Anti-gay Hate Mail is ok on DU, per Skinner

[dbackjon]

On ATA, I posted the hate mail I received.

Skinner's response:

That's pretty awful.
Unfortunately, some people seem to think it is okay to use the DU Mail system to be rude. If you go back to that message in your inbox, there is a button at the top of the message that says "Block this sender." Click it and follow the instructions to block mail from that person. He will not be able to insult you by DU Mail again.







So it looks like Hate Mail is OK here on DU.

[Buzz Clik]

1. Ok. Next time, air the message publicly. Take away the "private hate mail" game entirely.

[dbackjon]

3. I did - see posting in this forum

http://www.democraticunderground.com/113728403

[Buzz Clik]

7. Good!

[dixiegrrrrl]

15. I put that person on my ignore list after reading that mail.

If enogh people do that.............

[William769]

16. ...

[Vanje]

39. Wow.

Sender, davidpdx, deviated from the talking points.

[closeupready]

22. Yep.

[William769]

2. Oh boy.

I understand Skinner's response in that "Block this sender." Thats how he thinks.

Skinner does not understand (and this is only my opinion on this) that sometimes blocking isn't good enough. To me blocking something like that is telling me to go back into the closet then you won't have to deal with it. Thats just wrong on so many levels for our community. There is a LGBT member that sends me random PM's that really irk me but in no way are hateful, that would be a case to use block (even though I don't, I just ignore them on my own).

I realize it's a balancing act for Skinner but until he walks a mile in our shoe's which will never happen (given the nature of sexuality), we will constantly be subjected to this kind of treatment.

I hope I didn't ramble to bad on this.

P.S. Know that we love you & support you and that asshole that sent the PM will eventually get his. Karma has a way of working things out.

[dbackjon]

4. And that was the jist of my response back to Skinner

That's it? No punishment for him?
He's free to continue to spew his hatred towards others here on DU?

[DURHAM D]

5. I served on a jury for your OP.

The vote was 4-2 to Leave.

[William769]

6. Interesting.

Was there any tidbits in the comments?

[DURHAM D]

9. Not really.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

This smears DU and SKinner. Disruptive.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Thu Jun 27, 2013, 10:41 AM, and the Jury voted 2-4 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: A) Skinner has the ability to get rid of any posts he feels violates the rules. B) If it is an accurate account of the mail, then it isn't a smear, it's a recitation of events, coupled with opinion.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT and said: "Hide" vote here although poster's disgruntledness and wrongheadedness needs visabiity and review.
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Too bad davidpdx if you think this smears DU and Skinner. It is posted in a protected group and you should be removed from DU.


Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Ignore and alert. I agree with Skinner. Mail sender will not be around long if this behavior continues.



I was juror #4.

[William769]

11. Thanks .

Juror #1 & juror #4

[DURHAM D]

13. I checked earlier to see if the hate mailer has ever posted

in LGBT as he seems a perfect candidate for blocking but did not find a single post.

[William769]

14. Thats a whole other can of worms I'm staying away from

Since I stopped hosting here back in February.

But I do agree with that you said.

[dbackjon]

12. Good reply

[dbackjon]

8. Someone actually alerted on my OP?

Wow - probably one the anti-gay bigots that infest DU.

[QC]

17. Wish I could say I'm surprised, but

the management here tolerates a surprising amount of bullying.

There are members here who have done nothing for well over a decade but stalk, bully, and harass other members, and not only are they still around, but some of them are serving as MIRT members and forum hosts.

The jury system has basically made bullying official DU policy, since even the most hateful personal attacks generally stay up now if they are directed at unpopular members or ideas.

So no, I can't really say I'm surprised that hate mail is allowed.

[mitchtv]

18. time for another "best of DU" thread

this time in a non DU site , It's ready to roll

[nomorenomore08]

24. I guess they know where the line is. And how to stop just short of bannable behavior.

Needless to say, said "line" is fuzzier than it should be.

[Kolesar]

30. The NSA/drones get away with hounding Prosense

She writes well referenced posts, and they close in like yapping hyenas. They know how to test the line of rules violations as they cross the lines of civility.

[Marrah_G]

44. As far as PS goes

I'll say what I say in MIRT every time one of the posts aimed at PS gets alerted on:

I generally agree with the posters feelings about PS. With that said, the admins have no problem with the poster so that leaves people annoyed by PS with one of two options: Be civil towards the poster or ignore the poster. I personally choose to ignore the poster.

All of us have people we cannot stomach on DU. If you can't be civil to that DUer then put them on ignore. You can't change what they do, you can only control how you react to it.

