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CentralMass

(15,265 posts)
Thu Aug 25, 2022, 09:15 PM Aug 2022

New superfast electric car charging method reportedly takes just 10 minutes

https://talker.news/2022/08/25/new-superfast-electric-car-charging-method-reportedly-takes-just-10-minutes/
"When a lithium-ion battery is being charged, lithium ions migrate from one side of the device, the cathode, to the other, the anode.

By making the lithium ions migrate faster, the battery is charged more quickly, but sometimes the lithium ions don’t fully move into the anode.

In this situation, lithium metal can build up, and this can trigger early battery failure. It can also cause the cathode to wear and crack.

All of these issues reduce the lifetime of the battery and the effective range of the vehicle.

Speeding up the charge while avoiding the damage requires a huge amount of data on how it affects devices’ lifetimes, efficiencies and safety.

It is also important to take into account the design and condition of batteries, as well as how the charging method would fit into the electric grid infrastructure.

Dr. Dufek and colleagues sought to address this by using machine learning techniques that analyze charging data to create unique charging methods.

By inputting information about the condition of many lithium-ion batteries during their charging and discharging cycles, the scientists trained the machine learning analysis to predict lifetimes and the ways that different designs would eventually fail.

The team then fed that data back into the analysis to identify and optimize new methods that they then tested on real batteries.

Dr. Dufek added: “We’ve significantly increased the amount of energy that can go into a battery cell in a short amount of time.

“Currently, we’re seeing batteries charge to over 90 percent in 10 minutes without lithium plating or cathode cracking.”

The development is a large advance on current methods, the best of which can fully charge an electric vehicle in about 30 minutes."
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NNadir

(33,572 posts)
1. Nevertheless this exercise in kinetics will not change the overall thermodynamics.
Thu Aug 25, 2022, 09:24 PM
Aug 2022

We tell ourselves that electricity is "green," because we spend too much time lying to ourselves by genuflecting before stupid pictures of wind turbines and solar cells, both of which remain trivial forms of energy.

Electricity is not "green." It is increasingly produced by burning dangerous fossil fuels and dumping the waste directly into the planetary atmosphere. Mining shit for batteries makes the situation even worse.

Batteries waste energy, and I suspect the kinetic improvement will waste even more energy and probably increase fire danger as well.

History will not forgive us for our fantasies, including, but hardly limited to, our electric car fantasies.

Finishline42

(1,091 posts)
4. What wastes more energy...
Fri Aug 26, 2022, 09:43 AM
Aug 2022

An EV using batteries or an car using ICE?

Even if the electricity to charge the battery is from a fossil fueled power plant (combined cycle gas plants are closing in on 60% efficient) that power plant is more efficient than ICE.

But then what happens to the equation when those batteries are charged by a grid with a large amount of wind and solar? Or a home solar system?

Tell us again how efficient your favorite power plants are?

NNadir

(33,572 posts)
5. Let me say, first off, that I have been actively arguing that people should be required to have...
Fri Aug 26, 2022, 05:06 PM
Aug 2022

...at least a primitive sense of the laws of thermodynamics in order to graduate from high school, if not the somewhat arcane third law, certainly the very simple zeroth, first and second laws.

If one is illiterate about energy - and I certainly encounter a number of people who fit into the class of energy illiterates, some of whom are as proud of showing their illiteracy as Donald Trump is proud of displaying his illiteracy - one might profit by at least opening a high school level chemistry or physics text to learn that any process that converts one form of energy into another will be irreversible, that is, the second law.

If one actually gives a shit about the future of humanity on one level, and the future of the planet at a higher level, one can go even further and access college level texts, graduate level texts, or even (gasp) the primary scientific literature.

However if one has no time for any of the above, one can simply repeat lazy dogma when a bourgeois fantasy is exposed for what it is, ethical indifference of the worst possible sort. It is ethical indifference because people are quite literally, all over the world, literally dying from heat stroke. Rivers are disappearing, crops are failing, forests are burning, glaciers collapsing and what excites the attention of the type who chant insipidly on topics about which they clearly know nothing at all? The statement of the fact that a battery is a device that wastes energy.

Facts matter.

