Vatican promotes American as pope's spokesman

[Eugene]

Source: Reuters

World | Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:20am EDT

Vatican promotes American as pope's spokesman

The Vatican named former Fox News reporter Greg Burke as its new spokesman on Monday, the first time a U.S. citizen has been entrusted with leading the pope's communications team.

Burke, who is a member of the conservative Catholic group Opus Dei, was hired by the Vatican an adviser four years ago at a time when the Roman Catholic Church was mired in leaks scandals and stuck in a public relations quagmire.

On Monday, the Vatican announced that Burke would become the pope's official spokesman, with Father Federico Lombardi stepping down from the role which he had held for 10 years.

Spanish radio reporter Paoloma Garcia Ovejero will become the deputy spokesperson -- the first time a woman has had such a senior role in the Vatican communications department.

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Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-pope-spokesman-idUSKCN0ZR1D1

[trotsky]

1. "Burke, who is a member of the conservative Catholic group Opus Dei"

Ain't it grand what a "breath of fresh air" Pope Frank has been?

[DURHAM D]

2. Wow.

What a stupid stupid choice.

[rug]

4. Not really. There are better choices but naming a U.S. citizen was shrewd.

There aren't many and Burke was already named to the Press Office by Benedict.

[Bluenorthwest]

6. He does have that Fox News training as well, that's another big Vatican Plus for him

I'm sure.

[rug]

7. Fox News is hardly the bugaboo outside the U.S. as it is here.

I doubt that Vatican is any more impressed by that as it is with his experience with Time.

[trotsky]

5. To us and progressives, yes.

To the institution of the church and perpetuating the status quo, it's a fantastic choice.

[Brettongarcia]

13. Opus Dei members are not priests usually

THough they take some religious oaths, they are almost exclusively professionals. Who are often undercover. And often they feel free to commit any kind of sin, ironically, So long as it is in the final defense of the Church. They were central in Spanish fascism. Which sought to unite the church, business, and the army.

The pope is a Jesuit. An order with often similar functions. Jesuits are often allied to political and military actions.

In effect, these two orders are not so sentimental or as passive as priests. They retain ties to the church. But they are willing to defend the church as in effect, soldiers and spies. And some say, assassins.

There are some differences. Opus Dei is generally fascistic, or right wing. Supporting the Church Militant. Jesuits are more left wing, somewhat.

The current Spanish archbishop (cardinal?) of LA is from Opus Dei; "Acts of God."

[rug]

20. You left some out.

http://listverse.com/2013/08/21/10-crazy-catholic-conspiracy-theories/

[Brettongarcia]

24. The Church itself shut down the Jesuits

In 1773. Pope Clement XIV abolished the order for a time, out of concerns for the Jesuits' involvement in politics.

So it's not just traditional anti Catholics, protestants, and Chic Publications. But the Church itself. Tthat was concerned about Jesuits, say, departing from religion/God.

There has never been a Jesuit pope, due to the concerns of the Catholic Church itself. Until? Pope Francis.

[rug]

25. Because they were assassins?

[Brettongarcia]

26. Ask your own church why it opposed Jesuits

Maybe iit was opposed because it was active in politics, in say South American territories. Where "politics" often meant civil wars.

As for Opus Dei? In recent years, arch conservative EWTN spokesman " Father" John Corapi, was recently found to be not a priest at all. He next claimed to be a member of Opus Dei. Earlier, before becoming a Church spokesman, Corapi had been an accountant in Las Vegas

[rug]

27. I know why they were suppressed, by various monarchs. My question was about your crackpot theories.

[Brettongarcia]

28. As documented by historians?

The above descriptions were once standard academic History. Monarches opposed Jesuits, because their activity in social justice issues, interacted with political events. Including the early European and later (with Opus Dei) the Spanish and South American revolutions.

Seeing the problems there, in taking sides in political revolutions, the church wisely decided to back off. As a decision of the Church itself in part. (Or does the Church often compromise religious principles with kings?)

Rug? All you really know about your own church are Catechism whitewashes, apologetics, by highly biased teachers.

The role of Opus Dei and the Church in supporting Spanish (and for some, Italian) fascism is particularly well-documented.

Find a real history book. One not written by priests, or approved for use in Catechism classes and parochial schools.

[rug]

29. Oh good. Tell me all about the Catholic assassins.

In the meantime, you wouldn't be saying the problem with the Catholic Church is political intrigue, not its doctrine, would you?