[The Philosopher]

19. I'm sorry you were subjected to that

Both the hate mail and Skinner's response.

I think it's telling. If they can get by with it, there is no "hate speech." There is only "rude" people who "insult" others. That PM isn't "hate," in Skinner's view--it's a silly ol' insult, a "you're a poo-poo head!" that school children throw around (I imagine, it's been a while since I was a kid).

If that PM was seen as what it is, there would be a lot less posters around here. And who knows what that means to DU.

[dbackjon]

20. It would be a better DU!

[Starry Messenger]

21. Wow.

I'm sorry dbackjon. That went well-beyond rude. I thought sending hate-grams to DUers was a TOS offense.

[Kurovski]

23. I don't run the show, but a probation perio\d and an apology would seem reasonable.

But if I was Queen of the May? Shit-canned.

The PM Has a creepy violent undertone everyone of us knows all too well.

[nomorenomore08]

25. I agree he should be PPR'd. No reason to tolerate that kind of bullshit.

nt

[xchrom]

26. omg -- the mail was creepy -- and the poster should be banned. nt

[Kolesar]

28. Its a personal email in dramaville. Who gives AF? eom

[dbackjon]

33. Why are you reading this then?

[Zorra]

36. Kind of thoughtless of you to not have considered that a member of a minority group that is

subjected to very real threats of violence and actual physical violence at alarming rates on a daily basis might have legitimate concerns here, isn't it?

I'm assuming you are not LGBT, and not subject to the daily threat of unprovoked violence that we are, because you dismiss dbackjon's concerns so readily and aggressively.

All LGBT persons have to face the possibility of some crazed violent conservative wacko attacking us at any moment.

I've seen "drama" used to label LGBT concerns here a few times in the last few days. Is this some new and approved meme for LGBT concerns?

Violence against LGBT people
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_against_LGBT_people

We give AF.

We take any and all signs of hate and possible potential violence against LGBT persons very seriously. If you can not respect the concerns of our members, please refrain from posting in this group.

Thank you.

[nomorenomore08]

40. If you don't care then why post?

Bottom line is, the guy felt he was being bullied/threatened and that is not okay on what's supposed to be a progressive website.

[Marrah_G]

46. Short answer: We do.

[Kolesar]

27. You are trying to use this thread as a court to settle a score in an old thread

This is all very tiring. Its like enduring hormonal kids fighting. Have a nice day

[xchrom]

29. no. receiving mail like that is creepy and threatening. nt

[Kolesar]

31. " DOMA was before the SC. People like you don't support the president " from that personal message

I would not be surprised if the original poster of this thread was in flame war on a thread and is now trying to reframe it as being persecuted by davidpdx. I don't know. I don't see the original thread.

Dramaville

[xchrom]

32. you don't send ugly and hateful like that through the message boxes.

that's meant to intimidate -- flame war or what ever.

[dbackjon]

35. davidpdx was upset that I supported Ellen Sturtz

You have no clue what you are talking about - please leave this forum, because you do not belong here

[dbackjon]

34. No - what is tiring is the belittling of LGBT rights here on DU

You have no clue.

[Zorra]

37. That crispy Lavender Pizza takeout you ordered has arrived.

Thank you, dsc!

[HillWilliam]

38. Good call. n/t

[nomorenomore08]

41. You blocked him from the group? Good. He was being a dick.

nt

[Zorra]

47. Wasn't me.

dsc made the call.

[stevenleser]

42. That poster deserved a PPR in the worst way

Unsolicited angry/hate personal DU mail should be grounds for PPR more often than not.

I find the tone and content of that message to be bullying at the very least.

[dbackjon]

43. He hasn't been PPR'd. Only from this forum

He is still an active poster

[stevenleser]

49. I know. I'm just saying he deserved to be based on what he emailed you.

I think Skinner and co. should at least go back to having something like a 30 day timeout as a warning and precursor to PPR. It's one thing if he feels that a particular infraction doesn't deserve PPR but to have no tools that are in between "nothing" and "PPR" is probably a mistake and reinforces behavior for those long time members who commit serious infractions that fall short of what he thinks deserves PPR.

[nomorenomore08]

51. Which is why we should all keep an eye on the dude, and alert at the first sign of assholishness...

[Marrah_G]

45. That response from Skinner makes me sad.

I know it's not right for him to send a PM like that and chances are he will fuck up in the future. Until then, for your own good, I'd make sure to put that person on at least mail ignore.

[dbackjon]

50. I don't like to put people on ignore - I prefer to let their true colors shine through