EV fast charging station tells you when its power is at its cheapest and greenest

[Think. Again.]

Michelle Lewis | Sep 22 2023 - 4:42 pm PT
Full Article: https://electrek.co/2023/09/22/ev-fast-charging-station-better-energy/

This DC fast charging station tells EV drivers when renewable energy is at its peak in the grid – and thus when charging prices are cheapest.

-snip-

What makes this charging station unique is its dynamic pricing model. It differs from traditional fixed pricing schemes because it incentivizes EV drivers with lower charging prices when renewable energy is at its peak on the grid.



The charging price, which is available the day before, follows the Danish energy spot prices. Similar to a gas station’s pricing signs, the EV charging station’s price board is visible from the road. (Why don’t all EV charging stations do this?)

“We want to encourage people to charge their cars when there is a lot of renewable electricity in the grid by making it cheaper when the sun is shining and the wind is blowing,” said Peter Munck Søe-Jensen, EVP of power solutions at Better Energy.

The Danish company feels its model helps drivers plan in advance to charge their EVs when energy is at its cheapest. Plus, by charging EVs when solar and wind energy production is high, consumers can also increase the probability that they’re using renewable, not fossil fuel-powered, energy.

-snip-

It's good to see so much progress being made in these very young technologies, I only wish OUR country was also doing these things. Our National Energy Security should not be as ignored as it is.

[bcool]

1. Sounds good in theory, but...

...isn't practical for most people (at least in the U.S.).

Most fast chargers are used by people on road trips where you can't plan on charging at certain times - you need them when you need them.

These would work for those that charge locally, like people who live in apartments that can't charge at home - which is a tiny percentage of EV drivers right now.

It's a good idea for those who can take advantage of them, but it's not as great as they make them out to be.

[Think. Again.]

2. Or...

...people that need to use them when they need to, can use them when they need to, and others can can use them as they are planned to be used.

Theory proven!

[marble falls]

3. Texas wind produces so much power at night, it's given away for free. If we were on the national ...

... we could be selling it.

[Think. Again.]

4. You could just store it for use the next day?

[marble falls]

5. If it could be "saved", they wouldn't be giving it away for free.

[Think. Again.]

6. Impossible to store...

...in batteries or hydrogen? That's odd.

[marble falls]

7. Odd because no one's doing it on the scale that nation's largest producer wind power can use, ...

...or odd that you think this is practical as of today?

[Think. Again.]

8. It's extremely practical...

...to store unused energy for when it's needed. And the only reason they're not building out more storage is because they choose not to. It's done very successfully in lots of places.

I'm guessing the Texas oil companies would prefer to give away the night wind than have it reduce their day oil sales (or something like that)

[marble falls]

9. Really. Where's the equipment to do this? Seriously, the oil companies? The oil companies have ...

... investment in wind in Texas, the late oilman T. Boone Pickens started it and his stockholders are very happy about it.

As soon as the technology is proven, it's been amped up and in production and on the market, get back to me. Why would the wind energy companies not want to embrace storage technology? They don't like making money?

[Think. Again.]

10. Hi! just getting back to you....

...about that info you asked for.

Here's a quick and easy wikipedia link to start looking for a list of large, grid energy storage plants in operation.

The list at the link below has about 60 large storage facilities listed with lots of additional info, but it doesn't include ANY of the H2 production plants that can store energy for longer periods.

Good luck!...

List of energy storage power plants

This is a list of energy storage power plants worldwide, other than pumped hydro storage. Many individual energy storage plants augment electrical grids by capturing excess electrical energy during periods of low demand and storing it in other forms until needed on an electrical grid. The energy is later converted back to its electrical form and returned to the grid as needed. Most of the world's grid energy storage by capacity is in the form of pumped-storage hydroelectricity, which is covered in List of pumped-storage hydroelectric power stations and not included here. This article list plants using all other forms of energy storage.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_energy_storage_power_plants

[marble falls]

11. That's the description. Now show me a company catologue of the batteries and other equipment ...

... Again: why in the world would wind energy electric providers not want storage systems? Why do you think they give the energy away at night? Again, oil is heavily invested in wind. Why wouldn't oil companies (which mostly describe themselves these days as 'energy company' want wind electric when there are certain industries totally dependent on oil. Like militaries, airlines.

It's like the old saw about the oil industry quashing 500 mile a gallon gasoline carburetors. Why in the world would oil companies quash an opportunity to raise their prices commensurate with a 500 MPG carburetor? Why would big oil selling a commodity that will most certainly run out at some time, refuse to sell it's products at a higher price per gallon now?

Just think: Europe has hydrogen commercial trucks on the road and so do some Southeast Asian nations. But the cars are still burning gas. Rising gas prices selling more electric autos - good, more batteries being charged at night and people start paying for night electric as demand grows. Because cars would be charged at night, right?

