Can we please stop the silly word-games with the word "belief"?

[DetlefK]

Last edited Tue Feb 13, 2018, 10:26 AM - Edit history (1)

For example here:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1218270780

In everyday-language, "belief" and "believing" mean "guessing because you don't know better".
"I believe the weather will be nice today."

But ask a religious person and they will tell you that "belief" and "believing" mean "accepting a statement ad hoc as true".
"I believe in God."

See? Same word, two totally different meanings.




Except when religious people try to make up an argument, then they pretend that that word only has one meaning.

Just because you believe that the weather will be nice, that does not mean that meteorology is a faith-based field of study!

TWO. DIFFERENT. MEANINGS.




I mean... if you want to. As an atheist, I would be totally fine with translating "I believe in God." as "I'm guessing that God exists because I don't know better."

[Mariana]

1. That would call for honesty, respect, and plain old good manners.

You're asking a lot. I hope you aren't holding your breath.

[Voltaire2]

2. Equivocation fallacies are part of the standard kit

so no, it ain’t going to stop.

[Lordquinton]

3. This comes up when calls for civility

And retional discussion are brought out. Spent a while pointing it out, but it never sunk in.

[guillaumeb]

6. "Retional"

I am surprised that the official grammarian/spell checker of this group has not pointed out the misspelling.

[Lordquinton]

7. Thanks for underlining my point

Do you have any comments on the subject? Or just a hit and run personal attack?

[guillaumeb]

14. Another poster, let us call the poster MM,

pointed out a spelling error of mine. A second poster did the same thing, all with no comment about the post. So I am following the example of 2 non-theists here. Is it wrong for me to do this, and if so, was it wrong for them?

[marylandblue]

16. If atheists are such good role models

why not continue to follow them and become an atheist?

[guillaumeb]

19. Do you consider it to be good behavior?

Or is it impolite?

[marylandblue]

25. I consider it to be a most vexatious evil

to use the actions of another as justification for your own behavior.

[MineralMan]

26. But MM Did It First, Mom!

[marylandblue]

27. Ok, now you are both in trouble!

[MineralMan]

28. Uh-Oh...

[Lordquinton]

21. A second underline

Thanks for such prominent reinforcement.

[MineralMan]

22. Anyone is more than welcome to point out errors in my posts.

When they do, I will thank them and edit the post. I consider such corrections to be valuable, since I dislike spelling and grammar errors in my own posts. Since you are referring to me in your post, I am answering you. If you see a spelling error in a post I make, please let me know, so I can correct it.

[MineralMan]

4. Believe is one of those words with multiple definitions

It has no fixed meaning in the language. That mean that statements using it need to be carefully made, often with qualifications that identify which definition you are using. It's awkward, really.

Even then, however, individuals may interpret it using only a single definition. It's an imprecise word, at best.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/believe

[guillaumeb]

5. Speaking of silly word games.

[DetlefK]

8. Yes, indeed. I was speaking of silly word-games.

[Act_of_Reparation]

9. So that's what happens when one has nothing to say but feels personally obligated to post anyway.

You know what they say: If you throw a rock into a pack of dogs, the one who yelps is the one who got hit.

You just yelped.

[trotsky]

11. LOL, nice. n/t

[guillaumeb]

15. Did you feel personally obligated to post this ad hominem attack?

Interesting revelation, if it were needed.

[Act_of_Reparation]

17. I feel personally obligated to call bullshit where I see it.

I'm a civic-minded kind of guy.

[guillaumeb]

20. You are missing quite a bit of it, if that is indeed your perceived obligation.

Interesting that you miss all of the non-theistic nonsense. A narrow perceptual blindness?

[Act_of_Reparation]

23. Anything specific?

[trotsky]

10. No, they can't stop.

Equivocation is the best tool they ever invented (in their opinion).

[Act_of_Reparation]

12. Equivocation can be fun.

For example, if you equivocate the words "tool" and "invent" in your post the meaning shifts to: "Equivocation is the best penis they ever made up to deceive you".

[trotsky]

13. NO SEX POSTS!

Honestly, you filthy atheists!

[marylandblue]

18. Fine, we'll equivocate cleanly

Lying is the biggest organ ever erected to beguile women.

[Pope George Ringo II]

24. The dishonesty and cowardice of doing it once as a strawman is bad enough

But doing it repeatedly is an entirely different problem for me. The sheer inconsiderate rudeness behind, "No. Screw you. You're wrong about what you think you're saying, I will damn well tell you what you actually stand for." is simply unacceptable.

There's just no excuse for it. Doing it once is an admission of defeat, doing it repeatedly is just being offensive purely to be offensive. It's trolling. Period.

So, no, the troll is going to keep doing it because troll's gonna troll. Sadly.