I thought I saw a glimmer of rationality.

[Brettongarcia]

38. Here's a random article

That among other things, finds links between Spanish Catholic religion and Franco's repressions of, especially, atheists

http://www.historytoday.com/paul-preston/time-silence-civil-war-and-culture-repression-francos-spain-1936-1945

Another article or two notes continuing suppression or forgetting of such issues. Others note specifically assassinations and mass killings.

Franco explicitly endorsed a" Catholic Spain." And instituted a merger of Caholicism with his essentially fascist dictatorship:

"From 1937 to 1948 the Franco regime was doctrinally at least a semi-fascist state, the categorical fascism of the FET (Falange Española Tradicionalista) as state party being mitigated above all by the confessional nature of the regime—creating the strange hybrid known to some as clerical fascism and to Amando de Miguel as "fascismo frailuno" (friar fascism).[45. From Wiki

Here's another;

http://www.counterpunch.org/2006/07/19/how-spain-s-church-still-pushes-fascist-agenda/

[Brettongarcia]

37. Opus Dei members were with Franco...

... and similar-minded folks, before, during, and after the Spanish civil war. And during fascist Franco's long alliance with Adolph Hitler. Eight of Franco's ministers were from Opus Dei.

During the extremely bloody period - including the Spanish Civil War, and the infamous Nazi air attack on Franco's enemy, Basque Guernica - fascist Catholics would necessarily have participated in and approved all kinds of violent acts against liberal democratic revolutionaries. Including of course, the many assassinations of the fascist political/military opponents: the political liberals.

The Church of course, doesn't like to talk much about thus. Except to deny it. Or to stay silent. Opus Dei is famous for its secrecy; at various times, members were told not to reveal their membership. Which in effect made many of them undercover agents.

Opus Dei is not officially aligned with any particular political position; a few members today are said to be somewhat liberal. But historically, this secular Catholic organization was very closely interlinked with the fascist regime of General Franco; the Spanish dictator, and ally of Nazi Germany.

[rug]

3. Paoloma Garcia Ovejero will likely succeed him as Director.

Burke was named Vice Director only five months ago.

[Brettongarcia]

55. Opus Dei participated in several coups

From Opposition Notes, Catholics for choice:

'Opus Dei (Latin for “the Work of God”) is one of the most conservative orders
in the Catholic church. Founded in Spain, Opus Dei is especially influential
in Latin America because of the relationships it has cultivated in political and
business circles. Members and sympathizers of Opus Dei hold high-level positions in
various governments and it is one of the main forces supporting conservative activities in
the region. It vehemently opposes the promotion and provision of a wide range of sexual
and reproductive health services.
In just the last decade, people tied to Opus Dei participated in two right-wing coups
d’état in Latin America—in Venezuela in 2002 and in Honduras in 2009. In addition,
some of the leading personalities on the Latin American right were educated in Opus Dei
schools or have ties to it either as members or sympathizers.

Opus Dei’s participation in the business world has also been significant. '

Working often secretly or undercover in many aspects of society, and without even normal priestly vows to restrain them, secular Opus Dei members are in a good position to regularly violate priestly rules against dishonesty and violence.

[Lordquinton]

8. Who better than a Murdoch flunky to lead the PR

For the world's worst PR disaster.

[rug]

9. Maybe Dusty wasn't available.

[Lordquinton]

11. That you're not upset by a fox news person

Doing the PR for your church speaks volumes.

[rug]

18. I'm not concerned by whatever words you hear in your head either.

[Lordquinton]

21. Pretty sure those words came from the Vatican

But whatever helps you sleep at night.

[trotsky]

10. Well shit, you gotta be impressed by his work.

He's convinced a whole bunch of otherwise liberal people that somehow the latest pope is different than all his predecessors, and is changing things for the better... despite not changing a single thing.

You can't fool all of the people all of the time, but evidently you can fool enough of them to support the world's largest beacon of homophobia and misogyny.

[Lordquinton]

12. To be fair he had a great setup

They needed someone who wasn't a literal nazi, head of the Inquisition, responsible for the cover-up of the pedophilia scandal to follow and just have him smile and kiss feet and they were good.

[trotsky]

14. And coming from FOX, what a bonus to have him be so familiar with a right-wing propaganda outlet.

Must have been a nice, smooth transition for him.

