Congress considering measures to expand access to shooting ranges

[oneshooter]

Last edited Wed Mar 14, 2012, 04:47 PM - Edit history (1)

Reposting this as the origional got hijacked.

Wednesday, the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF) reported impending action on S. 1249, the "Target Practice and Marksmanship Training Support Act." S. 1249 and its House counterpart, H.R. 3065, would permit a portion of the revenue raised through a long-established federal excise tax on firearms and ammunition to be used for the construction, operation, and maintenance of public shooting ranges.

This tax--11% on long guns and ammunition, and 10% on handguns--amounts to a considerable sum of money, especially in light of the sustained boom in firearm sales. That money has, since the signing of the Pittman-Robertson Wildlife Restoration Act in 1937, been used for wildlife conservation. A discussion about the appropriateness of a federal role in wildlife conservation is beyond the scope of this column, but it is fair to question whether funding such efforts is any more the responsibility of gun buyers than of the rest of the public. In 1937, when a far greater percentage of gun owners were hunters, the case for such a tax was perhaps stronger than it is today.

There can be no "well-regulated militia" without a large pool of proficient shooters among the citizenry. Much of that proficiency is forged at the range. This legislation can thus be considered "necessary to the security of a free state."

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-in-st-louis/congress-considering-measures-to-expand-access-to-shooting-ranges

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[TheWraith]

1. A large, well equipped shooting range in every city should be part of the defense budget.

Similar to how it's done in Switzerland, where there's ~660,000 military issued rifles in people's homes and the national sport is sharpshooting. You don't need as much of a standing army when the public is capable of supplying that in time of need.

[bowens43]

4. that is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

[PavePusher]

8. You're right.

One range per city isn't nearly enough.

[shadowrider]

10. I agree. A minimum of 5

East side
West side
North side
South side
City Center

[denverbill]

2. Wouldn't a government shooting range unfairly compete with privately owned ranges?

Why should my hard-earned tax dollars go to support a government-owned business that will drive small businessmen out of business?

Also, will other training required for a 'well regulated militia' be done as well? A bunch of people who can shoot well but have no organization or structure whatsoever isn't much more than an armed mob.

[gejohnston]

7. how it works in Switzerland

target shooting is kind of the national sport (true for a few other European countries, but to lesser degree.) Since they have a draft, you go to basic training and your technical school. After that, you come home with your issued assault rifle (or pistol, in some cases).
High school students compete with them during Schutzenfest.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/117218786#post39
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/07/02/the-swiss-federal-schutzenfest-shooting-party-2010/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sch%C3%BCtzenfest

Equipment like tanks, trucks, mortars, artillery, etc are stored in central armories. As the Swiss model proves, you don't need a standing army for self-defense/self-determination. But you do need one for an empire.
The one thing I would do different from Switzerland, is that I would draft men and women alike and have a national service option (like the Peace Corps)

[denverbill]

23. I'd prefer that model.

Universal conscription and training. Everyone does a period of national service. The children of billionaires and janitors alike.

Big difference between that and building a free shooting range in every city in America.

[gejohnston]

26. free shooting range in every city in America.

they do that too. They even subsidize the ammo. They have restrictions on how much ammo you can buy at a store for your private guns. Most people buy at the range since it is 1 unlimited, and 2 cheaper and only get hunting ammo at the store.

If you check out the link to another post, the pictures are of a shooting fest. All of the shooters are aged 8-17. There are also the usual carnival rides, beer tasting and other non gun stuff. Hanover, Germany, has the largest.

[bowens43]

3. we attempt to take another giant step toward third world status.......

unfucking believable.

BTW jackass if you use "well-regulated militia" to justify this bullshit then you can't pick and choose. Either "well-regulated militia" is relevant or it isn't. If it is, you have no right to possess a firearm outside of the confines of a "well-regulated militia".

[shadowrider]

5. "Well regulated" at the time meant fully functional and operating like a swiss clock

FYI

[TheWraith]

6. Your personal attacks aside, you don't seem to understand the definition of "well regulated militia"

And seem to find it inseparable from the recent fiction that somehow that means there is no individual right associated with the second amendment, despite several Supreme Court rulings and basically the entire history of the second amendment which shows you're wrong.

Also, it's a high level of cognitive dissonance when you stand there claiming that investment in public facilities makes us a third world country. That's actually the opposite of how it works.

[X_Digger]

9. Explain that one, if you can..

We already have publicly funded shooting ranges, we also have the PR Act which already is supposed to fund said ranges.

Care to elaborate, or does shoe leather taste good?

[shadowrider]

11. I'll be damned. He is alive

Nice to see you

[X_Digger]

17. *pops head up*

Thanks.