Now if electric car manufacturers can only get efficent and safe batteries. And they will.

[Think. Again.]

12. Why are you fighting this so hard?....

...the wiki page I gave you shows over 60 actively working grid-scale energy storage facilities not including hydropower or H2 plants.

As to your questions about why the oil companies don't want competition to selling oil until they've sold the oil they already own, I think maybe the answer is obvious?

Anyway, have a great day.

[marble falls]

13. Again: no examples of any city or electric provider using a battery storage system...

... why can't you face reality: there's no sort of available system to bank the amount of electricity wind produces in Texas. If there was you can bet your grandmother they'd be using it right now. The oil industry doesn't care about wind power, they are invested in wind power.

[Think. Again.]

14. Again: 60 examples of grid-scale energy storage systems....

...why can't you face reality; I have supplied you with a list of over 60 grid-scale energy storage systems currently in use.

(I really don't understand this conversation)

[marble falls]

15. Not one of which could handle the output of the wind generation here in Texas. 10 megawatts ain't ..

... ain't going to cut it for turbines that put and average two megawatts daily.

"Wind power in Texas, a portion of total energy in Texas, consists of over 150 wind farms, which together have a total nameplate capacity of over 30,000 MW. If Texas were a country, it would rank fifth in the world: The installed wind capacity in Texas exceeds installed wind capacity in all countries but China, the United States, Germany and India."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_Texas

You do the math and then consider what it would take to monitor and tie these together.

There is NO practical off the shelf method for battery storage of wind generated electricity on the level Texas wind generation produces. If there were, the wind generation and oil companies would be all over it.


"Starting in 2008, the wind power development boom in Texas outstripped the capacity of the transmission systems in place,[19] and predicted shortages in transmission capability could have dampened the growth of the industry. Until 2008, the growth in wind power "piggybacked" on existing lines, but had almost depleted spare capacity.[20] As a result, in winter the west Texas grid often had such a local surplus of power, that the price would fall below zero.[21][22] According to Michael Goggin, electric industry analyst at AWEA, "Prices fell below US −$30/MWh (megawatt-hour) on 63% of days during the first half of 2008, compared to 10% for the same period in 2007 and 5% in 2006."[23]"

Do you think the energy producers are philanthropists who like generating free power????



"In July 2008, utility officials gave preliminary approval to a $4.9 billion plan to build new transmission lines to carry wind-generated electricity from West Texas to urban areas such as Dallas. The new plan would be the biggest investment in renewable energy in U.S. history, and would add transmission lines capable of moving about 18,000 megawatts.[24] ERCOT curtailed wind power by 17% (3.8 TWh) in 2009, but that decreased to only 0.5% by 2014, as transmission improved, particularly the Competitive Renewable Energy Zone (CREZ) in 2013.[25][26][27] However the CREZ lines are sometimes maxed out, and in November 2015, prices were negative for 50 hours. "

Did you get that? ERCOT cut Wind production by 17% because WIND WAS PRODUCING TOO MUCH ELECTRICITY. Just think: if they had practical battery storage and connection to the national power grid, they'd be getting paid for their surplus and provide for Texas when the weather almost breaks ERCOT down like this summer and winter two years ago.


"Future developments

Like several Texas solar plants, some Texas wind power plants include storage, with more projects under construction.[42] One of the first such energy storage systems started as 36 MW in Notrees in December 2012. The system allows excess wind energy to be stored, making the output more predictable and less variable.[43][44]

If developed, the Tres Amigas HVDC link to the Western grid and the Eastern grid could allow more flexibility in importing and exporting power to and from Texas.[45]

A 300 MW offshore wind farm is planned for Galveston, and 2,100 MW for the Gulf Coast of Texas.[46] Making turbines that are able to yaw quickly could make them more likely to be able to survive a hurricane.[47] "

See? Just like I said. The best storage they can get now is for 36 MW. They are trying to develop storage but it just is not available yet.


Get over it.

[Think. Again.]

16. You expect ONE...

...storage installation to be adaquate for an entire state's energy production???

And you're about the fact that there isn't an "off the shelf" system for Texas because there is no such thing as an "off the shelf" grid scale storage system.

[marble falls]

18. Who needs one? How about one with 100MW. The best that the wind industry has come ...

... up with is 30MW.

It needs more than one, there's more than one company involved. How about 1000MW? How about several per company? How about some magic beans?

However you want it to be, the equipment is not available, though wind power providers are experimenting with battery storage.

[Think. Again.]

20. yes...

The list I referred to above tops out with a system that is storing 3,000 MWH.

[Think. Again.]

17. and...

...the grid scale storage systems on that list top out at 3,000 MWh, I don't know where you got 10 MWh from.

[Think. Again.]

21. I don't understand this post.