Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
Tue Oct 15, 2013, 05:25 PM Oct 2013

Was Pythagoras the First to Discover Pythagoras’s Theorem?

According to Brown University mathematician David Mumford, the answer to the question is an emphatic "No!" On February 27, 2013, in a public lecture at the Institute for Mathematics and its Applications at the University of Minnesota, Mumford showed how ancient cultures, including the Babylonians, Vedic Indians, and Chinese, all proved the beloved formula long before the Greeks. He argued that the theorem is ultimately the rule for measuring distances on the basis of perpendicular coordinates. This comes up naturally in calculations of land area for purposes like taxation and inheritance, as shown in Figure 1. He further suggested that the Greeks' love of formal proof may have contributed to the Western belief that they discovered what Mumford calls the "first nontrivial mathematical fact."

Along with Pythagoras's theorem, Mumford discussed the discovery and use of algebra and calculus in ancient cultures. One of his key points is that deep mathematics was developed for different reasons in different cultures. Whereas in Babylonia algebraic "word" problems were posed seemingly just for fun, the Nine Chapters on Computational Methods, considered the Chinese equivalent of Euclid's Elements, was compiled in about 180 BCE for very practical applications--among them Gauss-ian elimination for solving systems of lin-ear equations, which the Chinese carried out using only counting rods on a board (Figure 2). Riemann sums grew naturally out of the necessity for estimating volume. Mumford suggested that Vedic Indians even pondered problems of limit in integral calculus.

contrary to Western historical belief, Mumford showed, the West did not always lead in mathematical discovery. Apparently, the origins of calculus sprang up totally independently in Greece, India, and China. Original concepts included area and volume, trigonometry, and astronomy. Mumford considers the year 1650 a turning point, after which mathematical activity shifted to the West.

Mumford's presentation runs counter to current texts on the history of mathematics, which often neglect discoveries occurring outside the West. He showed that purposes for which mathematics is pursued can be very culturally dependent. Nevertheless, his talk points to the fundamental fact that the mathematical experience has no inherent cultural boundaries.

http://www.siam.org/news/news.php?id=2067

6 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies

longship

(40,416 posts)
1. So what. If not Pythagorus, somebody has to come up with the thing.
Tue Oct 15, 2013, 05:53 PM
Oct 2013

If there's evidence that falsifies Pythagorus as inventor, bring it on. This is what science lives by. I can't prove myself right, so you'll have to prove me wrong.


Warpy

(111,261 posts)
2. He might have been the first to write it down
Tue Oct 15, 2013, 05:56 PM
Oct 2013

or the first whose writings survived.

I think the chances are very good that it had been known for a very long time by architects/engineers and stonemasons.

Jim__

(14,076 posts)
3. According to an 1985 History of Mathematics tex that I have, Plimpton 322 established this in 1945.
Tue Oct 15, 2013, 06:54 PM
Oct 2013
The History of Mathematics by David M Burton states that in 1945 when Neugebauer and Sachs deciphered Plimpton 322 it established beyond any doubt that the Babylonians knew the Pythagorean Theorem between 1900 and 1600 BC, more than 1,000 years before Pythagoras was born.

Igel

(35,309 posts)
4. That was established in the 1950s.
Tue Oct 15, 2013, 07:43 PM
Oct 2013

It was unestablished in later decades, mostly because it's a case of cherry-picking. The analysis accounts for some of the evidence in the tablet and renders the rest of contents of the tablet utter gibberish.

Igel's rule: Any interpretation that conveniently reduces to gibberish just that part of a text that is irrelevant to said analysis is inherently flawed. An interpretation of a text needs to be an interpretation of the text.

Ichingcarpenter

(36,988 posts)
6. The King's chamber in the Great Pyramid
Wed Oct 16, 2013, 10:17 AM
Oct 2013

show evidence of this knowledge

The 'King's Chamber' has its length twice its breadth and its height is half the diagonal of that rectangle.

Taking the width of this chamber as unity, phi Φ is traced out by the height plus half the width.

A 3:4:5 Pythagoras triangle is contained in the diagonal plane of this otherwise-empty chamber: if its length is 4 units, the main diagonal is 5 and the diagonal across the end wall, 3.








Also

There is evidence that Babylonian mathematicians understood the formula, although there is little surviving evidence that they used it in a mathematical framework.[4][5] Also, Mesopotamian, Indian and Chinese mathematicians have all been known for independently discovering the result, some even providing proofs of special cases.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_theorem

Latest Discussions»Culture Forums»Science»Was Pythagoras the First ...