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MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 03:38 PM Jan 2019

When Free Will Backfires - As It Often Does

About three decades ago, I was in San Francisco's Chinatown. I was feeling a bit peckish, so I bumbled into a small, hole-in-the-wall restaurant on a side street. When I sat down, I noticed first that there were no other foreign devils in the place. Next, I noticed that menu was devoid of English language descriptions of anything. Right about then, a waiter appeared. I asked a question, which was returned by a look of non-comprehension and a shrug. The waiter spoke no English. What do do?

I looked around the restaurant and noticed one man clearly enjoying what he was eating. He was slurping it down at a rapid pace and had a big smile on his face. So, I pointed at the man and then gestured toward myself. The waiter recognized my request, and said, in clumsy English, "American not like." I thought about that and then insisted, by repeating the same gestures. The waiter shrugged and disappeared.

Shortly after that, a bowl appeared in front of me. I slurped up some of the soupy dish and learned instantly that the waiter had been correct. This American did not like that bitter-tasting bowl. Apparently, that was fairly obvious, since the waiter appeared again, pointed at the bowl, then at me, and nodded with a big smile. We both laughed. He had been correct.

So, a new dilemma. What do do now? The waiter, probably having experienced something like this before, quickly picked up the bowl and gave me a gesture that I interpreted as "Wait." Soon, he was back with another dish, which he set in front of me. It had pieces of duck in it, noodles, assorted vegetables, and was quite delicious. I tried it and nodded enthusiastically at the waiter, who smiled again and left. Clearly, he knew that "American like" what he brought me the second time.

So, I had made a choice. I saw a patron who clearly enjoyed his food and reasoned that I would also enjoy it. But, I was warned by the waiter, who apparently knew something I did not know. I chose to ignore the waiter's advice and insisted, only to find that I should have listened to him. He then resolved my problem by removing choice from my options and brought me a dish that he knew pleased American palates. Free will betrayed me in this experiment. I chose to ignore the one person who knew, in favor of observing the gusto with which another customer was eating.

It was only when I gave up my free will and allowed the waiter to choose for me that I was able to enjoy my food.

N.B.: I learned later that the first dish was sea cucumber, which I will be sure never to order again.

14 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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When Free Will Backfires - As It Often Does (Original Post) MineralMan Jan 2019 OP
A very simplistic view of free will. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #1
Free will is the ability to choose? Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #2
Computers are programmed to make choices. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #3
Both computers and ants learn and make Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #13
Wow, that's really limited information you're working with there, g. trotsky Jan 2019 #14
Uh, duh... MineralMan Jan 2019 #4
Religion Group MM. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #5
Free will is a common topic here. MineralMan Jan 2019 #6
Free will is a much misunderstood topic here. eom guillaumeb Jan 2019 #7
Yes, and it is often discussed because of that. MineralMan Jan 2019 #8
I missed the other post. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #9
How did you do that? MineralMan Jan 2019 #10
You did not give up your free will at any point marylandblue Jan 2019 #11
Yes. MineralMan Jan 2019 #12

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
1. A very simplistic view of free will.
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 07:03 PM
Jan 2019

Free will is the ability to choose, which you did.

But because yours was an uninformed choice, you were not happy in this situation with your choice.

Voltaire2

(13,109 posts)
2. Free will is the ability to choose?
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 08:26 PM
Jan 2019

Computers make choices. Ants make choices. You should get a better definition.

Voltaire2

(13,109 posts)
13. Both computers and ants learn and make
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 10:00 PM
Jan 2019

choices based on information learned.

You really should choose a better definition.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
14. Wow, that's really limited information you're working with there, g.
Wed Jan 30, 2019, 09:43 AM
Jan 2019

You might want to read up on the latest data before spouting off nonsense like that.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
8. Yes, and it is often discussed because of that.
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 09:13 PM
Jan 2019

It is one of the core issues of religion.

In fact, two threads on the subject are currently at the top of the list. If you believe they are inappropriate, you can alert on them.

Your suggestion to me is out of place, I think.

As I said, not your group. We are both just participants in it.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
11. You did not give up your free will at any point
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 09:31 PM
Jan 2019

First you chose the customer's recommendation over the waiter's. When that failed, you chose the waiter's recommendation. Other possible options were
-leave the restaurant.
-point to a random dish.
-try to find a customer who could translate.
-look for a recognizable dish some other customer was eating.
-act like a chicken in the hope that the waiter will bring an edible chicken dish.

Lots of choices, so free will.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
12. Yes.
Tue Jan 29, 2019, 09:34 PM
Jan 2019

Exactly. My first choice left a bad taste in my mouth, too.

Not all choices are good choices, although even the bad ones impart a certain wisdom, perhaps.

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