Ohhh boy, here we go...gotta have the TALK with the Folks

[FirstLight]

my dad was blessed to be born into the era where you could work a job for 35 years, build up savings etc and have something to leave your family.

The folks are in their later 80s now and getting more frail each day, dad is losing more brain skills and memory too. I'm afraid he's missing payments on bills because he's not able to keep track of things.

So in the late 90s-2000s he made a Family trust...ALL properties, savings, stocks, etc were to be held with he and mom at the top and then my sister and I would be activated upon one of their demise. My sister has always been the "responsible one" (read:controlling) and was trying to "handle" some things for them last year after a wildfire decimated one of our family properties... well turns out all she REALLY wanted was the insurance etc.

Earlier this year she got into it with my dad and even threatened him with a lawyer. Then she cut everyone off and is no longer even checking on them via phone, so Im left to do the adulting and caretaking for the family.

I finally found the realtor that was working with the family. (She was so worried about my parents and said it was obvious my sister was all about the $$$ - She even said she was SO glad she was out of the picture because she was so hard to deal with, pushy and rude, etc. )
So she gave me the lead to who had the files and I have also reached out to a family lawyer to work on either re-writing the Family Trust or suspending it for a time. I am also going to need limited Power of Atty to just handle the property cleanup and sale, as well as rewriting home insurance policy on the other house... I also want to set up some auto-pay for basic bills so my dad doesnt lose something important in his piles of paper! I intend to go over there at least once a week and show him what's happening and go over his bank statement, etc... But I dont want to take away his sense of self agency...

So I am going down to have lunch with the folks tomorrow, and going to jsut tell my dad I dont WANT access to his bank acct, he can still make the decisions and write the checks if he wants to. But someone needs to do the "mental heavy lifting" and HELP so that he doesnt get railroaded. My biggest fear is that my sister is gonna burst back onto the scene, try and prove my parents mentally unfit and throw them in a home and proceed to take everything. (she wanted to sell their house out from under them and put them away LAST year during Covid...it was bullshit)

This is just the beginning of a very long haul, and I have never had to deal with these kinds of things before...oh goody! ADULTING!
Any advice or good vibes are appreciated...

[guillaumeb]

1. Speak with an attorney and see if the trust can be amended to appoint an independent trustee.

That would take family out of the equation.

[FirstLight]

8. dad doesnt trust anyone...

that's why I am stepping up

[guillaumeb]

10. Understood.

It is a real problem, especially if the person has cognitive issues.

[Ocelot II]

2. You really should get your dad's unlimited power of attorney so you *can* pay his bills

and do other things if for some reason he is unable to do it or no longer wants to do those things, meaning you'd have to have access to his checking account. Most importantly, this would make it difficult, if not impossible, for your sister to take over. It doesn't mean you'd be taking over from your dad but it means you'd be his backup for his financial affairs. I ended up doing this for my dad. He was mentally competent but he had Parkinson's and his vision was failing, so day-to-day bill paying and bookkeeping got to be sort of a chore for him; he was happy to let me do it.

[FirstLight]

9. one step at a time...I dont WANT him thinking I wanna take over. and at least

with limited pOA I can start showing him that I CAN help and Im not after his money...then we can take the next step soon

[No Vested Interest]

13. My daughter is a co-signer on my checking accounts; she is not a co-owner.

This is all for my convenience, in case infirmity keeps me from writing checks, or getting to bank for cash as needed.
My deceased husband set up many bills as autopay, thank goodness.

[azureblue]

16. agreed

You need to shut out the sister and you need access to his account in case he becomes unable to handle it. But you should provide a monthly statement of expenditures to all parties concerned. This is a CYA. You could run all expenses through his checking account, but that won't show the reason for purchase.

[blm]

3. Hope it goes well for all 3 of you.

🤞🏽

[TexasTowelie]

4. I don't know if you will be able to make changes in many of your parent's planning.

This could be considered as elderly abuse and your sister would have legal grounds to challenge any changes that are made, particularly since you've admitted that your parents are in mental decline.

I agree that it may be worthwhile to put some of your parents on automatic drafts from their bank. Their mortgage and utility bills seem like good candidates as long as you know that their are sufficient funds in the bank account.

[leftieNanner]

5. Oh, my goodness

What a challenge you have on your hands.

I had to take over my parents' finances when my dad could no longer balance his checkbook. I asked him to collect all of the bills in one place and I would go over and have lunch with him (Mom was in assisted living at this point). After lunch we would sit down together and I would write out the checks and then have him sign them. After a while, he asked me if I would be willing to be on the signature card for the checking account so I could handle everything from there on. Granted, I didn't have a toxic sister to deal with, but by taking it one step at a time, it didn't make it so scary for my Dad.

You are so right for stepping in on this. I know of a number of families who were torn apart by $$. I'm sad that your sister seems to fit into that category.

Sending you best wishes and hope that you can get control of the situation.

[Phoenix61]

6. I'm not sure why you want to change the trust.

The biggest reason to use one is to avoid probate. You need to have a legal copy of the trust documents as you will have to present them to any and all financial institutions that your parents have accounts at. If you and your sister are to split everything the institution will create two separate accounts, one in each of your names. Save yourself a lot of aggravation and ask to speak to whoever is in charge. Trusts are easy but a new person may not be familiar with them and it’s a royal pain to fix those types of mistakes. (I got to be friends with the bank VP) If you’re in Florida managing the property will be a pain if your sister decides to be difficult as all heirs have to sign off on a sale. The power of attorney can be specific to paying bills etc.
Happy to answer any questions. My folks had a trust but when my dad died my mom had advanced Alzheimer’s. Had to get a doctors note so I could be established as the trustee. Happy to answer any questions you have.

