is there any evidence for glucosamine, etc for joint health?

[mopinko]

my impression is that there isnt any. but i have had another vet recommend it to me for my dogs. 2 big boys w big dog bad hips.
it has never been recommended to me by a doc, and i have joint issues. think i have even asked about it, and been told no. dont recall clearly, tho.

if there is actual evidence please post a link. and not to natural news or any other purveyor please.

eta-the plural of anecdote is not data. i am looking for well constructed studies. for or against.

[tridim]

1. IMO coconut oil works best for joint health.

My dog is getting old and has some arthritis. She was having trouble jumping down from the bed and climbing stairs until I started giving her coconut oil every day. Now she bounds up stairs, three at a time.

Her food has glucosamine, which I've always assumed was just there for marketing purposes.

[mopinko]

2. i assume the same.

it certainly inst there in the recommended dosage. if it is there at all.

but just need to say- the plural of anecdote is not data. i am looking for well constructed studies. for or against.

[Brainstormy]

3. tried it for a while

Didn't work for me. But I swear by my Fish Oil. Starting taking it for the heart healthy hype but discovered that my knees bothered me when I forgot. Now I'm positive that if I skip a couple of days I feel it in my joints. Took me a while to convince myself I wasn't hallucinating, but I'm sure now.

[njlib]

4. Turmeric has anti-inflammatory properties

It helped with my Buster as he got older. The vet had said an aspirin now & then wouldn't hurt him. Did that for only a little while before I started using turmeric.

[PADemD]

5. Crystalline glucosamine sulfate in the management of knee osteoarthritis

Link:

Crystalline glucosamine sulfate in the management of knee osteoarthritis: efficacy, safety, and pharmacokinetic properties

Crystalline glucosamine sulfate in the management of knee osteoarthritis

[mopinko]

7. dont see a link.

[PADemD]

9. I tried to copy the address and it didn't work.

Just Google the title. Sorry.

[mopinko]

11. did that. thanks.

interesting info. useful info, too.

[hedgehog]

6. I don't think you will ever see a well controlled study,

because who would pay to study something that can't be patented?

I am under the impression that there may be some studies in Germany, but good luck finding them.

My vet said I could use it for my dogs, but to check the labels and source carefully.

I don't have data, but my husband and kids say it helps their bad knees. It's not very cheap as placebos go, but my advice would be to get a calendar and record your bad days now, then try it for a month and see if it makes an improvement.

[mopinko]

8. not for me. for my dog.

actually 2 dogs. one is def going to have surgery, the other the surgeon says can be managed w this and fish oil.

so, this is a long haul thing. and the trouble with bully dogs is that they rarely show their pain. i had a boxer who had bone on bone hip joints, and was starting to get erosion in the pelvis from the pounding. but you never would have known she was in pain.
the dog that is up for surgery only very occasionally makes a peep. otherwise, he is 200 lbs of drive in a 100 lb bag. i suppose i could watch his endurance of heavy exercise, but i cant keep up with him.

[postulater]

10. Here's some.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?linkname=pubmed_pubmed&from_uid=25719429


And here is from a Cochrane review ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25629804 ) .
"A review of randomized trials of mostly low quality reveals that chondroitin (alone or in combination with glucosamine) was better than placebo in improving pain in participants with osteoarthritis in short-term studies. The benefit was small to moderate with an 8 point greater improvement in pain (range 0 to 100) and a 2 point greater improvement in Lequesne's index (range 0 to 24), both seeming clinically meaningful. These differences persisted in some sensitivity analyses and not others. Chondroitin had a lower risk of serious adverse events compared with control. More high-quality studies are needed to explore the role of chondroitin in the treatment of osteoarthritis. The combination of some efficacy and low risk associated with chondroitin may explain its popularity among patients as an over-the-counter supplement."

Here's a randomized trial on biomarkers in humans.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25719429
"Randomized trial of glucosamine and chondroitin supplementation on inflammation and oxidative stress biomarkers and plasma proteomics profiles in healthy humans.
RESULTS:
Serum CRP concentrations were 23% lower after glucosamine and chondroitin compared to placebo (P = 0.048). There were no significant differences in other biomarkers. In the proteomics analyses, several pathways were significantly different between the interventions after Bonferroni correction, the most significant being a reduction in the "cytokine activity" pathway (P = 2.6 x 10-16), after glucosamine and chondroitin compared to placebo.

CONCLUSION:
Glucosamine and chondroitin supplementation may lower systemic inflammation and alter other pathways in healthy, overweight individuals. This study adds evidence for potential mechanisms supporting epidemiologic findings that glucosamine and chondroitin are associated with reduced risk of lung and colorectal cancer."

Of course the product you buy has to be pure, so you need to find a trustworthy lab. And for joint use it takes at least two weeks to even be able to judge an effect on your symptoms - the cartilage has little blood supply so cell turnover and metabolism is quite slow. In the spinal discs it works best when undergoing some active disc rehabilitation due to the poor fluid exchange to the disc.

[Maru Kitteh]

14. Excellent find! Level I evedence. Impressive.

I might have to try some finally.

Thanks for digging that up.

[demigoddess]

12. It does seem to have an effect on joints

I took it for a while and my knee joints felt like they had water balloons in them. Not pleasant for me so I stopped taking it.

[Warpy]

13. Double blind results were mixed

meaning that there is probably a small benefit in a small part of the population above the placebo effect.

It's more beneficial for dogs and horses than it is for people and cats.

Because of the mixed results, I tell people with OA that it's worth a try, it won't hurt them. It doesn't do a thing for RA.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24395557

http://rheumatology.oxfordjournals.org/content/41/3/279.full.pdf

Here's the search page, have a ball: https://startpage.com/do/metasearch.pl

[Chemisse]

15. I'm glad you posted this.

My mother convinced me to take this, a number of years ago, for my joint problems. I didn't expect much, since she will believe ANY health claims told or published by ANYONE.

But it seemed to help. I have been taking it 3 or 4 times a week since, and do notice after a while when I stop.

So it is great to see a bit of evidence to support some degree of improvement.