Had this been required for a very long time, that it be a requirement that to graduate from high school one would need to be familiar with at least the zeroth, first and second law of thermodynamics, everyone would know that a battery is a device that wastes energy. It's a law of physics, an incontrovertible law. The California legislature cannot repeal it. In this case, I suspect the planet would not be burning up, but it is burning up, this while bourgeois airheads carry on about their material fantasies of electric cars and how they can make this stupid fantasy address their appalling need to live with in absolute or at least maximal convenience.

I am not the type to be surprised to hear anti-nukes speak in defense of dangerous natural gas plants; their "solar and wind will save us" bullshit depends on access to natural gas, as the folks who funded Putin's brutal war, while declaring themselves "green" for willfully destroying nuclear infrastructure that was valuable to all humanity - this would be the Germans - are finding out. Of course, as they've pissed off the guy to whom they've sent all that money by not applauding the brutal war on which he's spending their money they paid him, they have to burn coal this summer, because their large amount of wind infrastructure hasn't been doing shit in this brutal low wind European summer. The Germans have no fucking idea how they're going to heat homes this winter, when their large amount of solar infrastructure will be as unreliable as their large amount of wind has been all fucking summer.

But let's return to thermodynamics:

Now, as it happens, I discussed combined cycle gas power plants with my son as he launched his nuclear engineering Ph.D. program, not because I have any interest in defending fossil fuel plants - I am quite clear that I want every fucking combined cycle dangerous natural gas plant on this planet shut - but because I regard process intensification as a vitally important issue. It doesn't make a fuck load of difference to me if they have higher thermodynamic efficiency than straight up Rankine coal plants such as the Germans are running this low wind hot summer. What matters to me is that the primary energy source, fossil fuels, is killing the planet. They shut their nuclear plants to burn coal. That's a fact.

Again, facts matter.

Again, people are dying in the streets from extreme heat, all over the world, and many of these people, particularly in poorer countries, will also face famine because of withered crops and the unavailability of water. I wonder, even if electric car worshipping types couldn't care less, how the cobalt digging slaves in the Congo River basin are doing in extreme temperatures.

Speaking of slavery you know, in this space, I recently directed attention to a scientific viewpoint in the recent issue of Environmental Science and Technology on the subject of human slavery, something about which I care, even though I'm powerless to do much about it: Toward an Emissions and Modern Slavery Impact Accounting Model. Predictably, none of the anti-nukes who populate this space had a peep to offer on the subject, but over the years, I've seen that any criticism of electric cars or batteries induces fits of rage.

It says a lot, at least to me.

In the original post on this scientific viewpoint on human slavery I didn't bold anything in the excerpts, but let me do so now in repeating an excerpt here:

...Despite this chain, research untangling the complex relationship between inequality, modern slavery, greenhouse gas emissions, and climate change–what we call the modern slavery-climate change nexus–has only just begun. (1,5,7,13) Often research misses this complexity, focusing instead on the modern slavery-environment nexus which is understandable given the prevalence of modern slavery in the supply chain of industries including fishing, (14) brick making, mining/quarrying, manufacturing, (12) forestry, (5) agriculture, renewable energies, and wildlife trafficking. (8,15) Because GHG emissions and modern slavery result from inequality and have a profound effect on climate change, we advocate moving toward a fairer society by (1) highlighting the value of a multi-region input–output (MRIO) model that integrates both modern slavery and greenhouse gas emissions data cross regionally to quantify and untangle the interlinkages between the two and how they impact across supply chains, (2) demonstrating the practical implications of such a model, and (3) working toward integrated international agreements that traverse the modern slavery-climate change nexus...


What we care about says who we are.

Now, since the thermodynamic efficiency of combined cycle gas plants has been discussed, a combined cycle plant couples a Brayton cycle device to a traditional Rankine cycle device. A Rankine cycle device is generally a steam driven plant. The overall thermodynamic efficiency of a plant is driven is driven by how it it operates. A Rankin device's overall (24/7, 365 days per year) efficiency will decline if it is repeatedly shut down because some highly subsidized redundant and generally unreliable system - say a huge wind infrastructure in a summer of extreme heat driven doldrums - suddenly works for a few hours in the day. One need not understand the laws of thermodynamics on a profound level say, so as to determine the entropy of a system via the use of probability distribution functions or understand the Helmholtz functions. One can simply put a kettle on a gas stove, boil water, turn the gas off for a time, and see if the water instantly returns to boiling when the gas is turned back on. One would have to be a liar to say that it does.