[DURHAM D]

7. Are you a Trustee? nt

[FirstLight]

11. yes

at this point it might be best to just hold off on the Trust...


I found a fillable Limited POA form and filled it out so I could do the 3 things that need handling... (we have a notary already on hand that knows us)


The three things: arrange/negotiate for home insurance on the cabin, handle repairs and maintenance, rental agreement for the cabin (my daughter lives there now and needs a REAL rent agreement, not just dad's verbal ok. SHe cant even put the utilities in her name ...
And the cleanup and sale of the damaged property.

The rest, we will set up bill-pay and he will have the final say and payment for the home insurance and the payment of the sale will go to him as well.

I intend on doing some big maintenance on the old cabin since he built it in 1960 and it's got a lot of plumbing issues...I cant tell him all about this mess so I am going to pay for it out of pocket and keep it in good shape for him and the future family.

[3Hotdogs]

12. Consider hiring an elder law attorney. Your county Bar Association can give referrals.

Also, were either of your parents combat veterans?

[FirstLight]

21. My dad served in Korea nt

[3Hotdogs]

27. He and your mom are eligible for benefits. Maybe some are available now.

In any case, if their health declines, they would both be eligible for long term care at a v.a. facility.

[Joinfortmill]

14. Omg. God bless you and wishing you well.

[AndyS]

15. I wish you were mine . . .

[ashredux]

17. GET...A...GOOD...ATTORNEY...ASAP

I was a trust officer for 20 years….get legal help

[calimary]

19. I'm no expert but the folks here who are urging you to talk to a lawyer are right.

That sounds like good advice, and certainly what I’d do if I were in your place.

[Auggie]

20. Support group?

[FirstLight]

22. I wish.... I do have several friends around my age who are also

either going through it or have already. But only one friend currently has the horrible sibling to contend with

I cant believe my sister has become such a nasty bitch

[LiberalFighter]

23. You might want to consider using Informed Delivery

If your parents still receive their bills by mail it would provide a means to keep tabs. Otherwise know when utilities and other bills have due dates.

If your dad is okay with you having access to your bank statements for the purpose of reviewing payments are being made. That might work.

It does sound like you need a POA.

[FirstLight]

24. it's all new to me... and Im not trying to just TAKE OVER

I think if I can set up online banking and still let him get his mail statements we can then work together on things. I really want to prove to them that I can and will help. Ive been the damn black sheep and always needing their help...it's time to return the favor. And my sister can piss off. SHe told me I was taking a "free ride" years ago when my dad helped me buy my own home.

Thank god MY house is in MY name. I dont need anything else... but yeah... just because some of us end up single mothers and some if us seem more "stable" is NOT for her to judge. My folks helped me because nobody else would... they deserve to have their sunset years be gentle and easy... not full of sibling bullshit.

She was the oldest, always had her shit together, I wasnt so lucky. Im glad my folks saw the differences in us and loved us equally. Too bad LOVE isn't part of my sister's vocabulary now

[reACTIONary]

25. Start writing "contemporaneous" notes....

... concerning your sister's behavior. If she does act to gain guardianship, the court decides who will be the guardian, and you can challenge her for the position based on past behavior.

I've been through this a couple times now, and the lawyers I've talked to all say that these situations are very common and can become very difficult.

[FirstLight]

26. really good idea!

I can date a few things that have happened already


It's so sad, my mom sounds so lost and hurt when she says "no...she hasnt called...I dont know why"

[csziggy]

28. My sister was the one that had to do this for my parents

She got power of attorney and was already the Executor and Successor Trustee for their trusts. But when my Dad got so he was not paying bills or taking care of necessary paperwork, she had to take over.

Rather than take it completely out of Dad's hands, she would go through the bills, write the checks, then have him sign them. After Dad died, she did the same for Mom.

At one point my little sister and her oldest daughter tried to get money out of Mom and Dad - my sister simply took their checkbook with her when she left the house. Since by then we had caretakers in the house for Mom and Dad, this was a safety for that part, too. There were reports from the caretakers of screaming and yelling by the little sister and her daughter (both have/had mental problems) to the point my older sister gave the caretakers permission to ask them to leave or to call the cops if they would not.

My older sister has been in charge of affairs for my parents ( various companies, trusts, and stuff) for nearly forty years. We're still waiting for my parents' trusts to be dispersed and then she will take a very needed break. But every step along the way it has been hard on her and she is fed up with the family members who made things difficult and take far longer than it should have.

In some ways it was easier to be the child who "left the family" by moving away and not visiting as often. And to be the child who did not follow the path my parents wanted and going my own way. That meant that I didn't end up with all the responsibility for all this stuff. Since my Dad died, I decided my goal was to make my older sister's job easier and to not rock the boat. Often all I was able to do was to let her vent to me.

Are both and your sister trustees or executors? Do either of you have Power of Attorney from your parents - if so can one for your sister be rescinded? Do your parents have Health Care Directives? Who is designated their Health Care Surrogate? Have they made choices for their final arrangements?

I hope you have someone you can vent to when things get tough - because they probably will. Good luck!