
MORE
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/the-environmental-impact-of-lithium-batteries/amp/

https://www.hcn.org/issues/53.3/indigenous-affairs-mining-nevada-lithium-mine-kicks-off-a-new-era-of-western-extraction

If AZ is woried about lower water tables now, a pipeling from the MS River isn't going to save them, nor tthe other States who will feel the result as water tables drop even further.
---------

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vice.com/amp/en/article/k7avam/inside-the-lithium-wars-that-could-poison-the-nevada-deserts-water-supply
SNIP
“I was kind of excited about the mine for electric car batteries, but not when I heard it had the potential to drop our water tables,” said Ed Bartell, a cattle rancher with land connected to the mining site. In early February, he sued the Bureau of Land management, which is responsible for approving some of the mine’s permits.

“We’re extremely concerned about the mine—both about our private lands and the likelihood of significantly dropping the water table and affecting vegetation,”Bartell continued. “We depend on the water out there for our livelihood.”

If allowed to proceed, the Thacker Pass Lithium Project would use a “brining” method that can take 500,000 gallons of water to extract one metric ton of lithium. The water is pumped underground to make lithium clay and other minerals surface, which are then put through a leaching process that separates the raw lithium.

🤔 (A lot like FRACKING, only for Lithium rather than Oil! )

Another instance of brine-mining in Nevada harmed fish populations 150 miles downstream from the operation.

“What is at stake here is the soul of the entire environmental movement.”

[dutch777]

7. The size of a pipe to "prevent flood damage along the Mississippi River" is not feasible

The volume and rate of flow is just too high. Not to say you couldn't do multiple pipes but you will never fully stop Mississippi floods. I completely agree states like AZ and CA need to come up with sane and sustainable water use policies before they look to tap other states' water resources. The whole southwest has this issue when you study the craziness around the Colorado and other rivers. There is an interesting editorial last couple of days in the LA times that speaks to CA's issues very well.

Just as an academic exercise a few years ago, I did a back of napkin study of piping water from the mouth of the Columbia river in Oregon and down to CA. On any given day, even in worst low flow in summer, the Columbia could give up a billion gallons of water a day with no environmental impact. My thought was to sell it to CA and backfill OR and WA state budgets with the proceeds. I think if you really need water, a buck a gallon isn't too much to ask, it it? WA state's annual budget runs on about $45 billion a year. If you assume you get even 10 cents a gallon, that would yield WA and OR each about $15 billion annually (assuming 10% or so lost overhead of operating and maintaining the pumping stations and pipeline). You could actually cut some taxes, and start properly funding schools and maintaining roads. Where CA would come up with the money will be a discussion I am sure.

Not sure what the best and smartest answer is but having climate refugees from AZ and CA doesn't seem fruitful. I have thought for a long time that a national "water grid" not dissimilar to the power grid would be good long term planning. That of course will take national level management and certainly run afoul of the all holy "states rights", which I am pretty sure means maybe in a hundred years after huge damage has already been wrought and there is no other option, it will be possible.

[hunter]

8. There was the North American Water and Power Alliance...

... and GRAND which were proposed projects that would have captured water for irrigation and hydropower from Alaska to Mexico.

Canals would have been blasted through the mountains using hydrogen bombs...



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Water_and_Power_Alliance

Many Central California farmers seem to think it is their god given right to use every last drop of water before it reaches the ocean and they put signage along the road explicitly demanding that. They don't care about natural riparian environments at all, even though there are very few of them left of them in the state.

Personally, I think the California would be a better place without the factory farm dairy industry, which uses huge amounts of water and causes huge amounts of pollution.

The Republicans will, of course, use the opinions of a radical environmentalist such as myself to smear all Democrats.