Almost all of the nuclear plants operating on this planet are BWR's and PWR's, and everyone of these is a Rankine cycle device. This means, depending on ambient temperatures, they operate at about 33% to 35% efficiency. AGCR's, a reactor design prominent in Great Britain, are essentially Brayton devices, and their thermodynamic efficiency because of their higher temperature operation is about 41%, better than the Rankine coal plants with which the Germans are killing people by burning lignite in them.

Now, I note that solar energy is not environmentally unacceptable because its thermodynamic efficiency is low. For decades announcements of light to electricity efficiency of a little more than 20% have all been hailed as "breakthroughs." The solar industry is neither environmentally nor economically viable because it is unreliable, because it cannot operate without redundant systems. The low thermodynamic efficiency impacts the material and land destruction required to use it, but it's not the main issue. The lack of reliability is the issue. Fifty years of similar battery bullshit "breakthrough" hasn't changed this either. Overwhelmingly, wherever money has been squandered on solar and wind, these unreliable systems are backed up with dangerous fossil fuels.

It's fucking killing the planet.

Of course, it really doesn't matter how efficient nuclear plants are since their source of primary energy, nuclear fission, doesn't kill people when the plants operate normally. This contrasts with dangerous fossil fuel plants that we find anti-nukes applauding which kill people whenever they operate, normally or otherwise.

Still, to maximize the benefit to humanity, thermodynamic efficiency of nuclear power plants should take a high priority.

To my mind - and this is the point I made to my son as we sent him off to his Ph.D. program - we should not focus on (at the simplest level) Carnot efficiency, but rather on maximizing exergy from primary heat energy, this by deriving chemical potential energy - my preferred form being DME - from this heat via thermochemical cycles, with electricity being a side product.

As for "fast battery charging" "breakthroughs," they, like solar cells with efficiencies higher than 20% are a dime a dozen. The search terms (fast charging battery review) produces over 20,000 hits, going back to the dawn of this century, a period in which the concentration of dangerous fossil fuel waste in the planetary atmosphere rose nearly by 50 ppm while everybody chanted nonsense about solar, wind and energy storage.

My son is already a Master's level materials scientist. I note that the development of combined cycle systems was a function of developments in materials science, specifically thermal barrier coatings and refractory alloys. There is no reason whatsoever that this technology could not be applied to clean energy - of which there is only one form, nuclear energy - allowing us to abandon filthy energy, the fossil fuel industry on which the useless solar and wind industries depend and indeed to abandon the land and material intensive and unsustainable wind and solar industries.

I have heard bourgeois anti-nuke types here whine incessantly about the cost of the Vogtle nuclear plants one of which will fuel next month. These same people don't ever whine about the cost of climate change, about which they have never before, and do not now, and never will give a shit.

I expect that the Vogtle plants will operate until nearly the dawn of the 22nd century, perhaps with an interlude of refurbishment such as is being carried out on many of Canada's Candus, meaning they will have operated 80 years. The Vogtle plants will be operating when every single wind turbine blade on every disgusting wind turbine on this planet will have been in landfills for more than half a century, when every solar cell now installed will be leaching crap into water supplies around the world after burial with the rest of the electronic waste, including spent batteries, even if some of them are able to find the energy to be recycled. (No distributed energy system is subject to complete recycling, and all recycling schemes involve heat, which is not generally accessible from wind and solar junk - I hope to not be disgusted by reference to the destruction of huge land areas for solar thermal junk.)

My son agreed in his first meeting with his advisor, by the way, that he will begin his lab training by familiarizing himself with additive manufacture of refractory alloys, another term for additive manufacture being "3D printing."

This is a key technology that will revolutionize nuclear infrastructure building.

