Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

cate94

(2,813 posts)
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 06:57 PM Jun 2018

IMHA

Have any of you dog lovers heard of that? It stands for Immune Mediated Hemolytic Anemia. It sucks. My Vet thinks it was caused by the Leptosporsis vaccine. He gave us a 50/50 chance of recovery. While our dog was not responding to treatment, we went to a specialist. We have been dealing with this for eight months and nearly 10 grand worth of tests and medications. Just learned from the specialist at our last visit, that dogs requiring 3 immune suppressors rarely make it. She is still hanging in there. In the meantime she had an acute hepatitis incident that also could have killed her. Got past that. She is now suffering from chronic diarrhea and fur loss. Our beautiful girl looks like a ragamuffin It is so incredibly difficult to convey what you need to deal with this disease. Ask for titer tests. If I had known at the beginning how difficult it would be, I might have made a different decision. Her odds of getting through all the weaning from medications, scares the hell out of me. It doesn’t take much for them to relapse. We won’t put her through it again, should that happen.

14 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
IMHA (Original Post) cate94 Jun 2018 OP
I am so sorry that you and her are going through this. irisblue Jun 2018 #1
Thank you! cate94 Jun 2018 #7
You are a good parent...don't give up and stay BigmanPigman Jun 2018 #2
Thank you! cate94 Jun 2018 #8
I'm very sorry and hope that you might have a much better prognosis/response than expected. hlthe2b Jun 2018 #3
Honestly, I never would have thought a vaccine was responsible cate94 Jun 2018 #9
So very sorry. Duppers Jun 2018 #4
She is a rescue cate94 Jun 2018 #10
Yes, one of my dogs was diagnosed with it. However, it wasn't the real sinkingfeeling Jun 2018 #5
I'm so sorry. cate94 Jun 2018 #11
Very best wishes to you and your good dog. Judi Lynn Jun 2018 #6
Thanks! cate94 Jun 2018 #12
I am convinced it was the lepto shot that affected my former dog... Phentex Jun 2018 #13
Thanks cate94 Jun 2018 #14

BigmanPigman

(51,626 posts)
2. You are a good parent...don't give up and stay
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 07:12 PM
Jun 2018

strong. You are amazing and she is lucky to have your love. She will make it!!!

cate94

(2,813 posts)
8. Thank you!
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 01:28 AM
Jun 2018

I hope she does make it! I’m hoping that everything she has gone through was worth every minute of it. It’s been a long road, especially for her.

hlthe2b

(102,357 posts)
3. I'm very sorry and hope that you might have a much better prognosis/response than expected.
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 07:23 PM
Jun 2018
It is heart-breaking for those of us who adore our dogs and pets to contemplate what you are going through.

Now is hardly the time when counseling you to keep perspective seems appropriate, but you asked for information, so here goes. Just know the evidence for vaccines as the primary or most important cause in dogs is not strong, though at least plausible in rare cases. Cold comfort that, though, isn't it?

It is true that in HUMANS, approximately 1-3 children/100,000 MMR vaccines can develop a related autoimmune syndrome that causes clotting defects (ITP), so there is some better evidence for the rare phenomenon in humans that is at least correlated with (though conceivably not caused by) a vaccine.


Right now, here is probably the best but small study (only 44 dogs) and thus weak evidence for it in dogs (2017 study):
Moon, AKB. Veir, J. Vaccination Behavior and Adverse Events in Dogs Treated for Primary Immune-Mediated Hemolytic Anemia (Abstract HM17) ACVIM Forum, National Harbor, MD, 2017.
The pertinent findings from discussion with the authors:

1) The average time from most recent vaccination to the initial onset of IMHA was 351 days. Such a long period makes it unlikely that vaccination was a major trigger for IMHA in many of these dogs. It still might have been in the subset who were vaccinated closer in time to the onset of their illness. This study found no such temporal relationship, but a different study design would be necesary to confirm that.Previous studies have found only a small proportion of IMHA cases received vaccinations in the 2-4 weeks before the onset of their illness, and most found no difference in recent vaccination rates between dogs who developed these diseases and comparison dogs who did not. So far, the overall data suggests that vaccination is rarely a proximal trigger for these autoimmune disease, though whether they play a role as an overall risk factor isn’t known.
2) About half of the dogs had not been vaccinated since their IMHA diagnosis. This is consistent with the common practice of many vets to eschew vaccination in dogs who have had a history of autoimmune disease. However, about half of these dogs did receive vaccines after their diagnosis, and almost all of these were rabies vaccines. This is likely because rabies vaccination is legally required in most of the U.S. and exceptions are not always allowed for dogs with a history of autoimmune disease.Only 2 of the 21 dogs who were vaccinated following their IMHA had any reported adverse reaction. These two reactions were typical of the acute hypersensitivity reaction seen with vaccination. No relapse of IMHA or other autoimmune disease was reported in the vaccinated dogs. This suggests that such dogs may not be more sensitive to vaccination than other dogs, though again the size and methodology of this study is not adequate to demonstrate that with any certainty.
3)Though this is just a small bit of data, it does fit into the larger context of existing evidence in dogs, and the much more comprehensive evidence in humans, suggesting that vaccines play an extremely small role, if any, in triggering such autoimmune diseases, While caution is warranted, and certainly unnecessary vaccination should be avoided on principle, there is no justification for extreme and confident claims that vaccines are a major cause of these autoimmune diseases in our pets or that what risk may exist outweighs the benefits of appropriate vaccination.



