Things Are Changing. Democrats are becoming Pro-Palestinian.

[qwlauren35]

Last edited Wed Mar 23, 2022, 10:03 AM - Edit history (1)

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-joe-biden-only-on-ap-middle-east-government-and-politics-8417ab720a42826a5e14f2dd31ff4fc8

WASHINGTON (AP) — A new poll on American attitudes toward a core conflict in the Middle East finds about half of Democrats want the U.S. to do more to support the Palestinians, showing that a growing rift among Democratic lawmakers is also reflected in the party’s base.

The poll from The Associated Press-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research finds differences within both the Democratic and the Republican parties on the U.S. approach toward Israel and the Palestinians, with liberal Democrats wanting more support for the Palestinians and conservative Republicans seeking even greater support for the Israelis.

The survey also examined Americans’ opinions on the Biden administration’s handling of the Israel-Palestinian conflict. The survey was conducted about three weeks into a cease-fire following a devastating 11-day war last month between Israel and the Gaza Strip’s Hamas militant rulers. The fighting killed at least 254 Palestinians and 13 people in Israel.

Among Democrats, 51% say the U.S. is not supportive enough of the Palestinians. The sentiment jumps to 62% among Democrats who describe themselves as liberal.

I have always had strong feelings in support of Palestine. In the articles I'm reading, this is true for a growing minority of African-Americans, especially those who identify with Black Lives Matter activists.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/05/30/black-lives-matter-palestine-history-491234

The violence that erupted in Israel and Palestine this spring has activated a powerful sense of solidarity among many African-Americans. Well-known Black public figures, from Brooklyn Nets point guard Kyrie Irving to actress Viola Davis, have been outspoken in support of Palestinians. Black Lives Matter activists have played an active role organizing and promoting pro-Palestinian protests all over the country. A Black Lives Matter organizer in New Jersey summarized the movement’s sentiments by saying, “we know occupation, we know colonization, we know police brutality.”

I think, when I read about what was happening, what is happening, I definitely think "police brutality". And it angers me.

However, I'm also VERY angry at the quickness I am seeing to silence those who are Pro-Palestinian. Especially those who would suggest that being Pro-Palestinian is ***automatically*** anti-Semitic. I read a recent OPINION PIECE about the Israeli position toward Palestinians, and it was so hostile and so unfair, I had no words. Six no's.

No two-state solution, no one-state solution. No negotiations. No end to settlement. No Palestinian Sovereignty in Jerusalem. No refugee return.

Now, this is an opinion piece, so it's possible that these things are not firm positions.

https://www.usip.org/publications/2022/02/israeli-palestinian-conflict-danger-no-solution-messaging#:~:text=Israel's%20%E2%80%9CSix%20No's%E2%80%9D,and%20no%20peace%20with%20Israel.

It is the sheer ugliness of this position that makes me want the US to take action against Israel. Stop sending them money and weapons. Invoke sanctions.

I would also like to see Palestine recognized as a nation by the UN.

[Tetrachloride]

1. I humbly submit a first draft of geography of the Palestinian subgroups

1. Gaza Strip. (south of Israel on the Mediterranean, with southern borders with Egypt)
2. West Bank
3. citizens inside Israel
4. Palestinians outside of the first 3

I have read Wiki recently. The leadership of West Bank vs Gaza are at odds.

Not all Egyptians are willing to discuss Palestinians calmly. I recently brought the topic up and was quickly rebuffed without completing 3 sentences, much less my first question.

So, … in conclusion, not a homogeneous group.

Yeah, it’s not much. Nevertheless, I have sources who I can chat with… if I know what to ask.

As economic and natural resources are getting thin here, some issues are going to arise from dormancy.

The old guard of staunchly pro Israel is not the same as pre Internet days

[Mosby]

2. You realize the 6 no's is made up by the author?

It's an opinion piece, which omits numerous salient facts regarding the conflict to create the authors narrative.

The author is trying to create a non existent parallel (because he made it up) to the 3 no's of Khartoum, a resolution the Arab league passed in 1967 after their war of genocide failed against the Israelis. It states:

No peace with Israel, no recognition of Israel, no negotiations with Israel.

This is the position today with many Middle East states, including the Palestinians for the most part.

[qwlauren35]

3. No, I didn't realize it.

I will make some edits to my note.

However, I would like to know - are any of these positions that are suggested actually false? Are any of these positions actually "yes's"?

[Israeli]

4. They are not false .

Over here it is called " The Status Quo ".

Ref : https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-the-deception-and-the-myth-of-the-status-quo-1.10155018

It’s not just that a status quo always perpetuates a power balance. In contrast to prevailing opinions that it freezes time, it also allows the side that profits from it to deepen the arrangement that benefits it, and to promote it, while the losing side is limited in what it can do. Israelis are well aware of this when, in the name of the status quo, they are deprived of the use of public transportation on Shabbat, but they prefer to forget the concept when it comes to Israel’s polices in the occupied territories.