[gejohnston]

13. first off,

look up what "third world" means. Are you saying Switzerland, Norway, and Finland are third world countries? Most if not all third would countries have very strict gun laws (if not bans) and have murder rates that make us look like Japan.

If it is, you have no right to possess a firearm outside of the confines of a "well-regulated militia".

Can you show a precedent for that? The SCOTUS rulings gun control groups like to cite are "states rights" rulings from the 19th century, including one that you don't have 1A or 2A rights if you live in the wrong state, and made civil rights laws unenforceable. None of them say anything about a "well regulated militia"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Cruikshank

[oneshooter]

15. So we should pay attention to a gun grabbing hopolphobe

who can't even give a reason why he/she is against this measure?

[era veteran]

20. Fucking Jackass ( jury experiment)

Since I have started shooting again I am sort of taken back by the cost. When I was a kid we could shoot in the backyard. I wish they would expand the CMP.
http://www.odcmp.com/

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

22. + 100 n/t

[PavePusher]

12. It seems that name-calling is now allowed, or at least in the "Gungeon".

Re: Post # 3:

At Wed Mar 14, 2012, 01:07 PM you sent an alert on the following post:

we attempt to take another giant step toward third world status.......

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

YOUR COMMENTS:

Name calling.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Wed Mar 14, 2012, 01:08 PM, and voted 2-4 to LEAVE IT ALONE.

Thank you.

[shadowrider]

14. Name calling is allowed if you're on the anti side of the argument

Much like insulting and denigrating our military is allowed.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

24. Been that way every since I got here...infamous demagogues got passes for some

really atrocious stuff on DU2. It is even laxer on DU3.

[oneshooter]

16. The main problem I see in this is that most PR Act money now dispersed

to the states ends up in the general fund, not in the Fish and Game coffers. Oh they get some of it, when they should get all of it.
Will this happen with the new funding?
And what can be done to prevent it from happining?

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[burf]

25. I found this on PR funds for ranges

http://www.nrahq.org/shootingrange/pitmann.asp

As I understand the program, the funds are allocated to the states based on the number of hunter licenses sold in the state.

All projects can be funded at no more than 75% and the remaining 25% cannot come from other Federal grant programs.

It is incumbent on the outdoor community to pressure their legislators to come up with the 25% needed to get a shooting range or whatever project they want. When the candidates are campaigning in our neck of the woods, they talk of how important the hunting heritage is, we have to hold their feet to the fire to do more than talk.

The monies for sport fishing programs are under the Dingell-Johnson Sport Fishing Restoration Act.
http://www.fws.gov/budget/2012/PDF%20Files%20FY2012%20Greenbook/24.%20Sport%20Fish%202012.pdf

HTH

[msongs]

18. bogus argument - nobody is in a "well regulated militia" in this country except right wing

nut jobs. the us military is certainly not "well regulated" nt

[shadowrider]

19. You've never seen the military coordinate a well planned pincer move.

I'd say they're beyond well regulated.

Tell me msongs, did you applaud when our "not well regulated" military took out Bin Laden in a precision strike or did you condemn our guys?

Just curious.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

21. You...

...are certainly evidence that you're not well regulated...

...but ought to be.

Maybe suggest to your mommy that she find you a new nanny.

[DonP]

28. Perhaps more dietary fiber will help them with that "well regulated" problem they seem to have?

I suggest all the gun control supporters start increasing their fiber intake until they actually grasp and accept the SCOTUS decisions defining the 2nd as an individual right that is now formally incorporated.

Then we can give them Lawrence Tribe and Alan Dershowitz cell phone numbers, so they can check to see if it's all true.

Some days I wonder if there is any way to finally drive a stake through the heart of the collectivist militia interpretation?

The scary part is they are generally all the same people that applaud the idea of forced confiscation, like the ones that are cheering Hugo's/Venezuela's new confiscation laws. A little fascism is OK with some folks it seems, as long as it's about guns and gun owners.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

30. Well personally...

...I'd prefer if they had a steady diet of mac & cheese 'liberally' seasoned with 1/4 cup of baking soda followed by 3 nice sour pickles for desert.

[E-Mag]

32. So the 2nd is the only place in Federal.....

.... Law where the militia is mentioned?!

[rl6214]

27. When are any of you anti-gun zealots going to get a clue

Seriously, learn what "well regulated militia" really means and then come back to play with the adults.

And the US military is definately the most well regulated in the world.

[burf]

29. Perhaps you could share

with us the military experience you have that you base your post on.

[PavePusher]

31. More vileness from you.

Whodathunkit....