It's not at all futuristic: This year, for the first time, 3D printed nuclear components were installed in a nuclear plant. First use of 3D-printed nuclear fuel debris filters . I'm happy as a clam to hear about my son working in this area, since I have long thought about 3D printed ceramic reactor cores. We are well on our way there: First-of-its-kind 3D printed nuclear fuel component to enter use

Now, it's very clear - and Vogtle, despite being a gift to future generations rather than the liability that every piece of so called "renewable energy" junk will be when today's toddlers are finishing college is evidence - that the American nuclear energy construction infrastructure has been badly damaged by appeals to fear and ignorance by bean counting bourgeois anti-nukes who value their electric car fantasies above human decency and even human lives.

The answer to this willful destruction is the term that my President uses in a different context: "Build back better."

I really don't care what anti-nukes think. Neither does my son. Neither do his peers, his advisors, and his new friends among his fellow graduate students, most of whom are where they are because climate change is the most important issue before humanity, as opposed to how fucking convenient and fast it is to charge an electric car.

Antinukes can pick lint out of their navels and whine about criticisms of their battery bullshit to the end of their days. Irrespective of it, the damage they have done to the future is winding down, to be sure; reality - dire reality, awful reality - is before us. The German Emperor, the Renewable Energy Kaiser, has been shown to be naked, except for the stains of coal soot.

Have a great weekend.








Finishline42

(1,091 posts)
6. It's going to take awhile...
Fri Aug 26, 2022, 06:54 PM
Aug 2022

heck of a post on a Friday afternoon...

The efficiency of a solar panel has no meaning except as a way to log the progress in their development, unlike with any other power plant that has to pay for fuel. The fuel for wind and solar comes at no cost (at least for now) so what does it matter if they are 15% or 25% efficient other than how many it takes to produce a given amount of electricity?

Batteries are a hell of lot more efficient in load shifting than nuclear is at creating electricity and if the electricity comes from wind or solar, it's a clear win for the environment. And unlike coal, gas or nuclear - batteries will keep getting cheaper and better. Just like most of what is manufactured - the more we make the better and cheaper it gets.

Back at you...

NNadir

(33,572 posts)
7. Bullshit. This is rich, and advocate of the solar and wind disaster talking about load following.
Sat Aug 27, 2022, 08:32 AM
Aug 2022

The unreliable solar and wind systems can't do "load shifting" and in fact destroy the economics of reliable systems, because they produce energy when it's not needed and don't produce energy when it is needed. This is a disgrace.

The wind and solar fantasy - led by anti-nukes under Hollande - has damaged the French nuclear infrastructure at precisely the time it might have saved Europe.

Load following? Really?

As for what nuclear plants can and cannot do, an anti-nuke who has spent four decades whining about Three Mile Island clearly knows zero about nuclear engineering. Every time they open their mouths on the subject, they expose their awful ignorance. Nuclear plants should and in fact must run continuously, powering non-nuclear islands for multiple missions, because continuous reliable systems have the least environmental impact. They are sustainable.

It is immoral to make more "stuff" "cheaper" because we have bizarre unworkable fantasies of piling "stuff" on top of "stuff" for Rube Goldberg rickety nonsense ideas that never address the reality of the task. Every mineral mined is stolen from future generations. The task is to save a world badly damaged by the "freedom" to endorse, spread, and market ignorance.

How is it that this escapes attention? Have we become so fucking head up the ass that we simply chant this kind of bullshit?

Wind and solar are not just an incredible loss to the environment, but it is a loss to humanity and are inducing, not that bourgeois types give a shit, energy poverty at the expense of our poorest citizens of the world.

It is unbelievably unconscionable under these circumstances to talk about whether batteries are becoming "cheap." For whom? The cobalt digging slaves? The poor people who are going to have to "recycle" them at risk to their health, so bourgeois morons can declare themselves "green?"

Have any of these people ever opened a paper discussing the concentration of organohalides in the blood of children of electronics "recyclers?"

How is it that anti-nukes can look at this situation, the planet literally burning, vast ecosystems collapsing, agriculture collapsing, incredible storms tearing through the planet and smile happily and say that "batteries are becoming cheap?"

If one can't open a science book and understand its contents, one should probably try to open a book on ethics, although this subject too, may be beyond the comprehension of these types.

keithbvadu2

(36,961 posts)
3. Short term convenience/gain for early expensive failure.
Thu Aug 25, 2022, 09:43 PM
Aug 2022

Short term convenience/gain for early expensive failure.

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