For many years now the preferred government policy toward the Palestinians has been to maintain the status quo, without the headache of negotiations and breakthroughs; maintaining what already exists, and that’s all. Military occupation forever. Benjamin Netanyahu turned this idea into his flagship policy. Naftali Bennett, it now turns out, intends to leverage this approach even more forcefully. In an interview with the New York Times this week, he described how his government would maintain a “balance”: on one hand not annexing, on the other hand not allowing a Palestinian state to be established.

A freeze that benefits everyone? Certainly not. The situation on the ground serves only the opponents of a two-state solution. Proof of this could be found in Bennett’s own words, when he said that along with the supposed freeze, Israel will continue to expand settlements in the name of “natural growth.” Palestinians allegedly will also be allowed to build in “existing towns and villages,” meaning Israel will continue its illegal expansion, since that is what already exists, and the Palestinians will remain in their own domain.

The existing situation that allows the deepening of the occupation and a creeping annexation along with an expansion of settlements is in no way the “middle ground.” The left wing of the coalition knows this full well, but is allowing the perpetuation of this thesis, enabling Bennett to use them as his excuse.

Under the myth/deception of a status quo that is a balanced compromise, manufactured by centrist politics that cleave to an imaginary “will of the people,” the Bennett government will advance more than ever the perpetuation of the existing situation, entrenching the current balance of power in the territories for generations, making the possibility of a two-state solution more remote than ever – and all of this courtesy of its left wing. Because anything new is forbidden by the Torah, the main thing is that the train of peace never passes this way.

[Israeli]

5. I agree

I think things are changing .

See my sig :

But aside from all the gloom and doom, yesh atid [there is a future]. Israelis and Palestinians cannot continue to live with the status quo—whether it’s the fear of terrorist attacks, the cost of living, or the brutality of occupation and land expropriation which is affecting their everyday lives. Israelis and Palestinians are neighbors, for better or worse, and can’t afford to continue the endless cycle of violence that has defined both peoples’ lives for generations. To give up or demonize the other is fruitless and unproductive. The only way forward is through a two-state solution which grants the right of self-determination to both peoples, and allows each population who are sick of each other, a chance to settle down. If you care about Israelis, Palestinians, justice, human rights, or all or any of the above, I strongly urge for you to coordinate with the Israelis and Palestinians on the ground working to create a better reality. So the next time you hear that the Israeli left, liberal Zionism, or the two-state solution is dead, I challenge you to challenge that, take a stance for peace in anyway you can. For the Israeli left is not dead, but it could certainly use our help.

Ref: https://www.progressiveisrael.org/the-israeli-left-lives/

We dont define ourselves as " Pro-Palestinian " rather pro Peace .
Without a Two State Solution there will never be peace ,

[qwlauren35]

6. Pro-Peace makes a lot of sense.

That's a beautiful paragraph, and I'm glad that your movement exists.

I wonder if the old school will have to die off before peace can be realized.

I know that here in the US, 20 years ago, I thought that the millenials and subsequent generations would end racism. But it hasn't happened, and I am very disappointed. Maybe I just haven't waited long enough. More old-timers, especially in the Senate and positions of power, have to die first.

[Israeli]

7. Its an American organisation .

They are affiliated with the political party that I support , Meretz .

Ref : https://www.progressiveisrael.org/about-us/history/

Meretz USA was strengthened by a 1997 merger with Americans for Progressive Israel, an organization whose origin dated back to an organization of graduates of the Hashomer Hatzair youth moment in the mid-1940s. API participated in Zionist institutions, raised money for the kibbutz movement and organized community and cultural activities. It established a monthly journal, “Israel Horizons.”a voice for left-wing Zionists for 59 years until 2011. PPI’s current online magazine, under the same name, first appeared in the fall of 2017.

In the early 2000s, Meretz USA collaborated with the Labor Zionist Alliance (today called Ameinu), as well as college-aged members of the two left-Zionist youth groups to create the Union of Progressive Zionists (UPZ). By 2007, the UPZ had chapters at 60 universities and colleges across the United States. In 2009, the UPZ became “J Street U.”

Partners for Progressive Israel has supporters and partners in many places across the United States. It has board members in California, DC, Florida, Massachusetts, New York, New Jersey, South Carolina and more. Its national offices are in New York City.

[Israeli]

8. We have many movements of our own

all of which are against the occupation and for a Two State Solution .

The largest and best known is Peace Now .

See : https://peacenow.org.il/en

The one that I belong to is smaller and not well known outside of Israel , Gush Shalom .

See : http://zope.gush-shalom.org/index_en.html

Plus many other Peace groups/movements :

https://www.theparentscircle.org/en/pcff-home-page-en/

https://www.ir-amim.org.il/en

https://www.breakingthesilence.org.il/

https://www.btselem.org/