The consensus is that given the increase in parvovirus nationwide, obvious risk in nearly all locales from wildlife rabies, and the highly infectious nature of distemper, the risk for disease far outweighs the risk of developing autoimmune disease, yet this is no comfort for the owners of a beloved affected dog. Leptospirosis is a complicated bacterial disease spread through the urine of rodents and other wildlife. In prior years the vaccines were not very protective and there are still issues with the improved vaccine, given the many subtypes of the Leptospire bacteria. Still, it is a serious disease, which destroys kidneys and liver and can be spread to humans from infected dogs, so in areas where it is prevalent, the vaccine is likely a necessity as well--at least for active dogs. It is also true that more reactions have been reported from the current Lepto vaccine than others, though most are mild and again, not all "reactions" are truly a result of this or any other vaccine. Temporal timing is key to that determination. among other factors.

I wish you and your beloved babe the very best, cate94. Truly.

cate94

(2,813 posts)
9. Honestly, I never would have thought a vaccine was responsible
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 02:06 AM
Jun 2018

But both my Vet and her Internist think it was the trigger. They very specifically talked about the Leptosporosis vaccine. She had her wellness exam and vaccine updates in October. Her blood tests at that time were perfect. The whole miserable event started less than 3 weeks after that.

I’m not an anti vaccine person. Mostly I think the arguments for that POV are ridiculous, but when healthcare professionals suggest that this is the root of the problem, I don’t have the degrees to disagree. It is also worth noting that the first time they gave her this vaccine I had to sign a waiver, agreeing t hat I understood there were risks. Now I’m being told by my vet that she can never have any kind of vaccine again!

In the information I have read since her diagnosis, there are some who believe it is more complicated than just the vaccine, maybe a secondary trigger. I am inclined to think that is probably true. To be honest though, it hardly matters, you do the best you can. Thanks for the good wishes.

Duppers

(28,126 posts)
4. So very sorry.
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 08:15 PM
Jun 2018

How old is your girl?

I've been totally ignorant of this, so thank you so much for alerting us. I'm now reading about it here:

https://fidoseofreality.com/contact-us/

Good luck to your baby and to you.

cate94

(2,813 posts)
10. She is a rescue
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 02:11 AM
Jun 2018

We have no idea how old, but guess that she is around 9 or 10 at this point. She is a smaller dog, so normally I’d consider her late middle age. However, the months on prednisone have really aged her. Hopefully after a full wean of all her meds she will get back to her feisty self.. fingers crossed.

sinkingfeeling

(51,471 posts)
5. Yes, one of my dogs was diagnosed with it. However, it wasn't the real
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 08:33 PM
Jun 2018

cause and he died 17 days later of Hemangiosarcoma when his spleen ruptured. It will be exactly 14 years ago, tomorrow, June 29.

cate94

(2,813 posts)
11. I'm so sorry.
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 02:16 AM
Jun 2018

I’ve lost several dogs over the years and it is always painful. They are such important family members.

Judi Lynn

(160,611 posts)
6. Very best wishes to you and your good dog.
Thu Jun 28, 2018, 11:17 PM
Jun 2018

No doubt your concern and caring for her is felt deeply, and goes a long way to calm and anchor her, making her feel loved.

Phentex

(16,334 posts)
13. I am convinced it was the lepto shot that affected my former dog...
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 05:53 PM
Jun 2018

He was four and it was the only thing that had been different. The vet included the lepto vaccine after Hurricane Katrina and I didn't realize it until too late. We went through blood transfusions and two hospitalizations and a host of nasty medicines (some did more harm than good!). We nearly lost him but we didn't give up. Some on DU might remember all we went through.

He lived another 8 years and was the best dog ever. In those 8 years, he never had another vaccine which meant no boarding or dog parks but it was worth it to me. We did have to do blood work from time to time just to keep an eye on things.

I'm with you. I'm not anti vaccine but I do my homework now and lepto is not one we need or give at this point. I also don't try any of the latest flea/tick meds and just stick with what I know works for us. Luckily, my current vet knows my feelings on this.

My heart goes out to you and your pup.

cate94

(2,813 posts)
14. Thanks
Fri Jun 29, 2018, 09:01 PM
Jun 2018

It has been a difficult road. She won’t get another vaccine per our vet, but I can’t keep her completely away from other dogs. It worries me, but she loves other dogs. Got to have a life. We walk and she cries to see other dogs. I try to keep her to the dogs we know, but not always possible. I’m hoping we make it through the wean.

Latest Discussions»Culture Forums»Pets»IMHA