[Lordquinton]

15. How could the Vatican know what Fox is about?

They are unheard of outside the US, we're the only country with Murdoch controlled right-wing media.

[trotsky]

16. Oh FFS.

Is that the Catho-splain?

[Lordquinton]

17. QED

[rug]

19. Lol, the clucking on display.

[Lordquinton]

22. Yep, move along, nothing to see here

You really trying to shame us into stopping the discussion of the RCC's problematic behavior, but guilt won't work on us, sorry.

[rug]

23. No, shaming is your game. I just observe.

How are things at JPR?

[Lordquinton]

30. Nice comeback

Maybe address the topic? Why are you alright with your church hiring this fox news veteran for it's PR? (And now promoting him to an even higher position.)

[rug]

31. You don't want to talk about your sojourn at JPR?

I don't blame you.

[Lordquinton]

32. I have no idea what you're talking about

But you're running scared on the actual topic at hand.

[PoutrageFatigue]

33. Which surprises who?

[rug]

34. No, of course you don't.

https://jackpineradicals.com/members/lordquinton/activity/

[Lordquinton]

35. Wow, you've never gone this far to avoid a question

This is a new low for you.

[rug]

36. I've never gone to a website that bashes DU and the Democratic nominee while serving on MIRT either.

And lied about it.

An unusual type of low.

[Lordquinton]

39. You'd rather attempt to stalk someone than answer a question

Must have hit a really sore spot.

[Brettongarcia]

40. It's a diversion by Rug

He's having some serious problems defending Opus Dei, above.

[rug]

42. Lol, yes, I'm all in a knot about your claims of Opus Dei assassins.

I hope you don't post the truth about how the Vatican controls the Pentagon.

[Lordquinton]

44. Look out! Jesuit assassins are out for you!

Never mind the actual content of your post...

[rug]

41. Check how this subthread started before whining about being attacked.

I'll take your lame accusation of stalking as a concession of your lying.

When you get called on bashing the Democratic nominee at your new site I expect you'll call that stalking as well.

[Lordquinton]

43. I started it talking about how troubling it is that the Vatican hired out of fox news

And you came in attempting to make it about anything but, including stalking people off site.

What is causing your desperation?

[rug]

45. QED.

[Lordquinton]

46. I'll take your refusal to answer any question as an admission

Of defending Fox.

Here on a progressive site.

[rug]

47. Flattery is the sincerest form of admiration, but only if done right.

As to answering questions, why are you on a DU-bashing site dedicated to opposing the Democratic nominee?

[Lordquinton]

48. Why are you a member of an organization

That promotes the oppression of women and LGBTQIA?

[rug]

49. Que se dice? "Wow, you've never gone this far to avoid a question".

Now you're squirting innuendo of homophobia and misogyny like a squid in flight.

You're transparent, quinton.

[Lordquinton]

50. You're not a dues paying member of the Catholic Church?

Hey, when did the deconversion happen? Are you among the ranks of non-believers, or just "spiritual but not religious?"

[rug]

51. With every evasion you post you shred any remaining credibility.

Avoid, evade, deflect.

The RCC has no dues.

You donate at JPR? You support their attacks on the Democratic nominee?

Is your answer going to be "Pedophilia!"

[Brettongarcia]

52. Is religion itself, abuse of children?

Beyond complaints about pedophilia, but related to them? The larger argument is that religion tells children half true myths, to make them behave. But any half truths and even "white" lies confuse our thoughts as much as they inform them. So that finally, religious stories amount to deception and abuse, even of children. And it's even worse when adults don't outgrow the old fables.

So pederasty is just part of the bigger picture of religiously-motivated abuse. And the abusive, enforced infantilism that also plagues religious adults.

[rug]

53. Of course not.

It's precisely this half-baked, ill-informed hatred of religion and those with belief, under some unwarranted guise of enlightened thought, that is intellectually abusive.

You mouth these prejudices as if they are the product of unbiased thought. The reality is it leads you to proclaiming the unmitigated nonsense of equating pederasty with religion.

What's wrong with you?

[Brettongarcia]

54. 14 years of Sunday school and church

What's wrong? A lifetime of endless, mindnumbingly repetitive sermons.

A lifetime of Christian and Muslim fundamentalists causing one war after another.

A lifetime of religious lies and half true sophistries.

All presented as absolute perfection.

Don't forget being commanded to love this stuff.